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Originally posted by A-Wolf
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Floyd is too much of set-reset type of fighter for that equation. This is exactly my point. Taylor could let off combinations from anywhere at any position at any angle. Same goes with Whitaker. Floyd compartmentalizes offense and defense in a completely different way. He needs comfort and room to work and prefers not to fight in transition. You're straight up comparing Taylor and Mayweather. That's like comparing off-road racing and racing on a track.
I covered this topic's millions of times so I will just refer you to a article by Steve C. that best sums up Mayweather's skillset, and the way he fights in transition.
Originally posted by Horus
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Floyd Mayweather : The ‘Sweet Science’
Steve Coleman
For me what makes boxing the ‘Sweet Science’ is not two guys just slugging it out in a 'see who falls first' scenario. It is seeing some real skill and artistry in the ring.
In Boxing defense is not often given the credit it deserves and Floyd's defense is one of the best that I have ever seen. The only other boxers whose defense is similar in some respects is James Toney.
1. Mayweather's defense
Key to Mayweather's defense is the fact that he is always moving as well as the rhythm,speed and smoothness of his movements, this is what makes this defense effective.
All the while his opponent is punching.
Floyd is
The rhythm of the rolling is very interesting because most opponents alternate their punches in a very predictable way, only occasionally doubling up with the same hand in the middle of flurries.
When his body is turned to his right Floyd's left shoulder usually rolls up high to deflect punches and sometimes additionally he uses his left arm to deflect punches, it depends on the angle of the punch. Shots to this left side of his body are usually deflected upward and/or in front of him. When Mayweather's body is turned to the left his right hand is held up high with his elbow tucked in, so these shots get blocked also, a few well placed body shots can get in but Floyd is already rolling after the first punch connects.
On the rare occasion where a fighter does double up with the same hand Floyd usually catches this and improvises by adjusting his rhythm with a series of 'changes of direction' in his rolling. The thing to notice is the timing, all fighters have a rhythm to their movements which can be timed by an experienced opponent after several rounds of boxing.
2.Two different overall rhythmic forms:
There are usually two different overall rhythmic forms, what I call the set-up rhythm
(preparing to punch or waiting to counterpunch, depending on the style of the boxer)
the rhythm of offensive motion and the rhythm of defensive motion.
However Floyd, like many great boxers varies these rhythms in subtle ways that are difficult for opponents to time, and he can seamlessly flow from one rhythmic form to the next without any break in the forms. Usually the opponent is not even aware that the transition has occurred until it is too late.
3.The name of the game is not aggressiveness, it is 'effective aggressiveness'.
Most of Floyd's Opponents punches get deflected and do not do much damage. Also use up a lot of energy in the process.
It is tiring and frustrating to punch at a target that constantly making you miss.
What constantly surprises me is the ignorance of the HBO commentators Jim Lampley,and Larry Merchant They kept talking about that Floyd should stay off the ropes. Now these HBO cats have seen so many fights they should know certain techniques by now.
4.Floyd Rest on The Ropes:
First of all Floyd get's hit with very few punches when he is on the ropes. Many times during Floyd's fights Floyd would rest while letting His Opponents flail away at him, this is a calculated ploy that only works because of the nature of Floyd's defensive skills.
Sometimes Floyd lays on the ropes, sometimes he stands in the middle of the ring right in front of his opponent, in neither case opponents rarely actually connects with thier punches in significant numbers.
Floyd's sense of the flow of a fight is fantastic.
5.Staying 'in the pocket',
When Floyd stands 'in the pocket', meaning that Mayweather was so close to His Opponent that they can not get the proper leverage on their punches.
There is an optimum distance that most fighters need to execute effectively.
6.The Science of Floyd's Offense
Offensively Floyd, 'place' his shots, he is not just wasting energy throwing punches. Even when he is in these defensive stances he is looking for well placed shots in the middle of the other boxer's flurries Notice that his eyes are wide open and they are seeing everything that is happening.
With many other top fighters this is not the case.
It is a natural reflex to close your eyes when an object is coming at your face and great boxers train to counter this tendency.
In the Joel Casamayor vs. Diego Corrales fight both boxers had defensive lapses while concentrating on offensive and there were moments when both fighters closed their eyes while punching.
Shane Mosley also closed his eyes a lot and flinched when Vernon Forrest had him against the ropes.
7.The Science of Movement
Changes of speed and direction, pivoting and spinning, dipping, rocking, backpedaling, sidestepping, feinting, weaving, side-slipping, angles––all are part of a repertoire of constantly shifting balancing mannerisms designed to alter the perspective of the observer, a kind of slick motion geometry. I call these various types of counterbalancing movement techniques ‘modalities of rhythm’.
This tradition has always been passed down from master to student mainly through experiencing the ‘feel’ of these modalities as well as using analogy to pass on information. However it is the insights that are gained through these experiences and the ability to execute that creates masters.
Floyd Mayweather Has Mastered The ‘Sweet Science’
Steve Coleman
For me what makes boxing the ‘Sweet Science’ is not two guys just slugging it out in a 'see who falls first' scenario. It is seeing some real skill and artistry in the ring.
In Boxing defense is not often given the credit it deserves and Floyd's defense is one of the best that I have ever seen. The only other boxers whose defense is similar in some respects is James Toney.
1. Mayweather's defense
Key to Mayweather's defense is the fact that he is always moving as well as the rhythm,speed and smoothness of his movements, this is what makes this defense effective.
All the while his opponent is punching.
Floyd is
- rolling,
- slipping,
- pivoting at the waist,
- feinting,
- bobbing and weaving,
- constantly displaying various ‘modes’ of movement .
The rhythm of the rolling is very interesting because most opponents alternate their punches in a very predictable way, only occasionally doubling up with the same hand in the middle of flurries.
When his body is turned to his right Floyd's left shoulder usually rolls up high to deflect punches and sometimes additionally he uses his left arm to deflect punches, it depends on the angle of the punch. Shots to this left side of his body are usually deflected upward and/or in front of him. When Mayweather's body is turned to the left his right hand is held up high with his elbow tucked in, so these shots get blocked also, a few well placed body shots can get in but Floyd is already rolling after the first punch connects.
On the rare occasion where a fighter does double up with the same hand Floyd usually catches this and improvises by adjusting his rhythm with a series of 'changes of direction' in his rolling. The thing to notice is the timing, all fighters have a rhythm to their movements which can be timed by an experienced opponent after several rounds of boxing.
2.Two different overall rhythmic forms:
- the rhythm of offensive motion
- the rhythm of defensive motion.
There are usually two different overall rhythmic forms, what I call the set-up rhythm
(preparing to punch or waiting to counterpunch, depending on the style of the boxer)
the rhythm of offensive motion and the rhythm of defensive motion.
However Floyd, like many great boxers varies these rhythms in subtle ways that are difficult for opponents to time, and he can seamlessly flow from one rhythmic form to the next without any break in the forms. Usually the opponent is not even aware that the transition has occurred until it is too late.
3.The name of the game is not aggressiveness, it is 'effective aggressiveness'.
Most of Floyd's Opponents punches get deflected and do not do much damage. Also use up a lot of energy in the process.
It is tiring and frustrating to punch at a target that constantly making you miss.
What constantly surprises me is the ignorance of the HBO commentators Jim Lampley,and Larry Merchant They kept talking about that Floyd should stay off the ropes. Now these HBO cats have seen so many fights they should know certain techniques by now.
4.Floyd Rest on The Ropes:
First of all Floyd get's hit with very few punches when he is on the ropes. Many times during Floyd's fights Floyd would rest while letting His Opponents flail away at him, this is a calculated ploy that only works because of the nature of Floyd's defensive skills.
Sometimes Floyd lays on the ropes, sometimes he stands in the middle of the ring right in front of his opponent, in neither case opponents rarely actually connects with thier punches in significant numbers.
Floyd's sense of the flow of a fight is fantastic.
5.Staying 'in the pocket',
When Floyd stands 'in the pocket', meaning that Mayweather was so close to His Opponent that they can not get the proper leverage on their punches.
There is an optimum distance that most fighters need to execute effectively.
6.The Science of Floyd's Offense
Offensively Floyd, 'place' his shots, he is not just wasting energy throwing punches. Even when he is in these defensive stances he is looking for well placed shots in the middle of the other boxer's flurries Notice that his eyes are wide open and they are seeing everything that is happening.
With many other top fighters this is not the case.
It is a natural reflex to close your eyes when an object is coming at your face and great boxers train to counter this tendency.
In the Joel Casamayor vs. Diego Corrales fight both boxers had defensive lapses while concentrating on offensive and there were moments when both fighters closed their eyes while punching.
Shane Mosley also closed his eyes a lot and flinched when Vernon Forrest had him against the ropes.
7.The Science of Movement
Changes of speed and direction, pivoting and spinning, dipping, rocking, backpedaling, sidestepping, feinting, weaving, side-slipping, angles––all are part of a repertoire of constantly shifting balancing mannerisms designed to alter the perspective of the observer, a kind of slick motion geometry. I call these various types of counterbalancing movement techniques ‘modalities of rhythm’.
This tradition has always been passed down from master to student mainly through experiencing the ‘feel’ of these modalities as well as using analogy to pass on information. However it is the insights that are gained through these experiences and the ability to execute that creates masters.
Floyd Mayweather Has Mastered The ‘Sweet Science’
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