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View Poll Results: Do you support Socialism?
Yes 36 55.38%
No 29 44.62%
Voters: 65. You may not vote on this poll

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#181
Old 11-13-2012, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by One_Tycoon View Post
Sorry...this sounds like the Tobacco lobbyists who fund research organizations that conclude that there is no link between cancer and smoking cigarettes.

I've almost read the entire thing and still no actual retort other then "Most experts conclude there is no link between student aid and tuition going up". I guess if you keep saying it enough times...it will make it true.

All one needs is to use is observation. If you pump more money into the system...prices go up because money is soo easily available, therefore less worth. If you make higher education more easily accessible through Fed grants and guaranteed loans...universities respond by hiking up tuition. 1) because of inflation and 2) because they can. If you're gonna give them more 'students' to teach, they're gonna give you (and the students themselves later on) a higher price to pay for that service, so they can pay their professors and staff more money for teaching bigger classrooms of students.

What you're also doing is devaluing the degree itself. That articles says that "63 percent of U.S. jobs will require some form of postsecondary education". Of course they will but why is that? It's because of the Govt. A 'free" high School diploma is now almost worthless. Bachelor degrees will follow suit.

Pretty soon you're gonna have to go to school an additional 10 to 15 years...just to stand out from the rest of the crowd and get paid for a job that you could've gotten with a High School diploma... decades ago.

1_Cap over and out.
I was actually talking about this with my Girlfriend the other day. Not only does student aid effect a rise in tuition, it also results in the creation of many useless degrees that didn't exist back in the day.

I think it speaks volumes about the state of the education system that the 1st two years of college are basically learning stuff which should have been a per-requisit to graduation from highschool.
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#182
Old 11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Cuauhtémoc1520 View Post
Such a simple question from a naive point of view....

I support socialist programs but don't support a complete socialist govt. By the way, so does America because that's been it's policies since it became a country.

I don't think most Americans even know what socialism is, or the difference between socialism, capitalism, communism or any of these other words that republican talking heads spew out 24 hours a day.
America has been supporting socialist policies since it became a country? That is a fairly bold proclamation, care to back it up?
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#183
Old 11-13-2012, 08:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Sin City View Post
sorry, I missed this whole conversation but thanks to some red k I remembered it and am revisiting it.
anyway, your claims are unsubstantiated I invite you to post a legitimate study on this conducted by a reliable source. simply copying and pasting what some conservative political pundit wrote just doesn't do it, shawn.

there is no evidence what so ever that student loans drive up tuition!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...EX5U_blog.html

see^^ that's how you post links and articles with reliable data.
Sorry, I am not in the business of reading, or listening to pundits from any side. My opinions are my own. I base them on my own reasoning skills. I know its hard for someone who relies on talking points to comprehend, but formulating your own positions on complex issues is indeed possible!
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#184
Old 11-14-2012, 01:57 AM
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Originally Posted by BattlingNelson View Post
I am asking YOU. I am not interested in the opinions of a man who has been dead for years and therefore has no knowledge of the situation within the eurozone today.

YOU said the eurozone was proof of the failure of socialism. YOU defend that statement or STFU.


FYI I am perfectly aware of who Friedman was. I have a masters in economics.
Your laziness is your utter ignorance.

I have no desire to converse with a clueless individual who's laziness is borne by choice despite getting spoon-fed information already.

But I'll throw you this one last bone.

Greece. Economic policy. DEBT to GDP ratio. United States. Austerity.Spot the DIFFERENCE.

If you still don't know how to connect the dots then I'm sad for you since your so-called "masters" in economics failed to teach you anything.

Needless to say, this is the last post I'll waste on your expense. We should both move on good sir.

Last edited by mokmokv2; 11-14-2012 at 02:15 AM.
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#185
Old 11-14-2012, 04:36 AM
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Originally Posted by mokmokv2 View Post
Your laziness is your utter ignorance.

I have no desire to converse with a clueless individual who's laziness is borne by choice despite getting spoon-fed information already.

But I'll throw you this one last bone.

Greece. Economic policy. DEBT to GDP ratio. United States. Austerity.Spot the DIFFERENCE.

If you still don't know how to connect the dots then I'm sad for you since your so-called "masters" in economics failed to teach you anything.

Needless to say, this is the last post I'll waste on your expense. We should both move on good sir.
Why would I fact check an outragerous postulate from you? You won't even try to defend it. You call me lazy. LMAO.

You have no idea what you are talking about 'good sir'.
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#186
Old 11-14-2012, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by !! Shawn View Post
America has been supporting socialist policies since it became a country? That is a fairly bold proclamation, care to back it up?
One form of either state or federal funded programs have been around since almost the U.S became a country.

The biggest spending we have in our history are socialist programs for either healthcare, welfare or to help recruit soldiers.

It's not as clear cut as either we are socialist or not, we use and have used socialist programs for over a hundred years to help in certain situations like the one's I mentioned above.

We can't be one or the other, this extreme thinking is what is dividing us and the notion that we are anywhere near a completely socialist country is absurd. Most people accusing Obama of being a socialist don't even really know what that means.
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#187
Old 11-14-2012, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Cuauhtémoc1520 View Post
One form of either state or federal funded programs have been around since almost the U.S became a country.

The biggest spending we have in our history are socialist programs for either healthcare, welfare or to help recruit soldiers.

It's not as clear cut as either we are socialist or not, we use and have used socialist programs for over a hundred years to help in certain situations like the one's I mentioned above.

We can't be one or the other, this extreme thinking is what is dividing us and the notion that we are anywhere near a completely socialist country is absurd. Most people accusing Obama of being a socialist don't even really know what that means.
Some very knowledgeable poster here pointed the analogy of the "slow-kill" mechanism of socialism. How socialism is presented as something harmless and helpful, presented in small doses at first and ever increasing in its scope.

Good sir never forget what Lenin said of HOW COMMUNISM WILL CONQUER THE WEST.

THE CAPITALISTS WILL SELL US THE ROPE FROM WHICH WE WILL HANG THEM

During the 18th century up to the early 1900's the government was extremely small in its scope and power. And yet the average guy can get married, have 3-5 kids(in most cases more), send all his kids to school, wife stays home, and still have more than enough for recreation and retirement all throughout his life.

Socialism then hasn't yet crept into your government.

And yes this was the GOLDEN AGE OF THE UNITED STATES.

Now of course the next question is.

WTF happened?
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#188
Old 11-14-2012, 12:36 PM
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Simply put...

I do not support socialism.
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#189
Old 11-15-2012, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by mokmokv2 View Post
Some very knowledgeable poster here pointed the analogy of the "slow-kill" mechanism of socialism. How socialism is presented as something harmless and helpful, presented in small doses at first and ever increasing in its scope.

Good sir never forget what Lenin said of HOW COMMUNISM WILL CONQUER THE WEST.

THE CAPITALISTS WILL SELL US THE ROPE FROM WHICH WE WILL HANG THEM

During the 18th century up to the early 1900's the government was extremely small in its scope and power. And yet the average guy can get married, have 3-5 kids(in most cases more), send all his kids to school, wife stays home, and still have more than enough for recreation and retirement all throughout his life.

Socialism then hasn't yet crept into your government.

And yes this was the GOLDEN AGE OF THE UNITED STATES.

Now of course the next question is.

WTF happened?
Women came into the workforce thereby increasing production and wealth?
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by mokmokv2 View Post
Greece. Economic policy. DEBT to GDP ratio. United States. Austerity.Spot the DIFFERENCE.
The US does not exercise spending restraint. Just because they are wasting money on draconian criminal justice and on expensive wars and an absurd military instead of spending it on their citizens doesn't make them an "austerity" government.
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