View Full Version : Nigel Benn vs Julian Jackson


Toney616
05-08-2011, 05:14 AM
Physical Attributes:
Power:Jackson
Handspeed: equal

Technical Attributes:
Defense: Benn
Offense:Jackson?
Footwork:equal
Jab:Jackson?

Other:
Intangibles:Benn

Blueprint fight: Benn vs McClellan

Who wins and why?

bojangles1987
05-08-2011, 07:52 AM
Benn by decision.

The Surgeon
05-08-2011, 08:23 AM
Nigel Benn early doors by KO :boxing:

The tension would be thick in the room while this fight lasted - either man capable of ending it at any given time

Toney616
05-08-2011, 09:43 AM
Benn by decision.
I think this fight would be a war that ends with someone winning by ko

Toney616
05-08-2011, 09:46 AM
Nigel Benn early doors by KO :boxing:

The tension would be thick in the room while this fight lasted - either man capable of ending it at any given time
Good point. Because of their power and less than granite chins this fight could go either way.

EMSLDB
05-09-2011, 12:46 AM
Assuming this fight is at 160 i think jackson would stop him in around 6rd. in my opinion Benn was alittle to wild at this weight didnt have the same punch resistance that he had at 168. but either way i dont see this fight going past 6or 7 rds

mickey malone
05-09-2011, 06:06 AM
If Jackson's gonna ko him, it'll have to be somewhere within the opening 10 secs of whatever round it ends in. I can only see Benn getting done on his way in which is precisely where he'd be heading. Up close, i'd say Benn does the most damage, stopping a bloodied and dazed Jackson in the mid to late rounds.

#1Assassin
05-09-2011, 06:25 AM
jackson kills him, different class of fighters imo. also keep in mind benn was wild and chinny at 160lbs, jackson had the ability to box when he needed to and had a great chin in his prime.

fake fans look at boxrec and see the KOs he suffered when he was completely shot and say he had a weak chin, but they didnt follow his career and see how durable he was in his prime and how far he had slipped when he lost those fights.

mickey malone
05-09-2011, 07:34 AM
jackson kills him, different class of fighters imo. also keep in mind benn was wild and chinny at 160lbs, jackson had the ability to box when he needed to and had a great chin in his prime.

fake fans look at boxrec and see the KOs he suffered when he was completely shot and say he had a weak chin, but they didnt follow his career and see how durable he was in his prime and how far he had slipped when he lost those fights.
Showed a very good chin at 154, but i wouldn't bank on it at 160.
He was getting knocked scatty by the comparitively light punching Herol Graham b4 landing his sunday punch and never really faced a ferocious puncher until getting ko'd by McClellan.

I can understand the argument for Benn being wild and chinny, but i'd say it was more a case of him gassing out. He was taken to school by Michael Watson quite early in his career and came back as a much better fighter for it, only getting stopped on his feet by the iron chinned Chris Eubank who somehow withstood some brutally flush shots, shots that spun his head 180 degrees and made him bite his tongue in half. Shots which my opinion would have been too much for Jackson.

#1Assassin
05-09-2011, 07:47 AM
Showed a very good chin at 154, but i wouldn't bank on it at 160.
He was getting knocked scatty by the comparitively light punching Herol Graham b4 landing his sunday punch and never really faced a ferocious puncher until getting ko'd by McClellan.

I can understand the argument for Benn being wild and chinny, but i'd say it was more a case of him gassing out. He was taken to school by Michael Watson quite early in his career and came back as a much better fighter for it, only getting stopped on his feet by the iron chinned Chris Eubank who somehow withstood some brutally flush shots, shots that spun his head 180 degrees and made him bite his tongue in half. Shots which my opinion would have been too much for Jackson.

jacksons eye was bothering him against graham, he wasnt getting hurt by punches to the chin. i agree jackson would not be able to take flush shots form benn consistantly. but i think benn would take jacksons punches even worse, in fact i dont think he would take them at all. jackson imo has a light edge in punch resistance over benn and a big edge in power, benn wa s agreat puncher but jackson was the greatest... ever.

on top of that he was more skilled. he like benn got overconfident at times and fought wild, but when he knew he had a dangerous guy in front of him he boxed very well.

Pastrano
05-09-2011, 08:00 AM
Nigel by ko 5. He was a better boxer. Jackson had a bad chin, Nigel's chin was better. Not great but still better.

physiker
05-09-2011, 08:07 AM
Nigel by ko 5. He was a better boxer. Jackson had a bad chin, Nigel's chin was better. Not great but still better.

That sounds about right, as far as most likely, but maybe not by much.

Of course, Jackson showed that he could be getting pounded, but unless he was down and out, one could come from nowhere when you least expect it, and KO his opponent. Was that Herol?

Which ever way, likely an early KO.

CiganoBoxer
05-09-2011, 08:09 AM
This would of been one hell of a fight guys..and is pretty much 50/50 in my book,i went with Benn tho as he beat better opponents than the hawk ...:boxing:

Jeff Da Maori
05-09-2011, 08:12 AM
Nigel by ko 5. He was a better boxer. Jackson had a bad chin, Nigel's chin was better. Not great but still better.

Benn was an awful boxer. No jab, no defense, wild and wide with most of his work and his head movement consisted of ducking down so low his a55 was almost touching the canvas! He relied on his power, and a big pair of balls and it took him a lot further than his actual boxing ability ever could have.

On the subject of chins though, I think you're right. A common opponent with truly world class power? Gerald McClellan. Benn survived barely, Jackson got blown away.

I fancy Jackson by mid round KO. Benn was too wild and loaded up on everything. Julian Jackson was a competent boxer as well as a big puncher so all needs to do is keep his hands high, his chin low and wait for the right opening. One well placed right hand later....... :boxing:

Pastrano
05-09-2011, 08:18 AM
Benn was an awful boxer. No jab, no defense, wild and wide with most of his work and his head movement consisted of ducking down so low his a55 was almost touching the canvas! He relied on his power, and a big pair of balls and it took him a lot further than his actual boxing ability ever could have.

On the subject of chins though, I think you're right. A common opponent with truly world class power? Gerald McClellan. Benn survived barely, Jackson got blown away.

I fancy Jackson by mid round KO. Benn was too wild and loaded up on everything. Julian Jackson was a competent boxer as well as a big puncher so all needs to do is keep his hands high, his chin low and wait for the right opening. One well placed right hand later....... :boxing:
:tool: If Benn was such a terrible boxer, then how come got a draw with Eubank that shoulda been a victory for him (Benn)?? You know who Chris Eubank was and what he was capable of as a boxer. Now stop talking complete bs and go watch some Benn fights!:rolleyes:

physiker
05-09-2011, 08:20 AM
Benn was an awful boxer. No jab, no defense, wild and wide with most of his work and his head movement consisted of ducking down so low his a55 was almost touching the canvas! He relied on his power, and a big pair of balls and it took him a lot further than his actual boxing ability ever could have.

On the subject of chins though, I think you're right. A common opponent with truly world class power? Gerald McClellan. Benn survived barely, Jackson got blown away.

I fancy Jackson by mid round KO. Benn was too wild and loaded up on everything. Julian Jackson was a competent boxer as well as a big puncher so all needs to do is keep his hands high, his chin low and wait for the right opening. One well placed right hand later....... :boxing:

Well you indirectly bring up a hidden factor.

When needed, Benn was willing to get dirty.
With McClellan, I saw many rabbit punches. Together with a horrible home ref, led to the demise of McClellan. He said as early as the 2nd round he could not comprehend his corner's instructions.

So maybe this matchup--like many--would come down to where it was held.

And I thought you might be kidding, but I looked up Papatoetoe, NZ. A real town near Auckland. Been there--was very nice along with the people. Wish I were there instead...

But it's nearly a boxing name as in toe to toe.

Jeff Da Maori
05-09-2011, 08:29 AM
:tool: If Benn was such a terrible boxer, then how come got a draw with Eubank that shoulda been a victory for him (Benn)?? You know who Chris Eubank was and what he was capable of as a boxer. Now stop talking complete bs and go watch some Benn fights!:rolleyes:




Getting a draw with Eubank somehow qualifies Benn as a capable boxer? Hmmm. And I'm the tool?

He was a big puncher, not a boxer. If you'd seen more than few YouTube highlight vids then you'd know this already. You might wanna watch a few more (complete) fights yourself there Princess... Why not start with Watson vs Benn? It's a prime example of the difference between a boxer and a puncher and clearly demonstrates how little technique Benn had.

Jeff Da Maori
05-09-2011, 08:38 AM
Well you indirectly bring up a hidden factor.

When needed, Benn was willing to get dirty.
With McClellan, I saw many rabbit punches. Together with a horrible home ref, led to the demise of McClellan. He said as early as the 2nd round he could not comprehend his corner's instructions.

So maybe this matchup--like many--would come down to where it was held.

And I thought you might be kidding, but I looked up Papatoetoe, NZ. A real town near Auckland. Been there--was very nice along with the people. Wish I were there instead...

But it's nearly a boxing name as in toe to toe.

Papatoetoe (papa 2 toes to us locals) is a suburb of Auckland bro, it's about 20 mins from the CBD. Glad you enjoyed your stay!


Good point with the dirty tactics too bro, Benn was never shy about using any means necessary so the venue could indeed be a factor. Oakland, CA seems to be a good venue for fighters who want to use as many illegal tactics as possible and go unpunished.... Ask anyone who's been in with Andre Ward!!

Pastrano
05-09-2011, 08:45 AM
Getting a draw with Eubank somehow qualifies Benn as a capable boxer? Hmmm. And I'm the tool?

He was a big puncher, not a boxer. If you'd seen more than few YouTube highlight vids then you'd know this already. You might wanna watch a few more (complete) fights yourself there Princess... Why not start with Watson vs Benn? It's a prime example of the difference between a boxer and a puncher and clearly demonstrates how little technique Benn had.

I've seen his fights with Eubank, Doug DeWitt, McClellan, Nicky Piper, Michael Watson, Iran Barkley and Steve Collins. Now I seriously suggest you fak off.:D

Benn outpunched himself against Watson btw. And the ref stopped it too soon, Benn was on his feet and obviously ready to go on. Another bs English stoppage. But I know Watson would get to him anyway. Benn's technique improved a lot after that fight, when he realised he can't just knock everybody out. In the first Eubank fight he was in bad shape and gassed out.

physiker
05-09-2011, 08:51 AM
Papatoetoe (papa 2 toes to us locals) is a suburb of Auckland bro, it's about 20 mins from the CBD. Glad you enjoyed your stay!


Good point with the dirty tactics too bro, Benn was never shy about using any means necessary so the venue could indeed be a factor. Oakland, CA seems to be a good venue for fighters who want to use as many illegal tactics as possible and go unpunished.... Ask anyone who's been in with Andre Ward!!

LOL about Oakland.
But it does seem to be a worldwide phenomenon that I call home cooking.

I agree about Ward. Just can't be a fan of someone who'll either hold all night or head butt his way to victory. Unless he is fighting a fellow traveler.

I'd love to see Ward vs Hopkins. Could be the first double KD from simultaneous head butts. Ward is younger, he'd get up first and win.

Jeff Da Maori
05-09-2011, 09:05 AM
I've seen his fights with Eubank, Doug DeWitt, McClellan, Nicky Piper, Michael Watson, Iran Barkley and Steve Collins. Now I seriously suggest you fak off.:D

Benn outpunched himself against Watson btw. And the ref stopped it too soon, Benn was on his feet and obviously ready to go on. Another bs English stoppage. But I know Watson would get to him anyway. Benn's technique improved a lot after that fight, when he realised he can't just knock everybody out. In the first Eubank fight he was in bad shape and gassed out.

He didn't gas out against Eubank. He had 6 shades of 5hit beaten out of him and couldn't continue because of the punishment he'd taken. It had fvck all to do with stamina and everything to do with Eubank being a lot tougher than anyone had anticipated.

You're right about the Watson fight, he did punch himself out. He'd been hitting fresh air all night and taking an a55 whipping in the process. The stoppage was the right call though, you don't have to wait until a guy is out cold or flat on his back to know he's had enough for one day.

Now I seriously suggest you fak off bro.... and learn about word comprehension. Then, next time you would see that all I did was say Benn was a poor boxer, which in terms of technical ability, he was. It can't be denied. He got where he did by virtue of "**** your pants scary" levels of power and balls so big he most likely carried them in a wheelbarrow! For you to claim otherwise is nonsense, and contrary to both public opinion and video evidence.

LOL about Oakland.
But it does seem to be a worldwide phenomenon that I call home cooking.

I agree about Ward. Just can't be a fan of someone who'll either hold all night or head butt his way to victory. Unless he is fighting a fellow traveler.

I'd love to see Ward vs Hopkins. Could be the first double KD from simultaneous head butts. Ward is younger, he'd get up first and win.

Hopkins vs Ward would be the only fight right now that could rival Haye vs Valuev for least punches thrown although, like you say, there'd still be a good amount of violence!

Pastrano
05-09-2011, 09:26 AM
He didn't gas out against Eubank. He had 6 shades of 5hit beaten out of him and couldn't continue because of the punishment he'd taken. It had fvck all to do with stamina and everything to do with Eubank being a lot tougher than anyone had anticipated.

You're right about the Watson fight, he did punch himself out. He'd been hitting fresh air all night and taking an a55 whipping in the process. The stoppage was the right call though, you don't have to wait until a guy is out cold or flat on his back to know he's had enough for one day.

Now I seriously suggest you fak off bro.... and learn about word comprehension. Then, next time you would see that all I did was say Benn was a poor boxer, which in terms of technical ability, he was. It can't be denied. He got where he did by virtue of "**** your pants scary" levels of power and balls so big he most likely carried them in a wheelbarrow! For you to claim otherwise is nonsense, and contrary to both public opinion and video evidence.



Hopkins vs Ward would be the only fight right now that could rival Haye vs Valuev for least punches thrown although, like you say, there'd still be a good amount of violence!
:lol1: Gee, this guy is good. If you had seen as many Benn interviews as I did, he said he didn't prepare like a champion against Eubank in the first fight. And its true, he had a tendency to go and party and spend an entire day at the hairdresser saloon (before the Watson fight), so its no wonder his stamina didn't hold up in such tough fights. But he improved that too. It was not long after that that he moved up to 168...I imagine a big part of it was that he felt he could make that weight more comfortably than 160. Another part was ofc that Eubank had already moved up and he desperately wanted a rematch.

physiker
05-09-2011, 10:18 AM
Well gentlemen, if I could ask a side question.

What about Steve Collins who fought both these guys and won all of them.
I've seen people rate Collins very low--despite these 4 wins of these 2 greats or near-greats. Others have him up there. I saw a great youtube vid highlighting these 4 fights.

Seemed like he had a LaMotta chin, because they both landed some bombs on him!

What do you think of Collins in this equation? (And let's not get Calz in to it, as a fighter should be able to retire when he wants to, esp if he's got medical problems, thanks.)

CiganoBoxer
05-09-2011, 01:19 PM
Well you indirectly bring up a hidden factor.

When needed, Benn was willing to get dirty.
With McClellan, I saw many rabbit punches. Together with a horrible home ref, led to the demise of McClellan. He said as early as the 2nd round he could not comprehend his corner's instructions.

So maybe this matchup--like many--would come down to where it was held.

And I thought you might be kidding, but I looked up Papatoetoe, NZ. A real town near Auckland. Been there--was very nice along with the people. Wish I were there instead...

But it's nearly a boxing name as in toe to toe.The ref or rabbot punches has little to do with the out come to this fight,btw its one of three fights i eva bought a ringside ticket for .
An important fact about this fight that always seems to get forgot is that Gerald McClellan hadn't prepared properly., He had fallen out with Manny Steward whom indecently thought the Benn fight was a big risk , and he wound up with***65279; a corner that included a guy he had met just three weeks earlier and who had never been a second before.
I can't help thinking someone like Steward would have realized long before the fight was over that something was wrong because television replays show McClellan blinking in his corner from midway through the fight !
Another thing that gets trivialized is Benn had been in these types of fights before and McClellan hadn't ,A lot of you guys are forgetting that Benn wasnt a bad fighter/puncher also ,and once Benn had taken all McClellan huge bombs, Benn started landing some heavy shots him self ,McClellan or his new corner hadn't planned for this and had no plan B !
These where massive factors in the tragic outcome to this fight ,a shame as if the outcome had of been better this fight could easy go down as one of the best fights of all time !

physiker
05-09-2011, 01:59 PM
[QUOTE=Mrpedigree;10508905]The ref or rabbot punches has little to do with the out come to this fight,

Stopped reading there, naturally.

mickey malone
05-09-2011, 02:28 PM
jacksons eye was bothering him against graham, he wasnt getting hurt by punches to the chin. i agree jackson would not be able to take flush shots form benn consistantly. but i think benn would take jacksons punches even worse, in fact i dont think he would take them at all. jackson imo has a light edge in punch resistance over benn and a big edge in power, benn wa s agreat puncher but jackson was the greatest... ever.

on top of that he was more skilled. he like benn got overconfident at times and fought wild, but when he knew he had a dangerous guy in front of him he boxed very well.
Some valid points, but Benn would engage him at close range, which was always his strategy with punchers and whether Jackson was a more skilled boxer or not, i'd still say Nigel was the better 'in' fighter of the two. Sure, if Benn got caught flush, he'd go, and i'm not insisting this couldn't happen but i just can't see him inviting it the way Norris and Graham did.

Toney616
05-09-2011, 02:34 PM
Stopped reading there, naturally.
McClellan said to his corner that after round 2 he knew something was wrong with his brain.

Gerald McClellan:
http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=426700&highlight=gerald+mcclellan

CiganoBoxer
05-09-2011, 02:44 PM
McClellan said to his corner that after round 2 he knew something was wrong with his brain.

Gerald McClellan:
http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=426700&highlight=gerald+mcclellan :ugh: I know as i made the same post in the thread...try reading through the posts :smashfrea

Pastrano
05-09-2011, 02:50 PM
Ofcourse there was something wrong with his brain! He just ate some of Dark Destroyer's bombs!:boxing: Please, anyone who says Benn wasn't winning that fight when it got stopped is a fanboy or a hater. Yes, so MAYBE he got some preferrential treatment from the stupid ref, who didn't even speak English except for a few words.:rolleyes: BUT the point still remains, after the first round and with exception of that 8th round kd, which was more of a case of being out of balance, it was all Nigel from there on. Learn to deal with it, McClellan fans! Hell, I'm a fan of the poor guy myself, but I just don't get all the negativity Benn-haters and McClellan-lovers have been giving this fight and Benn's achievement. Regardless of the tragic circumstances, you must give credit to Nigel for coming back so strongly after nearly getting koed!

coghaugen
05-09-2011, 11:44 PM
Benn was an awful boxer. No jab, no defense, wild and wide with most of his work and his head movement consisted of ducking down so low his a55 was almost touching the canvas! He relied on his power, and a big pair of balls and it took him a lot further than his actual boxing ability ever could have.

On the subject of chins though, I think you're right. A common opponent with truly world class power? Gerald McClellan. Benn survived barely, Jackson got blown away.

I fancy Jackson by mid round KO. Benn was too wild and loaded up on everything. Julian Jackson was a competent boxer as well as a big puncher so all needs to do is keep his hands high, his chin low and wait for the right opening. One well placed right hand later....... :boxing:

I disagree completely.

Benn had an absolutely lovely left jab - just see his fights with Amparo, Quinones, Williams, 6ft5 Morgan, Malinga (who had the longest jab in the division, Morgan aside), and Wharton. His defense against Eubank in their rematch was incredible - slipping, rolling and weaving with EVERYTHING Eubank threw from the outside and 90+% of what Eubank got off inside. He made it appear as if Eubank was throwing 12 rounds of inaccurate shoeshiners.

He was brilliant against dangerous powerhouse Wharton - darting in and out of range, leading off with his jab - doubling it beautifully, showing nice footwork, bobbing on the ropes, countering off the ropes.

He also had a very high landing % against DeWitt and Eubank in 1990.

Benn's right hand was very fast and very untelegraphed. I particularly like the counter overarm right punch timed to absolute perfection that flattened Sherry and Malinga - very short punch.

physiker
05-10-2011, 07:55 AM
Ofcourse there was something wrong with his brain! He just ate some of Dark Destroyer's bombs!:boxing: Please, anyone who says Benn wasn't winning that fight when it got stopped is a fanboy or a hater. Yes, so MAYBE he got some preferrential treatment from the stupid ref, who didn't even speak English except for a few words.:rolleyes: BUT the point still remains, after the first round and with exception of that 8th round kd, which was more of a case of being out of balance, it was all Nigel from there on. Learn to deal with it, McClellan fans! Hell, I'm a fan of the poor guy myself, but I just don't get all the negativity Benn-haters and McClellan-lovers have been giving this fight and Benn's achievement. Regardless of the tragic circumstances, you must give credit to Nigel for coming back so strongly after nearly getting koed!

Your wrong here, P.

Anyone can watch the fight from the beginning just to see and count how many times Benn hit him with rabbit punches, some very hard. And the ref did nothing, Benn should have been DQed, as many refs have done for lesser # of said infractions.

Some people for whatever reason, just want to note the outcome of a fight and disregard if rabbit punches, head butts, ball whoppers determined it.

Watch and count, and don't disregard what McC told his corner at rd 2 end. McC hadn't taken many punches from Benn at that point, but apparently the first few rabbit punches already damaged his brain.

Other boxers or cornermen might have stopped the fight at that point. They would have been right, but others would then call that fighter a ***** or such.

Rabbit punches can be life theatening, even a single hard one. It's a money sport not war. And what happened to McC (including the loss itself obviously) was primarily from rabbit punches early on. Perhaps even the very first one.

bboy80
05-10-2011, 08:01 AM
Jackson would of been a tad to small for Benn he fought most of his fights at light middle.

Benn would take it by TKO.

bboy80
05-10-2011, 08:04 AM
And what happened to McC (including the loss itself obviously) was primarily from rabbit punches early on. Perhaps even the very first one.


I doubt that very much, its much more likely that it was from an accumulation of punches and also that nasty flying head clash.

physiker
05-10-2011, 08:09 AM
One thing I have noted over the years, is many Brits in deep denial over the obvious here.

And I have noted the remedy--which also obviously won't be undertaken:

Watch it and count the rabbit punches.

It is great to have pseudos on ignore.

Ziggy Stardust
05-10-2011, 09:15 AM
It's a money sport not war.

Exhibit A for why I say Euros have an amatuer mentality when it comes to boxing: The act like it's a "sporting contest". Amatuer boxing is a sporting contest, professional boxing is a fight. Hence why it used to be referred to as "prize fighting". The goal in professional boxing is to beat the sh1t out of the other guy. Simple as.

Poet

Ziggy Stardust
05-10-2011, 09:16 AM
It's a money sport not war.

Exhibit A for why I say Euros have an amatuer mentality when it comes to boxing: The act like it's a "sporting contest". Amatuer boxing is a sporting contest, professional boxing is a fight. Hence why it used to be referred to as "prize fighting". The goal in professional boxing is to beat the sh1t out of the other guy. Simple as.

Poet