View Full Version : Dempsey Vs Greb


I am tyler
06-15-2011, 06:55 AM
Who do you think wins and why? I read a while back in boxing news that Greb beat the common opponents better and more convincingly than Dempsey. Also apparently in sparring Greb gave Dempsey fits. Would Dempsey's size make a difference? Or would the smaller, quicker Greb be too much for the 'Manassa Mauler'. Two great warriors, let me know what you guys think.

raf727
06-15-2011, 07:51 AM
i think greb takes it, but it depends on what year, the last few years of grebs career he was apparently fighting with one eye(which is when he alot of his losses) so who knows how much better he would have been with 2 eyes and no untimely death...

JAB5239
06-15-2011, 07:54 AM
Who do you think wins and why? I read a while back in boxing news that Greb beat the common opponents better and more convincingly than Dempsey. Also apparently in sparring Greb gave Dempsey fits. Would Dempsey's size make a difference? Or would the smaller, quicker Greb be too much for the 'Manassa Mauler'. Two great warriors, let me know what you guys think.

A better question would be why did Dempsey never fight Greb?

But to answer this, it can go two ways. 1, with Greb outspeeding him as he did when they sparred and cruising to a UD. Or 2, winning comfortably until Dempsey finally catches up and puts him to sleep.

I wouldn't discount either scenario but it should be noted that Willie Meehan, Billy Miske and Tommy Gibbons (amongst others) managed to go the distance with Dempsey, and none were nearly as great as Greb.

JAB5239
06-15-2011, 07:59 AM
i think greb takes it, but it depends on what year, the last few years of grebs career he was apparently fighting with one eye(which is when he alot of his losses) so who knows how much better he would have been with 2 eyes and no untimely death...

Greb had been fighting blind in 1 eye shortly after his fight with Kid Norfolk in 1921. He still managed an AMAZING resume and record after that point only losing to the very best.

I am tyler
06-15-2011, 08:28 AM
I personally think the reason why they didn't fight was because Jack didn't want to. It would have been an amazing fight.

JAB5239
06-15-2011, 08:37 AM
I personally think the reason why they didn't fight was because Jack didn't want to. It would have been an amazing fight.

I don't think there is any question he didn't want to, instead settling for Grebs leftovers while all the while being called out. This is a massive duck which is conveniently over looked by Dempsey idolaters. Jack was a great fighter, but there are many flaws in his career some are willing to look past in order to keep the image they have of him intact.

I am tyler
06-15-2011, 08:43 AM
I don't think there is any question he didn't want to, instead settling for Grebs leftovers while all the while being called out. This is a massive duck which is conveniently over looked by Dempsey idolaters. Jack was a great fighter, but there are many flaws in his career some are willing to look past in order to keep the image they have of him intact.
Agree completely. Dempsey wouldn't be able to bully Greb at all. I think it would pan out like this. Both start very fast trading blows. Dempsey landing some hard shots but Greb still there in the trenches fighting fire with fire. Grebs shots at first don't seem to be hurting Jack. By the later rounds Dempsey is tiring and trying to hold on to Greb. Greb is still being the windmill he is, is not tired and still throwing from all angles. I actually see Greb stopping Dempsey really late on because I don't think Jack will have the stamina to hang with Greb late on.

JAB5239
06-15-2011, 08:50 AM
Agree completely. Dempsey wouldn't be able to bully Greb at all. I think it would pan out like this. Both start very fast trading blows. Dempsey landing some hard shots but Greb still there in the trenches fighting fire with fire. Grebs shots at first don't seem to be hurting Jack. By the later rounds Dempsey is tiring and trying to hold on to Greb. Greb is still being the windmill he is, is not tired and still throwing from all angles. I actually see Greb stopping Dempsey really late on because I don't think Jack will have the stamina to hang with Greb late on.

Greb wouldn't stop Dempsey, the guy was as tough as nails. For all the faults that many choose to remain blind to, Dempsey was a great fighter and as game as they come. If the much bigger Tunney (compared to Greb) couldn't stop him after the beating he gave him and after 3 years off, Greb isn't stopping him either.

I am tyler
06-15-2011, 09:10 AM
Greb wouldn't stop Dempsey, the guy was as tough as nails. For all the faults that many choose to remain blind to, Dempsey was a great fighter and as game as they come. If the much bigger Tunney (compared to Greb) couldn't stop him after the beating he gave him and after 3 years off, Greb isn't stopping him either.
I don't see Greb hurting him. I mean I could actually see Dempsey doing a No Mas. He is one of my favourite fighters but Greb would be too much for him.

JAB5239
06-15-2011, 09:14 AM
I don't see Greb hurting him. I mean I could actually see Dempsey doing a No Mas. He is one of my favourite fighters but Greb would be too much for him.

We'll have to disagree on that one my man.

How about starting a thread for the billion points contest? You look like (your account) you could use a billion points!

NChristo
06-15-2011, 09:22 AM
I don't see Greb hurting him. I mean I could actually see Dempsey doing a No Mas. He is one of my favourite fighters but Greb would be too much for him.

What makes you think that Dempsey would quit ?.

Don't really have an opinion on this, lack of any Greb footage makes it impossible for me to make an analysis but if I had to I'd pick Dempsey to win.

barfly12
06-15-2011, 10:25 AM
The Greb/Dempsey sparring incident was way overblown. Dempsey often looked bad in sparring. So did Ali and Marciano. No big deal. Greb came out smokin and Dempsey either wasn't ready, wasn't in shape, or just got caught by surprise. In a real fight, does anyone honestlyt think 160 lb Greb can stand in front of Dempsey for 15 or more rounds (the Willard fight was scheduled for 45 rounds).

Ziggy Stardust
06-15-2011, 11:18 AM
The Greb/Dempsey sparring incident was way overblown. Dempsey often looked bad in sparring. So did Ali and Marciano. No big deal. Greb came out smokin and Dempsey either wasn't ready, wasn't in shape, or just got caught by surprise. In a real fight, does anyone honestlyt think 160 lb Greb can stand in front of Dempsey for 15 or more rounds (the Willard fight was scheduled for 45 rounds).

A non-entity named Gary Bell used to pwn Evander Holyfield all the time in sparring. Anybody think Bell takes Evander when the it's for real? Cuz I sure as hell don't.

Poet

Ziggy Stardust
06-15-2011, 11:21 AM
I don't see Greb hurting him. I mean I could actually see Dempsey doing a No Mas. He is one of my favourite fighters but Greb would be too much for him.

For the record, Dempsey merks Greb.

Poet

JAB5239
06-15-2011, 11:35 AM
The Greb/Dempsey sparring incident was way overblown. Dempsey often looked bad in sparring. So did Ali and Marciano. No big deal. Greb came out smokin and Dempsey either wasn't ready, wasn't in shape, or just got caught by surprise. In a real fight, does anyone honestlyt think 160 lb Greb can stand in front of Dempsey for 15 or more rounds (the Willard fight was scheduled for 45 rounds).

Wasn't in shape? Overblown? Here's one article from the NY times. I have more of you need further proof. Either way Dempsey shouldn't be excused for not fighting Greb. Do you honestly think its ok for a fighter to duck one guy to fight men that said fighter has already dominated?

Sept 3, 1920

Big Battlers Work Out At Top Speed

Dempsey and Miske Give Sparring Partners Lots Of Action in Training Bouts

Benton Harbor, Mich., Sept.2- With only one more day of hard work remaining before Billy Miske and Jack Dempsey ease up in their training for the ten-round bout for the heavyweight championship of the world here on Monday afternoon, speed was the order of the day at both camps today. Champion and challenger alike cast aside all brakes and gave their sparring partners a merry whirl. Both boxers waded through six rounds of real action with the big ten-ounce "pillows", the training gloves.

(paragraph skipped)

-Greb Swaps Blows With Champion-

It was Harry Greb who again today gave Dempsey his stiffest workout. The Pittsburgher was in fine fettle after the excellent showing he made against the champion yesterday. He was full of pep. With the call of time signalizing the beginning of activities, Greb promptly rushed Dempsey. The onslaught was so sudden that Jack was caught off his guard and it took a solid left hook into the body, plied with all the force at Greb's command, which is considerable, to jolt Dempsey into action. Then the fur began to fly.

It was a whirlwind three rounds that these two fighters staged for the edification of the biggest crowd that has yet shoe-horned its way into the grandstand at the baseball park in front of which the ring is built. There were fully 2,000 people present, and they were treated to as much action in those three rounds as is usually crowded into eight of a real bout.

The bout caused the crowd to burst into cheers and prolonged applasuse. In fact, during the intermission between the second and third rounds Ted Hayes, who acts as announcer at the Dempsey camp, was compelled to request the spectators to refrain from urging either of the men to greater efforts.

Scott9945
06-15-2011, 12:17 PM
I'll pick a great heavyweight over a great middleweight without giving it too much thought. I doubt that Greb ever faced anyone as offensively equipped as a near prime Dempsey.

GJC
06-15-2011, 12:30 PM
A non-entity named Gary Bell used to pwn Evander Holyfield all the time in sparring. Anybody think Bell takes Evander when the it's for real? Cuz I sure as hell don't.

Poet
I don't lend much credence to sparring stories Ali could be dreadful in sparring. Do think that around 23/24 Greb might have had a window of opportunity though, similar to Spinks/Holmes. Dempsey was fading by then IMO so Greb would certainly have been a live body in there. Wills is often thrown up against Dempsey but personally I think he was made for Dempsey but a quicker fighter with good whiskers who sets a high pace and I think Dempsey has an uncomfortable night

Barn
06-15-2011, 01:00 PM
If Dempsey was capable of pulling a No Mas he would have done it in the Tunney fight.

Personally over 15 rounds I see Dempsey stopping Greb.

The Surgeon
06-15-2011, 02:16 PM
A non-entity named Gary Bell used to pwn Evander Holyfield all the time in sparring. Anybody think Bell takes Evander when the it's for real? Cuz I sure as hell don't. Poet Ah Gary Bring The Pain Bell! Id heard he gave Evander Hell so i checked out his next fight vs Tua - over in about 30seconds! lol


Im goin with The HW, Greb was a mean mother by all accounts but this is no average Joe HW its Jack ****in Dempsey man The Manassa Mauler! I think he wins a barnburner

Sparring is sparring and nothing more as far im concerned

raf727
06-15-2011, 02:22 PM
you do know greb fought heavyweights right? he wasnt just a middleweight look at the weight fluctuations of the fighters in his box rec.

if he has his good eye he takes it, greb is the GOAT imo

I am tyler
06-16-2011, 06:15 AM
I think Greb takes this though. Points maybe. No doubt though if Jack caught him it would be over.

BigStereotype
06-16-2011, 09:50 PM
ATG heavyweight vs. ATG middleweight...I have to go with the heavyweight everytime. Wlad vs. Sergio? I don't know why Dempsey and Greb never fought, who avoided who, but I know what a size advantage is. Greb might have been able to out-technique Dempsey, but it would only be a matter of time before he got something big and was flattened.