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  • When they're done ...

    When Angelo Dundee stopped Ali from getting further beating from Larry Holmes, despite the objections from the rest of Ali's corner, he was praised by the press at the time as acting in accordance of human behaviour.

    However, did Dundee ever care when his fighters became washed-up or braindead?
    Or wasn't it so, that he just replaced them with another bunch to train and exploit?

    In 1976, Dr. Pacheco had seen the signs of Ali's brain being injured, and wanted him to quit. Though, Dundee let Ali's career continue.

    In boxing, there are some Hall of Shamers. And I'm not talking about Dundee alone.

  • #2
    I can't believe you accuse Dundee of this while praising the insufferable Pacheco of all people.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by BKM-2010 View Post
      I can't believe you accuse Dundee of this while praising the insufferable Pacheco of all people.
      Agree with this. And Ali needed the money and would have simply replaced Dundee amyway. This is a human and not a race horse. Ali decided on his own retirement and never complained about the consequences.

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      • #4
        Did I praise Pacheco? No.

        Did I accuse Dundee? Yes.

        When a young, well-trained man stops to function as a human being, is it OK not to care about his future, but just replace him with another prospect?

        I’d say no. There is no reason why the sport of boxing should differ from society's perspective on aiding the unprotected.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Ben Bolt View Post
          When Angelo Dundee stopped Ali from getting further beating from Larry Holmes, despite the objections from the rest of Ali's corner, he was praised by the press at the time as acting in accordance of human behaviour.

          However, did Dundee ever care when his fighters became washed-up or braindead?
          Or wasn't it so, that he just replaced them with another bunch to train and exploit?

          In 1976, Dr. Pacheco had seen the signs of Ali's brain being injured, and wanted him to quit. Though, Dundee let Ali's career continue.

          In boxing, there are some Hall of Shamers. And I'm not talking about Dundee alone.
          I agree with you!

          Dundee should not have come back to train Ali, he should have been the first man to leave camp. He was close enough to see Ali every day, to see the fact that he couldn't even climb the ring steps for sparring at times. But they all wanted a piece of the Ali pie one last time.

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          • #6
            Ali was a grown ass man. These fighters quit when THEY want to not when people tell them too, Its a tricky one, I can only assume Dundee knew Ali would fight on with or without him and that at least if he was there he could pull him out, as he did

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            • #7
              In the end, it’s about what you want to be as a person.

              If you want to make a living, exploiting other human fellows, well, that’s OK, I guess – there ain’t any universally written rules of what’s right or wrong of being a human being.

              The moral standards are set only by ourselves, what we wish to achieve and what we wish to be remembered for.

              We’re all visiting this planet only for a brief time. That counts for boxers too, and they deserve a satisfactory life also after their careers have come to an end.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by The Surgeon View Post
                Ali was a grown ass man. These fighters quit when THEY want to not when people tell them too, Its a tricky one, I can only assume Dundee knew Ali would fight on with or without him and that at least if he was there he could pull him out, as he did
                Of course. Anyone who thinks Dundee could have stopped Ali from fighting is being very naïve. We're talking about millions of dollars.

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                • #9
                  Dundee stayed to protect Muhammad, he knew he was going to carry on and you said it yourself the others would have let him continue! Angelo stopped him.
                  Dundee did not manage Ali he was employed by Ali mainly to be the chief second at a fight. He did not spent 100% of the training camp with Ali rather show up for spar time and break camp together. Ali did what he wanted to as most experienced fighters will do.
                  Their opponents tell them when their done, that's who they listen too!
                  Angelo was one of the most concerning corner men ever, boxing misses him more than you'll ever know.
                  Ray.

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                  • #10
                    To some extent these past trainers and the like were products of their time. Even the more empathetic figures were by the standards of today far too reckless with the health of fighters. The fighters themselves had the same cavalier attitude, borne in part out of ignorance of the damage they were doing to themselves.

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