View Full Version : Fighters who should have fought each other but never did.


Dempsey 1919
01-16-2006, 10:47 PM
name some, people.

!! AI-Holmes!!
01-16-2006, 10:54 PM
Tyson-Bowe
Foreman-Holmes

Dempsey1238
01-16-2006, 10:59 PM
Dempsey Wills

Robinson Burley

Sullivan Jackson.

Skydog
01-16-2006, 11:00 PM
Frazier-Norton

simsimon
01-17-2006, 01:42 AM
well bowe never fought lewis as a pro. i would have loved to have seen that fight go ahead: lewis would have finished it early, i think.

Dempsey 1919
01-17-2006, 12:50 PM
i would definetely say foreman-holmes, frazier-norton, tyson-bowe, and marciano-patterson.

gLobE199
01-17-2006, 12:53 PM
frazer shavers

tyson lewis

lewis bowe

hopkins toney

i remember demspey duckd a black fighter cuz of that ****in color line but i dont remember his name right now

MT73
01-17-2006, 01:03 PM
James Toney and Chris Eubank.

jabsRstiff
01-17-2006, 01:05 PM
Jeff Chandler & Lupe Pintor

Felix Trinidad & Ike Quartey

gLobE199
01-17-2006, 01:09 PM
Felix Trinidad & Ike Quartey

yea good 1 what was up wit that 1? y didt they figth?

VERSION1 (V1)
01-18-2006, 08:38 PM
Trinidad Quartey
lewis bowe

RockyMarcianofan00
01-18-2006, 09:54 PM
Marciano-Frazier
Marciano-Ali
Tyson-Marciano
Foreman-Marciano
Dempsey-Frazier
Tyson-Foreman
Dempsey-Marciano
PRIME Louis - Marciano
Prime Louis - Ali

i tried to think of fightss without marciano in them but didn't come out to well :rolleyes:
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Verstyle
01-18-2006, 09:57 PM
Marciano-Frazier
Marciano-Ali
Tyson-Marciano
Foreman-Marciano
Dempsey-Frazier
Tyson-Foreman
Dempsey-Marciano
PRIME Louis - Marciano
Prime Louis - Ali

i tried to think of fightss without marciano in them but didn't come out to well :rolleyes:


your stupid. they were tryin to realistic and u pull this ****.

SonnyG8R
01-18-2006, 10:10 PM
It would have been nice to see Bowe - Lewis

Also Prime Tyson - Holyfield and Prime Tyson - Lewis.

RockyMarcianofan00
01-18-2006, 10:50 PM
your stupid. they were tryin to realistic and u pull this ****.

yea i suppose your right i was thinking more fantasy fights :rolleyes:

well-
i think Tyson and prime holmes

Marciano was actually thinking about fighting a young Clay so

Tyson-Prime Holmes
Marciano-Clay
Marciano-Patterson

Foreman-Ali but earlier i'd like to see what would happen if Ali wasn't against the ropes
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machotime
01-18-2006, 11:20 PM
Macho Camacho/Meldrick Taylor

Skydog
01-18-2006, 11:39 PM
Hagler vs. Monzon

TheEvilSaint
01-19-2006, 12:08 AM
ken norton and joe frazier.
jake lamotta and rocky graziano.
jake lamotta and tony zale. (wouldve loved these two)
george foreman and lennox lewis.
roy jones and dariusz michalczewski.
sugar ray leonard and aaron pryor.
lou ambers and sammy angott.
rocky marciano and sonny liston.
rocky marciano and floyd patterson.
earnie shavers and gerry cooney.
jack dempsey and harry wills.
joe louis and elmer ray.
jack dempsey and jack johnson.

Dempsey 1919
01-19-2006, 11:55 AM
yea i suppose your right i was thinking more fantasy fights :rolleyes:

well-
i think Tyson and prime holmes

Marciano was actually thinking about fighting a young Clay so

Tyson-Prime Holmes
Marciano-Clay
Marciano-Patterson

Foreman-Ali but earlier i'd like to see what would happen if Ali wasn't against the ropes

foreman would've got his butt kicked worse!

Yaman
01-19-2006, 01:36 PM
yea i suppose your right i was thinking more fantasy fights :rolleyes:

well-
i think Tyson and prime holmes

Marciano was actually thinking about fighting a young Clay so

Tyson-Prime Holmes
Marciano-Clay
Marciano-Patterson

Foreman-Ali but earlier i'd like to see what would happen if Ali wasn't against the ropes

Ali would get brutally knocked out.

Dempsey 1919
01-19-2006, 03:13 PM
Ali would get brutally knocked out.

yeah, in your dreams, maybe.

Yaman
01-19-2006, 03:52 PM
yeah, in your dreams, maybe.

Nah he seriously would. But he was wayy to smart for Foreman to commit suicide like Frazier.

Dempsey 1919
01-19-2006, 04:13 PM
Nah he seriously would. But he was wayy to smart for Foreman to commit suicide like Frazier.

a young ali would make foreman look more stupid than an old ali did. foreman would have been confused, and ko'd and wouldn't have won a single round against 1967 ali.

RockyMarcianofan00
01-19-2006, 04:44 PM
foreman would've got his butt kicked worse!
no i think it'd be alot closer then it was

i'm not sure if ali would get ko'd or not i can't say yes or no but i think ali would at least get hurt
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Dempsey 1919
01-19-2006, 05:05 PM
no i think it'd be alot closer then it was

i'm not sure if ali would get ko'd or not i can't say yes or no but i think ali would at least get hurt

ali would have been to fast for foreman. liston is faster than foreman, and look how clay made him look.

Brassangel
01-19-2006, 05:55 PM
Ah, butterfly....still lacking in the ol' debate based on information department. "So and so was faster than he was, and look at what Ali did to so and so!"....blah.

I do believe that Ali would beat Foreman at any age 1974 and earlier. Just a lousy style matchup for Foreman.

Tyson vs. Bowe
Tyson vs. Holyfield (1987-1990)
Frazier vs. Norton
Holmes vs. Foreman
Marciano vs. Patterson
Tyson or Holyfield (see above) vs. Lewis
Lewis vs. Bowe
Lewis vs. Foreman

Dempsey 1919
01-19-2006, 08:34 PM
Ah, butterfly....still lacking in the ol' debate based on information department. "So and so was faster than he was, and look at what Ali did to so and so!"....blah.I do believe that Ali would beat Foreman at any age 1974 and earlier. Just a lousy style matchup for Foreman.

Tyson vs. Bowe
Tyson vs. Holyfield (1987-1990)
Frazier vs. Norton
Holmes vs. Foreman
Marciano vs. Patterson
Tyson or Holyfield (see above) vs. Lewis
Lewis vs. Bowe
Lewis vs. Foreman

so, what's wrong with that? it makes sense to comparethem that way if they had the same styles.

RockyMarcianofan00
01-19-2006, 11:45 PM
so, what's wrong with that? it makes sense to comparethem that way if they had the same styles.

hey i'm not saying Foreman would win i just think he would do better
but i have to say just cause ali was standing still doesn't give foreman an excuse to be so sloppy

i thought it was wierd he kept missing a stationary object
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Yaman
01-20-2006, 06:28 AM
Foreman would rip his head off if Ali decided to FIGHT him.

fabulous
01-20-2006, 06:59 AM
McCallum vs any Fabulous 4 member. Didn't happen.

Dynamite76
01-20-2006, 10:48 AM
Chandler-Pintor
Gomez-Garza
Pedroza-Sanchez
Lockridge-Sanchez
Camacho-Mayweather
Davis Jr.-Kenty
Pryor-Kenty
LaPorte-B. Taylor
McCrory-Starling
Curry-Young
Rosario-Arguello
Ramos-Czyz
Mustafa Muhammad-Qawi
Page-Dokes
Norton-Lyle
Tucker-Green
Frazier-Shavers
Young-Holmes

Dempsey 1919
01-21-2006, 12:12 PM
hey i'm not saying Foreman would win i just think he would do better
but i have to say just cause ali was standing still doesn't give foreman an excuse to be so sloppy

i thought it was wierd he kept missing a stationary object

alright, so imagine a young ali fighting him the same way he fought liston. he would just dance away from those big bombs and hit him with rapid-fire combinations!

Peter Kain
01-21-2006, 02:47 PM
Peter Kain - Jimmy Wilde

supaduck
01-22-2006, 05:24 PM
(pro) Mclellan-Jones
Eubank-Mclellan
Hagler-Robinson

Southpaw Stinger
01-22-2006, 05:50 PM
It took brains to beat Foremans brawn. A younger Ali could probrably beat Foreman by dancing and stinging, but if Foreman caught Ali with a big hit in the centre of the ring then I wouldn't like to say what would happen. The rope a dope worked brilliantly for Ali.

Pugnacious_Z
01-22-2006, 10:21 PM
Butterfly, dont even mention the Ali-Liston fight coz liston was like 37yrs old and slow as hell at that time. they found out liston was 5yrs older then they thought b4. anywayz, foreman wudve ripped ali, and i dont think any1 shud take you srsly after u posted that Lee could beat Ali.

Brassangel
01-23-2006, 12:16 AM
Well, in all fairness, Bruce Lee is in another class where weight separation doesn't matter.

On to the important subject.

Agreed, Sonny Liston was late 30's when he fought Clay, and definitely not faster than a 24-year old Foreman. So, Ali making Liston look stupid wasn't a remarkable feat compared to what he did to Foreman. It was the rope-a-dope that won that fight, however. In the 1960's, Ali was difficult to catch with a clean punch, but he was more vulnerable when cornered than he was in the 1970's. Most critics believe that Ali's prime was during one fight...The Rumble in the Jungle. I think that was his most impressive fight. He was cut, he was fast, and he had great strategy against a seemingly invincible opponent. Just because his footwork had slowed down doesn't mean that it wasn't his prime.

Also, just because butterfly says anything about Ali doesn't make it so. Although he does have his fair share of knowledge.

Anyway, Ali beats Foreman everytime from 1967-1974.

Yogi
01-23-2006, 12:46 AM
Butterfly, dont even mention the Ali-Liston fight coz liston was like 37yrs old. they found out liston was 5yrs older then they thought b4.

Sorry, but that is wrong.

Yogi
01-23-2006, 12:56 AM
Agreed, Sonny Liston was late 30's when he fought Clay

That would've meant that according to you Liston was born sometime in the mid 1920's, yet according to the recently released 1930 census which was taken in the late months of that year, Charles L. Liston had not been born yet. And the census people certainly didn't miss out on the Liston household because his father (Tobin), mother (Helen), three sisters (Clytee, Annie & Alcora), and two brothers (J.T., Leo & Curtis) were all on there...

Sonny Liston was no older than 32 or 33 years old when Ali defeated him that night in Miami.

Pugnacious_Z
01-23-2006, 07:08 AM
watch listons documentary, they say he was born in 1922-1923

Dempsey 1919
01-23-2006, 01:21 PM
wow, ya'll are crazy! 1964-1967 ali is waaaay better than 1974 ali.

Brassangel
01-23-2006, 10:23 PM
Originally posted by butterfly1964 wow, ya'll are crazy! 1964-1967 ali is waaaay better than 1974 ali.

Dundee doesn't think so. He was swifter in '67, but he wasn't smarter. His corner agrees that his hand speed wasn't drastically different, but his footspeed and stamina had come down a bit. Even so, all of them preferred the Ali that came forward in the jungle as opposed to the young punk of 1967. He had more heart, more technical skill, and he had perfected his ring psychology. It's just a shame that he went downhill after that fight; physically and mentally.

The term 'prime' doesn't have to mean a stint of one's career which included his physical prowess. Prime can be a number of things, such as a defining moment of achievement. 1974 defined Ali's career as great.

Yogi
01-23-2006, 10:31 PM
watch listons documentary, they say he was born in 1922-1923

Yeah so?

There are/were many different "sources" doing nothing more than guessing at what Liston's real age is/was, and I've seen/read a whole bunch of them.

I don't know about you, but I know that I'm certainly going to trust a government document like the 1930 census, especially considering that the whole Liston household/family was accounted for in that census except for Sonny...And the only reason they didn't have a listing for Charles 'Sonny' Liston was because he hadn't been born yet.

Dempsey 1919
01-23-2006, 11:49 PM
Yeah so?

There are/were many different "sources" doing nothing more than guessing at what Liston's real age is/was, and I've seen/read a whole bunch of them.

I don't know about you, but I know that I'm certainly going to trust a government document like the 1930 census, especially considering that the whole Liston household/family was accounted for in that census except for Sonny...And the only reason they didn't have a listing for Charles 'Sonny' Liston was because he hadn't been born yet.

yeah, that makes sense.

Dempsey 1919
01-23-2006, 11:51 PM
Dundee doesn't think so. He was swifter in '67, but he wasn't smarter. His corner agrees that his hand speed wasn't drastically different, but his footspeed and stamina had come down a bit. Even so, all of them preferred the Ali that came forward in the jungle as opposed to the young punk of 1967. He had more heart, more technical skill, and he had perfected his ring psychology. It's just a shame that he went downhill after that fight; physically and mentally.

The term 'prime' doesn't have to mean a stint of one's career which included his physical prowess. Prime can be a number of things, such as a defining moment of achievement. 1974 defined Ali's career as great.

if i were to choose, i would rather fight '74 ali, cause while '74 might outsmart me, '67 would just straight up embarrass me!

+= El Jefe=+
01-24-2006, 12:22 AM
RJJ Vs Darius Micha* idk the rest of the spelling.

Dempsey 1919
01-24-2006, 12:24 AM
RJJ Vs Darius Micha* idk the rest of the spelling.

you just saved this thread from a :hijacked:

Heckler
01-24-2006, 07:07 PM
you just saved this thread from a :hijacked:

Ali in 67 would beat foreman. Foremans style caters to Alis too much. Hes a slugger, that lumbers forward, he doesn't swarm. You watch the action off the ropes, Ali dominated it usually... he would move, judge the range work the jab and burst in with a big right cross. With his footwork in 67 hed stay on the outside, stick and move. Nothing in foremans arsenal would bother him. Foreman didn't have the boxing skills of say Norton to bother him, nor the body movement of frazier and swariming style. Nor was Foreman a defensive fighter. Everything plays into Alis hands. Styles make fights.

morancito
01-24-2006, 07:19 PM
Sal Sanchez vs. Alexis Arguello could have been done, if not for Sal's untimely death.

Brassangel
01-25-2006, 01:07 AM
Ali in 1967 would still beat Foreman handily; I'm not taking that away from him. This was a matter of how good Ali looked, and how his corner felt he fought in 1974 compared to when he was younger.

And butterfly, Ali would embarass you in either era. Outsmarting someone usually brings with it embarassment.

King Hippo vs. Bald Bull
Little Mac vs. Rocky Balboa
Tyler Durden vs. Dominick Teretto

Dempsey 1919
01-25-2006, 12:53 PM
Ali in 1967 would still beat Foreman handily; I'm not taking that away from him. This was a matter of how good Ali looked, and how his corner felt he fought in 1974 compared to when he was younger.

And butterfly, Ali would embarass you in either era. Outsmarting someone usually brings with it embarassment.

King Hippo vs. Bald Bull
Little Mac vs. Rocky Balboa
Tyler Durden vs. Dominick Teretto

yeah, i know, but i meant his boxing skills in the 60s would be too overwhelming for anyone.

Dempsey 1919
01-25-2006, 12:55 PM
Ali in 1967 would still beat Foreman handily; I'm not taking that away from him. This was a matter of how good Ali looked, and how his corner felt he fought in 1974 compared to when he was younger.

And butterfly, Ali would embarass you in either era. Outsmarting someone usually brings with it embarassment.

King Hippo vs. Bald Bull
Little Mac vs. Rocky Balboa
Tyler Durden vs. Dominick Teretto

i know, i meant that ali boxing skills in the 1960s would be overwhelming to begin with.

Dempsey 1919
01-25-2006, 12:56 PM
getting back to the topic of the thread, here's one.

muhammad alivs. eddie machen in the 60s, if ali wasn't stripped, they probably would have fought during that time.

pgates123
01-25-2006, 03:10 PM
i reckon the greatest fight never to happen was jake lamotta vs. sugar ray robinson it'd wud hav been a classic if these two actually fought each other rather than fighting boxers of the standard of those contender people

Brockton Lip
01-25-2006, 04:24 PM
They fought and alot more than once.
Oh, you must just be joking.

RockyMarcianofan00
01-25-2006, 09:48 PM
Rocky Marciano v Floyd Patterson
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Yogi
01-25-2006, 10:28 PM
getting back to the topic of the thread, here's one.

muhammad alivs. eddie machen in the 60s, if ali wasn't stripped, they probably would have fought during that time.

And defeating Eddie Machen at that point in time would prove what again?

leff
01-26-2006, 09:07 AM
marciano-pattersom
marciano-liston.

norton-frazier
holmes-foreman

younger tyson vs younger lewis
younger holy vs younger tyson.

Dempsey 1919
01-27-2006, 10:21 PM
And defeating Eddie Machen at that point in time would prove what again?

nothing much, just that they should have fought cause machen was a top contender at the time, and if ali wasn't stripped, they probably would have fought during that time.

Yogi
01-27-2006, 10:51 PM
nothing much, just that they should have fought cause machen was a top contender at the time, and if ali wasn't stripped, they probably would have fought during that time.

Yeah well, Machen was obviously past his best by that point in time, and wasn't exactly a top contender anymore when that fight could've taken place (by mid/late '65, Machen was no longer in the top ten...he was barely top ten when facing Terrell earlier in the year, as he entered that fight ranked as the #9 contender). He also hadn't defeated a top ten ranked Heavyweight since about four years previous in 1961. Shoot, around that time Machen took a pretty one-sided beating from Floyd Patterson, basically did absoltuely nothing against Ernie Terrell in that snorathon, and couldn't even beat a relative novice like Elmer Rush...yet you think he'd be a worthwhile challenger to Ali's title? :rolleyes:

No there's no way they should have fought.

Dempsey 1919
01-27-2006, 10:55 PM
Yeah well, Machen was obviously past his best by that point in time, and wasn't exactly a top contender anymore when that fight could've taken place (by mid/late '65, Machen was no longer in the top ten...he was barely top ten when facing Terrell earlier in the year, as he entered that fight ranked as the #9 contender). He also hadn't defeated a top ten ranked Heavyweight since about four years previous in 1961. Shoot, around that time Machen took a pretty one-sided beating from Floyd Patterson, basically did absoltuely nothing against Ernie Terrell in that snorathon, and couldn't even beat a relative novice like Elmer Rush...yet you think he'd be a worthwhile challenger to Ali's title? :rolleyes:

No there's no way they should have fought.

alright, then they should have fought in the mid '60s.

Yogi
01-27-2006, 11:08 PM
alright, then they should have fought in the mid '60s.

Uh, the mid 60's version of Machen is who I was talking about there, Butterfly.

Maybe Machen would have been a good veteran opponent to have on Ali's resume during his pre-title winning days (in '62 or '63), but he wouldn't have really been a legitimate challenger for the title after Ali won it and then rematched Liston, because Eddie was already well past it by that point.

Dempsey 1919
01-27-2006, 11:13 PM
Uh, the mid 60's version of Machen is who I was talking about there, Butterfly.

Maybe Machen would have been a good veteran opponent to have on Ali's resume during his pre-title winning days (in '62 or '63), but he wouldn't have really been a legitimate challenger for the title after Ali won it and then rematched Liston, because Eddie was already well past it by that point.

the night when clay won the title in '64, the announcer was asking dundee if he was going to face contenders like eddie machen and so on, and dundee said he'll face anybody. the fact that machen was mentiioned means something.

Yogi
01-27-2006, 11:38 PM
the night when clay won the title in '64, the announcer was asking dundee if he was going to face contenders like eddie machen and so on, and dundee said he'll face anybody. the fact that machen was mentiioned means something.

That's because he was still a top ranked contender at that point and even though he was already slipping, he was probably still viewed as a legitimate title challenger after Ali beat Liston the first time. But Machen proved shortly thereafter that he didn't have a whole lot left in the tank and fell completely out of the top ten by the time Ali was all finished his business with giving Liston a rematch.

Ring Ratings for June 1964:

Champ: Cassius Clay
1: Sonny Liston
2: Doug Jones
3: Zora Folley
4: Ernest Terrell
5: Eddie Machen
6: Cleveland Williams
7: Floyd Patterson
8: Karl Mildenberger
9: Henry Cooper
10: George Chuvalo

Shoot, just looking at those ratings for that month, there's some pretty friggin good names on there, isn't there?

Anyways, from there Machen took a pretty one-sided drubbing from the lower ranked Floyd Patterson, which dropped Eddie to 9th in the rankings. He followed that fight by basically doing nothing against Ernie Terrell for fifteen rounds in the early parts of '65, which dropped him from the ratings. And a few months later he fought to a draw with an inexperienced journeyman by the name of Elmer Rush.

Dempsey 1919
01-27-2006, 11:43 PM
That's because he was still a top ranked contender at that point and even though he was already slipping, he was probably still viewed as a legitimate title challenger after Ali beat Liston the first time. But Machen proved shortly thereafter that he didn't have a whole lot left in the tank and fell completely out of the top ten by the time Ali was all finished his business with giving Liston a rematch.

Ring Ratings for June 1964:

Champ: Cassius Clay
1: Sonny Liston
2: Doug Jones
3: Zora Folley
4: Ernest Terrell
5: Eddie Machen
6: Cleveland Williams
7: Floyd Patterson
8: Karl Mildenberger
9: Henry Cooper
10: George Chuvalo

Shoot, just looking at those ratings for that month, there's some pretty friggin good names on there, isn't there?

Anyways, from there Machen took a pretty one-sided drubbing from the lower ranked Floyd Patterson, which dropped Eddie to 9th in the rankings. He followed that fight by basically doing nothing against Ernie Terrell for fifteen rounds in the early parts of '65, which dropped him from the ratings. And a few months later he fought to a draw with an inexperienced journeyman by the name of Elmer Rush.

i'm impressed. well, it would have been nice to see them fight at any time period anyways.

Yogi
01-27-2006, 11:48 PM
i'm impressed. well, it would have been nice to see them fight at any time period anyways.

Well, it would have been ugly, Butterfly...it would have been real ugly. :(

Remember that the same Floyd Patterson who handled that version of Eddie Machen pretty easily was the exact same Floyd Patterson that was lucky to win a single round againt Ali a short time later...Same thing with Terrell.

Dempsey 1919
01-28-2006, 01:10 AM
Well, it would have been ugly, Butterfly...it would have been real ugly. :(

Remember that the same Floyd Patterson who handled that version of Eddie Machen pretty easily was the exact same Floyd Patterson that was lucky to win a single round againt Ali a short time later...Same thing with Terrell.

alright, i concede.

noypi
01-28-2006, 04:05 AM
FIGHTERS WHO WOULD HAVE FOUGHT EACH OTHER BUT NEVER DID!!!

TYSON -LEWIS If im not mistaken Lewis won the fight...
TYSON-HOLYFIELD REMEMBER THE EARS?...

Yogi
01-28-2006, 06:22 AM
***Edit***

king4fore
01-29-2006, 01:04 AM
rocky marciano vs floyd patterson

king4fore
01-29-2006, 01:05 AM
mike tyson vs george foreman 1991

Dynamite76
02-02-2006, 11:19 AM
Maxie Rosenbloom-Tommy Loughran

Cockyb
02-02-2006, 11:56 AM
frazier - norton

tyson - lewis (years b4 dey did)

morales or barera vs marquez, stil can hapen tho!

naseem hamed vs morales

dats of da top of my head!

sleazyfellow
02-04-2006, 06:06 PM
aaron pryor vs. sugar ray lenord, sugar ray obviously ducked him..
another would b pryor vs. hearns, but i know they fought b4, just not at the pro level..would b nice to see if hearns right hand would of done anything to pryors crazy chin, prolly just make him angrier

Da Iceman
02-04-2006, 06:14 PM
frazier vs norton
tyson vs foreman
leonard vs hagler 2

olympic boy
02-06-2006, 07:45 PM
espinosa-hamed :boxing: :boxing: :boxing: