Wlad and Hayes POWER vs Shavers and Foreman

[edgarg]

if you went back in time, wlad would not have half the training tactics available to him then that he has now. The conditioning, the knowledge, the supplements, the technique is far far improved now, because of the building blocks set over the years.

Throw a guy with Ali's skill in this day and age and give him all the things we know now and he'd be 1000 times more deadlier.

Kilt in Alis day would not have been as muscular or heavy, he'd been very big and sloppy, with far less skills, than he has now...

"Ali's time" as yoy like to call it, was part of the modern era. They had supplements then too, and probably everyone including Ali was on steroids. The training is basically the same except that they have more expensive, "tailor-made" machinery to take up some of the training which formerly was done the harder way. That;s likely one reason why fighters were toughers then than now.

They ran, chopped trees, b ashed huge tyres, sparred, punched bags, exercised to get the body in fit shape, had psychologists, and everything neccessary to make them the best they could be.

For goodness sakes, I remember that in or around 1940 or so, Joe Louis had an opponent fancied to beat him, called Lou Nova. His gimmick was that he had a special puhch, which was called the "Cosmic Punch". He also had a special meditation stance in which he stood with one foot on the other, like a Kikuyu tribesman or one of those guys. I even still have the RING Magazine with his picture on the cover........

Learn some boxing history. That seems to be my favourite phrase for tonight.

[D4thincarnation]

That's nonsense, he cannot be compared to the guys who regularly fought 20, 25, 45 rds almost every month for many years. Jefferies and Jack Johnson were far tougher.

Do you know that the Jess Willard-Jack Johnson title fight in 1915 was a 45 rd fight, and that poor old Johnson, 37 years old, untrained, with a pot belly, beat the 6'6" Willard all over the ring for 25 rds, until he succumbed from exhaustion in the 26th.

You should learn more about boxing history.

Is that the same Willard that looked like a yoyo against Dempsey.

Durability is about the amount of punishment you can take, and Ali could take more that any other Heavy IMO.

Ali vs Frazier III was a brutal fight, fought a high pace in sweltering heat, with big punches landed regulary to the body and the head.

Johnson or Jeffries never had a tough fight like that.

[D4thincarnation]

You should learn something about both boxing, and boxing history before making such sweeping, highly inaccurate statements. Ali had some very bad habits which, when he slowed down, put him in the shape he's in today. Nat Fleischer and other experts prophesied that very same future for Ali. I have the evidence.

Klitschko is a far better boxer than Ali ever was. Ali was faster on his feet, a faster punch, but not top heavyweight power, not even as much as a klutz like Haye, although they are comparable in size, weight and height.

Just trying to be helpful.

You're funny

[Unknown Champ]

what funny is wack ass corie sanders destroyed Wlad and so did mid level brewster. Come on guys fighters back in the day that were elite were monsters mentally and we know Wlad is not. So beyond all the physical gifts the older fighters had the mental advantage which is a large part of any sport or anything period.

[D4thincarnation]

"Ali's time" as yoy like to call it, was part of the modern era. They had supplements then too, and probably everyone including Ali was on steroids. The training is basically the same except that they have more expensive, "tailor-made" machinery to take up some of the training which formerly was done the harder way. That;s likely one reason why fighters were toughers then than now.

They ran, chopped trees, b ashed huge tyres, sparred, punched bags, exercised to get the body in fit shape, had psychologists, and everything neccessary to make them the best they could be.

For goodness sakes, I remember that in or around 1940 or so, Joe Louis had an opponent fancied to beat him, called Lou Nova. His gimmick was that he had a special puhch, which was called the "Cosmic Punch". He also had a special meditation stance in which he stood with one foot on the other, like a Kikuyu tribesman or one of those guys. I even still have the RING Magazine with his picture on the cover........

Learn some boxing history. That seems to be my favourite phrase for tonight.

Yes the last 50 year have brought about no change in training and nutrition.



Nutritional science and training methods reached it height in 1940s when the Cosmic Punch was born.

[D4thincarnation]

what funny is wack ass corie sanders destroyed Wlad and so did mid level brewster. Come on guys fighters back in the day that were elite were monsters mentally and we know Wlad is not. So beyond all the physical gifts the older fighters had the mental advantage which is a large part of any sport or anything period.

Maybe Ross Puritty is a better boxer than Ali too.

[D4thincarnation]

That's nonsense, he cannot be compared to the guys who regularly fought 20, 25, 45 rds almost every month for many years. Jefferies and Jack Johnson were far tougher.

Do you know that the Jess Willard-Jack Johnson title fight in 1915 was a 45 rd fight, and that poor old Johnson, 37 years old, untrained, with a pot belly, beat the 6'6" Willard all over the ring for 25 rds, until he succumbed from exhaustion in the 26th.

You should learn more about boxing history.

Jeffries had about 20 fights and most of them were gimmes, Ali boxed far more and against much tougher opposition than Jeffries and Johnson.

[gauze]

i think shavers is a bit overrated. outside of ken norton, jimmy ellis, and jimmy young, he didnt really KO anyone worthwhile (correct me if i'm wrong). a lot of those KOs came against guys with more losses than wins.

don't get me wrong, 69 KO's in 75 wins is pretty damn good. but looking at his record, i have no reason to believe klitschko couldn't stop those same guys as well

[FrankieBruno]

"Ali's time" as yoy like to call it, was part of the modern era. They had supplements then too, and probably everyone including Ali was on steroids. The training is basically the same except that they have more expensive, "tailor-made" machinery to take up some of the training which formerly was done the harder way. That;s likely one reason why fighters were toughers then than now.

They ran, chopped trees, b ashed huge tyres, sparred, punched bags, exercised to get the body in fit shape, had psychologists, and everything neccessary to make them the best they could be.

For goodness sakes, I remember that in or around 1940 or so, Joe Louis had an opponent fancied to beat him, called Lou Nova. His gimmick was that he had a special puhch, which was called the "Cosmic Punch". He also had a special meditation stance in which he stood with one foot on the other, like a Kikuyu tribesman or one of those guys. I even still have the RING Magazine with his picture on the cover........

Learn some boxing history. That seems to be my favourite phrase for tonight.

never heard so much **** spouted in my life on this forum

boxing is the same now as it was 50 years ago, we have had no training advances? lmaooo

you sound like a clueless moron, thats like saying music is the same as it was 50 years ago and we have had no change in sound, technology, mixing techniques, mastering etc...

what we learned 50 years ago, 40 years ago, 30 years ago,20 years ago has been used as building blocks, certain errors we made in the past have been corrected, supplements and sports science has moved on, there is more money invested into boxing. Throw Ali in this era and he'd beat both Wlad and Haye together at the same time.

The funny thing is Wlad is copying lennox tatics from 10 years ago, which he himself as admitted, trial and error, so 40 years ago who would have Wlad been copying?

Wlad weak chin would have been taken out by anyone 40 years ago, he'd just be a tall, man with not half the muscles he has now

[Dave Rado]

You're talking about two of the heaviest punchers in the history of the sport. Haye isn't that powerful, especially at this division. Wlad is strong but to compare him to Shaves, no f'n way.

Shavers seldom if ever knocked someone cold with a single punch, whereas Wlad has done it frequently. No one has ever recovered after taking a huge punch vs. Wlad, whereas both Ali and Holmes recovered and won after taking Shavers' best punch.