View Full Version : Time to go back to 15 rounds?


Stiv Rex
03-09-2006, 10:20 PM
When I watched the 2nd hopkins taylor fight and the 12th ended I was thinking, man this isnt over, both of these guys have more fight in them and its too close. My history on this is spotty and I dont feel like looking it up right now, but they changed the max number of rounds in a fight from 15 to 12 after the ray mancini duk koo kim fight, right? was it suggested by dr. flip homansky, incorporated by the nevada athletic commission and then followed suit throughout the world? i think thats how it happened.
anyway, i read about guys 100 years ago going 20, 30, 40 rounds and more. when was it set at 15? was it an unofficial thing that became official? i would think sometime in the 30's or so, but thats just a guess.
am i the only guy who thinks that there should be 15 rounds again?

sleazyfellow
03-09-2006, 10:29 PM
i dont know if theyll ever go 15 rounds since after mancini killed duk koo kim r sumthing in the ring back in the 80s they("scientist, experts") found out the 13, 14, and 15th rounds r the rounds the most damage happens, but what the hell do they know? lol but its probobly true since thats a long time to fight.

MlLkMan
03-09-2006, 10:30 PM
I think 15 rounders will separate pretenders from contenders.

Stiv Rex
03-09-2006, 10:43 PM
yeah, i agree rebel. i cant count the number of fights ive seen just in the last 2 or 3 years that deserved more rounds.
if they made the fights longer it wouldnt just test the physical stamina of the fighters, but their strategy also.
thats where a fight like hopkins-taylor 2 would get really interesting.

Verstyle
03-09-2006, 10:55 PM
i dont know if theyll ever go 15 rounds since after mancini killed duk koo kim r sumthing in the ring back in the 80s they("scientist, experts") found out the 13, 14, and 15th rounds r the rounds the most damage happens, but what the hell do they know? lol but its probobly true since thats a long time to fight.


yes it was here u guys go.http://boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=1639

Stiv Rex
03-09-2006, 11:03 PM
ok, there you go, it WAS the duk kim fight. and the wbc started the change.
ive never seen the fight, but ive read that it was a beating that should have been stopped way earlier. can you blame the long fight or a bad ref for this?
by the way, the ref committed suicide a couple months after this fight...

Da Iceman
03-09-2006, 11:48 PM
its the refs fault, he shouldve stopped it, and i heard kim had trouble making weight.

Dempsey 1919
03-10-2006, 01:00 AM
anyway, i read about guys 100 years ago going 20, 30, 40 rounds and more. when was it set at 15? was it an unofficial thing that became official? i would think sometime in the 30's or so, but thats just a guess.
am i the only guy who thinks that there should be 15 rounds again?

the first fight using the mandatory 15 rounds was the heavyweight championship fight between champion jess willard and the challenger jack dempsey. i love that fight. i repeatedly watch it all the time. gotta love mad jack!

http://www.espace-martial.com/album/data/media/19/jack_dempsey.jpg

Tony Blitz
03-10-2006, 03:43 AM
A Gatti-Ward type fight with 15 rounds in this new age of boxing where fighters dehydrate themselves up to the double digits is instant death. Plus, who the **** wants to see Hopkins-Taylor for 15 rounds :p

ferocity
03-10-2006, 05:39 AM
its the refs fault, he shouldve stopped it, and i heard kim had trouble making weight.

I don't think you can only blame the ref. You blame the ref, then you'd also have to blame the corner and the fighter for being so damn tough.

Although I don't think a boxer wants to die in the ring, I belive every boxer is aware that in between those ropes their is a chance he may die. But a fighter knows that risk and accpets it. Its a shame the ref took his own life, I havn't seen the fight but if Kim was fighting back then why stop the fight, but the Mancini v. Kim fight was the fight that caused the wbc to change the championship rounds to 12 and then the rest of the organizations followed.

I think it would be good to see 15 rounds again or how about have the 15 rounds for rematchs? Anytime a rematch take place, it would be mandatory for the fighters to fight in a 15 round Championship fight.

Yaman
03-10-2006, 07:03 AM
15 rounds is too dangerous if two well conditioned world class fighter go at it for so long. 12 rounds is perfect and not that boring imo. Its just so sad about the whole Kim fight that so many people died because of that fight.

I don't wanna go offtopic that much but i remember seeing a docu of a fight between a Puerto Rican and black fighter were the PR died. Do you guys know about this?

Southpaw Stinger
03-10-2006, 12:09 PM
I wish the old 15 rounders would return. Seperates the men from the boys, the champs from the chumps. Also we should just have one world champion for each division.

It would be great to see to highly trained fighters have a 15 rounder for the one and only world heavyweight title. This would bring peoples interest back into boxing.

MickyHatton
03-10-2006, 02:18 PM
i dont know if theyll ever go 15 rounds since after mancini killed duk koo kim r sumthing in the ring back in the 80s they("scientist, experts") found out the 13, 14, and 15th rounds r the rounds the most damage happens, but what the hell do they know? lol but its probobly true since thats a long time to fight.

Yep thats true, fatige and dehydration rapidly increases the chances of brain injury, hence the cut to 12, imagine some of the recent wars going 15 rounds, imagine Lacy having to do another 3 with Calzaghe in the state he was in, he would have been hurt!

Da Iceman
03-10-2006, 08:18 PM
I wish the old 15 rounders would return. Seperates the men from the boys, the champs from the chumps. Also we should just have one world champion for each division.

It would be great to see to highly trained fighters have a 15 rounder for the one and only world heavyweight title. This would bring peoples interest back into boxing.
yea seperate the men from the *****s

mrc213
03-12-2006, 04:18 AM
I believe it would be more exciting for us to watch and show the pretenders to contenders and also is physically more capable but for them it would be hell if they changed it back to 15 rounds cuz like near the 9th round there almost all out of power think of 15 ,**** I know i'd die in the ring after
that but like i said i gotta admit as long as not to many people were dieing it would be crazy ass fights.

Yaman
03-12-2006, 08:48 AM
Yeah, we can see a diffirence between the contenders and pretenders..and maybe see some people die in the ring..awesome.

leff
03-12-2006, 04:02 PM
15 rounds is too dangerous if two well conditioned world class fighter go at it for so long. 12 rounds is perfect and not that boring imo. Its just so sad about the whole Kim fight that so many people died because of that fight.

I don't wanna go offtopic that much but i remember seeing a docu of a fight between a Puerto Rican and black fighter were the PR died. Do you guys know about this?

yepp ive seen it on a documentary and the guy died way before the 15th round.

the death in the kim fight was because off bad reffing, i want the 15 rounders back

Stiv Rex
03-12-2006, 08:22 PM
Although I don't think a boxer wants to die in the ring, I belive every boxer is aware that in between those ropes their is a chance he may die. But a fighter knows that risk and accpets it.


Yeah, we can see a diffirence between the contenders and pretenders..and maybe see some people die in the ring..awesome.


people die in just about every sport, it happens. it used to happen a more in boxing before day-before weighins and mandatory catscans. this is not a sport where its an unexpected tragedy when someone dies. in boxing, people... will... die.
look at the woman in colorado, an amateur with 30+ fights, in perfect health. she took a weak left hook to the headgear from another woman wearing 14oz gloves, and suffered an aneurism and died.
last year in the whole world there were (if i remember right) 8 or 12 fatalities. more people died playing american football. how many died playing soccer? baseball? the only reason people get pissy about death in boxing in that the other guy is TRYING to hurt the opponent. its tragic but its gonna happen. to prevent death in boxing you dont need less boxing, you need more screening, more preparation.


I think it would be good to see 15 rounds again or how about have the 15 rounds for rematchs? Anytime a rematch take place, it would be mandatory for the fighters to fight in a 15 round Championship fight

i agree, or for any real championship it could be 15 rounds. they should do a poll of all the champions fighting right now, ask them if they would be opposed to fighting 15 rounds in title fights. i bet you wouldnt find very many at all opposed to it. ****, there were thousands of non title fights that went at least 12 rounds for what, 8 or 9 decades, at least? 3 more can only help to prove who the better boxer is.

Stiv Rex
03-12-2006, 08:29 PM
A Gatti-Ward type fight with 15 rounds in this new age of boxing where fighters dehydrate themselves up to the double digits is instant death. Plus, who the **** wants to see Hopkins-Taylor for 15 rounds :p

gatti and ward would have to pace themselves more. plus, i dont think that was a championship fight, was it? they only went 10 rounds, both of them were big punchers, not boxers. they knew what they were doing, both were going for the knockout, what made those fights so good was that neither of them could quite do it and neither would back down.

yeah, youre right about hopkins taylor, it was pretty boring if you were looking for a scrap. all the more reason to make it go 15, i want to see someone win. you know they both have pop left, and plenty of fight left. 12 wasnt enough to show who was better, make it 15

Stiv Rex
03-15-2006, 10:05 PM
A Gatti-Ward type fight with 15 rounds in this new age of boxing where fighters dehydrate themselves up to the double digits is instant death. Plus, who the **** wants to see Hopkins-Taylor for 15 rounds :p

they dont dehydrate more now than the old days, in fact they are way better off. there are day before weighins, which give the fighters time to rehydrate. they didnt have gatorade in the old days, didnt even know what electrolytes were.

TonyRingside
03-15-2006, 10:16 PM
i've seen the doo kuu kim fight, the fight was pretty close until the last couple of rounds when mancini just dominated, plus i think it was like 100 degrees that day, and the fight was outside.

Rockin'
03-15-2006, 11:03 PM
12 rounds is more than enough time to find who was the better fighter that night. Just because they have energy left does not mean that they have to use it. Remember that these are people sustaining irreversible damage. 12 rounds is long enough.

Rockin' :boxing:

Kid Achilles
03-15-2006, 11:23 PM
Stiv, please tell me you owe your name to

http://static.flickr.com/21/28744984_0fefab0f55_m.jpg

this guy.

K-DOGG
03-16-2006, 04:27 PM
When I watched the 2nd hopkins taylor fight and the 12th ended I was thinking, man this isnt over, both of these guys have more fight in them and its too close. My history on this is spotty and I dont feel like looking it up right now, but they changed the max number of rounds in a fight from 15 to 12 after the ray mancini duk koo kim fight, right? was it suggested by dr. flip homansky, incorporated by the nevada athletic commission and then followed suit throughout the world? i think thats how it happened.
anyway, i read about guys 100 years ago going 20, 30, 40 rounds and more. when was it set at 15? was it an unofficial thing that became official? i would think sometime in the 30's or so, but thats just a guess.
am i the only guy who thinks that there should be 15 rounds again?

Two things: 1.) Yes, I think that World Championship bouts should be 15 rounds. Primarily, I feel this way because the extra rounds would set a World Championship apart from any other fight and push the fighters to their limits....as should be the case for the richest prize in boxing. The fact is tragedies are going to happen in boxing...it's sad; but it's true....and they are going to happen whether a fight is 12 or 15. The only thing that can be done is rely upon the referee and ringside physicians to keep an intense eye on the situation...that's it. Boxing is dangeous whether it's a four or fourteen round match. Give the World Championships their significance back I say.

Now, #2.) I don't think I would have wanted to see three more rounds of Taylor-Hopkins. Depite the skill B-Hops has, I thought I had a "smellivision" that fight stunk so bad. :rolleyes:

:cool:

Stiv Rex
03-16-2006, 07:58 PM
Now, #2.) I don't think I would have wanted to see three more rounds of Taylor-Hopkins. Depite the skill B-Hops has, I thought I had a "smellivision" that fight stunk so bad. :rolleyes:

:cool:

okay fine, i give. taylor hopkins, all 24 rounds, pretty much sucked.

Stiv Rex
03-16-2006, 08:04 PM
Stiv, please tell me you owe your name to

http://static.flickr.com/21/28744984_0fefab0f55_m.jpg

this guy.

sid vicious? ha, no. i dont dislike the guy or anything, its just not my type of music. the stiv part would take a while to explain and its not that important, its just a change of my name. rex is latin for king, it was a nickname some guys in the gym gave me, cause when i wasnt working out i was reading and it came up once when i had a latin textbook.
stefano dapoliello is my given name but i go by steve

Kid Achilles
03-16-2006, 08:09 PM
Naw that's not Sid Vicious, it's Stiv Bators. Frontman of the Dead Boys, one of my all time favorite bands.

Dempsey 1919
03-16-2006, 08:15 PM
Stiv, please tell me you owe your name to

http://static.flickr.com/21/28744984_0fefab0f55_m.jpg

this guy.

that ***** look worse than the rolling stones, lol!! :D

tjmoney
03-17-2006, 08:05 PM
Fighters will continue to die in the ring until the end of the sport. There is no getting around it. When you have two guys fighting for tons of money in front of thousands of people you know that neither one is going to give an inch. They are going to fight their hearts out because neither one wants to look week, or take the losers share. I mean people die in 4 round tough man competitions, people have died in 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, and 15 round fights. I mean it doesnt matter how long the fight is scheduled for if a fighter is in serious trouble its the refs job to step in and end it. Thats the reason hes in there to keep it clean and to prevent either fighter from suffering any long term damage. I say bring back the 15 rounders, especially for the smaller guys. Todays fighters have better stamina than any of the fighters who fought in 15 rounders, and far better stamina than the guys who fought in 15 plus rounders way back when. I mean hell, back then everyone smoked and drink like sailors and still went 20 - 30 rounds, you dont think guys like Mayweather, Pacqiou and Taylor who have never smoked a single cigar and rarely if ever drink alcohol couldnt do the same? Be serious, we need the 15 rounders again, if im payin 50 dollars a fight i wanna at least see the guys break a sweat, you know what im sayin fellas????

There is however one division i never wish to see another 15 rounder for and thats the Heavyweights. I mean could you imagine watchin John Ruiz vs Chris Byrd for 15 rounds????

Da Iceman
03-18-2006, 12:23 AM
when it comes down to it, its the refs job to stop the fight. all they need is some better refs. i would fall asleep on that ruiz ****.

smasher
03-18-2006, 12:22 PM
the death in the kim fight was because off bad reffing, i want the 15 rounders backReferee Richard Greene (also reffed Ai-Holmes) should not be criticized for the way he handled the Mancini-Kim fight. Although Greene later committed suicide we don't know what other personal problems he had which may have led to him taking his own life.

Mancini-Kim was a toe-to toe brawl with two head-on fighters who were similar in size, style and physical attributes. I remember watching the fight live and at no time did I ever think either fighter was in jeopardy of being hurt, much less killed.

In the older days fighters had to make weight the day of the fight which often caused fighters to enter the ring dehydrated. Maybe the fact that heavyweights don't have to make weight by dehydrating themselves is a factor in why no man has ever died fighting a 15 round heavyweight championship fight.

Cutting championship fights to 12 rounds didn't help bantamweight Kiko Bejines who died after being KO'd in the 12th and last round against Alberto Davila in a WBC bantamweight title fight in September 1983.

Nowadays, fighters weigh in the day before a fight which allow them to replenish and hydrate their bodies and relace lost fluids and get closer to their natural 'in fighting shape' weight. Maybe this rule should have been introduced first before cutting fights from 15 rounds to 12.

leff
03-18-2006, 01:03 PM
Referee Richard Greene (also reffed Ai-Holmes) should not be criticized for the way he handled the Mancini-Kim fight. Although Greene later committed suicide we don't know what other personal problems he had which may have led to him taking his own life.

Mancini-Kim was a toe-to toe brawl with two head-on fighters who were similar in size, style and physical attributes. I remember watching the fight live and at no time did I ever think either fighter was in jeopardy of being hurt, much less killed.

In the older days fighters had to make weight the day of the fight which often caused fighters to enter the ring dehydrated. Maybe the fact that heavyweights don't have to make weight by dehydrating themselves is a factor in why no man has ever died fighting a 15 round heavyweight championship fight.

Cutting championship fights to 12 rounds didn't help bantamweight Kiko Bejines who died after being KO'd in the 12th and last round against Alberto Davila in a WBC bantamweight title fight in September 1983.

Nowadays, fighters weigh in the day before a fight which allow them to replenish and hydrate their bodies and relace lost fluids and get closer to their natural 'in fighting shape' weight. Maybe this rule should have been introduced first before cutting fights from 15 rounds to 12.

allrighty than, atleast it seems you agree that the length off rounds is not the reason off the death, so 15 rounds again would be nice.

by the way it takes 48 hours to get back to normal from dehydration.

smasher
03-18-2006, 02:44 PM
it takes 48 hours to get back to normal from dehydration.
I'm assuming that's from clinical dehydration, which is a state I would hope a fighter would not put himself in the day before a fight. Perhaps a better word would be depleted. In any event getting weighed the morning of the day before a fight gives the body at least 36 hours to hydrate which is better than what it once was. That's why jr. welters are often entering the ring at about 160 lbs by fight time...

leff
03-18-2006, 04:50 PM
I'm assuming that's from clinical dehydration, which is a state I would hope a fighter would not put himself in the day before a fight. Perhaps a better word would be depleted. In any event getting weighed the morning of the day before a fight gives the body at least 36 hours to hydrate which is better than what it once was. That's why jr. welters are often entering the ring at about 160 lbs by fight time...

im talking about my own experience and i useally weigh in the night before ore the same day so ive never gotten more than 18hours and that realy aint enough.

smasher
03-18-2006, 06:30 PM
im talking about my own experience and i useally weigh in the night before ore the same day so ive never gotten more than 18hours and that realy aint enough.That brings back memories of my amateur days when some of the guys in my club would starve themselves all week and be listless and and flat at the morning weigh-in only to go pig out at McDonald's after making weight....

leff
03-19-2006, 05:06 PM
That brings back memories of my amateur days when some of the guys in my club would starve themselves all week and be listless and and flat at the morning weigh-in only to go pig out at McDonald's after making weight....

well, i eat pasta fruit and oathmal before the fight, BUT after where talking kebab,steaks,fries,beer etc

mokele
03-21-2006, 12:31 AM
I like champions who are fit and tough, who can take punishment if necessary in order to wear down an opponent. Fighters like that do much better in 15 rounders than in 10 or 12. Of course it's really to some extent a matter of personal preference for how you think champions should fight. If you think that it's ok for champions to stick and move for 12 rounds, piling up points with the jab and a few other shots here and there, then the extra 3 rounds don't mean much. My preference is for inside fighters with heart and a good chin, like Julio Cesar Chavez, Joe Frazier or the young Mike Tyson. I've seen too many instances where a fast, slick boxer can beat a tougher, stronger man by moving, boxing, tying up on the inside, and landing more pitty-pat shots. Guys like that eventually wear down and have to stand and fight or else lose points for holding, but how long does that take? Sometimes it takes more than 12 rounds.