Facts About Cubans in Professional Boxing

[D-MiZe]

it's also true that there would be several more champions.

That's obvious, it goes without saying. But it's a pretty weak angle to come from to try and make a point.

[techliam]

While it's true that there would be a lot of weaker Cuban fighters in pro boxing if Cuba wasn't communist, it's also true that there would be several more champions. But obviously your tiny little mind cannot grasp that simple concept.

Sooo not much different from the other countries listed up there?

I have to agree with D-Mize... The argument that Cuba would have more champions everywhere had it not been communist, is only as good as these arguments:

The US would dominate the Heavyweights had it not been for the NFL etc. But they don't.
Vitali Klitschko would have won if it wasn't for the cut so technically won. But he didn't.

Whats to say these boxers aren't a product of the communist system? Their determination is to get paid and live the good life, so they trained hard?

Theres a million and one ways to prop up a country, you just picked the most flawed way to do it

I do love Cuba though. I heard they have a British flag craze over there ever since the 2012 Olympics. Weird stuff

[CubanGuyNYC]

That's obvious, it goes without saying. But it's a pretty weak angle to come from to try and make a point.

It's also obvious that there would be more weak fighters.

You already know the point of this thread -- to counter an anti-Cuban thread posted by another "member" (as in the male body part). There is more to say, but these facts I've already mentioned strike directly at that dope's "argument."

[HaglerSteelChin]

This has got to be the most ******ed angle from a Cuban fight fan, ever.

It's a country which has banned fighters from turning professional so only those who are certain to make a living from it will dare risk the journey to America. If Cuba wasn't a communist shithole then you'd drown in the amount of bums you'd produce.

If you want to prove how good Cuban boxers are, this is the worst possibly way to go about it. You're only making yourself look like an idiot.

Unfortunately, an imbecile as yourself fails to recognize there was a LONG cuban boxing tradition before communism took over. Did you ever hear about the original Kid Chocolate and Kid Gavilan? There were champions before Castro took over. The sport would be popular even if Daffy Duck was president.

I also agree with Cuban Guy about Santana as he will be a solid contender. Santana dispels Bob Arum’s theory that only black Cubans can fight as Santana is white. Arum once said that "White Cubans only follow baseball and not boxing", something to that nature.

The guy who started the thread possibly is trying to start up some Mexico vs. Cuba animosity. Little does he know that when Communism took over in Cuba many Cuban Boxers made a name for themselves in Mexico as Sugar Ramos, Jose Napoles, Florentino Fernandez, Luis Rodriguez, etc. In fact, the Mexican people embraced some of these fighters as their own. Salvador Sanchez growing up cited Jose Napoles (Cuban) along with Mexican Ruben Olivares as his two favorite fighters.

As far as Rios vs Gamboa, I am fan of both fighters, but that is not the best fight to be made. Rios is a natural JWW and I think him and Lucas would be a much better match.

[jri9d0]

Unfortunately, an imbecile as yourself fails to recognize there was a LONG cuban boxing tradition before communism took over. Did you ever hear about the original Kid Chocolate and Kid Gavilan? There were champions before Castro took over. The sport would be popular even if Daffy Duck was president.

I also agree with Cuban Guy about Santana as he will be a solid contender. Santana dispels Bob Arum’s theory that only black Cubans can fight as Santana is white. Arum once said that "White Cubans only follow baseball and not boxing", something to that nature.

The guy who started the thread possibly is trying to start up some Mexico vs. Cuba animosity. Little does he know that when Communism took over in Cuba many Cuban Boxers made a name for themselves in Mexico as Sugar Ramos, Jose Napoles, Florentino Fernandez, Luis Rodriguez, etc. In fact, the Mexican people embraced some of these fighters as their own. Salvador Sanchez growing up cited Jose Napoles (Cuban) along with Mexican Ruben Olivares as his two favorite fighters.

As far as Rios vs Gamboa, I am fan of both fighters, but that is not the best fight to be made. Rios is a natural JWW and I think him and Lucas would be a much better match.

Not to be off topic but that's an interesting avy, care to elaborate?

[D-MiZe]

It's also obvious that there would be more weak fighters.

You already know the point of this thread -- to counter an anti-Cuban thread posted by another "member" (as in the male body part). There is more to say, but these facts I've already mentioned strike directly at that dope's "argument."

Yes and all I'm saying is that of all the arguments you could've used...

I don't know the other thread was about but just rise above it.

[CubanGuyNYC]

Sooo not much different from the other countries listed up there?

I have to agree with D-Mize... The argument that Cuba would have more champions everywhere had it not been communist, is only as good as these arguments:

The US would dominate the Heavyweights had it not been for the NFL etc. But they don't.
Vitali Klitschko would have won if it wasn't for the cut so technically won. But he didn't.

Whats to say these boxers aren't a product of the communist system? Their determination is to get paid and live the good life, so they trained hard?

Theres a million and one ways to prop up a country, you just picked the most flawed way to do it

I do love Cuba though. I heard they have a British flag craze over there ever since the 2012 Olympics. Weird stuff

A million and one ways? Give me another. Indulge me.

It's true that practically all of the mentioned boxers are a product of the communist system. It's also true that Cuba had a successful history in pro boxing pre-Castro. Cuba had her first world champion before either Mexico or Puerto Rico, for instance, the ATG "Kid Chocolate". "Kid Gavilan" was a star fighting on American TV in the fifties. Along with another Cuban, Jose Napoles, who had to leave Cuba to continue to fight pro, Gavilan is considered one of the top-ten greatest welterweights of all time. There are others. I wouldn't say that Cuban pro success is a product of the communist system. In fact, I would say it's in spite of the communist system, since most of our guys have developed bad habits fighting as amateurs for so long.

P.S. I didn't know about that craze you mentioned. I can understand it, though. I've always thought the Union Jack is a cool looking flag.

[CubanGuyNYC]

Yes and all I'm saying is that of all the arguments you could've used...

I don't know the other thread was about but just rise above it.

What have I said that is so "low"? I've stated facts without resorting to bashing a whole people, just the animal that is trying to spread hate and garbage. You may not agree with my argument, but I certainly think it's valid...and I'm not alone.

[HaglerSteelChin]

Not to be off topic but that's an interesting avy, care to elaborate?

Baseball and Boxing started to become popular in Cuba in the late 1800's. However, there were some racial schism around black cubans (african heritiage) and White Cubans (spanaird descent). The govt put a stop in sanctioning boxing around the 1910's, than they reinstated the sport around the 1920's.

There were many notable bouts in Havana like Johnson-Willard that took place in the early 1900's. Syndicates did influence the sport and there was corruption.

As for Champions i already mentioned like six guys who were champ before Castro took over. There is a book by Jon Ducan that covers a lot of this history.

[HeroBando]

Good stuff. Don't understand the complaining, the other thread claims Cubans are failures as pros, clearly not the case. One key point is that most of these guys are still prospects by pro standards, most have less than 20 bouts/4 years of pro XP. However they're generally moved faster, so people forget how green they are as pros.

A couple of omissions from your list: Dorticos, Sullivan Barrera (what's going on? inactive for 1 yr), Collado, Luis Garcia.