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Old 08-07-2009, 02:27 PM
Obama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benncollinsaad View Post
I do believe a prime Virgil Hill beats a prime Bernard Hopkins. In a close fight that is. Altho Virgil may not be the best LHW or CW ever, he sure is one of the all time top 10 in both classes.
Now hold the **** up there. You've gone too far.

In all honesty, Virgil Hill is one of the most protected American champions of all time. The man had 11 title fights before he stepped up in opposition to fight an over-the-hill Tommy Hearns. Let me repeat that, he stepped UP in competition to fight an OVER THE HILL fighter, and he lost!

First Stint as LHW Champion:
The only reason Hill became Champion in the first place is because Marvin Johnson was washed up and lost to a man he already stopped previously. Stewart was never World Champion before that fight and was never World Champion again after. You look through Virgill's list of opponents before losing to Hearns and it's incredibly bleak. I mean without a doubt Bobby Czyz is the most credible Light Heavyweight on it. None of the other fighters aside from Bobby and Stewart ever won a World title PERIOD. And this just isn't at the time he fought them, it's over the entire length of their careers. In one of his early defenses he fights this guy named Ramzi Hassan and goes the distance with him. In Hassan's previous fight he's KOed in the last round by a man Hill should have faced instead of Hassan. His name was Tony Willis, and he was never that good but he had KO power so he was considered too dangerous for a protected fighter like Hill to fight. In Hassan's next fight after Hill, he gets KOed in 5 by the new WBO Champion Michael Moorer. With this KO Moorer increased his winning streak to 12 wins all via KO. 5 of the 11 fights Moorer had before this went 1 round, and another 5 went 2 rounds, with only 1 going 4 rounds. Would we ever get to see Moorer vs Hill? Not a chance. So the LHW career of Michael Moorer ended with 22 wins, no losses, and 22 KOs.

Second Stint as LHW Champion:
3 fights after losing to Hearns, Hill gets his WBA LHW title back in a vacant title fight. So that's 2 times he's won the title without really beating anyone of consequence for it. I mean Frank Tate was no bum, at Middleweight anyways. But this was LHW...Tate was far from a quality fighter at LHW. Tate actually having a record of once being a World Champion however enticed Hill to give the man a rematch some years later. Whoever Hill's manager was, did a DAMN good job. Enough was enough with the over-protection for the most part though, Hill finally started getting matched with recognizable names on a more regular basis. Notable wins of his second reign: Adolpho Washington, Fabrice Tiozzo, Lou Del Valle, and Henry Maske. Stylistically Hill was a problem for Fabrice (who I consider to be the better fighter of the two, something their record would support). The first win was a SD that could have gone either way, then years later Hill wins the Cruiserweight title from him via 1st round KO (lucky for Hill he caught him early). But hey, he won. Second biggest damn accomplishment of his whole career. Lou De Valle was an over rated fighter that never accomplished anything other than winning a vacant title and losing it immediately. Then there was Henry Maske...who was damn good, and nearly too good for Hill as he won yet another SD. It was Henry's first loss and it sent him into retirement. 10+ years later Henry came out of retirement for the sole purpose of beating Virgil, and he did. After the first fight with Henry, Hill would go on to lose back to back against Dariusz Michalczewski and RJJ, marking the end of his success as a Light Heavyweight. His success at Cruiserweight stems no further than what I stated earlier in the paragraph.

Main Guys Hill Avoided:
Michael Moorer
"Prince" Charles Williams
Jeff Harding
Dennis Andries
Mike McCallum

Where Hill rates in history:
Unfortunately for his fans...not remotely high. I couldn't put the man on a top 40 all time Light Heavyweight list. To do so would be a travesty of justice. He wasn't as good as the Light Heavyweights slightly before his time (Eddie Mustafa Muhammad, Matthew Saad Muhammad, Michael Spinks, Marvin Johnson, Dwight Muhammad Qawi), he wasn't as good as some of the Light Heavyweights during his time (Michael Moorer, Charles Williams), and he wasn't as good as the Light Heavyweights after his time either (RJJ, and soon to come Chad Dawson). 30 years of history sampled, 9 guys to rate over him at LHW in that time alone. How he makes any LHW top 10 list is completely beyond me.

Last edited by Obama; 08-07-2009 at 02:30 PM.
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