View Full Version : when did the 2nd world title get introduced


Sam Donald
06-12-2011, 04:23 PM
i know there used to be one title per division but when did they bring in the second title?

8 titles, 1 per division sounds pretty cool if ur champ, ur definitely the champ

BattlingNelson
06-12-2011, 04:47 PM
You can find a historical rundown on the alphabet soup here:

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=279907&highlight=alphabet

The Smash
06-12-2011, 07:47 PM
I was actually going to start thread similar to this, but mine was going to be entitled "When did you stop caring about world titles?"

Scott9945
06-12-2011, 08:13 PM
The first major split of a world title in my lifetime was when the WBA stripped Ali for giving Liston an immediate rematch. Ernie Terrell beat either Eddie Machen or Doug Jones to win their title. Nobody took it seriously, and it was unified when Ali easily beat Terrell.

Yogi
06-21-2011, 02:07 AM
There's never been a time when there's only been one title per division per say. Some divisions at some times perhaps. But that has never ever been the norm. Always been alternative claims out there opposite of the accepted champion and they were serving as promotional tools for the most part. Some had the backing of publications like Police Gazette in the earliest days of accepted gloved boxing. Some times it's been claimed by a fighter/promoter with support from many of the sportswriters in the press. Other times it's been from earlier "alphabet groups" like the International Boxing Union, American Boxing Association or the later National Boxing Association and NYSAC titles.

The major difference between now and then were how the onlookers viewed such titles. Back then they were largely ignored when it came to being written into boxing history. As generally were the WBC & WBA for a large portion of their time until the late 70's Ring Magazine-US Championship scandal. Nowadays, though, we've had a generation of fans, writers, fighters, etc., institutionalized into believing those promotional props of today are worth a damn when all they're doing is conflicting with the very singular definition of the term "world champion". In other words, there's no such thing as "two world champions" in any weight division.

JAB5239
06-21-2011, 03:03 AM
There's never been a time when there's only been one title per division per say. Some divisions at some times perhaps. But that has never ever been the norm. Always been alternative claims out there opposite of the accepted champion and they were serving as promotional tools for the most part. Some had the backing of publications like Police Gazette in the earliest days of accepted gloved boxing. Some times it's been claimed by a fighter/promoter with support from many of the sportswriters in the press. Other times it's been from earlier "alphabet groups" like the International Boxing Union, American Boxing Association or the later National Boxing Association and NYSAC titles.

The major difference between now and then were how the onlookers viewed such titles. Back then they were largely ignored when it came to being written into boxing history. As generally were the WBC & WBA for a large portion of their time until the late 70's Ring Magazine-US Championship scandal. Nowadays, though, we've had a generation of fans, writers, fighters, etc., institutionalized into believing those promotional props of today are worth a damn when all they're doing is conflicting with the very singular definition of the term "world champion". In other words, there's no such thing as "two world champions" in any weight division.

Good to see you Yogi! Another great poster just popping up, whats going on here lately? Seems this board is starting to get its legs back under it!

Yogi
06-21-2011, 04:26 AM
Good to see you Yogi! Another great poster just popping up, whats going on here lately? Seems this board is starting to get its legs back under it!

Cheers, Jab, and good to see you too.

JAB5239
06-21-2011, 04:41 AM
Cheers, Jab, and good to see you too.

You gonna get back to posting regularly, or are you just visiting?

Yogi
06-21-2011, 04:54 AM
You gonna get back to posting regularly, or are you just visiting?

We'll see, my old friend. Kind of got tired of posting on internet forums a couple of years ago for the most part (here and elsewhere), but have grown more warm to the idea again lately. But again, we'll see. I'd still have to have stuff to post about, though. Things like 'who ranks where' and 'who wins between such-and-such' have never really been my thing. Less so nowadays.

JAB5239
06-21-2011, 05:03 AM
We'll see, my old friend. Kind of got tired of posting on internet forums a couple of years ago for the most part (here and elsewhere), but have grown more warm to the idea again lately. But again, we'll see. I'd still have to have stuff to post about, though. Things like 'who ranks where' and 'who wins between such-and-such' have never really been my thing. Less so nowadays.

I understand completely. We'd love to have that great knowledge of yours back here regularly though. :fing02:

Yogi
06-21-2011, 05:07 AM
Keep buttering me up like that and how can I resist not posting more? Haha. You're very kind, Jab. Cheers for that.

JAB5239
06-21-2011, 05:14 AM
Keep buttering me up like that and how can I resist not posting more? Haha. You're very kind, Jab. Cheers for that.

Lol, keep posting my friend. If its buttering you up, fine. But the forum is a much better place with you here and any of the old regulars who know you will say the same thing, I can guarantee it!

Yogi
06-21-2011, 05:18 AM
Lol, keep posting my friend. If its buttering you up, fine. But the forum is a much better place with you here and any of the old regulars who know you will say the same thing, I can guarantee it!

On that note, who is still around from the old days if you don't mind me asking? And since I'm seeing a lot of unfamiliar names with a quick browse, which could be expected obviously, maybe I ca ask who is who of the new guard?

Yogi
06-21-2011, 05:32 AM
Geez, don't know how my old eyes missed him the first time through here, but it's great to see my old friend, Bat, is still hanging around.

JAB5239
06-21-2011, 05:44 AM
On that note, who is still around from the old days if you don't mind me asking? And since I'm seeing a lot of unfamiliar names with a quick browse, which could be expected obviously, maybe I ca ask who is who of the new guard?

Bat, Poet, and BennySt, and TerryA and a few others have recently returned. A few others have been banned, Im sure some have come back under new user names...some have left due to burnout or other reasons, and some of the trouble makers are either not allowed in the section or don't come around because I delete most of the troll post and insults. A lot of new people since you left, most willing to keep an open mind, others who just want to argue. Its about the same, just new faces. I really don't have time to go into who is who, but send me a PM and I'll fill you in tomorrow.

Yogi
06-21-2011, 05:52 AM
Yeah, that was kind of a loaded question to ask about the new faces. Sorry about that. I'm sure I'll get to know some of them in time. Good to hear some of the old timers have returned, though. Remember the four guys you mentioned quite well. All good people.

Cheers, Jab.

JAB5239
06-21-2011, 05:57 AM
Yeah, that was kind of a loaded question to ask about the new faces. Sorry about that. I'm sure I'll get to know some of them in time. Good to hear some of the old timers have returned, though. Remember the four guys you mentioned quite well. All good people.

Cheers, Jab.

No worries my friend.

Greatest1942
06-21-2011, 08:05 AM
There were always some disputes as Yogi mentioned. One famous case was concerning Sam langford and Jack Johnson. Jack Johnson's refusal to honor an agreement made by his manager to defend against the British champion led the National Sporting Club in London, the most powerful body in boxing outside the USA, to withdraw recognition of Johnson as champion. They matched Sam Langford and the British champion William "Iron" Hague for their version of the title. Langford beat Hague on a fourth round knockout in London on May 24, 1909. Langford returned home to America and never pressed his claim to the title.