Is Roy Jones Jr the greatest P4P fighter of all time better than sugar ray leonard ?

[BennyST]

You have gone on YouTube and watched Ala Villamor or Rocky Lin fights? If not, you are exepcting me to believe youspent money to buy them on ebay?

Joe Louis' fights have been avalable on tape since the 70's/80's, chief. As for Duran, a good number of his lightweight fights were on American television and his foes were far more well known and easier to find than any Lopez foe.

Admit it, you loved the way Lopez fought and how flawless/dominant he looked......but, you run into a problem when trying to place him historically. You have strict criteria for greatness that includes quality of opposition/resume. You use that criteria against fighters you don't like or think were overrated. Now you're fudging a bit when it comes to Lopez.

I loved Lopez and think he's one of those guys you show a young fighter films of.....but, much like Orlando Canizales I am baffled as to where he should be placed historically because his opposition is hard to gauge.

How dare you say such a thing!

Put 'em up sucka!

Jab! I'll take you on to!

[BennyST]

Sadly, you're right....as much as I don't like admitting it.

Canizales, in his prime, just didn't seem to have luck in getting the other top guys I guess. Daorung, Poison, Espinosa, Tats, Perez etc. All real good guys.

Sucks. Even fighting the best of the next weight up, he arguably won (apart from the Poison fight) but lost on SD and that was past his best, but sadly against by far the best he faced.

[SBleeder]

You have gone on YouTube and watched Ala Villamor or Rocky Lin fights? If not, you are exepcting me to believe youspent money to buy them on ebay?

I'm not understanding your question.

I rarely watch anything on youtube. I prefer to own fights. A youtube video could be taken down at any time.

Joe Louis' fights have been avalable on tape since the 70's/80's, chief. As for Duran, a good number of his lightweight fights were on American television and his foes were far more well known and easier to find than any Lopez foe.

And? You accused me of not watching Lopez live... Louis wasn't live in the 70s or 80s...

Of course Duran's fights are going to be more prevalent in the U.S. than a strawweight's... doesn't mean that strawweight fights aren't accessible if you're willing to search and shell out a lot of cash.

Admit it, you loved the way Lopez fought and how flawless/dominant he looked......but, you run into a problem when trying to place him historically. You have strict criteria for greatness that includes quality of opposition/resume. You use that criteria against fighters you don't like or think were overrated. Now you're fudging a bit when it comes to Lopez.

I use caliber of opposition to grade every fighter, Roy Jones Jr. and Ricardo Lopez included.

I loved Lopez and think he's one of those guys you show a young fighter films of.....but, much like Orlando Canizales I am baffled as to where he should be placed historically because his opposition is hard to gauge.

It's not hard to guage if you've seen enough fights. I've seen more strawweight fights than I've seen of any of RJJ's opponents.

Just because a fighter is obscure doesn't mean he's worthless. This is a circular logic trap- the flyweights and below are obscure because they're flyweights and below... that's all. There are absolutely piss-poor heavyweights that are far more familiar to American fans than some of the best little guys of all time.

[jabsRstiff]

I never said ANYTHING about you witnessing Ricardo Lopez's fights when they happened. I said I seriously doubted you had seen most of his opposition in action prior to their fights with him.....and I am having serious trouble believing that you have since purchased Ala Villamor and Rocky Lin fights in order to gauge Lopez's opposition.

I am every bit the boxing fan you are....I do not discriminate or ignore fighters because of their size.

[CarlosG815]

Yes, Roy Jones Jr. is better than Ray Leonard.

[SBleeder]

I never said ANYTHING about you witnessing Ricardo Lopez's fights when they happened. I said I seriously doubted you had seen most of his opposition in action prior to their fights with him.....and I am having serious trouble believing that you have since purchased Ala Villamor and Rocky Lin fights in order to gauge Lopez's opposition.

I am every bit the boxing fan you are....I do not discriminate or ignore fighters because of their size.

Doubt all you want. I have no way of "proving" anything, nor do I care to.


I'll admit... I DO discriminate based on size- I can't stand watching heavyweights for the most part.

[jabsRstiff]

Doubt all you want. I have no way of "proving" anything, nor do I care to.


I'll admit... I DO discriminate based on size- I can't stand watching heavyweights for the most part.

I enjoy watching GOOD heavyweights....which doesn't include any of today's heavies.

What about a fight like Holyfield-Dokes?

[NVSemin]

I believe the level of competition during Leonard's time was higher. This is not Roy's fault that he did not fight at that time. Nevertheless, I have no doubts Roy had it all to compete with Duran, Hears, Hagler, Benitez, ...

[MRBOOMER]

I believe the level of competition during Leonard's time was higher. This is not Roy's fault that he did not fight at that time. Nevertheless, I have no doubts Roy had it all to compete with Duran, Hears, Hagler, Benitez, ...

Roy jones would have sparked everyone on that list with maybe the exception of hagler but had the fight taken place at 168 then he might get a tko.

[AlexKid]

I believe the level of competition during Leonard's time was higher. This is not Roy's fault that he did not fight at that time. Nevertheless, I have no doubts Roy had it all to compete with Duran, Hears, Hagler, Benitez, ...

I think all the skill in the world wont help you when someone is as superior genetically as roy was, what good is Durans expert fients, counter punching, and ability to get on the inside, if Roy can attack you with blinding speed then get out before you can even flinch let alone counter.