Just Watched The Lyoto Fight

[Syf]

What's up, I just watched the fight finally... And I don't see what all the crying is about.

Machida wasn't getting credit from the announcers for alot of the shots he threw and landed. Shogun would land a kick, sometimes blocked and oftentimes dodged, and Machida would throw a two punch combination or big knee, and recieve no credit from announcers, while they gushed about Shogun. It went this way the whole fight.

Joe Rogan only gave credit to Shogun Rua, thats the only name you would hear Joe say throughout the whole fight practically. It reminded me of the first Mayweather-Castillo fight. Announcers going crazy over only one guy, and ignoring what the other guy did for some reason.

Luckily the judges didn't see it that way. Rua didn't do enough.

[TheNegation]

What's up, I just watched the fight finally... And I don't see what all the crying is about.

Machida wasn't getting credit from the announcers for alot of the shots he threw and landed. Shogun would land a kick, sometimes blocked and oftentimes dodged, and Machida would throw a two punch combination or big knee, and recieve no credit from announcers, while they gushed about Shogun. It went this way the whole fight.

Joe Rogan only gave credit to Shogun Rua, thats the only name you would hear Joe say throughout the whole fight practically. It reminded me of the first Mayweather-Castillo fight. Announcers going crazy over only one guy, and ignoring what the other guy did for some reason.

Luckily the judges didn't see it that way. Rua didn't do enough.

If you want to speak on Shogun not doing enough (which is completely ridiculous) what the hell did Machida do?

If you are planning on using the commentary as your sticking point for how people are blinded, that's a bit silly. I guess the thousands of people (Machida fans included) saw a different fight? You could even tell Machida knew he lost before they announced the scorecards and Dana was behind Shogun with the belt.

Shogun was the aggressor, landed more damaging shots while Machida was on defensive the entire fight.

Go and look up the fightmetric scores. Shogun did plenty to win outside of finishing, but going for the finish against Machida is easier said than done and, everyone but the stupid judges had Shogun winning at that point so why risk it.

This is why NA judging is stupid. It resembles boxing scoring too much, and it seriously flawed for MMA. Which is why a lot of people want the fights to be scored as a whole.

[Syf]

If you want to speak on Shogun not doing enough (which is completely ridiculous) what the hell did Machida do?

If you are planning on using the commentary as your sticking point for how people are blinded, that's a bit silly. I guess the thousands of people (Machida fans included) saw a different fight? You could even tell Machida knew he lost before they announced the scorecards and Dana was behind Shogun with the belt.

Shogun was the aggressor, landed more damaging shots while Machida was on defensive the entire fight.

Go and look up the fightmetric scores. Shogun did plenty to win outside of finishing, but going for the finish against Machida is easier said than done and, everyone but the stupid judges had Shogun winning at that point so why risk it.

This is why NA judging is stupid. It resembles boxing scoring too much, and it seriously flawed for MMA. Which is why a lot of people want the fights to be scored as a whole.

You are exactly right in this point: Announcers don't have any effect on the end decision. Judges proved that.

But Joe Rogan is a heeded voice in UFC. The fans when Lyoto won gave mixed cheers..not all boos. Its when Joe said "excellent fight" that they started booing, because the fans definitely didn't view that tactical slow paced bout as an excellent fight. Average UFC fans being what they are and all.. Hungry for knockouts, and submissions. They had no patience for it.

But Joe turned around, and blamed that on them thinking Machida lost and like they were disagreeing with it.

What most were booing is they disagreed it was an "excellent fight". Just watch the footage you'll see what I mean.

As to why people where you watched it were shocked, or why this decision got a lot of hate or whatever, Machida doesn't have the most crowd pleasing style unless he's ko'ing a guy. All that dodging and backing away is gonna catch some boos. But they landed comparable shots. And don't tell me you didn't see where he landed big knees and furious combinations that backed Rua up to the fence, and got no credit for it from Joe

[TheNegation]

You are exactly right in this point: Announcers don't have any effect on the end decision. Judges proved that.

But Joe Rogan is a heeded voice in UFC. The fans when Lyoto won gave mixed cheers..not all boos. Its when Joe said "excellent fight" that they started booing, because the fans definitely didn't view that tactical slow paced bout as an excellent fight. Average UFC fans being what they are and all.. Hungry for knockouts, and submissions. They had no patience for it.

But Joe turned around, and blamed that on them thinking Machida lost and like they were disagreeing with it.

What most were booing is they disagreed it was an "excellent fight". Just watch the footage you'll see what I mean.

As to why people where you watched it were shocked, or why this decision got a lot of hate or whatever, Machida doesn't have the most crowd pleasing style unless he's ko'ing a guy. All that dodging and backing away is gonna catch some boos. But they landed comparable shots. And don't tell me you didn't see where he landed big knees and furious combinations that backed Rua up to the fence, and got no credit for it from Joe

Not all UFC fans are blood thirsty, some of them are starting to become more educated. They were booing because the decision was BS.

I saw a few knees to the body from Machida which was the only shot that did damage to Shogun.

And if you watch the fight again and the replay along the fence or find that GIF during the third round, you'll see that Shogun was also landing shots and in fact his shot did more damage than all of Machida's in that exchange. The camera was just focusing behind Machida so it looked like he was teeing off and doing damage.

Again. I don't give a **** what Joe Rogan has to say. His opinions are irrelevant.

But then again with how much unwarranted hype Machida had going into this fight, and the vast majority of people who had Shogun having no chance, he had to find a way to talk up Shogun.

And when Shogun began giving Machida problems, who else was he supposed to talk about?

[Syf]

Not all UFC fans are blood thirsty, some of them are starting to become more educated. They were booing because the decision was BS.

I saw a few knees to the body from Machida which was the only shot that did damage to Shogun.

And if you watch the fight again and the replay along the fence or find that GIF during the third round, you'll see that Shogun was also landing shots and in fact his shot did more damage than all of Machida's in that exchange. The camera was just focusing behind Machida so it looked like he was teeing off and doing damage.

Again. I don't give a **** what Joe Rogan has to say. His opinions are irrelevant.

But then again with how much unwarranted hype Machida had going into this fight, and the vast majority of people who had Shogun having no chance, he had to find a way to talk up Shogun.

And when Shogun began giving Machida problems, who else was he supposed to talk about?

I agree that some disagreed with the decision. But not as many as you would insinuate. When Bruce Buffer says the winner is Lyoto "The Dragon" Machida... THAT reaction from the crowd is what you should use as a barometer. It was mixed cheers. Some agreed some didn't.

Then Joe came along and said, I forgot if he said Fantastic, or excellent fight, during the interview of Lyoto, and that's where fans really started booing. Its clear they did not view the fight as fantastic OR excellent.

Joe holds more sway than you are admitting. Anyone that comments on the proceeds of a highly televised and PPV'ed fight has the power to shape opinions at home, and also the way Joe conducted himself in the interview shaped the crowd's opinions a little bit, I feel.

Yeah I know where you are talking about, Rua landed a counter shot, and an elbow. My point was there shots were comparable, and it wasn't nearly as one sided as people were leading me to believe. I'd even probably give Rua the fight by a hair...But against a champion? Maybe not.. And am I gonna call this a robbery?.. Nah, it was pretty close.

I feel like they put a fan to the flame of controversy on this one, as a whole. One good thing about all this is UFC has set up a situation for a very lucrative rematch, what with all the outrage they've been able to manufacture.

[Move BRICKS™]

If someone doesn't think Shogun won the fight, they do not understand fighting, period. The numbers don't lie, Shogun outworked Machida.

http://fightmetric.com/fights/Machida-Shogun.html

Shogun landed 82 strikes out of 149.
Lyoto landed 42 strikes out of 116.

Shogun had 55% accuracy
Lyoto had 36% accuracy

Shogun landed 17 shots to the head (12 power shots).
Lyoto landed 14 shots to the head (8 power shots).

Lyoto landed 24 shots to the body
Shogun landed 16 shots to the body

Shogun landed 49 leg kicks.
Lyoto landed 4 leg kicks.

Shogun landed 48 strikes from distance.
Lyoto landed 26 strikes from distance.

Shogun landed 34 strikes from the clinch.
Lyoto landed 16 strikes from the clinch.

[Syf]

If someone doesn't think Shogun won the fight, they do not understand fighting, period. The numbers don't lie, Shogun outworked Machida.

http://fightmetric.com/fights/Machida-Shogun.html

Shogun landed 82 strikes out of 149.
Lyoto landed 42 strikes out of 116.

Shogun had 55% accuracy
Lyoto had 36% accuracy

Shogun landed 17 shots to the head (12 power shots).
Lyoto landed 14 shots to the head (8 power shots).

Lyoto landed 24 shots to the body
Shogun landed 16 shots to the body

Shogun landed 49 leg kicks.
Lyoto landed 4 leg kicks.

Shogun landed 48 strikes from distance.
Lyoto landed 26 strikes from distance.

Shogun landed 34 strikes from the clinch.
Lyoto landed 16 strikes from the clinch.

The fight seemed comparable. Lyoto landed alot more punches than that. And I wouldn't give Shogun quite that many stats..Lyoto blocked and dodged some of those hits.

fight metric... that sounds suspiciously like compubox to me...

Yeah, Compubox can be wrong, and so can fightmetric, I'd wager. They are human derived statistics, hence vulnerable to human error and sway.

[Move BRICKS™]

The fight seemed comparable. Lyoto landed alot more punches than that. And I wouldn't give Shogun quite that many stats..Lyoto blocked and dodged some of those hits.

fight metric... that sounds suspiciously like compubox to me...

Yeah, Compubox can be wrong, and so can fightmetric, I'd wager. They are human derived statistics, hence vulnerable to human error and sway.

And these people counting literally double the amount of shots for Shogun is incorrect?

[Left2theliver]

I do think Shogun won, but i do think people are going a little too far with this. It was a very competitive and close fight...it wasn't like Shogun completely steamrolled him...

[Syf]

And these people counting literally double the amount of shots for Shogun is incorrect?

Yeah..

Offhand, I'd take about 10-20 of Shoguns overall shots off, due to blocking, dodging, ect.. and add 10-20 to Machida's overall shots. Like one statistic I KNOW is bull is that Machida only landed 14 shots to the head in the whole fight. Lyoto was using his jabs and crosses all night. Rua just has a hell of a beard, and was hitting him with shots at the same time. Kicks and such. Hence it sort of "drowned out" Machida's efforts to these bean counter types. Add to that Joe freakin Rogan's part in this drama..and well yeah.

I place about as much faith in fightmetric statistics as I do in compubox, which is to say, very little.

I do find one stat interesting. Lyoto successfully defended against four takedowns. Don't judges award on defense too?