Would any version of Tyson ever beat Lennox?

[rightsideup]

They fought Tyson lost. If they fought at an earlier point Tyson would have been have been taken seriously so no suprise excellent fight with the better fighter on that night winning.

[Ray Corso]

Strong solid punchers always have a chance when their power lands. Thats the main intrique in a Heavyweight bout.
I believe Tyson was at his best when Cus was still alive and although his competition hadn't moved up yet he was sharp and was carrying out the plans very well.
However when they sparred as teenagers on the second day Lennox started stepping off and around Mike and Mike was having a tough time reseting.
He was asked to open up some because the first day Mike really had his way.
I think it was an indication that if a man as strong as Lennox stood to fight him and he couldn't get to him than he'd be in for a fight. Every heavy who fights equal to better opposition must face that test.
I give the younger version of Tyson (19-22 yrs. 210-218lbs) the best chances against anyone. At that age and weight he still maintained his foot and hand speed and that was essential with his power. He also could maintain his head movement at that weight without his stamina fading. Once Mike went up about 218lbs and he aged he couldn't maintain the defense he was taught by Cus. It was to demanding as a fighter aged let alone loose
flexability.
Tyson on any given night beats anyone, he also looses to a dozen or so who could beat anyone also!

Ray

[rightsideup]

Strong solid punchers always have a chance when their power lands. Thats the main intrique in a Heavyweight bout.
I believe Tyson was at his best when Cus was still alive and although his competition hadn't moved up yet he was sharp and was carrying out the plans very well.
However when they sparred as teenagers on the second day Lennox started stepping off and around Mike and Mike was having a tough time reseting.
He was asked to open up some because the first day Mike really had his way.
I think it was an indication that if a man as strong as Lennox stood to fight him and he couldn't get to him than he'd be in for a fight. Every heavy who fights equal to better opposition must face that test.
I give the younger version of Tyson (19-22 yrs. 210-218lbs) the best chances against anyone. At that age and weight he still maintained his foot and hand speed and that was essential with his power. He also could maintain his head movement at that weight without his stamina fading. Once Mike went up about 218lbs and he aged he couldn't maintain the defense he was taught by Cus. It was to demanding as a fighter aged let alone loose
flexability.
GTyson on any given night beats anyone, he also looses to a dozen or so who could beat anyone also!

Ray

great post ray. I have a question for the people who think Tyson was invincible who was the best fighter Tyson beat in his prime? Second question is why is Tysons prime so short?

[Ray Corso]

His "prime" situation reminds me of Ali's cut years. They both missed prime ages for a fighter to develop and mature. You can't replace those lost years with later ones it doesn't work that way in boxing. Ali defenitely lost his best 'years and it showed, I think Mike loosing his team (Cus, Jimmy & Cayton) and I'll through in Teddy too. Atlas was his physical trainer and Mike totally relied on Teddy for guidance and encouragement. Mike screwed that up and it cost him dearly, Atlas would have been better in the corner than Rooney. Kevin was decent at evaluating opponents but he could get excitable at times and to emotional. Teddy was a calming influence on Mike which was pretty funny because Atlas back then was a firecracker!

Ali was screwed by the goverment and I think Tyson was too.
They both got set up and payed a heavy price.

Funny thing is Ali needed no body. Tyson needed his team, without them
he was lost!

Ray

[rightsideup]

His "prime" situation reminds me of Ali's cut years. They both missed prime ages for a fighter to develop and mature. You can't replace those lost years with later ones it doesn't work that way in boxing. Ali defenitely lost his best 'years and it showed, I think Mike loosing his team (Cus, Jimmy & Cayton) and I'll through in Teddy too. Atlas was his physical trainer and Mike totally relied on Teddy for guidance and encouragement. Mike screwed that up and it cost him dearly, Atlas would have been better in the corner than Rooney. Kevin was decent at evaluating opponents but he could get excitable at times and to emotional. Teddy was a calming influence on Mike which was pretty funny because Atlas back then was a firecracker!

Ali was screwed by the goverment and I think Tyson was too.
They both got set up and payed a heavy price.

Funny thing is Ali needed no body. Tyson needed his team, without them
he was lost!

Ray

Great post I saw a special the other day questioning Mike defence and conviction it raised a lot of doubt but as a boxer he started to slide because he choose king over cayton and as you said his actions against teddy hurt him as well.

[sonnyboyx2]

great post ray. I have a question for the people who think Tyson was invincible who was the best fighter Tyson beat in his prime? Second question is why is Tysons prime so short?

Best fighters Tyson beat in his prime were:

Larry Holmes KO4 - 48-2 went 24-2 with 2 Heavyweight title fights after loss.
Tony Tucker KO2 - 24-1 Former Champion & very good fighter
Pinklon Thomas KO6 - 29-1 Former champion very good fighter
Tony Tucker 34-0 Undefeated Heavyweight Champion
Tyrell Biggs 15-0 Undefeated Olympic Gold Medalist.
James Smith - Reigning Champion who had beat Witherspoon & Bruno
Michael Spinks 31-0 Reigning Champ, former undisputed 175lb Champion
Frank Bruno - 32-2(32) KO Artist who went on to win title 6yrs down line.
Carl Williams -22-2 Excellent boxer
James"Buster"Douglas - Excellent boxer
Alex Stewart 26-1(26) KO Artist who gets destroyed in opening round
Razor Ruddock - Top Contender brutally beaten twice

Mike Tyson's prime was "So Short" because he was sent to prison for 5yrs

[rightsideup]

Best fighters Tyson beat in his prime were:

Larry Holmes KO4 - 48-2 went 24-2 with 2 Heavyweight title fights after loss.
Tony Tucker KO2 - 24-1 Former Champion & very good fighter
Pinklon Thomas KO6 - 29-1 Former champion very good fighter
Tony Tucker 34-0 Undefeated Heavyweight Champion
Tyrell Biggs 15-0 Undefeated Olympic Gold Medalist.
James Smith - Reigning Champion who had beat Witherspoon & Bruno
Michael Spinks 31-0 Reigning Champ, former undisputed 175lb Champion
Frank Bruno - 32-2(32) KO Artist who went on to win title 6yrs down line.
Carl Williams -22-2 Excellent boxer
James"Buster"Douglas - Excellent boxer
Alex Stewart 26-1(26) KO Artist who gets destroyed in opening round
Razor Ruddock - Top Contender brutally beaten twice

Mike Tyson's prime was "So Short" because he was sent to prison for 5yrs

His prime was also cut short because of a lack of character which came to the surface in the Douglas fight. He served 3 yrs

[PitbullParsons]

His prime was also cut short because of a lack of character which came to the surface in the Douglas fight

That was a product of lack of direction. The kid came from nothing and only knew struggle. When Cus took him in he cleaned up around the edges but never really pushed being a good human being on him. He focused on him being an animal in the ring more than anything. There was a lot going on at the time of the Douglas fight and he didn't have the guidance. Does anyone think the Cus would have let Tyson go into that fight the way he did? He was mishandled more than anything.

[juggernaut666]

great post ray. I have a question for the people who think Tyson was invincible who was the best fighter Tyson beat in his prime? Second question is why is Tysons prime so short?

Tysons prime was short because of Tyson himself ,nothing to do with age or prison,as prime is not age its when you are at your peak or performing at your best ,no ones prime has to be the same guys like Lewis and Wlad as well as Ali and Foreman developed into better fighters at an older age .Tyson never fought below 215 as a pro as im aware of and his defense certainly at a lower weight in the amateurs wasnt better his average weight was always more closer to 220,he slid down early for the most part in breaking up with Rooney ,combined with his fiascos outside the ring and add in prison then 4 years later in 95 against McNeely still surrounded by knuckle heads well its not even worth going into.

His style required much more athletism as an inside aggressor who was based on defense first ,to set up the counter shots under Cus ,with out the right trainer who he did need as he wasnt a tall run on the outside style which doesnt need to be exact science like Mikes ,was the end for him as a perfect fighter ,interesting enough Tyson had said he knew he would be going down hill after he immediately knocked Spinks out and stepped out of the ring in an interview when asked what was his peak in a interview i had read awhile back .

His best opponent at his peak was Holmes at 38 ,you could say Tucker who was a seasoned pro and undefeated in 86 but it was Tysons only 2nd year fighting ,i think Ruddock in his prime in 91 was the best guy he fought but Tyson was turned into a brawler then.


Holmes defeated prime Mercer and went the disance with Holyfield at age 43,against Tyson he was younger and in better shape despite the 2 year lay off that should give a good measuring stick how great Tyson under Rooney really was.

[rightsideup]

That was a product of lack of direction. The kid came from nothing and only knew struggle. When Cus took him in he cleaned up around the edges but never really pushed being a good human being on him. He focused on him being an animal in the ring more than anything. There was a lot going on at the time of the Douglas fight and he didn't have the guidance. Does anyone think the Cus would have let Tyson go into that fight the way he did? He was mishandled more than anything.

Very good post. Floyd Paterson was a troubled youth as well but turned out to be a fine gentleman. Cus seemed to fast tracked MIKE to be a great fighter but let him get away with alot