View Full Version : Who is the most skilled fighter of all time?
TysonForeman 01-19-2005, 12:50 AM I was watching the Johnson documentary and I started wondering, who was the most technically skilled fighter of all time? I've heard alot of people say it was Gene Tunney.
Also, from watching this documentary, I started thinking, how does the skill level of old time super skilled fighters match the fighters of today? Jim Corbett is always described as being astonishingly skilled, I wonder how his skills compare to todays fighters.
Also it's funny how "Gentleman" Jim was a violent racist!! LOL, I guess probably every white guy was racist back then (I'm white, I'm not taking shots at whitey :).
SweetScience 01-19-2005, 12:53 AM Ray Robinson - boxer
Roberto Duran - fighter
scramwarrior 01-19-2005, 12:54 AM I was watching the Johnson documentary and I started wondering, who was the most technically skilled fighter of all time? I've heard alot of people say it was Gene Tunney.
Also, from watching this documentary, I started thinking, how does the skill level of old time super skilled fighters match the fighters of today? Jim Corbett is always described as being astonishingly skilled, I wonder how his skills compare to todays fighters.
Also it's funny how "Gentleman" Jim was a violent racist!! LOL, I guess probably every white guy was racist back then (I'm white, I'm not taking shots at whitey :).
It's hard to compare. Most would say Ali. My choice is Sugar Ray Leonard. His skills were undeniable, but they might not have been the best. Like we've stated, it's very hard to compare. So many skilled fighters have been in the ring.
TysonForeman 01-19-2005, 02:08 AM I'm sorry but a guy who holds his hands low can't the most skilled. Ali was super quick, but I think his skills were actually not so good. He's still one of the greatest fighters ever though...
Floydmayweather 01-19-2005, 02:26 AM Ali because of ability to avade punches in his prime, his mental ability to beat an oppenent, and his hand speed and accuracy.
It's hard to compare. Most would say Ali. My choice is Sugar Ray Leonard. His skills were undeniable, but they might not have been the best. Like we've stated, it's very hard to compare. So many skilled fighters have been in the ring.Sugar Ray Leonard was my pick as well, although not one of my favorites, but he was a pretty well balanced fighter, another one comes to mind none other than Leonard's arch - rival the Marvelous one
Kimmy 01-19-2005, 02:39 AM If God given talent and overall ability is the criteria, the Roy Jones Jr would have to be considered!
Mike Tyson Jr. 01-19-2005, 03:06 AM Mike Tyson is the most
skilled and the greatest
of all time.
dodge 01-19-2005, 03:18 AM Mike Tyson is the most
skilled and the greatest
of all time.
lol. hahahahahahahahahahah.........hahahahahahha....... hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
psychopath 01-19-2005, 04:08 AM It's still ALI in my book. The guy can be a boxer, slugger, counter puncher; a well rounded fighter with both foot speed hands speed and power. :cool:
I'm sorry but a guy who holds his hands low can't the most skilled. Ali was super quick, but I think his skills were actually not so good. He's still one of the greatest fighters ever though...
Huh? That was like the most unexperienced comment I've heard in a while. How long have you been watching boxing? I literally only hear things like that when I'm at those rich upperclass boxing gyms on the rich parts of town that have snobby people who never spar. Having your hands low does not necasserly mean that you are a lazy fighter. A lot of punches fly better from lower positions, the left hook is more blind, the jab comes upward and hits you at a different angle. Rolling with punches is more effective with your left hand low. Did you notice that Ali's hands would come up when he knew a punch was coming. He knew exactely where is hands were at. BTW, I think that Sugar Ray Leonard was the most skilled. Some people say that fighters from like 1920 were the Best ever but if you actually watch the tapes you can clearly see that boxing back then was not the boxing now. They boxed totally different from the fighters today, the rules were much different and when you knock someone down you could just stand over him and knock him down again if he tries to get up. You can't compare fighters from like 70 years ago to fighters now.
bonafuwa 01-19-2005, 08:42 AM Sugar Ray Robinson and Sugar Ray Leonard IMO. Can't go with Ali for a few reasons. He lacked some fundamentals that came back to bite him when the relexes slowed (ala Roy Jones Jr.): moving straight back, keeping hands low, never body punching etc.
jabsRstiff 01-19-2005, 08:45 AM What are the skills you are referring to ?
If it's the ability to hit & not get hit...it's Pernell Whitaker.
If it's the abilty to hit, not get hit, & actually hurt the opponent....Leonard, Robinson, Jofre.
If it's the ability to be aggressive & defensively/offensively effective....Duran.
jack_the_rippuh 01-19-2005, 08:51 AM Jabs, again, I think you're going overboard to say that Whitaker was not able to hurt opponents. He just wasn't a big finisher.
jabsRstiff 01-19-2005, 08:53 AM Jabs, again, I think you're going overboard to say that Whitaker was not able to hurt opponents. He just wasn't a big finisher.
He could occasionally hurt a foe....but, look at his title defenses.
Most went the distance....& a lot of the guys lost every round, while not so much as blinking.
It doesn't matter, as it's apparent Whitaker never needed a big punch.
He's one of the most unbeatable fighters in the history of the sport.
LuKahnLi 01-19-2005, 08:56 AM Most skilled offense-Tommy Hearns
Most skilled defense-Pernell Whitaker
Overall-Sugar Ray Robinson
jabsRstiff 01-19-2005, 08:59 AM The most skilled offensive fighter of all time, is Joe Louis.
He threw every punch perfectly, & with deadly power.
He had a jolting jab, put his shots together perfectly to the body & head. His punches were super-short, accurate.
He's as great a finisher as there ever was in the sport.
LuKahnLi 01-19-2005, 09:09 AM The most skilled offensive fighter of all time, is Joe Louis.
He threw every punch perfectly, & with deadly power.
He had a jolting jab, put his shots together perfectly to the body & head. His punches were super-short, accurate.
He's as great a finisher as there ever was in the sport.
Oh yeah.....you are correct.
I saw alot of Louis thanks to this documentary my sister bought me for Christmas.
I was just thinking about Hearns ability to fire devastating shots from long range.
LuKahnLi 01-19-2005, 09:14 AM When Louis made Schmeling scream with that bodyshot....damn.
And poor Jimmy Braddock....
I have not seen the all time boxers (also it hard to compare Heavy Weights with Light Weights) just want to add that:
Marvin Hagler is one of the best all round boxers.
SweetScience 01-19-2005, 11:20 AM Marvin Hagler is one of the best all round boxers.
No he's not.
jabsRstiff 01-19-2005, 11:23 AM Hagler was highly skilled, no doubt.
He threw great combos behind one of the best jabs in boxing history.
He was an excellent counterpuncher.
His defense became suspect during prolonged exchanges.
In general....he was a terrific technician....but I wouldn't say he's one of the very best ever.
SweetScience 01-19-2005, 11:26 AM Great combos YES but great all around fighter hell no!
Mr. Violence 01-19-2005, 11:29 AM This is a hard one...Ali is the greatest fighter of all time in my opinion...BUT that doesn't mean he is the most skilled...In fact he had a lot of bad habits and TECHNIQUE wise made a lot of mistakes...his incredible athletic ability and heart is what made him get away with his bad habits...As far as pure skill I'd probably say Joe Louis. I studied those old films of Louis and history has mistakenly tagged him as just a slugger...this man had incredible boxing skills.
puppy_dogg 01-19-2005, 11:32 AM what about my boy ray leonard
JOM'S 01-19-2005, 11:49 AM among the most skilled figthers that i have actually seen figthing are ALI and SGL ...
Mr. Ryan 01-19-2005, 01:42 PM Best skilled boxer of all time I would say was Sugar Ray Robinson. The man could do just about everything.
psychopath 01-19-2005, 05:26 PM Guys . . .guys . . .guys . . . I believe when we talk of "most skilled" we are talking of "the best all around fighter" . . . so you don't separate the best offense, defense etc. Weaknesses and bad habbits? All fighters have weaknesses and bad habbits . . . the point is, who can change style . . . change strategy and can rise up to any situation brought by his opponents inside that ring and win fights. And definitely being smart should be part of it. ;)
The most skilled fighter of all time p4p would have to be Sugar Ray Robinson I believe. He had it all! Among the heavyweights it would be Joe Louis.
TheGreat1 01-20-2005, 06:36 AM i can't beleive no one thinks of JCC the man was great all around. i would also add Holmes for HW, one day James Toney will be on that list
Hagler was highly skilled, no doubt.
He threw great combos behind one of the best jabs in boxing history.
He was an excellent counterpuncher.
His defense became suspect during prolonged exchanges.
In general....he was a terrific technician....but I wouldn't say he's one of the very best ever.
Haglers defense became sustpect by choice:
In the beginning of his career hagler was an effective boxer-boxer. He fought mostly in his reverse gear, making angles and counter punched. Almost only came forward when the other guy was in trouble. Roughly from the Minter fight on (after the draw against Antuofermo) Hagler became in general more of a pressure fighter. This is the style he mostly used during his middleweight title reign (and at the end of his career he had by choice (almost) become an effective slugger, and as a result of this style he was getting hit more often).
Having been effective in both the extreme opposite boxing styles, and also using and being effective with ALL the different punches and mixing them up in his combinations, having good power, good speed, good defense, great chin and heart….and the thing I might have forgotten to name here for an all round fighter make:
Hagler one of the best ALL ROUND fighters in my book.
jabsRstiff 01-20-2005, 07:18 AM Haglers defense became sustpect by choice:
In the beginning of his career hagler was an effective boxer-boxer. He fought mostly in his reverse gear, making angles and counter punched. Almost only came forward when the other guy was in trouble. Roughly from the Minter fight on (after the draw against Antuofermo) Hagler became in general more of a pressure fighter. This is the style he mostly used during his middleweight title reign (and at the end of his career he had by choice (almost) become an effective slugger, and as a result of this style he was getting hit more often).
Having been effective in both the extreme opposite boxing styles, and also using and being effective with ALL the different punches and mixing them up in his combinations, having good power, good speed, good defense, great chin and heart….and the thing I might have forgotten to name here for an all round fighter make:
Hagler one of the best ALL ROUND fighters in my book.
Hagler was still quite the boxer after the Minter fight.
He sliced & diced Hamsho brilliantly in their first fight. His best performance was against Tony Sibson....& he followed that up with a similar performance against Scypion.
Hagler was a terrific technician, a great fighter, & my favorite fighter ever.
But I keep it objective enough to realize he had just a few too many lapses, in fights & in his style, to keep me from putting him with the ABSOLUTE best.
Haglers defense became sustpect by choice:
In the beginning of his career hagler was an effective boxer-boxer. He fought mostly in his reverse gear, making angles and counter punched. Almost only came forward when the other guy was in trouble. Roughly from the Minter fight on (after the draw against Antuofermo) Hagler became in general more of a pressure fighter. This is the style he mostly used during his middleweight title reign (and at the end of his career he had by choice (almost) become an effective slugger, and as a result of this style he was getting hit more often).
Having been effective in both the extreme opposite boxing styles, and also using and being effective with ALL the different punches and mixing them up in his combinations, having good power, good speed, good defense, great chin and heart….and the thing I might have forgotten to name here for an all round fighter make:
Hagler one of the best ALL ROUND fighters in my book.
Forgot to say: fight effectively from both the orthodox and the Southpaw stance.
jabsRstiff 01-20-2005, 12:37 PM Forgot to say: fight effectively from both the orthodox and the Southpaw stance.
Nobody did it better than he....
Most guys do it out of desperation, & never look comfortable or natural.
Hagler did it smoothly, intelligently......& he looked like either stance was natural for him.
In fact, his finishing blow was usually a RIGHT CROSS.
Silverfox 01-20-2005, 02:22 PM Hey!!! I'm not racist.I just frefer whites!
jabsRstiff 01-20-2005, 02:23 PM That's nice.
Mr. Ryan 01-20-2005, 02:25 PM Wilfredo Benitez in his prime was the most skilled fighter of all time. He was so fast, and was the best pure boxer of all time. He could make you miss like no one I've ever seen. He was fast as hell.
psychopath 01-20-2005, 04:16 PM i can't beleive no one thinks of JCC the man was great all around. i would also add Holmes for HW, one day James Toney will be on that list
Yes the very durable Jesus Cesar Chavez should be in that list. One of the most skilled fighters I have seen.
No he's not.
We can argue about that, but he has beaten your all time most skilled fighter! :p
dodge 01-23-2005, 09:21 AM Gene Tunney has got to be mentioned. Right now James Toney is a great technician.
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