I'm always surprised to find the negative talk surrounding two of boxing's biggest mouths - James Toney and Roy Jones, Jr.

As the man who practically invented jive, how would we see Ali if he was around today? And are there any who hate Ali anyway?

Ali was hated during his time just haters cant keep up with the postive about fighters

There is one difference between Ali and Toney/Jones: Ali always backed up his talk in ring. Unlike Jones who is getting knocked out by "journeymen" fighters or Toney who hasn't really done anything after beating Jirov.

I'm always surprised to find the negative talk surrounding two of boxing's biggest mouths - James Toney and Roy Jones, Jr.

As the man who practically invented jive, how would we see Ali if he was around today? And are there any who hate Ali anyway?
This is a great post. Everyone would hate Ali bu for something more then that. His mouth would make people sick but his fighting style is what everyone would reall hate. I'm one of the only few who love the art of boxing. I like Floyd, Spinks, and Paul Maligni. Most people hate those guys for their mouth and fighting ability. If Ali was around right now I could see everyone on here talking about he fights scared and like a girl. If he beat Tyson or Klitchko everyone would say he ran the whole fight and I dont know how the judges gave it to him. The same thing they said about Mayorga and Spinks

No way, Anorak. Ali was the "greatest" because of not only his boxing skills, ability, courage, and heart but because he verbally beat his oppenents and critics with his articulate wit and humor. Ali spoke his mind and never was afraid to offend anybody and backed it up all in the ring. Ali also never backed down from anybody and only fought the best condenders.

Riddick, your post makes sense, but Roy was hated even before he went on that losing streak. If Roy Jones would have retired immediately after the Ruiz fight and left boxing completely (just like Lennox Lewis). People 2 to 3 years later would be talking about how great he was in the ring..

Riddick, your post makes sense, but Roy was hated even before he went on that losing streak. If Roy Jones would have retired immediately after the Ruiz fight and left boxing completely (just like Lennox Lewis). People 2 to 3 years later would be talking about how great he was in the ring..


jack, whatever happennded to you? :eek:

No way, Anorak. Ali was the "greatest" because of not only his boxing skills, ability, courage, and heart but because he verbally beat his oppenents and critics with his articulate wit and humor. Ali spoke his mind and never was afraid to offend anybody and backed it up all in the ring. Ali also never backed down from anybody and only fought the best condenders.I think this is more how history represents events... it's an uncomfortable thought that during his first reign Ali and Martin Luther King were hated by the general populace.

One thing I don't like is how Sonny Liston is represented as the bad guy. In the Wil Smith film it's "I'm gonna f*** you up". But anyone see the real-life conference where Ali says "you're lucky to be lookin' at me" Liston comes right back with "Clay... let's hope you look the same when I'm finished with you."

Come to that, has anyone seen Liston in Head (1968)?


It's just a thought, this whole thread though - my feelings on Ali should be quite plain by my avatar and title.

jack, whatever happennded to you? :eek:

As the signature says...

I bet against the wrong "mon"

Lol..

As the signature says...

I bet against the wrong "mon"

Lol..


man, you have some guts

man, you have some guts

Yeah, but I'm a clean bet...
What shocked me was how much he prepared for winning..
He must have been pretty confident to have all of this stuff ready..

If I could just say something about had it been me who won...
I don't think I would have been this harsh on him (and no I'm not *****ing/complaining)

But we may never know.. ;)

Are you crazy? Have you looked at the Heavyweight division lately?

I could never hate Ali, in fact I hate you for even suggesting that Ali could be hated.

I HATE YOU........I REALLY HATE YOU..........ALI IS THE GREATEST!

Are you crazy? Have you looked at the Heavyweight division lately?

I could never hate Ali, in fact I hate you for even suggesting that Ali could be hated.

I HATE YOU........I REALLY HATE YOU..........ALI IS THE GREATEST!
Come on man, check the avatar!

Riddick, your post makes sense, but Roy was hated even before he went on that losing streak. If Roy Jones would have retired immediately after the Ruiz fight and left boxing completely (just like Lennox Lewis). People 2 to 3 years later would be talking about how great he was in the ring..

Because Ali didn't duck anyone like RJJ did.

RJJ did back up what he said. Don't act as if Ali never lost fights at the end of his career. He even lost to Leon Spinks and Trevoe Berbick.

Because Ali didn't duck anyone like RJJ did.


Who did RJJ duck? DM? lolol. He fought Toney, Tarver, Ruiz, McCallum, Hopkins...there really wasn't much else for him in that division.

I already dislike Ali by the comments he made about frazier which werent true during the period he said it, were totally inapproriate and impacted the life of not only frazier but his family as well.

Who did RJJ duck? DM? lolol. He fought Toney, Tarver, Ruiz, McCallum, Hopkins...there really wasn't much else for him in that division.

Wow how often do we need to go into this? DM, Jirov, Rocchigiani, Nunn, Sanders, Douglas, and probably more.

I already dislike Ali by the comments he made about frazier which werent true during the period he said it, were totally inapproriate and impacted the life of not only frazier but his family as well.
what did he say? sorry man i wasnt from those times, im more of the mid 90's when i started to get into watching boxing, not know a lot just Julio Cesar Chavez

I already dislike Ali by the comments he made about frazier which werent true during the period he said it, were totally inapproriate and impacted the life of not only frazier but his family as well.


do you mean when he called Smokin Joe Frazier a gorilla? i don't think Ali would be hated if he were in his prime today. back in the 60's the things that hurt Ali's image the most was his choice of religion and the fact that he refused to enlist in the army and go 3000 miles around the world to kill poor people. he was tremendously charismatic in his prime, when Ali went to Africa to fight Foreman, the africans hated Foreman and loved Ali. one thing is sure though, Ali would have an easy time being undisputed champ today, the division is weak compared to his day. he'd be way more popular if he were prime now, the hw division needs a champ like Ali

I know I wouldn't hate on Ali. I respect the guy for his deaication to boxing.

Ali talked trash but he did it in a humorous way unlike Toney who seems to be very serious for the most part.

Ali talked trash but he did it in a humorous way unlike Toney who seems to be very serious for the most part.


In the beginning of this year, I couldn't stand James Toney, now I'm starting to become a fan and think he's actually funny..

Yeah, but I'm a clean bet...
What shocked me was how much he prepared for winning..
He must have been pretty confident to have all of this stuff ready..

If I could just say something about had it been me who won...
I don't think I would have been this harsh on him (and no I'm not *****ing/complaining)

But we may never know.. ;)


Well, there is going to be a rematch.

I think Tarver will try to do fight a war with GJ this time, instead of trying to think too much.

I think Tarver will win a remacth, just like he won the rematch with RJJ.

I hope JPboxer3 will ease up after a a few days. :D

what did he say? sorry man i wasnt from those times, im more of the mid 90's when i started to get into watching boxing, not know a lot just Julio Cesar Chavez

He called Joe Frazier an Uncle Tom. Which is another word for a sell out, a white mans black man, etc. When in Reality Joe Frazier was more like the average african american of the time than Ali. The public bought it, and as a result he and his family were threatened by their own community. Fraziers daughter would come home crying because the kids knew who she was and called her names because of what Ali said. It was dangerous.

In those times u couldnt joke around about being a sell out in my opinion that was very uncool.

That's probably Frazier's biggest beef with Ali.

All I know is that Ali brought excitement and that is exactly what boxing needs right now. Someone to grab the national spotlight how Ali, Sugar Ray, and Tyson did. Lewis wasn't even on the level Tyson ever was. Love or hate, Ali, it would be nothing but great for boxing.

Ali was hated during most of his career...for his mouth, and for his style both. It wasn't until several years after he retired that he truly became popular among most boxing fans.

I really can't stand clay. When he was stripped of his title and wasn't making any money, Joe Frazier helped him out. Joe Frazier did a tremendous amount of lobbying for clay to get his license back. So clay repays him saying really mean and hurtful things about Joe and his family. With friends like that.... I know, sticks and stones, blah, blah. But when you help someone out and they stab you in the back, who needs that. The trash talk wasn't to sell tickets either, the money was guranteed. Sure clay was the biggest fight out there for Frazier, but so what? There are a lot of big fights out there that champions have walked away from. Especially from a fighter as dangerous as clay. Frazier didn't duck anyone and wanted to fight the best,the same cannot be said of clay.

The whole refusing to serve thing bothered me too. It wasn't like clay was going to the front lines with the grunts. Just like Louis, Elvis and a ton of other celebrities, he would have been touring, doing exhibitions and what not for the troops. Whether you supported the war or not, you have to support the troops, which clay didn't want to do.

man, you have some guts

Jack_the_Rippuh is the man :D :cool:

People would hate him today. Guess I shouldnt say everyone. But Fox news would be sayign how he was anti american. They would bash him for not believing the war in Iraq was a just cause. The era of liberal media has passed and it is now more conservative-right wing, like it was back then. So he would have been villanized like he was back then. And since most people cant think for themselves, they would believe what Bill O'reilly tells them.

Unlike Jones who is getting knocked out by "journeymen" fighters or Toney who hasn't really done anything after beating Jirov.

Ali looked just as bad or worse at the end of his career.

Next.

Please don't tell me Roy "ducked" DM or Buster fuggin Douglass.

Right.

With everyone hating in the brash fighters such as Hamed and Judah, I would see him getting hated on by a lot of people.