Fernando Montiel, Giovanni Segura and Juan Manuel Marquez

[jrosales13]

Not really my argument stands if you hold all the Chest pieces to beging with its more impressive if i checkmate you then if you do me that's Quality over quantity. Easy enough to understand! Its an unblanced comparison to say there are more Mexican champions wooohoo!. Its like me saying there are more black superstars in the NBA woohooo!

Never once did I say there are more Mexicans champions. We are going Quality>Quantity. Which I fully agree.

P4P ATG there are no Puerto Rican fighters greater than Olivares, Sanchez, and JCC.

That falls under the Quality. And, we are in agreement quality>Quantity. Quality wise Mexico is the best right?

P4P active fighters there are no Puerto Rican fighters better than JMM and Montiel.

Again that falls under quality. And, we are in agreement that quality>quantity. Quality wise Mexico is still the best right?

Now a Better way to do it its to compare the best Mexican champion vs Another single individual in their Merits and abilities thats something else because you would have to see their individual attributes and i dont see any Mexican champ that can be compared in the top 5 p4p at this point.
In this regard Oddly enough AND VERY IMPRESSIVELY Philipines got the quality now followed by the US thennnnnnnnnn Mexico till JMM needs a wheelchair then bye bye 3rd place.

Exactly quality. No you can get any 3 Puerto Rican fighters of all time and they don't match up in P4P ATG's with Olivares, JCC, and Sanchez. 3 guys that IMO are top 50 ATG's.

JMM is top 5 P4P level fighter. There are no Boricuas in the top 10 let alone top 5. While Montiel is a top 10 P4P fighter.

Again no disrespect to Puerto Rico. A lot of posters on here know how I fell about Tito who is Puerto Rican. So is not shot at them.

[DannYankee]

Montiel top 10 p4p? watch what happens him if he doesnt duck and stays at bantam very soon give him a year at most. All you truly have to argue with in prescent time is JMM and hes on hes way to becoming a past great i dont see any promising quality champions from Mexico at this point maybe ill be proven wrong but like i said this thread point is what?Woohoo 3 Mexicans are unified champions?.....So?

1 Cuban unified Champion is more impressive to me ....shiet there have been more people to the moon then Cuban active pro's in that division atm see what i mean ? so woohoo 2 ok mexican champions and 1 top 10 p4p .Like i said thats like me celebrating black people do well in the NBA!

To me its just stupid to say P4P Mexico best boxing when the #1 or top 5 P4P for that matter right now arent Mexican even with the number on their sides sounds like a bs statement to me.

[jrosales13]

Montiel top 10 p4p? watch what happens him if he doesnt duck and stays at bantam very soon give him a year at most. All you truly have to argue with in prescent time is JMM and hes on hes way to becoming a past great i dont see any promising quality champions from Mexico at this point maybe ill be proven wrong but like i said this thread point is what?Woohoo 3 Mexicans are unified champions?.....So?

1 Cuban unified Champion is more impressive to me ....shiet there have been more people to the moon then Cuban active pro's in that division atm see what i mean ? so woohoo 2 ok mexican champions and 1 top 10 p4p .Like i said thats like me celebrating black people do well in the NBA!

Nice that there is 1 Cuban unified champ. However, is not impressive than Montiel unified title. Reason why Montiel did it in a much harder, deeper, talented, best division in boxing.

Nice for Gamboa props to the guy. But, P4P active fighter level he is not in not near JMM nor Montiel.

And, here is a link of boxingscene own P4P list. And, they have both JMM and Montiel top 5 P4P. I personally think Montiel is in the top 10 clearly.

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/view.php?pg=pound

And, yes Montiel could lose any giving night. But, not because, he is not that good. Is because he fights in the best division in boxing. Bantamweight is again the deepest and talented division in all of boxing. Any giving match up amongst the best in that weight-class is can't miss fight.

And, that reason alone is why that division is better. A win>Hasegawa over any win of Gamboa and that includes if Gamboa beats John.

And, anyways how is Gamboa unified title more impressive than say Montiel? Who did Gamboa beat to be WBA champion? When did he beat a WBA title holder? Oh I forgot it was an interim title that somehow became a WBA titleholder. And, that is more impressive than Montiel winning legit titles not no damn interim titles that magically became a full title?

Yea OK.......

[DannYankee]

Nice that there is 1 Cuban unified champ. However, is not impressive than Montiel unified title. Reason why Montiel did it in a much harder, deeper, talented, best division in boxing.

Nice for Gamboa props to the guy. But, P4P active fighter level he is not in not near JMM nor Montiel.

And, here is a link of boxingscene own P4P list. And, they have both JMM and Montiel top 5 P4P. I personally think Montiel is in the top 10 clearly.

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/view.php?pg=pound

And, yes Montiel could lose any giving night. But, not because, he is not that good. Is because he fights in the best division in boxing. Bantamweight is again the deepest and talented division in all of boxing. Any giving match up amongst the best in that weight-class is can't miss fight.

And, that reason alone is why that division is better. A win>Hasegawa over any win of Gamboa and that includes if Gamboa beats John.

And, anyways how is Gamboa unified title more impressive than say Montiel? Who did Gamboa beat to be WBA champion? When did he beat a WBA title holder? Oh I forgot it was an interim title that somehow became a WBA titleholder. And, that is more impressive than Montiel winning legit titles not no damn interim titles that magically became a full title?

Yea OK.......

A win over Drained Hasegawa better then Gamboa beating Salido to unify titles become super champion and thus forcing John to fight him?............. we have way different definitions of greatness... That p4p list needs to be revised and for more then Montiel being in it alone just look at hes resume if you say thats the best Bantamweight could offer him then i Strongly disagree about Bantamweight being the best class over Featherweights and please dont Make me name drop cuz bantams cant hold a candle and we both know it.

[jrosales13]

A win over Drained Hasegawa better then Gamboa beating Salido to unify titles become super champion and thus forcing John to fight him?............. we have way different definitions of greatness... That p4p list needs to be revised and for more then Montiel being in it alone just look at hes resume if you say thats the best Bantamweight could offer him then i Strongly disagree about Bantamweight being the best class over Featherweights and please dont Make me name drop cuz bantams cant hold a candle and we both know it.

Yes a win over Hasegawa in Japan mind you is much and i repeat much better than a win over Salido. How many fighters and average fighters beaten Salido? Yet that suppose to be more impressive than a win over a red hot Hasegawa?

FW being a better division than Bantamweight? 118 can't hold a candle to 126? Are serious?



I guess we just agree to disagree.

LMAO at 126 being better than 118.

[DannYankee]

He didnt win by decision thats the whole so called advantage people are said to have in their home turf corrupt judges or even that crowd would influence judges by goin nuts at every jab their guy lands.... so being in japan factors nothing in hes win He knocked dha fk out a drained opponent period and we both know it.

Laugh all you want it still a fact Featherweight is way hotter atm am trying my best not to start name dropping as it is!psh bantam even super bantamweight is hotter.

And since you trust so much what boxingscene lists say.... wna poll it to see whos hotter/better atm Featherweights or Bantam?This is one thing we can find out right now whos right.....

[ELHURACAN58]

But, your argument is quality>quantity. And, quality still belongs to Mexico.



Yo mean like a 3 division champ? That is P4P right? Like JCC was? And, there is no Boricua greater than what JCC was.

You might have more divisional champs but that falls under quantity. You don't have better which falls under quality.

So I am glad you agree with me.

Yeah but then we would have to say Cesar Chavez is better P4P not Mexico.

6 champions makes a country, not individuals, and person for person, champ for champ, pound for pound, with the numbers Puerto Rico is better than Mexico.

[jrosales13]

He didnt win by decision thats the whole so called advantage people are said to have in their home turf corrupt judges or even that crowd would influence judges by goin nuts at every jab their guy lands.... so being in japan factors nothing in hes win He knocked dha fk out a drained opponent period and we both know it.

Laugh all you want it still a fact Featherweight is way hotter atm am trying my best not to start name dropping as it is!psh bantam even super bantamweight is hotter.

And since you trust so much what boxingscene lists say.... wna poll it to see whos hotter/better atm Featherweights or Bantam?This is one thing we can find out right now whos right.....

Going to Japan in hostile territory with a whole different time zone is a factor.

It seems like you have a biased towards Cuban fighters and since I am assuming Gamboa being your favorite fighter is the reason why think 126 is a better division. I see no other logic how anybody can think 126 is a better division. Same reason why I think you mentioned 122 being better than 118. Since Rigondeaux is at 122 another hot talented Cuban fighter. And, since there are no Cuban fighters at 118 at the moment you think is not the best division which clearly is.

And, yea I have no problem with you making that poll.

[jrosales13]

Yeah but then we would have to say Cesar Chavez is better P4P not Mexico.

6 champions makes a country, not individuals, and person for person, champ for champ, pound for pound, with the numbers Puerto Rico is better than Mexico.

Ok....

But, there are still no Puerto Rican fighter P4P ATG better than JCC, Sanchez, and Olivares.

Sad to say but there isn't.

[ELHURACAN58]

Basically what jrosales is saying is that Phillipines is better than Mexico and Puerto Rico quality wise because these countries havent had a better P4P fighter than Pacquiao.

Are you guys gonna take that?

I wont. Historically we have been more consistent than Mexicans, and other countries in producing champions, and the mayority is not like those kind of champions who are lucky enough to win title against bums and then never make a title defense.

Puerto Rico averages 1 double division champion per 5 champions and 1 triple division champion per 7 champions, thats what P4P truly means for a country quality wise(defenses count too), what Gomez or Tito obtain individually is their acheivement, and if they are up in the P4P charts as individuals well great for them, but it doesnt mean that because we have one guy as the best, we automatically call ourselves the best P4P.