I was watching footage of Marquez againts Licona and other past fights he had and I have come to the conclusion that Marquez is one bad ass fighter. He is quicker than EM or MAB and It looks like he has more power. I was surprise at how really quick Marquez is when he counters with combos. The thing is, to make JMM exciting you need an agressive fighter like PAC that throws a bunch of punches. I think EM/Marquez would have made a good fight as well. But I think JMM would take Morales out handily. I hope they make the rematch with Pac after the EM fight. I wan't to see how the fighters would adapt in the rematch.

Marquez may be quicker but is the weakest of the three. Morales is the strongest.

Marquez is a great counterpuncher and student of the game but he is not dangerous.

IMHO JMM is the greatest challenge for PAC, even greater than EM ...

Marquez is going to need to get his head out of his ass. He is not a superstar, so he needs to drop the primadonna attitude. He is quicker, but is not nearly the puncher everyone makes him out to be. He uses his opponents momentum, and doesn't commit to his punches. But he has heart and great recooperative powers. Styles make fights, and Marquez' style is just bad for Pacquiao. But he is not on the level of Barrera and Morales.

If he better than those two then he is 10 times better than Mrs.Pacman.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2004/May-09-Sun-2004/photos/fight.jpg

If he better than those two then he is 10 times better than Mrs.Pacman.
Whats with the hateration. Well I guess if Barrera, Morales and Marquez can't beat him, you're going to give it your best in the forums.

Whats with the hateration. Well I guess if Barrera, Morales and Marquez can't beat him, you're going to give it your best in the forums.

That's funny. Barrera got his ass beat. Marquez got his ass beat. and Morales will get his ass beat.

Don't even say it, "Well Marquez did'nt get his ass beat". Yes he did. I was there. I saw Marquez after the fight, I saw Pacquiao after the fight. Marquez got his ass beat. Marquez sounded like his nose was clogged and needed someone to help him to get out of his chair. He could not move his neck. Pac was rarin for a rematch and Marquez did not want any. Just because I think Marquez is good don't mean I don't think Pac will beat him much worse in the rematch. After Pac is done with Morales, and he will punish Morales like he's never been punished before, I hope he fights JMM again.

I hope he fights JMM again.
The fans want it, Pacquiao wants it, HBO wants it, everyone but Marquez.

Marquez is a tier below Barerra and Morales. He is the most patient and may be the best counter puncher...but both MAB and EM would hand him a beating if they fought.

Marquez is a tier below Barerra and Morales. He is the most patient and may be the best counter puncher...but both MAB and EM would hand him a beating if they fought.
Marquez is just as one dimensional as Pacquiao.

Marquez is just as one dimensional as Pacquiao.

Until I see him turn on the heat against another fighter or take the lead for the majority of a fight I will agree with you about that.

I was watching footage of Marquez againts Licona and other past fights he had and I have come to the conclusion that Marquez is one bad ass fighter. He is quicker than EM or MAB and It looks like he has more power. I was surprise at how really quick Marquez is when he counters with combos. The thing is, to make JMM exciting you need an agressive fighter like PAC that throws a bunch of punches. I think EM/Marquez would have made a good fight as well. But I think JMM would take Morales out handily. I hope they make the rematch with Pac after the EM fight. I wan't to see how the fighters would adapt in the rematch.
hes not better
hes juts not as ring worn
look for some old mab footage
then ull see who was faster at droppen sudden combos
plus mab is more aggresive in hitting combos there for less "boring"
find some old tapes of EM then ull see who has more power

You can never tell so long as JMM doesnt get to fight the other two.

Marquez is a very good fighter. I think he beats Barrera but i dont know if he beats Morales.

JMM is not as versatile as MAB or EM which means that MaB and EM are better than JMM. It's just that JMM has the right style to frustrate Pac. JMM is one dimensional, he can only counterpunch, he can't lead.

I think it's more accurate if you say JMM is the MOST CAREFUL , not better, of the three. He likes to play it safe most of the time by just counter-punching, not taking the initiative or taking the fight to his opponent or mixing it up. :rolleyes:

Having watched most of Pac's old fights, I guess you can say I was surprised to see JMM give Pac a damn good fight. I was not expecting someone being able to catch Pac with combos the way I saw JMM did. At least not the Pac of the Freddie Roach Era. Honestly I don't know how valid Pac's excuses are but I replayed the JMM Pac fight and it seemed that those counters would have hit Pac without the injuries, because he was catching Pac wide open and of balance. This is a fight I need to see again. I love wondering what these guys are thinking while they are in battle. I don't think Erik will give MP as much trouble as JMM but I guess well have to see. The only thing that truly worries me about El Terrible is his size. I thought JMM was too big already because Mannys was being moved when JMM was hitting his guard. Manny is still quicker and more of a puncher though. It will be good.

I was watching footage of Marquez againts Licona and other past fights he had and I have come to the conclusion that Marquez is one bad ass fighter. He is quicker than EM or MAB and It looks like he has more power. I was surprise at how really quick Marquez is when he counters with combos. The thing is, to make JMM exciting you need an agressive fighter like PAC that throws a bunch of punches. I think EM/Marquez would have made a good fight as well. But I think JMM would take Morales out handily. I hope they make the rematch with Pac after the EM fight. I wan't to see how the fighters would adapt in the rematch.


I believe you are right, JMM posses better power and speed than MAB. And being an AWESOME counter puncher makes him very effective against sluggers and move forward fighters. But he won't be able to reach MAB and EM in terms of stature. Why? Check the list of his opponents. :D How many elite fighters has he fought at this stage of his career. He was at the right time at the right place . . . getting two titles and belts from aging Champs. JMM is 30+ . . . . and given the chance that every fighter has been dreaming of he blew it. Any other fighter could have grab that chance to fight the p4p No 1 at his regular purse. How much is his purse for his title defenses? $400,000! How much is he being offered to challenge for the p4p title? A whooping $750,000 and yet he asked for $1.5M.

Basically this fighters came into the sports because they needs money . . . and money goes with stature. So why refuse the chance to earn millions? :D Pac was earning less as to what JMM is earning now before he fought and defeated MAB. How much is he being offered now? Minimum of $900,000. If that was not STUPIDITY then it must be a plain excuse, right? :p

As to that Pac/JMM tussle sooner or later it's bound to happen. JMM can't run forever. Undeniably JMM has shown that he has the style that can beat PAC . . . all he has to do is grow some balls to go for it.

he'll lose against both

As to that Pac/JMM tussle sooner or later it's bound to happen. JMM can't run forever. Undeniably JMM has shown that he has the style that can beat PAC . . . all he has to do is grow some balls to go for it.

Questioning whether JMM has balls makes not sense at all. But that's the question he's caused by not signing for the rematch.

Truth is, JMM and Pac both are going to make a **** load more than $750K and $900K when the rematch actually occurs. The increase for both fighters will be attributable largely to Pac's increased marketability after Morales and possibly after Barrera II. HBO has deep pockets and they can be made much deeper, but only if they payout big for the rematch. Let's hope they make it happen, soon.

I think it's more accurate if you say JMM is the MOST CAREFUL , not better, of the three. He likes to play it safe most of the time by just counter-punching, not taking the initiative or taking the fight to his opponent or mixing it up. :rolleyes:


:D Right . . . not necesarily better.

Questioning whether JMM has balls makes not sense at all. But that's the question he's caused by not signing for the rematch.

Truth is, JMM and Pac both are going to make a **** load more than $750K and $900K when the rematch actually occurs. The increase for both fighters will be attributable largely to Pac's increased marketability after Morales and possibly after Barrera II. HBO has deep pockets and they can be made much deeper, but only if they payout big for the rematch. Let's hope they make it happen, soon.


Good point Bro. We are all hoping it happens soon. :D

Morales is going down!!!

I think Marquez is probably quicker

Techinally better.

Whats with the hateration. Well I guess if Barrera, Morales and Marquez can't beat him, you're going to give it your best in the forums.


Morales wont beat Pac, Barrera CAN and JMM will if they fight again.

marquez is the better boxer i think of them three...

marquez is the better boxer i think of them three...

Based on what? How he fought Pacquiao?

if you ever seen marquez's old fights... he was faster than barrera and a better puncher than morales... barrera got his ass serve by pac... and so will morales... pac even said that morales is an easier opponent than marquez...

if you ever seen marquez's old fights... he was faster than barrera and a better puncher than morales... barrera got his ass serve by pac... and so will morales... pac even said that morales is an easier opponent than marquez...

Ah yes...we'll take Pac's word for it. Marquez has never had faster hands than Barerra...he doesn't know when and how to take the lead in a fight. Saying that Marquez is a better puncher than Morales is a joke...especially at lower weights. At 122, and 126, Morales threw harder punches that were more accurate...and he threw a variety of punches from range and inside. Marquez is too limited to be proclaimed better than MAB or EM.

Ah yes...we'll take Pac's word for it. Marquez has never had faster hands than Barerra...he doesn't know when and how to take the lead in a fight. Saying that Marquez is a better puncher than Morales is a joke...especially at lower weights. At 122, and 126, Morales threw harder punches that were more accurate...and he threw a variety of punches from range and inside. Marquez is too limited to be proclaimed better than MAB or EM.

That's what I said in my earlier post, maybe much technically sound and effective style . . . but not neccesarily better. ;)

Ah yes...we'll take Pac's word for it. Marquez has never had faster hands than Barerra...he doesn't know when and how to take the lead in a fight. Saying that Marquez is a better puncher than Morales is a joke...especially at lower weights. At 122, and 126, Morales threw harder punches that were more accurate...and he threw a variety of punches from range and inside. Marquez is too limited to be proclaimed better than MAB or EM.

I think he lost a lot of pop as he moved up. At 122 and 126 he was a monster with speed. He slowed down significantly at 130.

I think he lost a lot of pop as he moved up. At 122 and 126 he was a monster with speed. He slowed down significantly at 130.

He has slowed down some but he would do himself a huge favor if he came in at or very close to 130 when he fights Pac. He was too heavy for the Barerra fight. He was much quicker and on point in the Hernandez fight.

He has slowed down some but he would do himself a huge favor if he came in at or very close to 130 when he fights Pac. He was too heavy for the Barerra fight. He was much quicker and on point in the Hernandez fight.

For sure. You can't give Pac any more speed advantage that he already has. What did he weigh against Hernandez?

For sure. You can't give Pac any more speed advantage that he already has. What did he weigh against Hernandez?

I think he came in at 130 or close to that. You could just see the extra weight he was carrying for the MAB fight. He looked fat if that's even possible for him.

I dont think MAB will beat Pac if they fight again. MAB's right hand doesnt come naturally to him as he is a lefty and it so happens thats the punch pacquiao is more open to. If you look at Barrera vs Pacquiao fight you can see that the little times he was effective against pacquiao was with a straight right hand, when he got popped by pacquiao he was relying on his left.

Marquez is alright..but he cant take barrera or Moralles. He will get knocked for sure if he fights pacqiao again...paqiao made some mistakes in the previous fight and he is the kind of fighter that learns from hsi mistakes he will clean the ring with marquez.

I was watching footage of Marquez againts Licona and other past fights he had and I have come to the conclusion that Marquez is one bad ass fighter. He is quicker than EM or MAB and It looks like he has more power. I was surprise at how really quick Marquez is when he counters with combos. The thing is, to make JMM exciting you need an agressive fighter like PAC that throws a bunch of punches. I think EM/Marquez would have made a good fight as well. But I think JMM would take Morales out handily. I hope they make the rematch with Pac after the EM fight. I wan't to see how the fighters would adapt in the rematch.
No. Well, yes and no. Yes, he is a badass fighter. No, he is not better than Barerra or Morales. When you say that you think Marquez would take out Erik Morales, I wonder what it is that makes you believe that. Because it's certainly not the success he had against every fighter not named Marco Antonio Barerra. And remember, the two times Barerra was successful against Morales (I & III as far as I'm concerned, regardless of the scorecards), he wasn't boxing. He was brawling. Don't doubt it, cuz I'm not wrong.

stlyes make fights and thats why i think that mab and EM are better p4p than jmm. jmm is more suited for pac man than is mab

IMHO JMM is the greatest challenge for PAC, even greater than EM ...


yea, your right.

Let's see the 3M's styles.


MABarrera - slugger/boxer/counterpuncher (has morphed more to become a laid back counterpuncher)
EMorales - boxer/slugger (good boxer actually, but throws sweet science out of the window and just BRAWLS!)
JMMarquez - counterpuncher (and a master at it!)


They're all technically-gifted boxers basically, each one is a master of his own fighting style. IMO it's a matter of who-wins-against-who that determines the better fighter.


JMMarquez-MABarrera - a tactical chess game. I give JMM a slight edge here IF MAB forces his way in. But, IF MAB chooses to box and ride his bike, he'll win
JMMarquez-EMorales - styles makes fights. I reckon JMM will counterpunch EM all night as he tries to brawl. But, IF EM boxes & takes full advantage of his reach, he'll win.

Marquez is a very good fighter. I think he beats Barrera but i dont know if he beats Morales.
if pac beats morales, then i'll say jmm beats morales...

I think JMM has a great skill and can effectively work against move forward fighters... however... he does'nt have the heart to take the level the game higher... he's just a good counter puncher... and that's it... he's the real one dimensional fighter...
he's too careful not to mix it up with his opponents.... because he can't sustain it...

I dont think MAB will beat Pac if they fight again. MAB's right hand doesnt come naturally to him as he is a lefty and it so happens thats the punch pacquiao is more open to. If you look at Barrera vs Pacquiao fight you can see that the little times he was effective against pacquiao was with a straight right hand, when he got popped by pacquiao he was relying on his left.
who's fighting in your avatar bro?

IMHO JMM is the greatest challenge for PAC, even greater than EM ...

It's because of his boxing style.....Pacman's style is tailor-made for Marquez.....but it doesn't mean that Pacman will not beat him.....afterall, Pacman has the equalizer, his great left hand. :) :) :)

if pac connects. the 1st fight marquez was caught by surprise. he didnt think it would pack so much power but after the 1st rd he adjusted to it and was never really hurt after that simply by doing what he does best, BOX! tru manny has the left hand and hes getting a right hand now but so do other fighters. i believe in marquez that when the time comes he will get the job done yet once again. i think hes waiting for pac to beat morales, though i dont see that happening, to fight him again since morales will never agree to fight jmm. smart move. either way they WILL fight again and jmm knows that.

Marquez got caught alot as well with solid lefts. In the 12 round and some other rounds before that. The sting was out of Pac's left for whatever reason he started to hesitate throwing it. When he began to throw it in the later rounds at a higher clip it started to connect. When Manny missed his mark he paid for it with rapid fire counters. I still think Pac would fight alot better in the rematch, then again, I think Marquez would have trained better and would be in better shape. Pac is dangerous the whole 12 rounds. Marquez is a little less dangerous but can slowly beat you down during the course of the fight. I think this would actually be more exciting than a PAC/EM fight because it is a clash between pure opposites. One, a fighter that is brought to the top levels of the game by being an aggressive, powerful and relentlessly brilliant puncher; the other brought by his extremely masterful, tactical counter punching expertise. When extreme opposites collide it makes for a very interesting match up. Is Marquez' counter punching style enough to survive a savage puncher like Manny? Is Manny's powerful relentless attack enough to overcome a masterful technician? This is the fight.

who's fighting in your avatar bro?
It's Julio Cesar Chavez in his championship fight against Mario Martinez. Julio gets rocked by a right hand and Mario makes the mistake of chasing after him thinking he has him. Julio lands a straight right that seriously hurts Mario and an uppercut. He wins by 8th round TKO.

Well it was i changed it back to my old one. ;)

Marquez got caught alot as well with solid lefts. In the 12 round and some other rounds before that. The sting was out of Pac's left for whatever reason he started to hesitate throwing it. When he began to throw it in the later rounds at a higher clip it started to connect. When Manny missed his mark he paid for it with rapid fire counters. I still think Pac would fight alot better in the rematch, then again, I think Marquez would have trained better and would be in better shape. Pac is dangerous the whole 12 rounds. Marquez is a little less dangerous but can slowly beat you down during the course of the fight. I think this would actually be more exciting than a PAC/EM fight because it is a clash between pure opposites. One, a fighter that is brought to the top levels of the game by being an aggressive, powerful and relentlessly brilliant puncher; the other brought by his extremely masterful, tactical counter punching expertise. When extreme opposites collide it makes for a very interesting match up. Is Marquez' counter punching style enough to survive a savage puncher like Manny? Is Manny's powerful relentless attack enough to overcome a masterful technician? This is the fight.

VERY GOOD CONDITIONING is what Pacman needs against Marquez. JMM proved he got the nose and the chin to survive the bombs of MP.
But the fight also showed that Pacman lacked very good conditioning unlike in the MAB duel.
Morales will never fight JMM coz they have the same promoter. But if JMM transfer then who knows. Unfortunately JMM might leap into GB promotion, so no fight against MAB. Arum and GB don't see eye to eye right now. Anyway JMM's manager seems to be so serious in following the rules of the BELTS. So JMM is in **** for now. JMM needs to fight EM or MAB to get his million$$$ dreams. If he doesn't, we'll never know what he can do against this duo.

Marquez is a very good boxer, right up there with EM and MAB. Bur I can never tell if he can beat them until they fight each other. On the other hand, Marquez could be the more intelligent of the three great Mexicans, in the ring. People don't like Marquez's style because its not exciting and he doesn't take a lot of risk. But when he punches he makes it count. The guy plays his game in the ring and you gotta respect that.

Againts a puncher like Manny, I think Marquez is very exciting. He does not really get to showcase his excellence unless it is with a fighter who will make him utilize his ability to it's absolute capacity. I think Pacman bring it out of JMM. I hope to see him agains MAB or EM as well. I hope he gets called out by one of the two greats. With just these 4 fighters alone I think the division will be good for a long time. Any combination of the 4 fighters in a match up, including rematches should entertain. EM and MAB will have their hands full with JMM. JMM is a careful calculated fighter who is more intelligent than both Barrera and MAB. I don't think they take him easy if they do at all.

I was watching footage of Marquez againts Licona and other past fights he had and I have come to the conclusion that Marquez is one bad ass fighter. He is quicker than EM or MAB and It looks like he has more power. I was surprise at how really quick Marquez is when he counters with combos. The thing is, to make JMM exciting you need an agressive fighter like PAC that throws a bunch of punches. I think EM/Marquez would have made a good fight as well. But I think JMM would take Morales out handily. I hope they make the rematch with Pac after the EM fight. I wan't to see how the fighters would adapt in the rematch.

um...no

Marquez is clearly a level below both.

I like JMM as much as anyone, but I cant consider him as good as either MAB or Morales. Both of them have a rugged, warrior edge to them that he has yet to possess. He's a great counter puncher and a good boxer, but he's not the boxer/slugger that the other two are..no way at all.

I like JMM as much as anyone, but I cant consider him as good as either MAB or Morales. Both of them have a rugged, warrior edge to them that he has yet to possess. He's a great counter puncher and a good boxer, but he's not the boxer/slugger that the other two are..no way at all.

Always the diplomat, your words ring true. Except the usage of "yet" when you mention warrior edge.

When Marquez got up after that third KD and started throwing, getting hit, and throwing, then went the next 11 rounds with more of the same, I was converted. He never had be believing that he had warrior qualities, until then.

I figure Marquez consistently fights only slightly above his opponents skill level, to get the win. In Pac-JMM I, Marquez wrongly treated Manny like he knew what to expect and got nailed for it. He'll walk into Pac II not assuming anything and will again fight slightly above his opponents' level for the win. Not the stuff of your typical Mexican warrior, but a win no less.

Always the diplomat, your words ring true. Except the usage of "yet" when you mention warrior edge.

When Marquez got up after that third KD and started throwing, getting hit, and throwing, then went the next 11 rounds with more of the same, I was converted. He never had be believing that he had warrior qualities, until then.

I figure Marquez consistently fights only slightly above his opponents skill level, to get the win. In Pac-JMM I, Marquez wrongly treated Manny like he knew what to expect and got nailed for it. He'll walk into Pac II not assuming anything and will again fight slightly above his opponents' level for the win. Not the stuff of your typical Mexican warrior, but a win no less.


Hey I totally agree that it took alot of guts, strength, courage...alot of the 'good stuff' to get back up and keep fighting, and put on such an outstanding performance! I cant remember the last time I saw something quite like that...very impressive. He just doesnt seem quite as rough around the edges as those two are..but in time that could change. He did have one awesome 'come from behind' fight..but each of the others have had more of those types of fights already, even against each other.

I like JMM as much as anyone, but I cant consider him as good as either MAB or Morales. Both of them have a rugged, warrior edge to them that he has yet to possess. He's a great counter puncher and a good boxer, but he's not the boxer/slugger that the other two are..no way at all.


no way hes as much a warrior as the rest. he proved that.

no way hes as much a warrior as the rest. he proved that.

I'm not saying he's not a warrior..I dont really know how to explain what I mean, except that he's not developed a certain "edge" they have..must come with time??

please watch morales getting knocked down by pack!!! :)
this coming march 19!!!

http://www.otlichno.ru/pictures/baby****.jpg

I hope he fights fight that count. He chooses opponents he can beat up. To be a great champions u have to fight great named fighters. Thats why even though he has 2 belts under him he still hasn't earn the respect he wants.

Looking at the fights before he fought Pacman, I'd say that he is really good and sharp. But after the Pacman sent him 3x in 3 mins and broke his nose and re-arranged his face that night, I don't think he is the same Marquez anymore. I am (and a lot of others are) very upset on how he fought against Salido. If he was fighting Pac, EM or Barrera that night, he will probably go out in stretchers. So I'd say MAB and EM are both better (still) than JMM for now.