The towel came flying in from the corner

[.Mik.]

I never said that Joe Calzaghe has become an ATG at LHW. With all this putting words into people's mouth, you're starting to sound like the moronic thread starter here.

Nobody has said that Calzaghe is an all time great for beating Roy Jones. Nor have they said that he is one of the best light heavyweights of all time. Personally, when it comes to remembering and ranking people I think that its stupid to do it based by their weight class. You do it based on their accomplishments. As things stand at the moment, Joe Calzaghe will retire undefeated, will have defended his SMW title against all opposition (Jeff Lacy and Mikkel Kessler were the two most credible opponents based on accomplishments and records during Calzaghe's reign who actually made an effort to get the fight made) for a record amount of times and will have also beaten two all time greats. One perhaps when he was on a great decline (only the future will tell, but the manner of victory certainly compliments Calzaghe) and the other when he still obviously had a lot left in his tank, as evidenced by his stunning and easy victory of a top P4P fighter in Pavlik and his own P4P status when he fought Joe.

That, to me, makes you an all time great. What more could he do in his time? Everyone in the history of boxing has a list of opponents that they could've faced, or blips on their record. Sugar Ray Robinson probably has less of the former, but more of the latter. Calzaghe has no blips on his record, but could've faced a couple more fighters in their prime. Does that mean that despite clearing out his division, defending his championship for over a decade and defeating two hall of famers in his (and their) twilight years and retiring undefeated (a feat that only Rocky Marciano and Floyd Mayweather Jnr have so far matched with similar standards of opposition)...he somehow wouldnt be considered an all time great when the two aforementioned fighters would be? Lets not be silly here.

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

I never said that Joe Calzaghe has become an ATG at LHW. With all this putting words into people's mouth, you're starting to sound like the moronic thread starter here.

Nobody has said that Calzaghe is an all time great for beating Roy Jones. Nor have they said that he is one of the best light heavyweights of all time. Personally, when it comes to remembering and ranking people I think that its stupid to do it based by their weight class. You do it based on their accomplishments. As things stand at the moment, Joe Calzaghe will retire undefeated, will have defended his SMW title against all opposition (Jeff Lacy and Mikkel Kessler were the two most credible opponents based on accomplishments and records during Calzaghe's reign who actually made an effort to get the fight made) for a record amount of times and will have also beaten two all time greats. One perhaps when he was on a great decline (only the future will tell, but the manner of victory certainly compliments Calzaghe) and the other when he still obviously had a lot left in his tank, as evidenced by his stunning and easy victory of a top P4P fighter in Pavlik and his own P4P status when he fought Joe.

That, to me, makes you an all time great. What more could he do in his time? Everyone in the history of boxing has a list of opponents that they could've faced, or blips on their record. Sugar Ray Robinson probably has less of the former, but more of the latter. Calzaghe has no blips on his record, but could've faced a couple more fighters in their prime. Does that mean that despite clearing out his division, defending his championship for over a decade and defeating two hall of famers in his (and their) twilight years and retiring undefeated (a feat that only Rocky Marciano and Floyd Mayweather Jnr have so far matched with similar standards of opposition)...he somehow wouldnt be considered an all time great when the two aforementioned fighters would be? Lets not be silly here.

Hey check my other post my mfrined. I don't appreciate the name calling. Just because I "imagined" what might have been said to Joe during the fight doesn't mean I am ******ed or an idiot. I belive one o fht eannoucers said the same thing I said in my post my friend. And I too think Joe should be considered an ATG for hi accomplishments. I said it in my post but yet you call me an idiot....Lefty

[.Mik.]

You're an idiot because you imagined something one of the fighters said and tried to pass it off as an authoritative statement on the matter. Thats ridiculous.

Remember when the ref told them to stop talking in the middle of the ring? I imagined that Calzaghe was saying "This is easy Jones. I thought that you'd be better than this. Is this the best that you've got?" and I imagined that Jones responded "Yeah, you're too good. You would've destroyed me in my prime".

So I guess my imagined conversation puts the prime vs prime debate to rest eh? No. Cos if I tried to claim such imagined conversations were authoritative or informed, I'd be laughed at and called an idiot...like what I'm doing with you right now.

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

You're an idiot because you imagined something one of the fighters said and tried to pass it off as an authoritative statement on the matter. Thats ridiculous.

Remember when the ref told them to stop talking in the middle of the ring? I imagined that Calzaghe was saying "This is easy Jones. I thought that you'd be better than this. Is this the best that you've got?" and I imagined that Jones responded "Yeah, you're too good. You would've destroyed me in my prime".

So I guess my imagined conversation puts the prime vs prime debate to rest eh? No. Cos if I tried to claim such imagined conversations were authoritative or informed, I'd be laughed at and called an idiot...like what I'm doing with you right now.

Joe probably did say that to him when he was leaning in and loking up at Roy through his guard. He said it with out even muttering one word. he said it to all of us. Whether or not they never fought in either of their primes so we will never know but I am sure we can all argue about it till the stars burn out.

[neils7147933]

Ok so many of us ate our words Saturday night when Roy took a terrible beating to the hands of Joe Calzaghe. It looked as if the return of Roy was in effect as of the 1st round Saturday night at the Garden. He was dancing and moving around the ring his hand speed looked great. He was landing and moving with the grace of the pre 2003 Roy. The fact that he was nearly 40 didn’t seem to matter. He landed a big right hand as Joe was leaning in and Joe fell to the canvas. With more than a minute left I was thinking to myself wow I paid to see 1 round all those 24/7 on HBO and it is going to end in less than 2 minutes? But as we all are aware now that didn’t happen. Instead of showing us his killer instinct Roy smiled and let Joe return to his feet and didn’t press the action not one bit. I was expecting a barrage of punches. Tremendous pressure from Jones. Instead about 4 or 5 seconds passed before Roy even thought of throwing a punch. He let Joe regain his legs and now Joe was firing back shots and landing on Roy. Opportunity knocked for the nearly 40 year old Roy but I guess he didn’t hear it. He had his chance to KO the P4P #2 fighter in the world.

At the start of the 2nd round it was quite evident that Roy was not Roy and that we were about to see just how much punishment he could take. The Ledderman score card gave round 2 to Roy but as I was scoring I gave it to Joe. I don’t think another round was even contested after that. Maybe round 5 but it was just a better round for Roy not really a round he won. I found myself thinking wow is this really happening? Is this guy mocking Roy? Joe would just lean in with his head and lay it against Roy’s forearms and dare Roy to throw a punch. I thought to myself that Joe was trying to say to Roy “Hey Roy are you in there?”. “ Roy I can see a shell of a man out here and it looks like Roy Jones but I gotta to know for sure Roy are you in there?” Here was Joe there with his hands below his waist and start shaking and moving his shoulders. I was yelling at the TV throw a god damn uppercut Roy!! I do not know why Roy even paid any of those fools to be in his corner. Honestly Zab’s cut was just as bad as Roy’s and they were able to stop the bleeding on Zab. Roy bleed all over his trunks his gloves the reff and Joe. I heard one of the HBO announcers compare it to the beating that LaMotta took at the hands of Sugar Ray.

I can see Hopkins now sitting there smiling doing his patent X by crossing his arms before the fight pulling back one hand across his throat. I can imagine what B Hop was thinking. “Wow there is no shot at all for me to fight Roy now” what would be the point? what is this fool doing? Roy throw a god damn punch for god sakes Roy!!! After one round Roy went to his corner and said I can’t stop bleeding I can’t find him his punches don’t hurt but I can’t hit him. I was thinking to myself why doesn’t his corner throw in the towel? Honestly it was quite clear that Roy was finished at that point. I mean they weren’t giving him any instructions. They weren’t saying calm down Roy. You put him on the set of his pants once that means you can hurt him. Just stay off the ropes and protect your eye for a round or so just o we can get the bleeding under control. Move away from his left. You are fuc@ing Roy Jones you got this. No instead they said nothing. They just sat back and watched and never were able to stop the bleeding. Instead Roy did more talking rather than punching. Instead Hopkins smiled and thought to himself now who has the better legacy? Instead we all saw hopefully the end of Roy Jones. Instead Joe Calzaghe whooped and beat on Roy for the better part of 11 rounds. Joe didn’t leave Roy with any dignity as he danced and clowned him every opportunity he got making my dislike grow even to greater heights for him. I had a hard time watching the fight after the 5th or 6th round when it was quite clear that there was no chance for Jones. It was that he was hurt or couldn’t to me it was like he gave up. To me that is almost as bad as the post fight interview with Iron mike after the McBride fight. I was waiting to hear Roy say some of the same things. Roy if you are smart and hopefully you don’t need the money just retire.

To all the Joe Calzaghe fans I definitely have respect for Joe he is a damn good fighter. His ATG status at 46-0 is quite impressive. You guys hopefully enjoyed the fight and the show Joe put on. I know there are going to be many threads and arguments here on Boxing Scene but I said it before the fight if Joe beats Roy to me he is an ATG so I am going to keep my word. He to me is one of the ATG at SMW/LHW. Like I said in a previous thread many will say oh Roy was shot and Joe is still not a ATG great even though he beat Roy. I will point out he did not just beat Roy he dominated him for 11 rounds. He got up off the canvas and handed Roy Jones his a$$ for 11 rounds. He danced and smiled in the face of Roy and hit him at will. He landed more punches than any other fighter ever to fight Roy. He probably lnaded more punches then Roy was hit with in last 3 fights on Roy Saturday night. So to all you na sayers about Joe I am convinced you won’t hear any argument from me about Joe not being an ATG. That being said I still would love to see him get his a$$ kicked……Lefty

It was kind of like Tyson/Lewis. Tyson gave all his fans hope Round 1, but when the deed wasn't done, reality set in...

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

It was kind of like Tyson/Lewis. Tyson gave all his fans hope Round 1, but when the deed wasn't done, reality set in...

Yes my friend the same fight different fighters. Tyson got his a$$ whooped and so did Roy Jones....Lefty

[Lord13]

Sounds like someone is mad...
Joe clowned Roy when many people thought the opposite will happen.

"Those pitty pat punches were a little harder than I thought,'' Jones (52-5, 38) admitted. "I couldn't figure him out.''

Stop bitching yanks, this is the 2nd instance where Joe comes in your turf and shows who the daddy.

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

Sounds like someone is mad...
Joe clowned Roy when many people thought the opposite will happen.

"Those pitty pat punches were a little harder than I thought,'' Jones (52-5, 38) admitted. "I couldn't figure him out.''

Stop bitching yanks, this is the 2nd instance where Joe comes in your turf and shows who the daddy.

He whooped Roy bad for 11 rounds. I said it. What more do you want from me? If Roy said that after the fight in a post fight interview I didn;t see it because as soon as the fight was over I turned off the station. I was disgusted and trying to rationlize what I had just seen. The last thing I wanted to see or hear was Joe talk about the a$$ whooping he just gave Roy or hear Roy make an excuses i Had enough....Lefty

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

He whooped Roy bad for 11 rounds. I said it. What more do you want from me? If Roy said that after the fight in a post fight interview I didn;t see it because as soon as the fight was over I turned off the station. I was disgusted and trying to rationlize what I had just seen. The last thing I wanted to see or hear was Joe talk about the a$$ whooping he just gave Roy or hear Roy make an excuses i Had enough....Lefty

I read where Jones said those slaps looker harder then they appear from outside the ring. SO maybe he did hurt Jones? We will never truely know a fighters punching power cause we aren't the ones being hit...Lefty

[Kris Silver]

Roy was not close to KOing him from one brief knockdown, sorry. Joes been down 4 times and never looked like being KO'd. You can knock him down but not out, he has a very tough chin.

Plus, Roy did not say Joes punches are weak mik. In the lead up to the fight on numerous videos he said Joe has a decent KO ratio and has hurt some opponents because he can hit hard, he just doesn't all the time. He's also quoted as saying Joes pitter patter punches were harder then I thought. He's respectable enough to accept it, especially with a busted eye.