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#21
Old 10-14-2012, 10:21 AM
TX_BOXNG
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Originally Posted by Frank Ducketts View Post
I wasn't 50-50. I knew Rios would win, and he won exactly how you said he did. Good post.
well yea i really feel it wasnt a 50/50 fight but u never wanna underestimate an opponent, so when he has power n heart u should recognize what the fighter might be capable of, Rios is gona get his confident back with this, n what i like that him n Garcia know each other so well, Rios after this will have his full confidence of Garcia of following the gameplan

Acosta had the same plan fight in the outside but Acosta is a good fighter from the outside unlike Alvarado n Acosta still couldnt avoid the ko from Rios

makes me wonder if the weight issue played a role on the Abril fight, but i still think Abril school Rios again, thats a fight that im scared to see but Abril does the deserve that W lol
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#22
Old 10-14-2012, 10:34 AM
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I actually see that in quite a lot of fighters nowadays, especially the younger ones that are coming up, that shoulder roll defense isn't for everybody, you need some really good natural defensive instincts to make it work. So yeah, I've seen more than once where younger fighters, whether they are emulating Mayeather or not, get tagged and hurt while trying to work that shoulder roll defense.

I think what's happening now with the shoulder roll defense that Mayweather uses so well is similar to what happened when Roy Jones was at the top. I remember quite a lot of younger fighters back then trying to be like Roy Jones, throwing lead left hooks and right hands while keeping their hands low. A lot of them learned the hard way that they weren't Roy Jones.

What's a little weird about Alvarado was that earlier in his career I remember him keeping both hands up on the inside and ripping away with his shots, whereas he's tried to roll the shoulder as a defensive move on the inside in his more recent fights.

Last edited by Silencers; 10-14-2012 at 10:38 AM.
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#23
Old 10-14-2012, 10:47 AM
Frank Ducketts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TX_BOXNG View Post
well yea i really feel it wasnt a 50/50 fight but u never wanna underestimate an opponent, so when he has power n heart u should recognize what the fighter might be capable of, Rios is gona get his confident back with this, n what i like that him n Garcia know each other so well, Rios after this will have his full confidence of Garcia of following the gameplan

Acosta had the same plan fight in the outside but Acosta is a good fighter from the outside unlike Alvarado n Acosta still couldnt avoid the ko from Rios

makes me wonder if the weight issue played a role on the Abril fight, but i still think Abril school Rios again, thats a fight that im scared to see but Abril does the deserve that W lol
Making weight played a huge roll in the Abril fight. The shoulder roll isn't just a roll of the shoulder. Alvarado didn't protect the body and Rios hurt Alvarado to the body which is what brought his hands down. Rios took a lot of Alvarados energy the round before the stoppage with bodyshots.
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#24
Old 10-14-2012, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Defututus View Post
using the philly shell automatically = trying to be like floyd mayweather
this......
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#25
Old 10-14-2012, 11:15 AM
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Now you done it. Mayweather's name = 20 page war of foolishness.

It does not matter what the intentions of the thread starter were. I realize he meant the philly shell whatever its called, not necessarily Mayweather. But once the name "Mayweather" shows up, half the forum turns retarded. Damage done.

Enjoy.
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#26
Old 10-14-2012, 11:18 AM
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It just takes a certain fighter to bust through that defense. Rios is one of them. Mayweather avoids those fighters that can expose him and threaten him. You mix that with the fine art of cherry picking and payoffs....you remain looking special!
Its not that it didnt work for Alvarado..it did! Rios just banged through it with big shots and tore the wall down!
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#27
Old 10-14-2012, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by PAC-BOY View Post
It just takes a certain fighter to bust through that defense. Rios is one of them. Mayweather avoids those fighters that can expose him and threaten him. You mix that with the fine art of cherry picking and payoffs....you remain looking special!
Its not that it didnt work for Alvarado..it did! Rios just banged through it with big shots and tore the wall down!
Mayweather is a pure boxer and master counter puncher. Alvarado is not, that style of defense doesn't work for him.

Rios would look foolish against Mayweather at this point, no way he busts through that defense. Two completely different fighters. But thank you for proving my case in the aforementioned post.
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#28
Old 10-14-2012, 05:00 PM
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That defense actually helped Alvarado get hit less. If he hadn't used it he would be like Rios just eating up punch after punch like they were candy.

What he should have done though was fight less on the inside and try to keep the fight at long range as much as possible. Like other posters have already mentioned.
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#29
Old 10-14-2012, 05:04 PM
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What was Alvarado thinking using that stupid damn philly shell defense? If you have serious defensive liabilities that's the last thing you should be trying. If you have slow reflexes and are easy to hit, especially on the inside, then using that leaves you very open and vulnerable to big shots and guess what? Alvarado got caught trying to use boxing techniques that no trainer in his right mind would have him using!

Now, not to slag on his trainer cause I'm sure I heard him saying to Alvarado to stop using it as it wasn't working, but he just kept doing it thinking that he was the one with the boxing skills. This is what happens kids when you try to fight like Mayweather and Toney without having any of the skill, speed, reflexes, general savvy and experience in that style. You get KTFO!

Why did he think that would work? If you're a slow, power punching guy with major defensive liabilities that breaks guys down and uses strength and power to win fights rather than defensive counter punching, then coming into your biggest career fight using a style that shouldn't even be thought about is just incredible. I could not believe my eyes when he came out using it. I thought he was taking the piss for a minute then he just stayed in it while getting hit with right hand and left hook over and over on the inside.

Really hate it when fighters do stupid **** like that and lose a fight because of it. Maybe he would have lost anyway, but from what had transpired in both of their offensive games, it looked to me that Alvarado could have certainly won it without such a moronic game plan.

What could he have been thinking? "Hmmm, maybe with my complete lack of any defensive skill, using one hand to block shots will be better than two! Lets do it!"
Abril beat Rios and used his shoulder as a shield. Alvarado saw that and must have focused on that while training. It was too late by then to drop it when his trainer told him to since he had been training like that for weeks. imo
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#30
Old 10-14-2012, 05:04 PM
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just like broners shoulder roll doesnt make him above average till proven otherwise.
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