View Full Version : Dr. Jon "Bones" Jones, MD


SuckaPunch
09-24-2011, 11:27 PM
Jones worked Rampage with surgical precision, absolutely stunning almost-flawless performance!

SkillspayBills
09-24-2011, 11:48 PM
He's really something to behold. Times like this I am happy I was on the bandwagon early.

led
09-25-2011, 12:00 AM
He's really something to behold. Times like this I am happy I was on the bandwagon early.

Me too....

SuckaPunch
09-25-2011, 12:13 AM
Me too....

me three...i've been following jones since his high school wrestling days.

dragonlee34
09-25-2011, 01:42 AM
anyone that has studied kung fu or all the arts knows jones is the real deal

he was using kung fu in the fight that inside leg kick when rampage used his jab is a kung fu move

that wing inside elbow is a white crane move

that front kick is kung fu

and that front kick to the knee is kung fu

man he is good no one will beat him unless he gets lazy he will only get better in time

way to go champ :boxing:

kaps
09-25-2011, 02:39 AM
Jones finally has a legit win over a top guy in the weight class. Now he is deserving of some recognition. I'm still not a fan, but at least he beat someone who was ranked and not just coming off of a long lay off and surgery....

BIg Smoke
09-25-2011, 02:58 AM
He's really something to behold. Times like this I am happy I was on the bandwagon early.

you already know.

me and u was one of the first on the bandwagon homie.

dragonlee34
09-25-2011, 05:03 AM
bones is the truth no one will beat this kid book it even rampage said so

this kid uses kung fu and all the arts

this should kill the fake ***** that jujitsu is the best cause its not

dragonlee34
09-25-2011, 05:06 AM
its funny cause white crane has a counter to the rear naked choke easy arm lock to make them tap

dragonlee34
09-25-2011, 05:09 AM
and there is a easy arm lock to stop a take-down its a shoulder lock

dragonlee34
09-25-2011, 05:11 AM
funny thing i have never seen a ufc fighter use this these counters

-The Glove-
09-25-2011, 05:45 AM
Jones finally has a legit win over a top guy in the weight class. Now he is deserving of some recognition. I'm still not a fan, but at least he beat someone who was ranked and not just coming off of a long lay off and surgery....

I know you're a huge MMA fan, and I thought if anyone would be a fan it would you. Tell me why you aren't?

Squirrel
09-25-2011, 07:19 AM
I posted this on another forum:

"Like I said though, that TDD, strength and chin made Jones look human. His wrestling got nullified really, really well and he fell back on his insane range. People seem to read into his "incredible gifts" cause he throws a lot of flashy, unorthodox strikes - the point is he has SO MUCH room to do that in that he doesn't ever pay the price for it.

I definitely feel this fight, though an incredible display, showed that Jones isn't AS good at things that he was made out to be. I heard people say he was p4p strongest and his wrestling was the best; those are two points that definitely are NOT the case.

Rampage put in one good camp after two miserable performances and still fared OK. I'm eager to see how Rashad will do against Jones now he also seems to be training ultra hard."

- v e t -
09-25-2011, 08:20 AM
me three...i've been following jones since his high school wrestling days.

me four

Gino Ros
09-25-2011, 08:26 AM
me three...i've been following jones since his high school wrestling days.

Where did you wrestle?

SOTO
09-25-2011, 08:35 AM
I believe that shogun is a better fighter than rempage, I want to see john jones fight machida or chael sonnen.

project xxx1
09-25-2011, 08:40 AM
anyone that has studied kung fu or all the arts knows jones is the real deal

he was using kung fu in the fight that inside leg kick when rampage used his jab is a kung fu move

that wing inside elbow is a white crane move

that front kick is kung fu

and that front kick to the knee is kung fu

man he is good no one will beat him unless he gets lazy he will only get better in time

way to go champ :boxing:
most of the stand up moves jones used were muay thai not sure about kung fu but ive done muay thai and kickboxing,most of the things he done were perfect tex book stuff with great technique

bones jones the real deal,cant see no one beating him anytime soon

BKM-2010
09-25-2011, 09:50 AM
I posted this on another forum:

"Like I said though, that TDD, strength and chin made Jones look human. His wrestling got nullified really, really well and he fell back on his insane range. People seem to read into his "incredible gifts" cause he throws a lot of flashy, unorthodox strikes - the point is he has SO MUCH room to do that in that he doesn't ever pay the price for it.

I definitely feel this fight, though an incredible display, showed that Jones isn't AS good at things that he was made out to be. I heard people say he was p4p strongest and his wrestling was the best; those are two points that definitely are NOT the case.

Rampage put in one good camp after two miserable performances and still fared OK. I'm eager to see how Rashad will do against Jones now he also seems to be training ultra hard."

To be honest I think if that version of Rampage(defensive wrestling) shows up he can make ANY wrestler look like they have overrated wrestling. ANYONE from Lawal to Evans to Davis.

He showed some of the best TDD last night that I've seen in quite a while.

-Swizzy-
09-25-2011, 10:45 AM
Anderson Silva can be beat on the ground. GSP can be beat in the Stand up.

Jones can't be beat in the standup or the ground. Best all-around fighter in MMA right now IMO.

BALLISTIC
09-25-2011, 11:59 AM
I believe that shogun is a better fighter than rempage, I want to see john jones fight machida or chael sonnen.

are u serious sonnen would get KO and machida would get summit or KO
jones could have TKO rampage if he wanted too..those knee kicks slowed rampage down big time..buckled his knees..but jones playd it safe..

evans ve jones should be better since both hate one another..

-Swizzy-
09-25-2011, 12:22 PM
are u serious sonnen would get KO and machida would get summit or KO
jones could have TKO rampage if he wanted too..those knee kicks slowed rampage down big time..buckled his knees..but jones playd it safe..

evans ve jones should be better since both hate one another..

yeah but if you noticed last night, Rashad wasn't talking as much **** when they were face2face. He looked scared after what he saw Jones do to Rampage. Rashad knows he has no chance.

kaps
09-25-2011, 12:40 PM
I know you're a huge MMA fan, and I thought if anyone would be a fan it would you. Tell me why you aren't?

Mainly his attitude. I think he's a good fighter, but I don't like him as a person. Also, I still don't understand the major nut hugging. This was his first win against a top ten LHW that wasn't coming off of surgery but people have been swinging off his nuts since he beat Bonnar....

kaps
09-25-2011, 12:40 PM
yeah but if you noticed last night, Rashad wasn't talking as much **** when they were face2face. He looked scared after what he saw Jones do to Rampage. Rashad knows he has no chance.

Rashad looked scared? Jones started crying and walked away....

Carpe Diem
09-25-2011, 01:38 PM
He's very skilled. He's very much similar as Anderson Silva.

JDezi4
09-25-2011, 03:15 PM
The baddass thing about Jones is that, although he is tall, lanky, and has mostly physical advantages over his opponents... That's not all he is. He's a very skilled fighter, and can easily be one of the best ever... I can't see anyone beating him

Squirrel
09-25-2011, 03:29 PM
To be honest I think if that version of Rampage(defensive wrestling) shows up he can make ANY wrestler look like they have overrated wrestling. ANYONE from Lawal to Evans to Davis.

He showed some of the best TDD last night that I've seen in quite a while.

Very true, he'd obviously trained that one religiously. I was thoroughly impressed.

*Boss*
09-25-2011, 07:30 PM
Mainly his attitude. I think he's a good fighter, but I don't like him as a person. Also, I still don't understand the major nut hugging. This was his first win against a top ten LHW that wasn't coming off of surgery but people have been swinging off his nuts since he beat Bonnar....

Jones is the truth , stop the hate.

kaps
09-25-2011, 11:05 PM
Jones is the truth , stop the hate.

Read the post. I said he was a good fighter, just don't like the dude. Kinda like Mayweather, probably the best boxer fighting right now, but as a person, he's a piece of ****. Just because someone is a good fighter doesn't mean I have to like the guy......

BKM-2010
09-26-2011, 01:34 PM
Read the post. I said he was a good fighter, just don't like the dude. Kinda like Mayweather, probably the best boxer fighting right now, but as a person, he's a piece of ****. Just because someone is a good fighter doesn't mean I have to like the guy......

Yet you're a big Diaz fan who still act like a bunch of immature punk kids.


This Jones hate is one of the weirdest hate I've seen in combat sports. Barely anyone can explain their reasoning either.

the traveler
09-26-2011, 03:01 PM
I posted this on another forum:

"Like I said though, that TDD, strength and chin made Jones look human. His wrestling got nullified really, really well and he fell back on his insane range. People seem to read into his "incredible gifts" cause he throws a lot of flashy, unorthodox strikes - the point is he has SO MUCH room to do that in that he doesn't ever pay the price for it.

I definitely feel this fight, though an incredible display, showed that Jones isn't AS good at things that he was made out to be. I heard people say he was p4p strongest and his wrestling was the best; those are two points that definitely are NOT the case.

Rampage put in one good camp after two miserable performances and still fared OK. I'm eager to see how Rashad will do against Jones now he also seems to be training ultra hard."

I disagree. Wrestling still won jones the fight. He won the fight by taking Rampage down and submitting him. His wrestling was not all that nullified and he still showed a strength and technique advantage. He was able to bully Rampage against the cage the entire fight and he took Rampage down twice, the last time being a good showing of wrestling and strength as he just forced him down from guillotine position. The first time he took Rampage down he transitioned to to full mount in lighting speed and opened a cut on Rampage's face with strikes from the top. His ground and pound still looked scarier than ever. Rampage was lucky that he got out of that position because he probably would have been stopped. Also, and even more so, I think his ground game looks even better now that we've seen more of his submission game.

He easily submitted Rampage who has rarely been submitted in his long career and even gave us more to think about as he pulled guard and attempted a triangle.

So, now not only do we know he can wrestle but he has a jui jitsu game. He also took little to no damage with a striker that has been in stand up wars with some of the best strikers in the game.

~BoZz~
09-26-2011, 10:39 PM
I haven't watched one jones fight..what's his strength? ..ground or stand up?

kaps
09-26-2011, 10:57 PM
Yet you're a big Diaz fan who still act like a bunch of immature punk kids.


This Jones hate is one of the weirdest hate I've seen in combat sports. Barely anyone can explain their reasoning either.

Diaz acts like a real dude, he doesn't show off or pretend to be someone he's not for the cameras. Jones fake persona isn't much better than his real one....

the traveler
09-27-2011, 11:04 AM
I haven't watched one jones fight..what's his strength? ..ground or stand up?

Right now, I'd say his main strength is his wrestling and ground and pound. However his striking gets better each fight. His striking defense is as good as anyone in the game right now but even though it is decent, he still needs more work in getting crisper with his striking offense.

As far as his wrestling, he mainly looks to get guys down by judo/greco roman throws from the clinch. He has dumped many of guys on their back with flashy throws and trips. When he gets guys down he usually quickly transitions to a dominant position and he is great at holding guys down in order to advance positions. As of right now, his level of trianing jui jitsu is still kind of unknown, but what is scary for people is that he has choked out several guys recently and has shown the willingness to attempt submissions. My next point about him will tell you why his surging BJJ game is scary....

His ground and pound is perhaps the most lethal I've ever seen in MMA. He throws a lot of elbows from top position. He broke one guys face with an elbow before and has sent guys in a desperate scramble for safety while unleashing his barrage of elbows. The thing is, his arms are so long that he's able to get a lot of leverage while on top to reign down the elbows. It's truely grotesque to watch.

#1Assassin
09-27-2011, 11:44 AM
Jones worked Rampage with surgical precision, absolutely stunning almost-flawless performance!

really? i thought he looked like shiet, only thing that made him look good was rampage fighting like a retard.

im a huge rampage fan but since he left junito ibarra his boxing gon to shiet, yet thats all he wants to use. before he had godd headmovement, threw short punches, had good punch variation, good timing, good sense of range, good accuracy and used feints and jabs to set up his punches.

he had some good headmovemnt against jones, ill give him that but everything else was garbage. he only threw hooks and from too far away leaping in, they were wide as hell, terrible timing. he was just looking for one big punch all night and refused to set it up, just waited and then jumped in like a bum.

jones' offense looked good, but his defense was garbage. he made plenty of mistakes where was wide open to get ktfo, rampage just didnt have the skill, speed and intelligence to capitalize. had he used his jab, thrown the straight right to the solar plexus, some right hooks to the ribs and used feints before coming up top with punches in bunches he wouldve flattened jones.

jones is a great wrestler and has potential in his striking, but as of now his striking aint ****.

the traveler
09-27-2011, 12:18 PM
How can you say his striking aint **** when he has fought two of the best strikers of ALL time in his division and has taken little to no damage? Your problem is that you're so simple minded. Everything that occures is because the other guy wasn't good enough?

When has Rampage or Shogun ever looked as bad as they have striking? You're trying to tell people that are actually in the arena fighting how they should be fighting from behind a monitor? How about going in there and trying to hit jones? Jackson even said it after the fight that you really don't know how hard it is to fight jones until you step in the octagon with him. The guy has never been hit hard with strikes and yet his striking defense sucks? Show me another fighter that has taken less damage than he has striking.


jones' offense looked good, but his defense was garbage. he made plenty of mistakes where was wide open to get ktfo, rampage just didnt have the skill, speed and intelligence to capitalize. had he used his jab, thrown the straight right to the solar plexus, some right hooks to the ribs and used feints before coming up top with punches in bunches he wouldve flattened jones.

hahah this is hilarious. You make it sound as if it's just as easy as saying it. Point is you don't know ****. Rampage has been training in MMa probably longer than your brain cells have been working. I'm sure he knows a lot more about fighting mma than you do.

I can understand the sentiment if jones is doing this to rookies, but he has just made two straight vets that are considered by wide majority to be top 5 greatest in their division to look like fools.

Right now, you gotta say that he is one of the best strikers cuz his striking defense is too much to overcome.

$Natedatpkid$
09-27-2011, 12:52 PM
really? i thought he looked like shiet, only thing that made him look good was rampage fighting like a retard.

im a huge rampage fan but since he left junito ibarra his boxing gon to shiet, yet thats all he wants to use. before he had godd headmovement, threw short punches, had good punch variation, good timing, good sense of range, good accuracy and used feints and jabs to set up his punches.

he had some good headmovemnt against jones, ill give him that but everything else was garbage. he only threw hooks and from too far away leaping in, they were wide as hell, terrible timing. he was just looking for one big punch all night and refused to set it up, just waited and then jumped in like a bum.

jones' offense looked good, but his defense was garbage. he made plenty of mistakes where was wide open to get ktfo, rampage just didnt have the skill, speed and intelligence to capitalize. had he used his jab, thrown the straight right to the solar plexus, some right hooks to the ribs and used feints before coming up top with punches in bunches he wouldve flattened jones.

jones is a great wrestler and has potential in his striking, but as of now his striking aint ****.

Totally agree, I think Rampage impressed more people then Jones. Most boneheads where like "Rampage gets destroyed worse then Shogun got destroyed by Jones, or worse then what Shogun did to him." HAHAHAHAHA Rampage gave him his toughest fight.

Not to mention Rampage blocked the majority of his strikes besides the leg kicks. The reach is what did it, thats what frustrated Rampage, not Jones picking him apart.

#1Assassin
09-28-2011, 06:31 PM
How can you say his striking aint **** when he has fought two of the best strikers of ALL time in his division and has taken little to no damage? Your problem is that you're so simple minded. Everything that occures is because the other guy wasn't good enough?

When has Rampage or Shogun ever looked as bad as they have striking? You're trying to tell people that are actually in the arena fighting how they should be fighting from behind a monitor? How about going in there and trying to hit jones? Jackson even said it after the fight that you really don't know how hard it is to fight jones until you step in the octagon with him. The guy has never been hit hard with strikes and yet his striking defense sucks? Show me another fighter that has taken less damage than he has striking.

hahah this is hilarious. You make it sound as if it's just as easy as saying it. Point is you don't know ****. Rampage has been training in MMa probably longer than your brain cells have been working. I'm sure he knows a lot more about fighting mma than you do.

I can understand the sentiment if jones is doing this to rookies, but he has just made two straight vets that are considered by wide majority to be top 5 greatest in their division to look like fools.

Right now, you gotta say that he is one of the best strikers cuz his striking defense is too much to overcome.

im anything but simple minded, im a true student of the game (boxing) who spends several hours every single day studying my craft. and ive done that since the age of 12, i know striking. you are the one who doesnt understand what hes looking at, you dont recognize flaws in a fighter until they are exposed. you dont see the opening unless someone takes advantage of it. well i see it, i see all of them (or close to it).

boxing skill in mma is close to non existing, even the best strikers have major flaws. GSP fights in straight lines, anderson silva hates to lead, machida pulls straight back with his chin in the air etc etc.

jones have more flaws then they do though. hes very sloppy defensivley. if you cant see that well then u just dont know **** about boxing son. makes sense since u cant see the decline in skill in rampage jackson.

rampage was an atg striker by mma standards, but he isnt anymore. thats like 75% of my previous post. when he was with ibarra he had great boxing skill by mma standards. he had good sense of range, good timing and had a wide arsenal of punches which he threw with good technique and put together in beautiful combinations. he set it all up with moving his head or parrying punches then countering, a solid jab and sharp feints.

ALL THAT is gone now. since the griffin fight his skills have diminished each bout and its gotten to the point where he does fight like a rank amateur and depends 100% on his power and chin and shows no skills whatsoever.

his headmovement looked good against jones like i said, but everything else?

sense of range - gone, he was leaping in with punches all night. and its not jones' height bcuz he was doing the same thing against hamill and machida.

timing - gone, he just swings randomly.

punch variety - garbage. no jabs, no straight rights, no bodyshots, rarely throws uppercuts. its basicly hooks all the time, and wide hooks at that thrown from the wrong range.

technique - garbage, nothing straight or short. evetything is wide as hell and usually leaping in.

combinations - rarely. and if he does throw one its usually just two punches and its always a left hook followed by a right hook or a right hook followed by a left hook.

set up - none. just leaps in with hooks.

u ask me when rampage looked this bad striking? he looked bad against hamill, he looked bad against machida, he looked bad against rashad. ill give jones credit for making him look worse than they did but lets face it. rampage is no longer a quality striker. all hes got is power and punch resistance, not too hard to make those guys look bad.

and shogun? shogun is a brawler, his skills are limit aswell. he doesnt have the footwork or headmovement to close in on a tall fleet footed oponent. hes fast, powerful, aggressive and has a wide arsenal of strikes. but skillwise hes average at best. poor footwork, fights in straight lines, limited defensively etc.

and again im not bashing jones, hes the best prospect in the sport, perhaps ever. his wrestling and bjj seems superb (thats not my craft) and his striking is great.. offensively. there are major flaws in his defense, there just isnt anybody who has the skills, speed and intelligence to expose it. and lets keep in mind this kid is 24 and always improving. these flaws will dissapear, probably before anybody takes advantage of them (only guy i give a serious chance of doing that is silva if he moved up).

jones will become one of the greatest ever and he will become one of the best if not the best p4p fighter in the world. but he still has alot to learn and improve on. just calling it like i see it, son.

the traveler
09-28-2011, 08:32 PM
im anything but simple minded, im a true student of the game (boxing) who spends several hours every single day studying my craft. and ive done that since the age of 12, i know striking. you are the one who doesnt understand what hes looking at, you dont recognize flaws in a fighter until they are exposed. you dont see the opening unless someone takes advantage of it. well i see it, i see all of them (or close to it).

How can something be called a flaw when it has never failed? You seem to only be judging his striking defense based on your preconceived notions of what constitutes good striking defense..what you have been thought. Guess what, there isn't one way to do something. At the end of the day what determines if something is successful or not is the outcome. Until we see Jones getting tagged on occasion due to what you consider "sloppy defense" then making a claim that his striking defense is bad is only an opinion based on simple minded judgement.



jones have more flaws then they do though. hes very sloppy defensivley. if you cant see that well then u just dont know **** about boxing son. makes sense since u cant see the decline in skill in rampage jackson.


Yeah, I don't train boxing in a gym and I don't study it a couple hours a day but do you really need to to tell that a guy that has been in 15 mma fights and has taken no damage striking is not sloppy defensively. The problem is that you study so much and are stuck in such narrow ways of thinking that when you see something outside of what you've been brainwashed to thinking it automaticly is bad even when there is no evidence to support the claim.

Also, perhaps your problem is that you're coming in mma with boxing glasses on. They are two different sports. I think it's been shown that mma striking is a lot different than the individual striking arts. You don't judge an mma striker by boxing standards because they aren't the same sports.



and shogun? shogun is a brawler, his skills are limit aswell. he doesnt have the footwork or headmovement to close in on a tall fleet footed oponent. hes fast, powerful, aggressive and has a wide arsenal of strikes. but skillwise hes average at best. poor footwork, fights in straight lines, limited defensively etc.


His skills are limited lol shogun is considered to be one of the best strikers in mma history. How can you just lay it out as a general statement that "he doesnt have the footwork or headmovement to close in on a tall fleet footed oponent" when jones is the only opponent matching that description that he has done that bad against? Shogun has been in the game for a while and has smashed nearly everyone in his way including guys like Diabate and Overeem. Average at best? Seems to me like all the facts say one thing while you say another.


there are major flaws in his defense, there just isnt anybody who has the skills, speed and intelligence to expose it.

Then doesn't that mean that his striking defense is good? If there isn't anyone that can exploit his defense in the largest and most talented mma organization that says to me that he has great striking defense.

#1Assassin
10-02-2011, 09:50 AM
How can something be called a flaw when it has never failed? You seem to only be judging his striking defense based on your preconceived notions of what constitutes good striking defense..what you have been thought. Guess what, there isn't one way to do something. At the end of the day what determines if something is successful or not is the outcome. Until we see Jones getting tagged on occasion due to what you consider "sloppy defense" then making a claim that his striking defense is bad is only an opinion based on simple minded judgement.

so if i leave my front door wide open when i go to work im not vulnerable to get robbed until someone acctually robs me? jones is vulnerable, there just hasnt been anyone whos taken advantage of it yet.

to say a mistake doesnt count just bcuz nobody taken advantage yet is just ignorant, sooner or later someone will unless its fixed.

i dont judge his striking based only on what ive been thought. i base it on what i know, some from my boxing training, some from studying boxing tapes and some from watching mma. isnt that what we all do? why are you allowed to have an opinion on his striking but mine is a "preconceived notions of what constitutes good striking defense"?


Yeah, I don't train boxing in a gym and I don't study it a couple hours a day but do you really need to to tell that a guy that has been in 15 mma fights and has taken no damage striking is not sloppy defensively. The problem is that you study so much and are stuck in such narrow ways of thinking that when you see something outside of what you've been brainwashed to thinking it automaticly is bad even when there is no evidence to support the claim.

thats not true at all, there are several ways to defend yourself. pernell whitaker and muhammad ali were unconventional. they were still amongst the best defensive boxers ever bcuz they managed to leave few openings even if it was in an unconventional way.

my problem with jones isnt that hes un orthodox and im not stuck in narrow ways, theres no way you could know if i were bcuz i havent said anything about jones' style. you go as far as saying im brainwashed, your guessing dude. there is evidence to my claims you are the one saying things you know nothing about.

jones having sloppy defense isnt about style at all and i never said it was. he simply leaves openings. he over commits to punches for example, when he does he gets of balance, out of position and sometimes even falls over. anyone can make mistakes but he does it alot and when he does he is wide open to get hit and has no defense bcuz hes of balance.

be un conventional all you want, but if your of balance (incapable of moving your feet or head), have your hands down (incapable of blocking) and is right in your oponents line of fire with your chin hanging out, guess what thats sloppy defense. its no defense acctually, since hes of balance hes in no position to defend himself. SLOPPY! if his oponent doesnt land that just means hes sloppy too.


Also, perhaps your problem is that you're coming in mma with boxing glasses on. They are two different sports. I think it's been shown that mma striking is a lot different than the individual striking arts. You don't judge an mma striker by boxing standards because they aren't the same sports.


i think i am in some ways even though im well aware they are two different sports. i think that happens to everyone to a certain degree. but if your open to get punched your open to get punched, no matter if theres grappling involved, if you are in a cage or a ring etc.


His skills are limited lol shogun is considered to be one of the best strikers in mma history. How can you just lay it out as a general statement that "he doesnt have the footwork or headmovement to close in on a tall fleet footed oponent" when jones is the only opponent matching that description that he has done that bad against? Shogun has been in the game for a while and has smashed nearly everyone in his way including guys like Diabate and Overeem. Average at best? Seems to me like all the facts say one thing while you say another.


shogun is a great brawler like i said before. fast, powerful and with a wide arsenal of strikes. but his skill level really isnt that high and i always felt he would do poorly against a technical fighter. in fact i predicted jones would destroy him like he did. styles make fights and shogun was just right for jones not to mention at the right time in his career.

i never said shogun was an average striker, i said hes average from a technical point of view, but he makes up for it physicly. but when he cant beat a guy with physiqe hes screwed as was the case with jones. it will take a technical striker to beat jones and thats not shogun style.

Then doesn't that mean that his striking defense is good? If there isn't anyone that can exploit his defense in the largest and most talented mma organization that says to me that he has great striking defense.


i said all along hes a great fighter, just that he isnt perfect. i say he has one hole in his game and you act like im hating on him. yet within his division there is nobody with the skills needed to capitalize.

if you have soft legs and theres nobody in your division who can throw leg kicks, you still have soft legs even if nobody can take advantage of it. its a bad example i know but im trying to simplify.

my point is the flaws are there, there just arent any anderson silvas, jose aldos or cain velasquez' in his division. that doesnt eliminate the flaws though. if i go to work and leave my door un locked im vulnerable. even if no robbers happen to be on my street in those hours i still messed up.

jones messed up against rampage, he fought a sloppy fight regardless if quinton capitalized or not. still hes a great fighter, just dont think he fought a perfect fight or that hes a perfect fighter. i know im so unfair lol.

the traveler
10-03-2011, 02:40 PM
so if i leave my front door wide open when i go to work im not vulnerable to get robbed until someone acctually robs me? jones is vulnerable, there just hasnt been anyone whos taken advantage of it yet.


Bad analogy. You seem to be one of the very few people that think his defense is bad. How many times have you heard his reach advantage brought up? Never before have I heard a physical attribute talked about more in mma than jon's reach. His reach is used mainly for defense. If his defense was bad or sloppy it wouldn't be talked about as much. It's talked about so much because he keeps people away and forces them into poor offense. He made Shogun and Rampage look like complete fools in the striking department. Shogun was running forward and eating punches while Rampage was swinging for the fences because he couldn't figure out jon's defense. Even a lot of Jon's strikes are made for defensive purposes. For example, the kicks he used against Rampage were to keep distance. And he did it effectively.


to say a mistake doesnt count just bcuz nobody taken advantage yet is just ignorant, sooner or later someone will unless its fixed.

I'm not saying it doesn't count, but what happens when that "mistake" continues to succeed in the face of opposition? When does it stop becoming a mistake and actually a good tactic? Jones hasn't been hit for 15 MMA fights. I'd say he's passed enough tests to where you question him based on results.

i dont judge his striking based only on what ive been thought. i base it on what i know, some from my boxing training, some from studying boxing tapes and some from watching mma. isnt that what we all do? why are you allowed to have an opinion on his striking but mine is a "preconceived notions of what constitutes good striking defense"?

Because I'm basing most of my opinion on his striking defense based on stats, which are facts, whereas you are going more off of hypotheticals and opinions.

the traveler
10-03-2011, 03:09 PM
jones having sloppy defense isnt about style at all and i never said it was. he simply leaves openings. he over commits to punches for example, when he does he gets of balance, out of position and sometimes even falls over. anyone can make mistakes but he does it alot and when he does he is wide open to get hit and has no defense bcuz hes of balance.



Then wouldn't that mean that he has bad offense? I agree that he sometimes misses wildly with flying knees and his other wild strikes but I think that's an issue of striking technique and accuracy that he has to fix. That is an offensive issue not a defensive issue. Infact the fact that he is still able to evade getting hit after attempting those types of strikes gives more credit to his defense because it shows he has great escapability.

Besides when he misses badly with wild strikes or when his jab isn't intact, when is he ever out of position? Mostly, it's his opponents that are always out of position because they can never hit him due to his footwork and movement. Jones problem isn't his defense, it's his offense. He needs to sharpen it up. It looked really good against Shogun, but not as good against Rampage. But you have to also give credit to Rampage as he is very good defensively.




shogun is a great brawler like i said before. fast, powerful and with a wide arsenal of strikes. but his skill level really isnt that high and i always felt he would do poorly against a technical fighter. in fact i predicted jones would destroy him like he did. styles make fights and shogun was just right for jones not to mention at the right time in his career.

So now you're saying Jones is technical? lol.. I thought he was sloppy? And you keep mentioning Shogun is a brawler as if he's a tank abbot type. Brawler implies a guy with little technique but a lot of power. Shogun didn't make it this far just because of power, the guy has been training mau thai since he was a teenager and trained in one of the best mau thai acadamies in Chute Box for years. Mau Thai is a striking discipline just as boxing. So don't try to sit there and try to relegate Shogun as just a brawler. You may know some about boxing but how much do you know about mau thai? If you don't know much you should probably shut your mouth when trying to judge Shogun's "technical" skills.

"I awalys felt he'd do bad against a technical fighter" Then what the hell is Machida? Shogun arguably beat Machida twice, the very fighter that has been considered by many to be one of the most technical strikers in mma history.

i never said shogun was an average striker, i said hes average from a technical point of view, but he makes up for it physicly. but when he cant beat a guy with physiqe hes screwed as was the case with jones. it will take a technical striker to beat jones and thats not shogun style.

Again, how the hell are you in any place to comment on Shogun's technique when he is mainly a mau thai striker and you said you come from a boxing background. If you don't know ****, isn't it best to actually look at the fights. If a man has been in as many fights as Shogun has and has dominated almost all his fights in the striking department, then how is his technique bad? Technique is basically what you do in order to achieve a given effect. If you're highly successful then I'd have to say that your technique has to be good. Shogun makes up for it physically... lmao. Shogun is one of the more average sized Lhws. He is fast and powerful, sure, but it takes good technique in order to translate your physical tools, which every high level fighter has, into things that benefit you.

Sorry to say, but you're dumb, dude. Shogun isn't some big brute moron that just goes out there and strong arms everyone down like you are trying to make it seems. You just really seem to not know much about what you're talking about.



Jones messed up against rampage, he fought a sloppy fight regardless if quinton capitalized or not. still hes a great fighter, just dont think he fought a perfect fight or that hes a perfect fighter. i know im so unfair lol.

Yeah, he messed up real bad. He was so sloppy he took no damage in four rounds against a veteran that has been fighting longer than you've probably been able to type. Rampage and other fighters give Jones props, but I guess you know it all. You know more than the actual fighters that are going in the cage, risking their health while you sit behind a monitor and make judgements on technical skills. Please.