View Full Version : Rate the Puncher


The Surgeon
01-16-2012, 12:11 PM
Rank in order the following 15 fighters based PURELY on one punch power

Doesn't matter what hand its from or what punch it is just rate their one punch power based on their best shot

Tyson, Liston, Shavers, Foreman, Lewis, Dempsey, Louis, Tua, Bowe, Wlad, Ruddock, Morrison, Marciano, Ibeabuchi & Frazier....

1. ?
2. ?
and so on....

kendom
01-16-2012, 12:57 PM
Rank in order the following 15 fighters based PURELY on one punch power

Doesn't matter what hand its from or what punch it is just rate their one punch power based on their best shot

Tyson, Liston, Shavers, Foreman, Lewis, Dempsey, Louis, Tua, Bowe, Wlad, Ruddock, Morrison, Marciano, Ibeabuchi & Frazier....

1. ?
2. ?
and so on....
I would rank them, might change my mind later but thats how it would currently makes sense in my mind
1 Foreman
2 Liston
3 Tyson
4 Tua
5 Lewis
6 Shavers
7 Louis
8 Wlad
9 Dempsey
10 Frazier
11 Marciano
12 Morrison
13 Ruddock
14 Bowe
15 Ibeabuchi

I am tyler
01-16-2012, 02:55 PM
As said before, if i was asked again would probably change.

1. Shavers
2. Foreman
3. Tua
4. Tyson
5. Liston
6. Wlad
7. Marciano
8. Lewis
9. Louis
10. Morrison
11. Frazier
12. Bowe
13. Dempsey
14. Ruddock
15. Ibeabuchi

The Surgeon
01-16-2012, 03:21 PM
Quite surprised to see The Brown Bomber scoring so low...

kendom
01-16-2012, 05:16 PM
Quite surprised to see The Brown Bomber scoring so low...

Louis was a devastating combination puncher but it terms of one punch power I'm able to recognise that there were those ahead of him

New England
01-16-2012, 07:22 PM
Quite surprised to see The Brown Bomber scoring so low...



it's the size as well

he's going to have a serious task ahead of him generating more power than some of these outright larger guys


if we're talking about hitting a heavybag that is.


if you're talking about the best puncher
most effective
most dangerous, etc


it's louis up front for me, and then we can sort out the rest. he's the most dangerous//effective puncher ever in my book and nobody really comes that close.


dont have the time to get through the list right now but i'll go through it in terms of pure power when i get the opportunity.

i got one and two for you though
no brainers :

foreman
shavers

pick an order. i wouldnt want to be the guy in charge of holding on to the bag while those guys are getting in some work

allupnem
01-16-2012, 10:32 PM
1. Shavers
2. Liston
3. Foreman
4. Marciano
5. Louis
6. Dempsey
7. Tyson
8. Frazier
9. Lewis
10. Morrison
11. Tua
12. Ruddock
13.Wlad
14. Ibeabuchi
15. Bowe

nomadman
01-18-2012, 05:31 AM
How are we rating them? On a imaginary PSI machine, on some equally imaginary bloke holding pads, or are we just guessing based on their fights?

If it's a PSI machine, then strong right handed punchers automatically have an advantage over the left hookers due to the angle of the pad.

The Surgeon
01-18-2012, 06:15 AM
How are we rating them? On a imaginary PSI machine, on some equally imaginary bloke holding pads, or are we just guessing based on their fights?

If it's a PSI machine, then strong right handed punchers automatically have an advantage over the left hookers due to the angle of the pad.

Lets just say you have an outstanding chin and each one of them gets to take a free shot at you! Which one do you dread the most?

SBleeder
01-18-2012, 07:11 AM
1. Earnie Shavers
2. Sonny Liston
3. Geroge Foreman
4. Joe Louis
5. Joe Frazier
6. Razor Ruddock
7. Mike Tyson
8. Lennox Lewis
9. Rocky Marciano
10. David Tua
11. Jack Dempsey
12. Riddick Bowe
13. Wladimir Klitschko
14. Tommy Morrison
15. Ike Ibeabuchi

nomadman
01-18-2012, 06:07 PM
Lets just say you have an outstanding chin and each one of them gets to take a free shot at you! Which one do you dread the most?

Haha, can't say that's the most pleasant scenario!

Ok, probably Tua or Lennox followed by Foreman, Tyson, Shavers, Wlad, Morrison then the rest. Tua could knock anyone out if he gets a free shot at their chin, though I'd probably recieve more damage from a Lennox or Foreman right hand thrown at full power. Might be able to brace for it a bit better though. Honestly, the only one I wouldn't mind taking a shot off of from that list is Dempsey (assuming I'm McCall, say).

New England
01-18-2012, 08:14 PM
Rank in order the following 15 fighters based PURELY on one punch power

Doesn't matter what hand its from or what punch it is just rate their one punch power based on their best shot

Tyson, Liston, Shavers, Foreman, Lewis, Dempsey, Louis, Tua, Bowe, Wlad, Ruddock, Morrison, Marciano, Ibeabuchi & Frazier....

1. ?
2. ?
and so on....



outside of the top two the order is probably most dependent on whose fights // drubbings i saw recently
it's hard to rank a guy low when he's recently blasted some guys out for you on the youtube

foreman
shavers
tyson
wladimir
liston
lewis
tua
ruddock
morrison
bowe
ibeabuchi
louis
marciano
frazier
dempsey


my head is thumping just thinking about the methodology (letting them hit you on the chin and evaluating the damage)



i also will add that i rank wladimir so high because:

A: because it's very evident that he punches with unbelievable power in his right hand
B: emanuel steward says he hits harder than lennox lewis
C: he's naturally the biggest man on the list

New England
01-18-2012, 08:16 PM
Haha, can't say that's the most pleasant scenario!

Ok, probably Tua or Lennox followed by Foreman, Tyson, Shavers, Wlad, Morrison then the rest. Tua could knock anyone out if he gets a free shot at their chin, though I'd probably recieve more damage from a Lennox or Foreman right hand thrown at full power. Might be able to brace for it a bit better though. Honestly, the only one I wouldn't mind taking a shot off of from that list is Dempsey (assuming I'm McCall, say).



what do you think of ruddock's power Mr. Ovah?


that hook he threw was always pretty damn brutal

quite a bit behind that shot

lazy
01-18-2012, 08:45 PM
1. Shavers
2. Foreman
3. Tua
4. Tyson
5. Liston
7. Marciano
8. Louis
8. Lewis
9. James Smith
10. Witherspoon

nomadman
01-19-2012, 05:15 AM
what do you think of ruddock's power Mr. Ovah?


that hook he threw was always pretty damn brutal

quite a bit behind that shot

The smash? It was a very hard shot if it landed cleanly, though it always looked rather awkward and difficult to throw. I wouldn't enjoy taking it of course, but then I really wouldn't want to be punched by anyone on that list.

I think that ranking power punchers of this calibre is always a bit silly, since when it comes down to it there's so little difference between them. Course, there are some really standout guys like Tua, but if nearly everyone on that list barring Dempsey landed right they'd probably get the stoppage.








Not on me though, cause I'm Oliver McCall. ;)

nomadman
01-19-2012, 05:28 AM
i also will add that i rank wladimir so high because:

A: because it's very evident that he punches with unbelievable power in his right hand
B: emanuel steward says he hits harder than lennox lewis
C: he's naturally the biggest man on the list

Just to address points 2 and 3, I always tend to be skeptical of what others have to say about a fighter's power since it's always so subjective and you never know exactly what the reason behind it is. Not that I doubt Manny Steward, but he's said some funky things in the past and gone back on his statements a couple of times. He's also training Wlad at the moment, so that has to be taken into consideration.

Regarding his being the naturally biggest man on the list, that of course is true, but unlike some of the punchers mentioned (Lennox, Tyson, Shavers etc) he really doesn't get a lot of his bodyweight behind the shots, so his size advantage is to a degree mitigated. I'd still rank him above a good many men on that list, probably in the top five or just outside, but I can't help thinking that a good many of his recent opponents have been able to take his right hands flush on the chin without being laid up in a dribbling heap on the floor, Haye especially.

The Surgeon
01-19-2012, 06:55 AM
As most have mentioned these lists are very hard and opinions change frequently but here is my take - Today!

1. Shavers (Right hand) Just a monster shot, uppercut was a beast too

2. Foreman (Right uppercut) Ask Smokin Joe...

3. Tyson (Left hook) Hard to pick his best shot, he thinks it was the right hand but most KO shots came from left hook. Speed and power combo was lethal

4. Liston (Left hook) heavy bonecrunching power

5. Tua (Left hook) Ferocious shot thrown with great form and a lot of weight behind it

6. Louis (Right hand) The Perfect shot, excellent technique

7. Lewis (Right hand) Terrific leverage and big weight behind it

8. Frazier (Left Hook) Dropped (Prime-ish) Ali clean, Nuff said.

9. Morrison (Left Hook) Was sending guys through the air and i cant shake that Razor KO

10. Marciano (Right hand) Suzy Q baby....

11. Dempsey (Left hook) Delivered with malice

12. Bowe (Overhand Right) Looping and heavy, close ran by upperrcut

13. W.Klitchko (Right hand) Naturally heavy and well executed but lacking the commitment or vicious intent of a Tyson, Dempsey ect...

14. Ruddock (Smash) Awkward shot delivered with bad intensions

15. Ibeabuchi (Left hook) Heavy handed and fairly quick, had Bryd cooked

New England
01-19-2012, 10:47 AM
Just to address points 2 and 3, I always tend to be skeptical of what others have to say about a fighter's power since it's always so subjective and you never know exactly what the reason behind it is. Not that I doubt Manny Steward, but he's said some funky things in the past and gone back on his statements a couple of times. He's also training Wlad at the moment, so that has to be taken into consideration.

Regarding his being the naturally biggest man on the list, that of course is true, but unlike some of the punchers mentioned (Lennox, Tyson, Shavers etc) he really doesn't get a lot of his bodyweight behind the shots, so his size advantage is to a degree mitigated. I'd still rank him above a good many men on that list, probably in the top five or just outside, but I can't help thinking that a good many of his recent opponents have been able to take his right hands flush on the chin without being laid up in a dribbling heap on the floor, Haye especially.



agreed on the points. ruddock left his feet with the "smash hook"
that's unique punch if i've ever seen one!
i used to throw them at the bag in the gym back in my day!

when i mention steward's statement in a LIITR interview (a company i used to write for and toward which i am very partial,) i usually preface it with your logic
wladimir is his current HW and his best fighter. he's obviously got a stake in building up his power.

i do believe he;s a bigger right handed puncher than lennox, though, but that's just me agreeing with an opinion

and wladimir also rarely lets his horses run
i think if you line up a heavybag, though, you wont find many guys in history who can hit it harder than wladimir can with that right hand of his

obviously thats an opinion and up for debate

his shoulders are so high and arms so long
his bones are gigantic
and he's 245-250 in supreme condition.


if we're talking about an "effective" punchers list he'd be quite far below most of the other punchers, simply on the merits of him not throwing much or in combination

hell, he usualyl starts a fight off with literally nothing but jabs for a few rounds
you cant be an effective power puncher if you dont throw the things

The Surgeon
01-19-2012, 11:02 AM
The Smash kinda reminds me of a wilder version of Oscar's 45 shot


Wlad would have scored higher for me but he never commits to a punch the way some of the other do, for instance Ive seen Tyson land himself on the floor after a miss having thrown it with such malice on his mind. Guys like Dempsey and Tyson REALLY committed to their punches, Wlad is too careful to generate his maximum power

SIDE NOTE: Talking of committing to ur punches (throwing with bad intentions) can u think of anyone who threw with more commitment than Gatti or Mosley?

New England
01-19-2012, 11:10 AM
The Smash kinda reminds me of a wilder version of Oscar's 45 shot


Wlad would have scored higher for me but he never commits to a punch the way some of the other do, for instance Ive seen Tyson land himself on the floor after a miss having thrown it with such malice on his mind. Guys like Dempsey and Tyson REALLY committed to their punches, Wlad is too careful to generate his maximum power

SIDE NOTE: Talking of committing to ur punches (throwing with bad intentions) can u think of anyone who threw with more commitment than Gatti or Mosley?


lol
probably not. gatti did nothing but punch in his prime

jackson is up there as well
rocky marciano
g man mcclellan
jean pascal puts a lot into his shots if i had to pick an active figher

but nobody is like gatti in that regard
not many like shane either (who could also rely on his perfect ten chin)

ScrotieMcBooger
01-19-2012, 05:56 PM
The smash? It was a very hard shot if it landed cleanly, though it always looked rather awkward and difficult to throw. I wouldn't enjoy taking it of course, but then I really wouldn't want to be punched by anyone on that list.

30 second mark
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uehFuWEkI-Q" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

nomadman
01-20-2012, 05:50 AM
agreed on the points. ruddock left his feet with the "smash hook"
that's unique punch if i've ever seen one!
i used to throw them at the bag in the gym back in my day!

Yeah I tried it out myself a few times and ended up cramping my left lat and getting a pain in my lower back. Not really an orthodox punch, but obviously an effective one if you're built to throw it.

when i mention steward's statement in a LIITR interview (a company i used to write for and toward which i am very partial,) i usually preface it with your logic
wladimir is his current HW and his best fighter. he's obviously got a stake in building up his power.

i do believe he;s a bigger right handed puncher than lennox, though, but that's just me agreeing with an opinion

and wladimir also rarely lets his horses run
i think if you line up a heavybag, though, you wont find many guys in history who can hit it harder than wladimir can with that right hand of his

obviously thats an opinion and up for debate

his shoulders are so high and arms so long
his bones are gigantic
and he's 245-250 in supreme condition.

I consider Wlad a harder puncher than Shavers (whose power is a bit overrated) but there's no doubt that Shavers wrung every last bit of power out of his body as he could; it was all he had to fall back on really. Wlad's probably capable of being one of the hardest punchers of all time if he commited more to his shots. On the few occasions he does people lose their consciousness. But he is what he is, and you can only really measure someone on what they do and not what they potentially could do.

if we're talking about an "effective" punchers list he'd be quite far below most of the other punchers, simply on the merits of him not throwing much or in combination

hell, he usualyl starts a fight off with literally nothing but jabs for a few rounds
you cant be an effective power puncher if you dont throw the things

I think Wlad's actually more easily evaluated in this category because he almost only ever throws one or two punches. Guys like Tyson tend to get underrated in one punch power due to their excellent combination punching, which confuses the issue as to whether it was one shot or several that got the knockout. But I think there's more than enough evidence to suggest he was a very hard one shot puncher as well.

nomadman
01-20-2012, 05:57 AM
The Smash kinda reminds me of a wilder version of Oscar's 45 shot


Wlad would have scored higher for me but he never commits to a punch the way some of the other do, for instance Ive seen Tyson land himself on the floor after a miss having thrown it with such malice on his mind. Guys like Dempsey and Tyson REALLY committed to their punches, Wlad is too careful to generate his maximum power

SIDE NOTE: Talking of committing to ur punches (throwing with bad intentions) can u think of anyone who threw with more commitment than Gatti or Mosley?

Arthur Abraham almost spins around if he misses a punch. There are pictures of him where his punching arm is literally crossed over his body and facing backwards due to the momentum. Haye is another one who's incredibly wild with his shots, as is Pascal. Vic Darchinyan?

The Surgeon
01-20-2012, 06:36 AM
Arthur Abraham almost spins around if he misses a punch. There are pictures of him where his punching arm is literally crossed over his body and facing backwards due to the momentum. Haye is another one who's incredibly wild with his shots, as is Pascal. Vic Darchinyan?

Excellent call on AA he completely sells out on some of his big shots!

Someone88
01-26-2012, 09:24 AM
It depends on how we rate power but based on explosiveness, style, technique and results I say Tua is the hardest puncher

nomadman
01-26-2012, 05:52 PM
It depends on how we rate power but based on explosiveness, style, technique and results I say Tua is the hardest puncher

Agreed. Can't really see how anyone can say otherwise really.

Someone88
01-26-2012, 06:21 PM
Agreed. Can't really see how anyone can say otherwise really.

Size is a factor too but yep explosiveness, style, technique and results are the main criteria because Shavers, Foreman, Tyson, Tua and Wladimir aren't that far apart in size but yep a lot of people are looking at it differently they are great punchers I just think Tua is the hardest puncher

nomadman
01-26-2012, 07:47 PM
Size is a factor too but yep explosiveness, style, technique and results are the main criteria because Shavers, Foreman, Tyson, Tua and Wladimir aren't that far apart in size but yep a lot of people are looking at it differently they are great punchers I just think Tua is the hardest puncher

Even though Tua was short, he was built like a wad of muscle, just unbelievably thickset and solid even at 225. A bigger heavyweight like Lennox or Wlad might have been able to get more leverage and weight behind the shot, but there was just something about Tua that seemed almost superhuman at times. It was scary. The dude was born to punch.

Someone88
01-26-2012, 09:21 PM
Even though Tua was short, he was built like a wad of muscle, just unbelievably thickset and solid even at 225. A bigger heavyweight like Lennox or Wlad might have been able to get more leverage and weight behind the shot, but there was just something about Tua that seemed almost superhuman at times. It was scary. The dude was born to punch.

Actually when I meant size I meant weight actually, taller and shorter fighters can be hard punchers it depends on explosiveness and their style more I think. But yep Tua punched so hard Lewis and Wladimir hit really hard too but Tua has koed so many fighters with short punches and put opponents out.

Also it was mentioned before that Wladimir could be punching harder than he does I agree, I can see how much power he has he just holds himself back sometimes he could be an even harder puncher than he is but he's so effective

nomadman
01-29-2012, 02:01 PM
Actually when I meant size I meant weight actually, taller and shorter fighters can be hard punchers it depends on explosiveness and their style more I think. But yep Tua punched so hard Lewis and Wladimir hit really hard too but Tua has koed so many fighters with short punches and put opponents out.

I'm no expert on bio-mechanics, but there strikes me as a clear difference in the way a taller leaner fighter punches compared to a shorter stockier one, assuming both are of equal "athleticism" (a vague term I know).

A tall fighter seems to be able to generate much more snap and leverage on his shots, straight shots in particular, and tends to engage his shoulders and upper body more, whilst generally punching down on opponents. A shorter stockier fighter can get tremendous explosivity out of hooks, uppercuts and other punches which require torque and is generally punching upward with the legs and core. Both are capable of dealing tremendous damage to opponents, though it sometimes seems that fighters are more vulnerable to one and more resistant to the other. That's why I find it difficult to just rate someone's power on a linear scale.

What separated Tua from the crowd, IMO, was his physical strength, which struck me as immense. Like Foreman, Tua just seemed like a really strong dude, but unlike Foreman he also had handspeed, technique and explosive power to go with it. Unfortunately, his height limited his chances to truly land the devastating blows on better opponents, as well as his poor boxing abilities. As a pure puncher though, Jesus!

Also it was mentioned before that Wladimir could be punching harder than he does I agree, I can see how much power he has he just holds himself back sometimes he could be an even harder puncher than he is but he's so effective

True. I sometimes get the same impression with Mayweather, that he could throw much harder punches if he wanted to but chooses not to compromise himself or give his opponents any unnecessary opportunities. At the very upper level of the sport, punching power becomes secondary to a lot of other things that could cost you the fight if you ignore them, things like ring control, maintaining your defence and distance, and so on. Whilst there have of course been hard punching champions, I think you're more likely to see the hardest punches thrown at the mid level of the sport, where fighters can sell out on shots to get the win.

Someone88
01-30-2012, 09:00 AM
I'm no expert on bio-mechanics, but there strikes me as a clear difference in the way a taller leaner fighter punches compared to a shorter stockier one, assuming both are of equal "athleticism" (a vague term I know).

A tall fighter seems to be able to generate much more snap and leverage on his shots, straight shots in particular, and tends to engage his shoulders and upper body more, whilst generally punching down on opponents. A shorter stockier fighter can get tremendous explosivity out of hooks, uppercuts and other punches which require torque and is generally punching upward with the legs and core. Both are capable of dealing tremendous damage to opponents, though it sometimes seems that fighters are more vulnerable to one and more resistant to the other. That's why I find it difficult to just rate someone's power on a linear scale.

What separated Tua from the crowd, IMO, was his physical strength, which struck me as immense. Like Foreman, Tua just seemed like a really strong dude, but unlike Foreman he also had handspeed, technique and explosive power to go with it. Unfortunately, his height limited his chances to truly land the devastating blows on better opponents, as well as his poor boxing abilities. As a pure puncher though, Jesus!



True. I sometimes get the same impression with Mayweather, that he could throw much harder punches if he wanted to but chooses not to compromise himself or give his opponents any unnecessary opportunities. At the very upper level of the sport, punching power becomes secondary to a lot of other things that could cost you the fight if you ignore them, things like ring control, maintaining your defence and distance, and so on. Whilst there have of course been hard punching champions, I think you're more likely to see the hardest punches thrown at the mid level of the sport, where fighters can sell out on shots to get the win.

Great post