How much more Mayweather needs to do to be serious candidate for GOAT?

[res]

The match-up is too silly to entertain honestly. Mayweather was at his best south of 140 lbs IMO so it speaks well for his own greatness and ability that he's been successful at 147/154. Robinson would encounter the same difficulty finding Floyd's chin, but when he's ripping shots to the body in bunches and often, it is going to hurt much more than anybody Floyd has faced, not to mention they will be coming in much faster. Floyd does not have the power at 147 to bother him with his counter rights and Robinson wasn't short in the reflexes department himself. He doesn't need Floyd to go toe-to-toe to out-jab and out-work him, or even stop him. Of course if it came to blows he'd steam roll him in devastating fashion.

Yeah I agree, I give Floyd atleast a chance in a 10 round fight but I still favor Ray. I think Floyd has no chance in a 15 round bout.

[McGoorty]

Greb ?

Ever seen Robinson fight?

I honestly don't see how he has come to be known primarily as this grand, elegant boxer. Dancer, my ass. Guy was a savage. Sure, He circled the ring with fluidity and balance and possessed a quick, accurate jab, but used it to set up and unload an array of power blows, effectively choosing his spots and ripping off multiple shots to the body and head at the drop of a dime. Had so much speed and power, could punch and hurt you wading in-and-out, going forward or backwards, with a cast iron chin of his own. Best combination puncher I've ever seen -- that includes Louis, Tyson, Leonard, et al. This is based primarily on '50s Middleweight material, when Robinson was over 30 years old and no longer at his peak or even his most dominant weight class. Crazy.

Comparing his record to anybody not named Greb, Langford, Charles, Armstrong is almost a certain joke as well.

I dont even rate those guys as a legit comparison to Ray Robinson, I know they are highly popular and deserve to be. BUT, seriously theres no way Greb for instance was comparable, for a start he wasnt the complete fighter like Ray,, SRR had a dynamite punch... Greb was NOT a puncher compared to the likes of SRR or Les Darcy for that matter,,, I could go on about the others too, but hey I just woke up,, see ya'll in a few hours lol

[McGoorty]

Yeah I agree, I give Floyd atleast a chance in a 10 round fight but I still favor Ray. I think Floyd has no chance in a 15 round bout.

I hate the fact that title fights are only 12 rounds and in my opinion has wrecked title fights ever since and has created a new type of fighter,, something akin to the 10 round ND experts that were in the US a long time ago, I am sick to death of watching the likes of mayweather cruising through fights and not really taking any risks,,,, I wish we still had 20 round fights, they would have been true wars.......... No cruising for 20 rounds, that would have been impossible.

[NChristo]

I dont even rate those guys as a legit comparison to Ray Robinson, I know they are highly popular and deserve to be. BUT, seriously theres no way Greb for instance was comparable, for a start he wasnt the complete fighter like Ray,, SRR had a dynamite punch... Greb was NOT a puncher compared to the likes of SRR or Les Darcy for that matter,,, I could go on about the others too, but hey I just woke up,, see ya'll in a few hours lol

Are you trying to imply that Darcy is greater then Greb ?.
You don't need to be a 'dynamite' puncher to be up there by the way, e.g Willie Pep and Henry Armstrong.

[McGoorty]

Are you trying to imply that Darcy is greater then Greb ?.
You don't need to be a 'dynamite' puncher to be up there by the way, e.g Willie Pep and Henry Armstrong.

No I'm not implying that, just that Darcy had a serious dose of TNT in both hands, as for who is greater ?. unfair comparison, Darcy's last fight was at age 20. Darcy had he lived would probably have fought around 299 fights like Harry did. A Greb V Darcy fight around 1921 would have been one of the classics, 20 rounds of pure fury, and not much chance of a stoppage. when Darcy had his last fight Greb was still on the way up. The point I'm making about SRR is that there was nothing lacking in his armoury. Please understand that Greb is one of my favourites as well and yes a dynamite punch is not the be all and end all, but certainly I prefer Darcy,, a combination of iron chin/dynamite on both hands/skills/stamina/speed of hand and foot sure makes for an exciting fighter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Darcy ?,, yes his early death may leave some questions in some minds, and the biggest question is how a Darcy V Greb fight would have turned out. Many decades have now passed, so I cant be sure especially since no film of a Greb fight exists, but Jack Doc Kearns certainly was a bit of an expert on fighters and had seen Greb, Darcy, Klaus, ketchel, Walker, Flowers, McGoorty, Clabby, Gibbons, Papke in action by the early 30's when he stated that in his opinion Les Darcy was the best Middleweight he ever saw, (he trained Walker so one would have expected Jack to have favoured Walker, but according to Kearns, walker wasnt a chance in that match-up). ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Boxing history is basically stats and opinions and great books and film,, nothing more.

[McGoorty]

No I'm not implying that, just that Darcy had a serious dose of TNT in both hands, as for who is greater ?. unfair comparison, Darcy's last fight was at age 20. Darcy had he lived would probably have fought around 299 fights like Harry did. A Greb V Darcy fight around 1921 would have been one of the classics, 20 rounds of pure fury, and not much chance of a stoppage. when Darcy had his last fight Greb was still on the way up. The point I'm making about SRR is that there was nothing lacking in his armoury. Please understand that Greb is one of my favourites as well and yes a dynamite punch is not the be all and end all, but certainly I prefer Darcy,, a combination of iron chin/dynamite on both hands/skills/stamina/speed of hand and foot sure makes for an exciting fighter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Darcy ?,, yes his early death may leave some questions in some minds, and the biggest question is how a Darcy V Greb fight would have turned out. Many decades have now passed, so I cant be sure especially since no film of a Greb fight exists, but Jack Doc Kearns certainly was a bit of an expert on fighters and had seen Greb, Darcy, Klaus, ketchel, Walker, Flowers, McGoorty, Clabby, Gibbons, Papke in action by the early 30's when he stated that in his opinion Les Darcy was the best Middleweight he ever saw, (he trained Walker so one would have expected Jack to have favoured Walker, but according to Kearns, walker wasnt a chance in that match-up). ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Boxing history is basically stats and opinions and great books and film,, nothing more.

Mayweather ?... well judging by the common opponent he has with Pacquiao, Miguel Cotto, I think Pacquiao is way better than Mayweather,, and I can now see why Floyd wants to avoid Pacquiao..... So Floyd, you either fight Pacman within the year or forever be ranked behind him, no more excuses are acceptable.

[wmute]

Mayweather ?... well judging by the common opponent he has with Pacquiao, Miguel Cotto, I think Pacquiao is way better than Mayweather,, and I can now see why Floyd wants to avoid Pacquiao..... So Floyd, you either fight Pacman within the year or forever be ranked behind him, no more excuses are acceptable.

Are you serious?

[Daddy T]

tommy hearns would destroy him

[Barn]

Ever seen Robinson fight?

I honestly don't see how he has come to be known primarily as this grand, elegant boxer. Dancer, my ass. Guy was a savage. Sure, He circled the ring with fluidity and balance and possessed a quick, accurate jab, but used it to set up and unload an array of power blows, effectively choosing his spots and ripping off multiple shots to the body and head at the drop of a dime. Had so much speed and power, could punch and hurt you wading in-and-out, going forward or backwards, with a cast iron chin of his own. Best combination puncher I've ever seen -- that includes Louis, Tyson, Leonard, et al. This is based primarily on '50s Middleweight material, when Robinson was over 30 years old and no longer at his peak or even his most dominant weight class. Crazy.

Comparing his record to anybody not named Greb, Langford, Charles, Armstrong is almost a certain joke as well.

Good post.

I remember watching the Fullmer fight where he got the KO, he basically abandoned the jab and was just launching right hand and left hook leads. Coupled with inside fighting in a very messy fight.

Robinson could box though, no doubt about that. As you say his jab was nice, not too powerful but very frequent and accurate.

[Faerun]

1. Martinez @154
2. Pacquiao @147
3. Alvarez @154

If he fought and beat Martinez at 160 he'd have a legit claim at GOAT in my book.