Article on how protests are hurting University of Missouri

[New England]

It clear parents are not happy with the way the University leadership responded to the incidents so they are advising their kids to not apply to Mizz. No parent wants their kids in an environment where university leaders are not responsible and take too long to respond to things. The campus became unsafe for everyone.

Maybe next time something happens, whoever is responsible to address things will do so.

do you have any data for this? comparing it to other campuses, isolating the causality of whatever racism [or unsafeness] you're talking about, etc?

[New England]

being offended and not being safe are completely different things. i don't know where this rhetoric started out, but it is absolutely ridiculous. it just isn't practical.

[The Big Dunn]

i'd guess that there's much more of a net detriment to student's wellbeing and education from the massive crowds and protests.


there's a proper way to be political and try and change policy, bring light to individuals or actions you don't agree with, etc. storming through a library and screaming at people is not it.


if you watch some of these student protests, you get an idea of how young and naive these people are. they're just kids.

what do you mean by "proper"?

Change doesn't seem to happen unless the protests are extreme.

[The Big Dunn]

do you have any data for this? comparing it to other campuses, isolating the causality of whatever racism [or unsafeness] you're talking about, etc?

Of course not. Parents are not going to judge safeness through data, they are going to look at the TV and see what is going on, watch tempers flare, listen to the rhetoric, and then determine safety that way. It's a snap judgment based solely on what you see on the TV.

Additionally, as a parent, you likely will not have faith in leadership after the deplorable job they did on this. They didn't control the problem and address it when it was small, only when it went national. Would you send your kids to a university (more to the point give a university your money) that has leaders who are this inept?

[MDPopescu]

... and the "rednecks" count at about 84% in Missouri? Well...

[New England]

what do you mean by "proper"?

Change doesn't seem to happen unless the protests are extreme.

in a manner that gets more directly to the heart of the issue, instead of clogging up a campus, storming a library, etc. that's a state run school. a letter to the state congressional leaders in your district would do a heck of a lot more than shouting in a library

do you watch these kids? how they act with faculty, administration, etc? they act like the clueless 18-22 year olds they are.

watch them deal with people who don't agree with them. they resort to shouting very quickly . they're just kids. entitled ones, too.

[New England]

Of course not. Parents are not going to judge safeness through data, they are going to look at the TV and see what is going on, watch tempers flare, listen to the rhetoric, and then determine safety that way. It's a snap judgment based solely on what you see on the TV.

Additionally, as a parent, you likely will not have faith in leadership after the deplorable job they did on this. They didn't control the problem and address it when it was small, only when it went national. Would you send your kids to a university (more to the point give a university your money) that has leaders who are this inept?

if the programs were good and i got good financial aid i'd go there myself as a graduate.

i don't care in the least if teenagers are offended. i'm going to need more than that to shut a school down . show me some data. these kids think the school isn't safe? why? show me racist policies, or evidence that verifies the idea that policies are enforced in a manner that is racist.

it's not enough for me that a black girl gets offended when a white girl asks about her hair. i udnerstand that people get offended, and we should make sure we are working to reduce that, but you don't stop an important research institution because of that. that's petty and childish, and it's shaped the perception of this "movement ."

if you can't produce verifying data [quantified instances of violence, genuinely hateful speech, etc,] you're talking about opinions and perceptions, and those don't mean much in the social sciences.


are blacks being disproportionately victimized violence? property crimes? i'm not trying to be a jackass when i say that any data that supports this claim helps your case, and if you can't get me any, i'm not going to give a ton of time to hearing out a case that the campus is disproportionately unsafe for black students.

prove to me that it is unsafe.

[The Big Dunn]

in a manner that gets more directly to the heart of the issue, instead of clogging up a campus, storming a library, etc. that's a state run school. a letter to the state congressional leaders in your district would do a heck of a lot more than shouting in a library

do you watch these kids? how they act with faculty, administration, etc? they act like the clueless 18-22 year olds they are.

watch them deal with people who don't agree with them. they resort to shouting very quickly . they're just kids. entitled ones, too.

A letter to state congressional leaders. HAHAHA. You make change by making people uncomfortable.

if the programs were good and i got good financial aid i'd go there myself as a graduate.

i don't care in the least if teenagers are offended. i'm going to need more than that to shut a school down . show me some data. these kids think the school isn't safe? why? show me racist policies, or evidence that verifies the idea that policies are enforced in a manner that is racist.

it's not enough for me that a black girl gets offended when a white girl asks about her hair. i udnerstand that people get offended, and we should make sure we are working to reduce that, but you don't stop an important research institution because of that. that's petty and childish, and it's shaped the perception of this "movement ."

if you can't produce verifying data [quantified instances of violence, genuinely hateful speech, etc,] you're talking about opinions and perceptions, and those don't mean much in the social sciences.


are blacks being disproportionately victimized violence? property crimes? i'm not trying to be a jackass when i say that any data that supports this claim helps your case, and if you can't get me any, i'm not going to give a ton of time to hearing out a case that the campus is disproportionately unsafe for black students.

prove to me that it is unsafe.

If you need data, so be it. As I said, most parents are likely making a snap judgment.

They made their choice and it worked. The president that failed to address things got terminated. They shut down the campus because that is the only thing they could do.

You are missing the point entirely. You are trying to measure safety with data when safety is about peace of mind. You can't prove or disprove how someone feels or what factors need be present for them to feel that way.

I mean you are trying to be overly intellectual when common sense is all you need. It isn't a social science discussion its a perception discussion.

The university leadership didn't address the incidents on campus. As a parent, that would make me hesitant to send my kid there as I feel its an unsafe environment, regardless of the data.

ARe you a parent?

[New England]

A letter to state congressional leaders. HAHAHA. You make change by making people uncomfortable.



If you need data, so be it. As I said, most parents are likely making a snap judgment.

They made their choice and it worked. The president that failed to address things got terminated. They shut down the campus because that is the only thing they could do.

You are missing the point entirely. You are trying to measure safety with data when safety is about peace of mind. You can't prove or disprove how someone feels or what factors need be present for them to feel that way.

I mean you are trying to be overly intellectual when common sense is all you need. It isn't a social science discussion its a perception discussion.

The university leadership didn't address the incidents on campus. As a parent, that would make me hesitant to send my kid there as I feel its an unsafe environment, regardless of the data.

ARe you a parent?

i'm 28, and i really hope i don't have kids. we have gone over this
you called me a geriatric one time



and the congress in a state funds that institution. there's no more direct means of affecting change than changing the minds of the people who fund the thing. i'm really not going to go crazy trying to convince you that the sky is blue when you refuse to look up.

there's an ungodly amount of state money that goes into an institution like that. ungodly. it is the most important characteristic to consider, that these places cost money and can't run without it. i think you'd be pleasantly surprised with the outcome if 1/10th of these kids put in the research and wrote meaningful letters, essays, to influence the state congress, those who fund local elections / campaigns, and local leadership.


if enough letters pile in from campaign contributors, business owners / community leaders, it's a heck of a lot more convincing than an 18 year old getting in a reporter's face. or talking about his rights free speech and peaceful assembly while shouting in the face of somebody who doesn't agree with him



also, if you actually follow the "movement" you'd see that these kid don't even want media attention. they yell at reporters . WTF you protesting for? to get a message out [through media,] or get out of class?

[The Big Dunn]

i'm 28, and i really hope i don't have kids. we have gone over this
you called me a geriatric one time



and the congress in a state funds that institution. there's no more direct means of affecting change than changing the minds of the people who fund the thing. i'm really not going to go crazy trying to convince you that the sky is blue when you refuse to look up.

there's an ungodly amount of state money that goes into an institution like that. ungodly. it is the most important characteristic to consider, that these places cost money and can't run without it. i think you'd be pleasantly surprised with the outcome if 1/10th of these kids put in the research and wrote meaningful letters, essays, to influence the state congress, those who fund local elections / campaigns, and local leadership.


if enough letters pile in from campaign contributors, business owners / community leaders, it's a heck of a lot more convincing than an 18 year old getting in a reporter's face. or talking about his rights free speech and peaceful assembly while shouting in the face of somebody who doesn't agree with him



also, if you actually follow the "movement" you'd see that these kid don't even want media attention. they yell at reporters . WTF you protesting for? to get a message out [through media,] or get out of class?

OK, so not having kids you can't really understand the perspective.

Racism is not going to be changed by writing your congressman FFS. The university president had already mangled things. SO now you want students to write the people that supported his nomination as president of the university. Ok, its nice that you think things work as they should.

Yeah, so all the people that have directly and indirectly benefitted from the problems that these incidents highlight are going to respond to written letters. ok, again if you really believe this I can't fault you.

You are all off tangent. I'm sure there were some who were angry for no reason, but I think this was the minority. The bottom line is applications (and as a result application fees) are down 5%. This is most likely related to what happened on campus this year. Its clear that students and parents were negatively impacted by what happened and how the university handled it.