Where does Dariusz Michalczewski rank on the ALL Time LHW List?

[JAB5239]

They are from Ukraine and reside in Germany.....neither are bordering Asia

Their parents are Eurasian.

[crold1]

He was the lineal champion. He wasn't the ring champion. Roy was the ring champion once they brought the title back. The Ring like they did in Flyweight ignored the lineage history. They gave Roy the title because I think he the WBA, WBC, and IBF title at the time.

There was a key difference in that Flyweight stretched WAY back and could be traced on their pages. The Light Heavy line DM gets credit for was established with Hill-Maske and only really paid attention to by superhardcore types for a long time.

However, had Ring been under their current policy in 96 (Maske-Hill was a 1-2 fight), then they never would have had Roy as champ. The line would have continued right up to the Erdei vacancy (if Erdei had agreed to vacate Ring's belt; without it, I think his WBO vacating was good enough).

[Brother Jay]

I saw that post previously.

Here's my take on it.

There's a few ways you can look at the K2 bros.

Do they dominate because of their size? Yes, I think that plays a major role. But not every big man in the NBA is a HOF'er, All-Star or even role player for that matter. Look at Manute Bol and Shawn Bradley lol

So while I agree with you that that they dominate because of their size, I also think that it takes a great deal of skill to do what they've done for so long. I think Vitalil is the more skillful between the two.

That was my first outlook and here's my 2nd. I wouldn't consider them to be P4P type fighters, but you don't have to be a P4P type fighter to be "effective" and know how to utilize your size in your weight class. In other words, if Mayweather or Pac was 6'2 230 lb's, I'm not so sure either would beat Vitali. So I think Vitali and his Brother deserve some respect in that aspect.

It sounded like in your analysis, you thought Tyson would beat Vitali because Tyson had "more talent". Although I do agree that Tyson would've defeated Vitali, I'm not so sure Tyson's fight attributes complimented his size/frame no more than I think Vitali's fight attributes compliment's his size frame. In other words, I don't think Tyson being, in your opinion, the P4P better fighter would have won him the fight. I think he would've won in other areas that I explained in the thread you linked me too.

That said, I am in no way, shape and size a fan of Wlad's fighting style, but I respect it because it's effective.

Do you see what I'm saying?

Nice response.

I disagree though on the skillset portion.

I understand what you mean by not being P4P caliber but still having what it takes to get it done.

However neither Wlad or Vitali strike me as being anything but two 6'7 oafs who uses superior reach to hide behind their jabs and hold once their opponents get passed it.

They are the White versions of Lennox Lewis. Boring, stiff, Steward-made fighters who jab at opponents and clinch.

The most important points I wanted to drive home was neither man would do well in ANY other division because without the size and weight disparity, they are average at best.

Imagine them at ltHW. I believe Chad Dawson would completely dominate them. I believe at ANY weight below HW they would lose frequently.

Hell ... even at HW if they weighed in at 220 against a prime Tyson I believe that they would be KO'd in the first 4 rounds.

The HW division allows for HUGE weight disparities. Its unique in that aspect.

In that regard, it allows men who are average to seem more formidable against smaller men. Its hard to gauge how talented someone is in boxing when they outweigh their opponent by over 30lbs and have 5-7 inches in height over them.