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#201
Old 01-28-2012, 02:36 PM
Cutthroat
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Originally Posted by nomadman View Post
Exactly, yet people have a problem with that for some reason.

Just taking the US HW scene in isolation, big money sports obviously affect the size of the talent pool going into boxing, which like in almost every other country in the world, is a second-tier sport. A shambles of an amateur system, coupled with lack of success at the Olympics level produces less top level talents or those who can be promoted as such. Over-priced PPVs, poor matchmaking, poor promotion and greedy promoters compound the problem in the pros. Lack of interest by HBO and a shift from US to Germany for big fights means fewer Americans are exposed to the top heavyweights.

It's all just a massive clusterfuk, and I could totally sympathise with anyone who feels the same way. I know the HW scene in the US is dire. What I hate is this thinly veiled nationalistic excuse that just blithely ignores all the myriad problems to focus the blame on something which, whilst it definitely has an effect, no one can do anything about. Besides which it's only ever used to poke jabs at this current heavyweight division and its champions, and as wish fulfilment fantasies. And it really doesn't hold water.

Let's go back a bit to Louis's era, when boxing was one of the top sports in America. Where were all these awesome athletes then? Why did the division comprise oafs like Abe Simon and fat barflies like Tony Galento? Why were even top contenders like Max Baer crude, backhanding sluggers? The passage of time and nostalgia has lent a golden sheen to these fellows, but with the exception of Louis and a few others, they were not great athletes.

Now fast forward to the Golden Era. Filled with athletic talent right? Well, aside from Ali and Norton not really. Foreman? Strong but slow as an ox and crude. Shavers? Not unathletic, but hardly a top level athlete either. Frazier? You only have to look at his performance on Superstars to see he was neither fast nor particularly physically strong. As pure athletes, which is what this argument seems to be about, they would not have stood out from the crowd. What they could do, of course, was fight, which is all that matters, and all that has ever mattered, in a boxing ring.

I agree with a lot of what you said but except the part in the bold. You just can't compare soccer to sports like Basketball or American Football, Rugby yeah but that's it.

Or how these sports relate to the U.S, do you honestly think if the Klitschko bros. were born in America that they'd be boxing? These sports play a huge role that affects the American boxing scene especially with their increased popularity in the 70's-80's in which basketball's popularity was totally transformed.

Nearly every single child in America attends school, at age 12 they're allowed to play football/soccer/basketball/baseball etc. for free. Same with High school. You can be short and small and play basketball/football but that doesn't mean you'll succeed at a higher level which is why very few kids make it to play in college.

Seth Mitchell was forced to quit football because of injuries, stepped into the ring for the first time in his life in 2006, went 9-1 in just 2 years as an amateur, turned pro in '08, and has gone 24-0 the guy just KO'd Ibragimov in 2 rounds, a guy with over 200 Am. fights and 30 pro fights.

Deontay Wilder had just graduated and wanted to join a local college and play for either their football or basketball team, due to his newborn daughters' illness he was forced to join a community college. Stepped into the ring for the first time ever in October of 2005 and just in a little under 3 years he won the bronze medal at the Olympics.


Lennox Lewis played Canadian football, search on google images for a pic of him. And if you look at the comments one of them says:
"I almost talked him into coming to St. Jerome's and giving up the boxing. Good thing he didn't listen to me. He was quite the athlete. Played JDP Basketball for our Central West Regional Team."

Lennox could've been a basketball player lmao.




Oh btw, if you look at the athletes in the NBA/NFL from the 50s-80s they're nothing compared to the athletic freaks of today, guys are WAAAAY bigger than they used to be, bigger, stronger, faster, etc.
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#202
Old 01-28-2012, 04:06 PM
AntonTheMeh
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Originally Posted by Cutthroat View Post
I agree with a lot of what you said but except the part in the bold. You just can't compare soccer to sports like Basketball or American Football, Rugby yeah but that's it.

Or how these sports relate to the U.S, do you honestly think if the Klitschko bros. were born in America that they'd be boxing? These sports play a huge role that affects the American boxing scene especially with their increased popularity in the 70's-80's in which basketball's popularity was totally transformed.

Nearly every single child in America attends school, at age 12 they're allowed to play football/soccer/basketball/baseball etc. for free. Same with High school. You can be short and small and play basketball/football but that doesn't mean you'll succeed at a higher level which is why very few kids make it to play in college.

Seth Mitchell was forced to quit football because of injuries, stepped into the ring for the first time in his life in 2006, went 9-1 in just 2 years as an amateur, turned pro in '08, and has gone 24-0 the guy just KO'd Ibragimov in 2 rounds, a guy with over 200 Am. fights and 30 pro fights.

Deontay Wilder had just graduated and wanted to join a local college and play for either their football or basketball team, due to his newborn daughters' illness he was forced to join a community college. Stepped into the ring for the first time ever in October of 2005 and just in a little under 3 years he won the bronze medal at the Olympics.


Lennox Lewis played Canadian football, search on google images for a pic of him. And if you look at the comments one of them says:
"I almost talked him into coming to St. Jerome's and giving up the boxing. Good thing he didn't listen to me. He was quite the athlete. Played JDP Basketball for our Central West Regional Team."

Lennox could've been a basketball player lmao.




Oh btw, if you look at the athletes in the NBA/NFL from the 50s-80s they're nothing compared to the athletic freaks of today, guys are WAAAAY bigger than they used to be, bigger, stronger, faster, etc.
1st round ko.
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#203
Old 01-28-2012, 11:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Cutthroat View Post
I agree with a lot of what you said but except the part in the bold. You just can't compare soccer to sports like Basketball or American Football, Rugby yeah but that's it.
Why not? We're discussing potential talent here, so the sport itself is secondary to its popularity and the types of athletes it absorbs. In soccer's case this is pretty much 80% to 90% of athletic males in over a hundred countries on the planet, including many who could be potential heavyweights. Sure, some of the really big guys might go into rugby, but by and large the premiere athletes are all in soccer. And besides, before the Klitschkos, and to a lesser extent Lewis and Bowe, most of the best heavyweights were around the six foot two mark, so all this talk about NBA guys making awesome boxers is really not well founded in fact. Wilder has a chance to change that, but at the moment he's just a prospect, and not a particularly well-tested prospect at that.
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#204
Old 01-29-2012, 04:35 PM
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http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...tes-in-the-nfl

Imagine these guys playing centreback, ball-winning midfield, or even poacher...and oh yeah, they'd all be heavyweights too.
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#205
Old 01-29-2012, 06:18 PM
ShoulderRoll
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Originally Posted by nomadman View Post
Why not? We're discussing potential talent here, so the sport itself is secondary to its popularity and the types of athletes it absorbs.
We're talking about athletic talent that thrives in a contact sport.

Soccer players don't exactly fit that description.

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#206
Old 01-29-2012, 06:42 PM
nomadman
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Originally Posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
We're talking about athletic talent that thrives in a contact sport.

Soccer players don't exactly fit that description.
Peter Aerts



Quote:
At the age of six, Peter began to play soccer. He continued to do so until he reached the seventeenth year of his life. In 1983 he started to practice Tae-Kwon-Do for about two years.
Ernesto Hoost



Quote:
Ernesto Hoost put on his first pair of boxing gloves at the age of 15. Until then his big passion had been soccer, He played in the inter-regional...
Remy Bonjasky



Quote:
At the age of five I started to play soccer such as every ordinary Dutch boy did. This very popular Dutch sport was the love of my life and I put my heart and soul to it. I was a defender as well as the goalkeepers backup. These days I could not imagine a life without my beloved soccer....
Oh yeah, and:



Quote:
Sergio Martinez is a late starter in boxing. He didn't take up the sport until he was 20 years old when he realized that his dream of being an Argentine soccer star wasn't meant to be.
Yeah, a right bunch of whining wimps, huh?

Last edited by nomadman; 01-29-2012 at 06:45 PM.
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#207
Old 01-29-2012, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by nomadman View Post
Peter Aerts





Ernesto Hoost





Remy Bonjasky





Oh yeah, and:





Once again, numbnuts, are you even aware of what you're arguing about?
LMAO!! Owned!
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