Was RJJ too fast at MW to be beaten by anyone?

[BennyST]

Toney was considered by some to be the best fighter in the world in 1994....and he was favored to beat Jones. I wanted him to beat Jones. But, he got beat in a way that told me he would never compete with Roy at their best.....and Andre Ward hasn't showed me he's better than Toney was at 168. I have no doubt that the '93-'94 Toney handles Froch, Kessler, or anyone else who Ward beat.

Easily. I'm not kidding either. Prime 160/168 Toney dismantles everyone, not named Ward, and embarrasses guys like Kessler, Froch, Abraham etc. outboxed them from the outside and annihilates them on the inside. Froch has nothing that would trouble Toney. As good as Froch is today, nothing he does, speed, power, technique, anything, would trouble Toney.

In his prime, much forgotten now obviously, he had the speed, savvy, defense, power, stamina to go through today's division without a loss, or even a very close fight, apart from Ward.

[wmute]

Easily. I'm not kidding either. Prime 160/168 Toney dismantles everyone, not named Ward, and embarrasses guys like Kessler, Froch, Abraham etc. outboxed them from the outside and annihilates them on the inside. Froch has nothing that would trouble Toney. As good as Froch is today, nothing he does, speed, power, technique, anything, would trouble Toney.

In his prime, much forgotten now obviously, he had the speed, savvy, defense, power, stamina to go through today's division without a loss, or even a very close fight, apart from Ward.

agree 100% with the exception that Toney had the ability to make close some fights which should not have been clothes. So I would not be surprised if he lost some rounds on activity against say Froch.

That being said, with the generally poor defense of the guys you mentioned, I see some of them hurt like no one ever hurt them.

[likeamulekick]

I think of all the weight devisions a prime RJJ is the most dominant in his catergory! I think he was naturally bigger and faster than robinson. He always had a bad chin though and i would be interested too see how he deals with tommy hearns, tall, big reach, fast and a good jab, i think that would be a wierd opponent for roy but then again he was faster and hearns is probably getting knocked out

[VapeRippa]

I didn't know moving to Cruiserweight was relevant to MW and SMW.

You say like any other professional fighter, as if Toney's accuracy wasn't amazing when he had a guy moving to punch. He read punches extremely well, and I have stated in the past that Toney losing RJJ is nothing short of phenomenal on RJJ's part. That doesn't mean that RJJ fights the same vs everyone and clowns Froch as a result. That's ****ing ludicrous.

Styles make fights, and Froch has the tools and the style to beat RJJ imo.

The last part made me lol.

I think Froch has the tools and style to get ktfo for the first time against prime RJJ: hands down, stiffness, big chin up in the air. As great as Frochs chin is, is the hurt accurate punches you dont see the ones that hurt the most. This is coming from one of the few who appreciate the Cobra.


You sir dont know shite about boxing, back to watching Ippo and the gang.

[Hitman Hodgson]

Froch would get thoroughly outclassed against prime RJJ, although I'm not convinced RJJ is the best SMW of all time based on what? I think he only had about 4 or 5 fights at 168? I think a fight with Ward would be close, Ward doesn't have the at times freakish speed of Jones and I can see Jones' unorthodox style giving Ward hell at first but Ward is a very smart fighter with better fundamentals than Jones and depending on how quickley Ward could work him out and start timing him. I think Jones' would UD him in an ugly fight.

To be honest though although speed isn't the be all and end all in boxing once Jones lost his he was a very average fighter.

[Japanese Boxing]

The thing I think people aren't understanding is that RJJ never fought the big punchers, Froch has the power to test what RJJ dodged. But hey, I guess I must not know anything about boxing because I analyze a career and notice a consistency he had when it came to opponents who weren't enormous KO guys or guys who have a lot of power. And don't think just because Froch's style isn't flashy meaning it isn't good or solid. Charley Burley, one of the best ALL TIME was a basic fighter, and I'd pick him over RJJ too.

I don't think Froch is Burley good. I think he;s good enough though.

[StarshipTrooper]

The thing I think people aren't understanding is that RJJ never fought the big punchers, Froch has the power to test what RJJ dodged. But hey, I guess I must not know anything about boxing because I analyze a career and notice a consistency he had when it came to opponents who weren't enormous KO guys or guys who have a lot of power. And don't think just because Froch's style isn't flashy meaning it isn't good or solid. Charley Burley, one of the best ALL TIME was a basic fighter, and I'd pick him over RJJ too.

I don't think Froch is Burley good. I think he;s good enough though.

I'm sorry but Farl Croch is NOT Nigel Benn in the power department. Or even Eubank. He's a limited club fighter who throws a lot of punches from awkward angles. He NOT a big puncher.

Poet

[Cardinal Buck]

^That must be one nice ass club he's fighting at.

[Japanese Boxing]

I'm sorry but Farl Croch is NOT Nigel Benn in the power department. Or even Eubank. He's a limited club fighter who throws a lot of punches from awkward angles. He NOT a big puncher.

Poet

Limited Club fighter who holds titles titles in the most stacked weight division in boxing.

His biggest flaw is Andre Ward.

[Cardinal Buck]

Easily. I'm not kidding either. Prime 160/168 Toney dismantles everyone, not named Ward, and embarrasses guys like Kessler, Froch, Abraham etc. outboxed them from the outside and annihilates them on the inside. Froch has nothing that would trouble Toney. As good as Froch is today, nothing he does, speed, power, technique, anything, would trouble Toney.

In his prime, much forgotten now obviously, he had the speed, savvy, defense, power, stamina to go through today's division without a loss, or even a very close fight, apart from Ward.

Dawson could give Toney problems outside. Froch and Kessler could cause problems by virtue of superior conditioning. I'd favor Toney against all, but it's unrealistic to think that he'd easily beat them.