Top 50 Non U.S. ATG LIST

[McGoorty]

Your Top 50 Non-U.S. All-Time Great List.

It is an undeniable fact of boxing history the U.S.A. has produced most of the greatest Boxers to ever live, but there are a 100 or more fabulous boxers to come from other countries, especially Great Britain and Mexico. There are many who dominated their own National scenes but were given no chance of getting world recognition.-------

So who do you think are the best 50 fighters of all-time from outside of the U.S.A ????????????????,....... I expect to see fighters from all around the World on your lists....... I expect the competition for a spot to be hot..... I will not name any yet, but will put names up soon for discussion, many are obvious but enjoy yourself, that's the main thing.

[McGoorty]

Your Top 50 Non-U.S. All-Time Great List.

It is an undeniable fact of boxing history the U.S.A. has produced most of the greatest Boxers to ever live, but there are a 100 or more fabulous boxers to come from other countries, especially Great Britain and Mexico. There are many who dominated their own National scenes but were given no chance of getting world recognition.-------

So who do you think are the best 50 fighters of all-time from outside of the U.S.A ????????????????,....... I expect to see fighters from all around the World on your lists....... I expect the competition for a spot to be hot..... I will not name any yet, but will put names up soon for discussion, many are obvious but enjoy yourself, that's the main thing.

No need for you to come up with 50 straight away, 10 is a good start...... Any problem with these 10 fighters being in the top 50........ Wilde, Duran, Arguello, Griffo, Langford, Peter Jackson, Cerdan, Carpentier, Villa, Ted Kid Lewis,...... ??????????

[McGoorty]

No need for you to come up with 50 straight away, 10 is a good start...... Any problem with these 10 fighters being in the top 50........ Wilde, Duran, Arguello, Griffo, Langford, Peter Jackson, Cerdan, Carpentier, Villa, Ted Kid Lewis,...... ??????????

THREAD RULE #1. Current fighters are not included....... So no Pacquiao..... he will be a certainty when his time is up.

[SCtrojansbaby]

My top 15

1.JCC
2.Monzon
3.Duran
4.Barrera
5.Pacquiao
6.Sanchez

The rest are in no order

Felix Trinidad
Samuel Serrano
Jose Napoles
Humberto Gonzalez
Rafeal Marquez
Azumah Nelson
Wilfredo Gomez
Erik Morales
Lennox Lewis
Naseem Hamed
Sumbu Kalambay
Wlad Klitschko
Vitali Klitschko
Ricardo Lopez
Alexis Arguello
Dariusz Michalczewski
Jose Luis Ramirez
Jeff Fenech
Wilfredo Benitez
Henry Maske
Steve Collins
Isreal Vasquez
Kostya Tszyu
Juan Manuel Marquez

I probable forgot a few

[McGoorty]

My top 15

1.JCC
2.Monzon
3.Duran
4.Barrera
5.Pacquiao
6.Sanchez

The rest are in no order

Felix Trinidad
Samuel Serrano
Jose Napoles
Humberto Gonzalez
Rafeal Marquez
Azumah Nelson
Wilfredo Gomez
Erik Morales
Lennox Lewis
Naseem Hamed
Sumbu Kalambay
Wlad Klitschko
Vitali Klitschko
Ricardo Lopez
Alexis Arguello
Dariusz Michalczewski
Jose Luis Ramirez
Jeff Fenech
Wilfredo Benitez
Henry Maske
Steve Collins
Isreal Vasquez
Kostya Tszyu
Juan Manuel Marquez

I probable forgot a few

OK they are up for discussion and debate....... But Rule #1. applies and not just for Paquiao. I am a fan of pac-Man,...... he may be the best thing to happen in a very long time, when he retires,.... somebody leaves the top 50,....... which is a long way from being decided....... and you did miss some big names,.... one that I need not have to mention is not there.

[rorymac]

1. Roberto Duran
2. Eder Jofre
3. Carlos Monzon
4. Julio Cesar Chavez
5. Jimmy Wilde
6. Sam Langford
7. Alexis Arguello
8. Ruben Olivares
9. Kid Gavilan
10. Carmen Basilio
11. Salvador Sanchez
12. Ricardo Lopez
13. Marcel Cerdan
14. Carlos Ortiz
15. Bob Fitzsimmons
16. Carlos Ortiz
17. Kid Chocolate
18. Joe Calzaghe
19. Khaosai Galaxy
20. Jose Napoles
21. Wilfredo Gomez
22. Jimmy McLarnin
23. Flash Elorde
24. Fighting Harada
25. Azumah Nelson
26. Marco Antonio Barrera
27. Lennox Lewis
28. Georges Carpentier
29. George Dixon
30. Jeff Fenech
31. Kostya Tszyu
32. Freddie Mills
33. Naseem Hamed
34. Erik Morales
35. Les Darcy
36. Peter Jackson
37. Vicente Salvidar
38. Tommy Burns
39. John L Sullivan
40. Jack 'Nonpareil' Dempsey
41. Barbados Joe Walcott
42. Panama Al Brown
43. Lionel Rose
44. Randy Turpin
45. Dave Sands
46. Pancho Villa
47. Ken Buchanan
48. Benny Lynch
49. Felix Trinidad
50. Howard Winstone

Phew..

[FasTHarD]

My top 15:

1. Roberto Duran
2. Lennox Lewis
3. Carlos Monzon
4. Alexis Arguello
5. Salvador Sanchez
6. Flash Elorde
7. Carlos Ortiz
8. Wilfredo Gomez
9. Ruben Olivares
10. Julio Cesar Chavez
11. Eder Jofre
12. Azumah Nelson
13. Pancho Villa
14. Bob Fitzsimmons
15. Jimmy Wilde

[IronDanHamza]

1. Sam Langford
2. Bob Fitzsimmons
3. Roberto Duran
4. Jimmy Mclarnin
5. Eder Jofre
6. Kid Gavilan
7. Joe Walcott
8. Alexis Arguello
9. Carlos Monzon
10. Carlos Ortiz

Not sure about the rest but the names would certainly include;

Dick Tiger
Azumah Nelson
Ted Kid Lewis
Jimmy Wilde
Jose Naploes
Julio Cesar Chavez
Ruben Olivares
Fighting Harada

etc etc etc.

[McGoorty]

5 star effort,....

1. Roberto Duran ATG
2. Eder Jofre ATG
3. Carlos Monzon ATG
4. Julio Cesar Chavez Very high, but ATG
5. Jimmy Wilde A top contender for #1 position
6. Sam Langford Same as Wilde
7. Alexis Arguello ATG....
8. Ruben Olivares
9. Kid Gavilan
10. Carmen Basilio Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't he a US citizen ?
11. Salvador Sanchez
12. Ricardo Lopez
13. Marcel Cerdan
14. Carlos Ortiz
15. Bob Fitzsimmons A few places higher maybe
16. Carlos Ortiz
17. Kid Chocolate Great fighter.. ATG
18. Joe Calzaghe Great record but maybe borderline
19. Khaosai Galaxy
20. Jose Napoles
21. Wilfredo Gomez
22. Jimmy McLarnin Only if the Irish claim him.... Love this guy
23. Flash Elorde
24. Fighting Harada Now Darcy is better than Harada, No problem with him being borderline, but I wouldn't even consider him ranked higher than whathisname
25. Azumah Nelson
26. Marco Antonio Barrera
27. Lennox Lewis
28. Georges Carpentier
29. George Dixon
30. Jeff Fenech Only 3rd best Aussie at best, but I agree with him in top 50..... old-school fighter our Jeff
31. Kostya Tszyu The Thunder from downunder.. his punching power was ****ing awesome.
32. Freddie Mills Hit him on the skull with the edge of a cricket bat, and he'd just turn around and say something like "oh how long have you been here ?", tough as nails.
33. Naseem Hamed
34. Erik Morales
35. Les Darcy You'll have to plead his case, who is he ?
36. Peter Jackson
37. Vicente Salvidar
38. Tommy Burns
39. John L Sullivan I always thought he was American ?
40. Jack 'Nonpareil' Dempsey
41. Barbados Joe Walcott This guy is very low here, this was the real McCoy
42. Panama Al Brown IMPRESSIVE, and a certainty in top 50
43. Lionel Rose You see I would rank Lionel higher than Harada,..... and he proved it to Harada in person.... Thanks for having him there
44. Randy Turpin
45. Dave Sands Here is an ATG........ nearly as tragic as whatshisname
46. Pancho Villa I think top 25 for sure
47. Ken Buchanan
48. Benny Lynch My favourite British from Scotland fighter..... this little bloke had the swagger of an undisputed HW champeen
49. Felix Trinidad
50. Howard Winstone Is he related to the actor Ray Winstone ?

Phew..

No need for comment on all of them,... apart from the actual order which we can have fun discussing, but they are all great fighters,.... Felix Trinidad is a name I'm pleased to see here.... Sands is a masterstroke, no arguments from me there, I think my list will have 90 % of those names there but there would be much different rankings,...... But I'm sure you will have second thoughts on them, who deserves to be ranked above who is a tough process,.. always subject to change...... 5 star post my man.

[rorymac]

No need for comment on all of them,... apart from the actual order which we can have fun discussing, but they are all great fighters,.... Felix Trinidad is a name I'm pleased to see here.... Sands is a masterstroke, no arguments from me there, I think my list will have 90 % of those names there but there would be much different rankings,...... But I'm sure you will have second thoughts on them, who deserves to be ranked above who is a tough process,.. always subject to change...... 5 star post my man.

Thanks man, it took me a while. I completely agree with your comments suggesting that Villa, Langford, Rose and Walcott should be higher. My bad with Basilio and Sullivan - I always think of John L as Irish for some reason, and for Basilio I just had a mind lapse.

Some great fighters only occurred to me later, and I kinda forgot to place them higher up the list e.g. Walcott.