Do you support Socialism?

[!! Shawn]

Originally Posted by kswizzy99

it all depends. here in canada we have free health care and our university fees are nothing compared to what it costs in the states and that is because of the government support. that to me is amazing and I took it for granted until I heard some of the horror stories with the health care and education system in America but yet American's like to say that its a socialist system we have here and say it like its a bad word. that just boggles my mind cuz I fail to see the problem in our system.

my cousin's univesity fees in the states cost him something like $300,000. my 3 years in University here only cost me about $6000. If that is considered bad, than I don't want good.

Tuition like that is reserved for private ivy league universities like Harvard. You can get a degree from State Universities for much much less. It is still over priced, but I explained the basic reason for that in a previous post.

As for the medical system. Yes, there are problems, it has more to do with corrupt congressmen bowing to the whims of pharmaceutical lobbiests than it has to do with our free market medical system.

I have spent more time in doctors offices than I would care to mention, and I can say that there is no problem with the medical system itself. Insurance companies do need some regulation. The way some companies jerk people around should be put under control, but socialised medicine is not the answer.

There is a reason why Canadians come state side when they need really serious medical treatment. Socialised medicine does not lend itself to innovation and cutting edge technology.

Most of the people espousing the benifits of socialised medicine have never had to go through the system with a serious illness. Specialists are a scarcity. Most of them move to higher paying places like the US.

I have heard horror stories of ungodly waits to see a specialist for any serious illness you might be having.

I have had my share of strange and ****ed up diseases in my life. It has never taken longer than a week to get in too see a specialist. I have no complaints about the US medical system, even with all of the time I have spent dealing with it.

[theghost#1]

A big hell no. If you like it move to Europe and get your free healthcare and pay triple the amount in taxes like they do in France.

[Spare Moody]

Originally Posted by JaguarJames

is it me or does Ben Afflec seem really coked out in this segment?

[Spare Moody]

oh and sorry Shawn. i didn't answer yer question. the truth is, i don't know. i really have no clue.

what i do know is that i just saw a banner ad on here advertising Zombie Strippers, starring Jenna Jameson and Robert Enlund. did he not make enough money as Freddy Kruger?? Really????

Zombie Strippers. does this site seriously go out of it's way to search, hunt, scavage and find the absolute dumbest fucking things available to promote?

[-Swizzy-]

Originally Posted by !! Shawn

Tuition like that is reserved for private ivy league universities like Harvard. You can get a degree from State Universities for much much less. It is still over priced, but I explained the basic reason for that in a previous post.

As for the medical system. Yes, there are problems, it has more to do with corrupt congressmen bowing to the whims of pharmaceutical lobbiests than it has to do with our free market medical system.

I have spent more time in doctors offices than I would care to mention, and I can say that there is no problem with the medical system itself. Insurance companies do need some regulation. The way some companies jerk people around should be put under control, but socialised medicine is not the answer.

There is a reason why Canadians come state side when they need really serious medical treatment. Socialised medicine does not lend itself to innovation and cutting edge technology.

Most of the people espousing the benifits of socialised medicine have never had to go through the system with a serious illness. Specialists are a scarcity. Most of them move to higher paying places like the US.

I have heard horror stories of ungodly waits to see a specialist for any serious illness you might be having.

I have had my share of strange and ****ed up diseases in my life. It has never taken longer than a week to get in too see a specialist. I have no complaints about the US medical system, even with all of the time I have spent dealing with it.

buddy, you can't feed me false information cuz I live here in Canada. we get great health care and we get great education for almost nothing.

canadian doctors going to the states and not having the system here set in place for major illnesses is all propaganda.

you like to use the word FREE but really, is your system actually free? do you really have the choice in your hands? the choice is in how much money you've got. if you can't pay for your cancer treatments, well, the choice has been made for you. if you can't pay for your education well, the choice has once again been made for you. here, we have actual freedom. where having an education and being treated for any health issue is completely up to you.

[hinduw]

only people who are hurt by socialism are the very very rich, and those rich people from the USA made the middle class and poor people believe that socialism is a bad thing. thats why u see dumb undeducated people like shawn and miketyson77 saying that socialism is evil even tough socialism would help them and get their kids the education they never had.

[Spare Moody]

Originally Posted by hinduw

only people who are hurt by socialism are the very very rich, and those rich people from the USA made the middle class and poor people believe that socialism is a bad thing. thats why u see dumb undeducated people like shawn and miketyson77 saying that socialism is evil even tough socialism would help them and get their kids the education they never had.

the golden rays of enlightenment have shined upon thee!!!

[!! Shawn]

Originally Posted by kswizzy99

buddy, you can't feed me false information cuz I live here in Canada. we get great health care and we get great education for almost nothing.

canadian doctors going to the states and not having the system here set in place for major illnesses is all propaganda.

you like to use the word FREE but really, is your system actually free? do you really have the choice in your hands? the choice is in how much money you've got. if you can't pay for your cancer treatments, well, the choice has been made for you. if you can't pay for your education well, the choice has once again been made for you. here, we have actual freedom. where having an education and being treated for any health issue is completely up to you.

* According to a September 14, 2007, article from CTV News, Canadian Liberal MP Belinda Stronach went to the United States for breast cancer surgery in June 2007. Stronach's spokesperson Greg MacEachern was quoted in the article saying that the US was the best place to have this type of surgery done. Stronach paid for the surgery out of her own pocket.[39] Prior to this incident, Stronach had stated in an interview that she was against two-tiered health care.[40]
* When Robert Bourassa, the premier of Quebec, needed cancer treatment, he went to the US to get it.[41]
* In 2007, it was reported that Canada sent scores of pregnant women to the US to give birth.[42] In 2007 a woman from Calgary who was pregnant with quadruplets was sent to Great Falls, Montana to give birth. An article on this incident states, "There was no room at any other Canadian neonatal intensive care unit."[43]
* Champion figure skater Audrey Williams needed a hip replacement. Even though she waited two years and suffered in pain, she still did not get the surgery, because the waiting list was so long. So she went to the US and spent her own money to get the surgery.[44]
* A January 19, 2008, article in The Globe And Mail states, "More than 150 critically ill Canadians – many with life-threatening cerebral hemorrhages – have been rushed to the United States since the spring of 2006 because they could not obtain intensive-care beds here. Before patients with bleeding in or outside the brain have been whisked through U.S. operating-room doors, some have languished for as long as eight hours in Canadian emergency wards while health-care workers scrambled to locate care." [45]


I am not sure if you are satisfied with your health care system because you have never experienced anything else, or if it is because you have never had a serious illness.

All I know is your Doctors only make 160k a year. We have doctors making upwards of a 1m a year with a good family practice doctor making upwards of 500k a year.

Studies show that 1 in 9 doctors trained in Canada will end up practising in the united states.

Getting an MRI does not take months here, it takes days if not hours. Consulting a specialist takes days not months.

The Canadian healthcare system is wonderfully efficient at accommodating the every day needs of its citizens, but when it encounters a true medical problem, they are under equiped, under manned, and over their head.

The US system is set up to compete. Not only can you see a specialist in less than 3 week, you can see the specalist of your chosing in less than a week.

You not only get to see a doctor soon, you have a choice of which doctor to see.

Whe have more, better equipment. And yes, more is always better. It means that you dont have a 22month waiting line to get an mri

Instead you might have a week wait to get mri, if you go to a medical imaging specialist center you can get an mri the same day.

If you looked at thet difference betten our healthcare systems, you wouldn't see much difference other than the private sectors role in our system.

[hinduw]

Originally Posted by !! Shawn

* According to a September 14, 2007, article from CTV News, Canadian Liberal MP Belinda Stronach went to the United States for breast cancer surgery in June 2007. Stronach's spokesperson Greg MacEachern was quoted in the article saying that the US was the best place to have this type of surgery done. Stronach paid for the surgery out of her own pocket.[39] Prior to this incident, Stronach had stated in an interview that she was against two-tiered health care.[40]
* When Robert Bourassa, the premier of Quebec, needed cancer treatment, he went to the US to get it.[41]
* In 2007, it was reported that Canada sent scores of pregnant women to the US to give birth.[42] In 2007 a woman from Calgary who was pregnant with quadruplets was sent to Great Falls, Montana to give birth. An article on this incident states, "There was no room at any other Canadian neonatal intensive care unit."[43]
* Champion figure skater Audrey Williams needed a hip replacement. Even though she waited two years and suffered in pain, she still did not get the surgery, because the waiting list was so long. So she went to the US and spent her own money to get the surgery.[44]
* A January 19, 2008, article in The Globe And Mail states, "More than 150 critically ill Canadians – many with life-threatening cerebral hemorrhages – have been rushed to the United States since the spring of 2006 because they could not obtain intensive-care beds here. Before patients with bleeding in or outside the brain have been whisked through U.S. operating-room doors, some have languished for as long as eight hours in Canadian emergency wards while health-care workers scrambled to locate care." [45]


I am not sure if you are satisfied with your health care system because you have never experienced anything else, or if it is because you have never had a serious illness.

All I know is your Doctors only make 160k a year. We have doctors making upwards of a 1m a year with a good family practice doctor making upwards of 500k a year.

Studies show that 1 in 9 doctors trained in Canada will end up practising in the united states.

Getting an MRI does not take months here, it takes days if not hours. Consulting a specialist takes days not months.

The Canadian healthcare system is wonderfully efficient at accommodating the every day needs of its citizens, but when it encounters a true medical problem, they are under equiped, under manned, and over their head.

The US system is set up to compete. Not only can you see a specialist in less than 3 week, you can see the specalist of your chosing in less than a week.

You not only get to see a doctor soon, you have a choice of which doctor to see.

Whe have more, better equipment. And yes, more is always better. It means that you dont have a 22month waiting line to get an mri

Instead you might have a week wait to get mri, if you go to a medical imaging specialist center you can get an mri the same day.

If you looked at thet difference betten our healthcare systems, you wouldn't see much difference other than the private sectors role in our system.

all the people you mentioned are very rich, i doubt that even 90 procent of americans can afford the best health care in their own country

[-Swizzy-]

yes typical. come up with isolated incidents. I could do the same if I was motivated enough to do some research and find as many if not more americans who have crossed over to get treatment in Canada. Even off the top of my head I could think of hockey players who have been treated for concussions in Canada even though they live and play in the states. Thats just more propoganda. Here is a small piece of info that I found after a single 2 second search on google.

Americans Less Likely to Survive Treatment

According to Woolhandler, by looking at already ill patients, the researchers eliminated any Canadian lifestyle advantage and just examined the degree to which the two systems affected patient deaths. (Mortality was the one kind of data they could extract from a disparate pool of 38 papers examining everything from kidney failure to rheumatoid arthritis.)

Overall, the results favored Canadians, who were 5 percent less likely than Americans to die in the course of treatment. Some disorders, such as kidney failure, favored Canadians more strongly than Americans, whereas others, such as hip fracture, had slightly better outcomes in the U.S. than in Canada. Of the 38 studies the authors surveyed, which were winnowed down from a pool of thousands, 14 favored Canada, five the U.S., and 19 yielded mixed results.



- Life expectancy is longer in Canada, and its infant mortality rate is lower than that of the U.S.