View Full Version : Easier Opponent For The Dancing Master


Dempsey 1919
11-05-2005, 06:17 PM
Who was Muhammad Ali's easiest opponent in his career?

wmute
11-05-2005, 09:36 PM
who is this coopman guy anyway?

I think the title of dance master should belong to SRR, but it's a matter of preferences, I guess

Skydog
11-05-2005, 09:37 PM
Well he destroyed Williams, Patterson, Quarry, Moore, etc.

I'll go with Patterson. He easily could have knocked him out, but he wanted to punish him for insulting him and saying he wasn't an American.

Williams wasn't as easy for he wanted to go for the knockout as soon as possible to avoid Williams (for Williams had been shot, and taking him far could have really hurt him), so he just stopped him as soon as possible. If he did that to Patterson, or some other people, he would have KO'ed them in the first round.

Linx
11-05-2005, 10:34 PM
In terms of style (and style does make fights), Big, slow, hard hitters are taylor made for Ali. Example, Sonny Liston, George Forman, Ron Lyle, Ernie Shavers and Cleveland Williams.

habZ
11-05-2005, 10:49 PM
Cleveland Williams fight was the easiest fight for Ali.

http://pelic.free.fr/blog/images/leifer_ali_williams.jpg

fistlegend
11-06-2005, 09:41 AM
patterson or cleveland williams

M26
11-06-2005, 11:20 AM
Cleveland Williams fight was the easiest fight for Ali.

http://pelic.free.fr/blog/images/leifer_ali_williams.jpg

I agree. Ali really had his way with Williams.

Dempsey 1919
11-08-2005, 11:56 PM
williams all the way. ali hit the big cat in 1966 with over 100 punches in each round! that is unreal. he had 80% accuracy! that is also unreal. ali was hit a total of three times! that is again, unreal. it was the greatest display of the sweet science in its history, and ali did it at the tender age of 24! that is truly unreal. that was ali's prime fight. that was aliiiiiii!

http://216.150.78.130/headshop/2004/040213/MuhammadAli_csg030_vsClevelandWilliamsNov141966.jp g

Skydog
11-09-2005, 12:03 AM
Yea, but Ali was going for a knockout as soon as possible on Williams. Had he done that to Terrell or Patterson, he would have made them look even worse. If you watch both fights, there is a cruel fire in Ali's eye that reminds me a lot of Frazier and Foreman. He could have knocked either of them out whenever he pleased, he just wanted to bring the pain those nights.

McKay 1
11-09-2005, 12:08 AM
Sonny Liston in the second fight. I dont think I need to explain why for anybody who actually witnessed that debacle.

Dempsey 1919
11-09-2005, 12:15 AM
Sonny Liston in the second fight. I dont think I need to explain why for anybody who actually witnessed that debacle.

um, this is an ali thread.

McKay 1
11-09-2005, 01:20 AM
um, this is an ali thread.

Yeah, I know, and that was obviously his easiest win he had for anybody who witnessed that debacle like I said.

Dempsey 1919
11-09-2005, 01:44 PM
Yeah, I know, and that was obviously his easiest win he had for anybody who witnessed that debacle like I said.
oh, i thought you were talking about floyd patterson.

Dempsey 1919
02-17-2006, 04:59 PM
i see now that ali's easiest opponent was actually not cleveland williams, but an englishman named brian london in 1966. this is true because ali barely trained for this fight. ali trained hard for the williams fight, and also for the patterson fight and the terrel fight. ali tried the best he could to take williams out is why it ended so quickly. for london, ali weighed i believe something like 217 1/2, the most he ever wieghed until he fought jimmy ellis in '71, and london still fell in three. if ali trained hard for that fight, he would probably have ko'd brian in the first round.

http://www.lafortezzaclub.it/boxe/alilondon.jpg

RockyMarcianofan00
02-17-2006, 05:28 PM
i'd have to agree with the other guy

Ali v Liston II was ridiculous for ali

landed like one punch- before you knew it had happened it was over
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Dempsey 1919
02-17-2006, 05:31 PM
i'd have to agree with the other guy

Ali v Liston II was ridiculous for ali

landed like one punch- before you knew it had happened it was over

well, i don't think that fight should count, since liston threw the fight.

El Guapo
02-17-2006, 05:32 PM
moore or williams, both guys were to slow for ali! i would of liked to see ali and moore go at it!

RockyMarcianofan00
02-17-2006, 06:06 PM
the question was who was the easiest opponent for him

beside Liston II umm probably an acient Moore or patterson
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Dempsey1238
02-17-2006, 07:37 PM
Hands down its Liston 2.

Moore, and Patterson are a close 2nd.

Dempsey 1919
02-17-2006, 08:05 PM
Hands down its Liston 2.

Moore, and Patterson are a close 2nd.

none of those were as easy as brian london.

Dempsey1238
02-17-2006, 08:38 PM
Moore lasted just 4 rounds with Ali or Clay as he was called during that bout.

I think the Moore fight was as easy as it gets out side of Liston 2.

Moore hardly landed a punch, and Ali just well dance his way to victory. And Moore was reaching 50 during that fight I belive.

Frazier's 15th round
02-17-2006, 09:57 PM
Brian London.

Dempsey 1919
02-18-2006, 01:25 AM
Brian London.

definetely.

Dempsey 1919
02-18-2006, 01:25 AM
Moore lasted just 4 rounds with Ali or Clay as he was called during that bout.

I think the Moore fight was as easy as it gets out side of Liston 2.

Moore hardly landed a punch, and Ali just well dance his way to victory. And Moore was reaching 50 during that fight I belive.

but london lasted only three rounds, and ali hardly trained for that fight.

RockyMarcianofan00
02-18-2006, 01:42 AM
are you saying london was better then an Acient Archie moore lol , i have to say Moore was pretty tuff but still he was like 49
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Dempsey 1919
02-18-2006, 01:58 AM
are you saying london was better then an Acient Archie moore lol , i have to say Moore was pretty tuff but still he was like 49

no, i'm just saying he had an easier time overall with london than moore.

catskills23
02-20-2006, 02:17 PM
patterson gave ali a fight second time around though which goes to show if patterson didnt have a bad back for the first fight he would of given ali a tough fight .

Dempsey 1919
02-20-2006, 05:16 PM
patterson gave ali a fight second time around though which goes to show if patterson didnt have a bad back for the first fight he would of given ali a tough fight .

ali was overweight in the second fight and past his prime. plus ali could have ko'd him earlier if he wanted to in the first fight cause he wanted to punish floyd.

Yaman
02-20-2006, 06:47 PM
Easy because they were skinny and not as big as Ali. Thats why they were easy.

Dempsey 1919
02-21-2006, 01:29 AM
Easy because they were skinny and not as big as Ali. Thats why they were easy.

really? Sonny liston-218lbs. ernie terrel 6'-6" 215. cleveland williams 6'-6" and about 220lb. they are real small aren't they? :rolleyes:

Yogi
02-23-2006, 11:56 AM
cleveland williams 6'-6" and about 220lb. they are real small aren't they? :rolleyes:

Williams was no 6'6/220, Butterfly.

Kid Achilles
02-23-2006, 12:12 PM
He definitely wasn't. He was no taller than 6'3" and a good 210 pounds. Once again Butterfly (this time literally) tries to build Ali's opponents up.

Cleve was also well past his prime when Ali fought him, having been shot with a .35 to the stomach. That is the real reason Ali looked so great in beating him. A prime Williams would have given Ali a great fight.

smasher
02-23-2006, 12:23 PM
A prime Williams would have given Ali a great fight.
Ali wasn't troubled by straight up tall erect fighters. Also Williams didn't have a great chin. He may have given Ali a better fight but I can guarantee it wouldn't be 'great'.

Dempsey 1919
02-23-2006, 12:39 PM
He definitely wasn't. He was no taller than 6'3" and a good 210 pounds. Once again Butterfly (this time literally) tries to build Ali's opponents up.

Cleve was also well past his prime when Ali fought him, having been shot with a .35 to the stomach. That is the real reason Ali looked so great in beating him. A prime Williams would have given Ali a great fight.

cleveland williams was 6'-6" and 215-220. you probably looked on boxrec didn't you.

I've seen Liston destroy Cleveland Williams. Destroy him! And Cleveland Williams is a big guy, he's like 6'-6". And when Liston flattened him out, he covered the whole ring!

cleveland williams and ernie terrel were both 6'-6". not 6'-3".

Yogi
02-23-2006, 12:39 PM
He definitely wasn't. He was no taller than 6'3" and a good 210 pounds. Once again Butterfly (this time literally) tries to build Ali's opponents up.

Cleve was also well past his prime when Ali fought him, having been shot with a .35 to the stomach. That is the real reason Ali looked so great in beating him. A prime Williams would have given Ali a great fight.

Giving Williams the benefit of the doubt I'd also say he was 6'3/210 (his listed weight for the fight), even though there are times in that fight where Williams looked just slightly shorter than did Ali (prefight instructions, as well as a few instances when they come together & stand straight up to each other)...The Liston fights also show that Williams didn't have very much of a height advantage over Sonny, so that fight footage again shows that Williams was no taller than 6'3.

Still a big guy obviously, but not the towering giant Butterfly is trying to make him out to be.

Da Iceman
02-23-2006, 12:40 PM
i gotta say wepner, yea ali knocked out williams in three. but ali was hittin wepner at will.

Yogi
02-23-2006, 12:41 PM
cleveland williams was 6'-6" and 215-220. you probably looked on boxrec didn't you.

Ah, there is fight footage of Williams that one can use to judge his height...or did you forget about that?

Da Iceman
02-23-2006, 12:43 PM
cleveland williams was 6'-6" and 215-220. you probably looked on boxrec didn't you.



cleveland williams and ernie terrel were both 6'-6". not 6'-3".
shut up you stupid ass *****

Dempsey 1919
02-23-2006, 03:04 PM
shut up you stupid ass *****

the only reason i think you would say that is because i've proven my point and there's nothing else for you to say.

Dempsey 1919
02-23-2006, 03:04 PM
Ah, there is fight footage of Williams that one can use to judge his height...or did you forget about that?

didn't you read the quote that angelo dundee said.

Yogi
02-23-2006, 03:36 PM
didn't you read the quote that angelo dundee said.

Yeah, I read it, but I'm certainly going to trust my very own eyes over somebody who says "he's like 6'6" ("like" he's not exactly sure himself), especially when it was VERY obvious by watching the fights that Williams wasn't nearly that tall...

Do you always believe what Dundee says, Butterfly?

"I don't think anyone can argue that the following fighters must rate as the cream of the crop: Muhammad Ali, Sugar Ray Leonard, Ray Robinson, Sugar Ray Leonard, Tony Canzoneri, Joe Louis, Henry Armstrong, Willie Pep, and ROCKY MARCIANO." - Angelo Dundee (page 271 of his bio, 'I Only Talk Winning')

He's also stated in print that he rates Marciano as the third greatest Heavyweight of all-time, which is backed up by that list up top there.

So, knowing your own personal thoughts & opinions on Marciano...what do you say?