View Full Version : Vitali Klitschko vs. Rocky Marciano


boxingking500
04-14-2011, 12:38 PM
who take the win

2Fast
04-14-2011, 01:03 PM
Vitali Klitschko. Prime Vitali prety much beats every HW pre 1980

Barn
04-14-2011, 01:31 PM
Vitali Klitschko. Prime Vitali prety much beats every HW pre 1980

I can't put into words how fvcking retarded that statement is.

I tried this match up on FNC playing as Marciano and I got KTFO but, FNC tenders to tall boxers. Anyway it's irrelevant.

In a 15 rounder the Rock definitely gets a stoppage victory and there is no bones about it, if it gets to 15 Rock wins 10/10 (Unless a cut stoppage.)

In a 12 rounder I think Rock will get the Late KO around the ninth with an even scorecard after Vitali tires around the 7th from the accumulation of body punches and just being hit constantly(The Rock didn't care if punches hit your arms, shoulders etc. Everything takes its toll).

I honestly think the Rock's crouch would wreak havoc on Vitali's big straight punches which must travel a long distance.

In a 3 fight series(especially in these days) I could see Vitali getting a cut stoppage win.

The_Demon
04-14-2011, 01:40 PM
I think Marciano late stoppage but i wouldnt rule out a decision win for Vitali either,very interesting match-up

lightsout_finit
04-14-2011, 01:43 PM
Marciano stops him late after gettin beaten up himself for a while...............

Holtol
04-14-2011, 02:15 PM
There would be a chance Marciano would make Vitali quit espesially if it was a 15 rounder. I think Vitali would have a problem with Marciano's pace and intensity. Vitali has never been knocked out but a human can only take so much and a fighter like Marciano would be all over Vitali. Marciano would get to Vitali eventually and once he did the punches would come at a tempo and power that Vitali can't match. And from all different sorts of angles, Archi Moore compared it to trying to fight an air plane propeller.

Marciano most likely by Ko but could win a decision if Vitali some how made it through the 12 or 15 rounds.

Scott9945
04-14-2011, 08:07 PM
I never dismiss Rocky's greatness. But these are two different weight classes. If you saw them stand face to face in a boxing ring, you would get a sick feeling that you were about to see a gross mismatch.

CarlosG815
04-14-2011, 09:05 PM
Rocky Marciano KO inside of 6 rounds. Anything after that and Vitali is so gassed he takes more unnecessary punishment and then gets knocked out.

SCtrojansbaby
04-14-2011, 10:48 PM
Imagine if Marciano would have fought in the 1920s he would knock Vitali out in the irst round.

Wild Blue Yonda
04-14-2011, 11:35 PM
I think Marciano late stoppage but i wouldnt rule out a decision win for Vitali either,very interesting match-up

Interesting is right. People under-estimate how badly punching down at a target takes the power right out of your shots --- not that Klitschko is an especially big hitter anyway, & Marciano had a great chin, but if anyone thinks the size disparity makes it all one way in Klitschko's favour, they should think again.

People also like to try their hand at criticising Marciano's opposition, but he has by far the edge when compared with Klitschko.

On the other hand, Klitschko does fight tall well, & even though I don't rate him nearly as highly as most people (he will always be over-rated to me), he has a strong case here. It would be interesting.

Barn
04-15-2011, 07:21 AM
Interesting is right. People under-estimate how badly punching down at a target takes the power right out of your shots --- not that Klitschko is an especially big hitter anyway, & Marciano had a great chin, but if anyone thinks the size disparity makes it all one way in Klitschko's favour, they should think again.

People also like to try their hand at criticising Marciano's opposition, but he has by far the edge when compared with Klitschko.

On the other hand, Klitschko does fight tall well, & even though I don't rate him nearly as highly as most people (he will always be over-rated to me), he has a strong case here. It would be interesting.
Marciano crouch further adds to the problem of punching down which I think is the main point in this bout.

right_hand_lead
04-15-2011, 02:07 PM
I never dismiss Rocky's greatness. But these are two different weight classes. If you saw them stand face to face in a boxing ring, you would get a sick feeling that you were about to see a gross mismatch.

Finally some reason! I'm not even a big Vitali fan, but other than the massive size difference, Vitali would pound Rocky with heavy jabs and right hands until he folds.

Am I the only one that sees this?

Barn
04-15-2011, 02:29 PM
Finally some reason! I'm not even a big Vitali fan, but other than the massive size difference, Vitali would pound Rocky with heavy jabs and right hands until he folds.

Am I the only one that sees this?
Yeah, size difference can work both ways, how far will Vitali's punches need to travel. Distance is directly proportional to time meaning more reaction time for the rock (Especially fighting out of his crouch). A lot of body punching will go on and unless Vitali forces a cut stoppage then Rock gets him late on an even scorecard.

Holtol
04-15-2011, 02:50 PM
Finally some reason! I'm not even a big Vitali fan, but other than the massive size difference, Vitali would pound Rocky with heavy jabs and right hands until he folds.

Am I the only one that sees this?

Size advantage is mostly a placebo. Someone like Marciano was not mind fcked like many people are these days. He would not see Vitali as being to big for him to beat and thats one reason he would beat Vitali.

Theres to many people like you saying that guys like Vitali are to big, and many boxers and athletes beleive it and thats why they lose. A large % of sports are mental. If a boxer does not believe in himself he will be hard pressed to win. Plus the big man has the placebo advantage now days. This would not happen to Marciano though because he did not believe that people were to big for him to beat. If he believed that he would have droped down to LH.



His punch was powerful enough to spot lift 1000 pounds 1 foot off the ground. I had someone in the Tua vs The Greats thread try to tell me he only punched at 1000 psi lol. It was not a psi test they did on Marciano, a punch that has enough power to knock 1000 pounds 1 foot into the air is a lot more then 1000 psi.

BigStereotype
04-15-2011, 03:03 PM
I like this matchup, the Rock's tenaciousness and power against Vitali's awkwardness and size...This is obviously a very high contact matchup and, even though Vitali is a bad, tough, gritty dude, I think Rock stops him. It'll be bloody, it'll be violent, but Rocky would pound such a heavy cadence on Vitali's body that he couldn't stand up by the end.

right_hand_lead
04-15-2011, 06:59 PM
Size advantage is mostly a placebo. Someone like Marciano was not mind fcked like many people are these days. He would not see Vitali as being to big for him to beat and thats one reason he would beat Vitali.

Theres to many people like you saying that guys like Vitali are to big, and many boxers and athletes beleive it and thats why they lose. A large % of sports are mental. If a boxer does not believe in himself he will be hard pressed to win. Plus the big man has the placebo advantage now days. This would not happen to Marciano though because he did not believe that people were to big for him to beat. If he believed that he would have droped down to LH.



His punch was powerful enough to spot lift 1000 pounds 1 foot off the ground. I had someone in the Tua vs The Greats thread try to tell me he only punched at 1000 psi lol. It was not a psi test they did on Marciano, a punch that has enough power to knock 1000 pounds 1 foot into the air is a lot more then 1000 psi.

I'm the last person that would ever think size is everything. The same reason I never expected Margarito or Cotto to beat Pac just on size. It's about skill. We could debate all day about this because it'll never happen, but with Vitali's good chin, tall stance, powerful jab/right, I don't see anything but a decision/KO for Vitali.

People keep saying Vitali has to punch down, but how hard will it be for Rocky to punch up at a 6-8 fighter that fights tall?

Disclaimer: I'm not a big Vitali/Rocky fan.

BigStereotype
04-15-2011, 07:09 PM
I'm the last person that would ever think size is everything. The same reason I never expected Margarito or Cotto to beat Pac just on size. It's about skill. We could debate all day about this because it'll never happen, but with Vitali's good chin, tall stance, powerful jab/right, I don't see anything but a decision/KO for Vitali.

People keep saying Vitali has to punch down, but how hard will it be for Rocky to punch up at a 6-8 fighter that fights tall?

Disclaimer: I'm not a big Vitali/Rocky fan.

Yeah, I don't like Rocky's ability to hit the chin, especially because he fought almost doubled over. Which is why he goes hard at the body. I can't even imagine taking Suzy Q to the solar plexus over and over...

GF of Boxing
04-15-2011, 07:27 PM
Finally some reason! I'm not even a big Vitali fan, but other than the massive size difference, Vitali would pound Rocky with heavy jabs and right hands until he folds.

Am I the only one that sees this?



No. You have a fighter that stood 5'10" 187lbs and the other fighter 6'7"1/2 249lbs. I just don't see how Rocky could with stand the blows from a guy that size. Rocky was very limited when it came to footwork, defense, and skill. But what made him great was even with his limited tools he was still able to get the job done. Rocky greatest attribute was his determination, timing, and power. But even against Vitali who would outweigh him by over 60 pounds would defeat Marciano. I know the Marciano fans don't want to hear this but if you sit back and look at it from an unbiased neutral stand point you have to agree to.

Barn
04-15-2011, 07:31 PM
I'm the last person that would ever think size is everything. The same reason I never expected Margarito or Cotto to beat Pac just on size. It's about skill. We could debate all day about this because it'll never happen, but with Vitali's good chin, tall stance, powerful jab/right, I don't see anything but a decision/KO for Vitali.

People keep saying Vitali has to punch down, but how hard will it be for Rocky to punch up at a 6-8 fighter that fights tall?

Disclaimer: I'm not a big Vitali/Rocky fan.
To use metaphors he will bang that drum.

Wild Blue Yonda
04-15-2011, 09:29 PM
No. You have a fighter that stood 5'10" 187lbs and the other fighter 6'7"1/2 249lbs. I just don't see how Rocky could with stand the blows from a guy that size. Rocky was very limited when it came to footwork, defense, and skill. But what made him great was even with his limited tools he was still able to get the job done. Rocky greatest attribute was his determination, timing, and power. But even against Vitali who would outweigh him by over 60 pounds would defeat Marciano. I know the Marciano fans don't want to hear this but if you sit back and look at it from an unbiased neutral stand point you have to agree to.

Klitschko just flat-out isn't a puncher, though. His brother, yes, but size doesn't mean all that much if you don't know how to properly generate power, & Klitschko simply does not. He doesn't have that talent, & his actual punching technique is infamously poor. When you throw in how deep he's throwing down at a sub-6' rival who is fighting out of a crouch, I just cannot see this argument that Klitschko is going to badly batter & bruise Marciano.

If Klitschko wins (& he may very well), it's a decision all the way based on fighting tall well & leaning on Marciano, in addition to using his jab as much as he can. I don't think he'd get near to stopping Marciano.

Holtol
04-15-2011, 10:03 PM
I'm the last person that would ever think size is everything. The same reason I never expected Margarito or Cotto to beat Pac just on size. It's about skill. We could debate all day about this because it'll never happen, but with Vitali's good chin, tall stance, powerful jab/right, I don't see anything but a decision/KO for Vitali.

People keep saying Vitali has to punch down, but how hard will it be for Rocky to punch up at a 6-8 fighter that fights tall?

Disclaimer: I'm not a big Vitali/Rocky fan.


Its only about 10 inches, at certain times Vitali would not be standing at his full height. Like others have said Marcinio would settle for hitting Vitali where ever he could and he could reach his head just fine when the time is right . Marciano fought lots of guys with a big reach and it never caused him to lose a fight.

Even if Vitali was standing totally straight and tall Marciano could still reach his chin easily. Vitali has a huge target of a body that I'm sure Marciano would love to go to work on.

Some people think Walcott was winning the fight going into the 13th round so Marciano was not that good. Walcott was a very good fighter and a large portion of the fight Marciano was blind, but once Marciano's eye's cleared he quickley knocked out Walcott. I agree with you skill is the most important thing and Marciano beat guys more skilled then Vitali and beat guys more skilled then Vitali has ever fought.

Earl Hickey
04-15-2011, 10:53 PM
FACTS about Vitali Klitschko:

- All Time Great and Hall Of Famer.

- There is no blueprint to beat him.

- He is unbeatable.

- He has dominated every opponent he has ever faced.

- Has never been behind on the scorecards at the end of a fight.

- Has a great chin, never been down.

- 39 KOs in 42 wins, greatest heavyweight champ KO% of all time.

- Only man ever to be world heavyweight champ in boxing and kickboxing.

Vitali is almost 40 now, came back after a 4 year layoff and is still dominating the HW division. He hasn't lost a single round in his comeback.

Vitali beats any HW from any era.


Awesome sfuff steelhammer.

And yeah Vitali batters Marciano in brutal fashion

Ziggy Stardust
04-16-2011, 12:33 AM
Vitali Klitschko vs Lennox Lewis

THE TRUTH

Vitali took the fight on just 10 days notice then grew a vagina on his face.

Vitali was clearly winning the fight 4-2 on all 3 scorecards at the time of growing a vagina on his face.

vaginas grown on face

Vitali 1
Lewis 0

Lewis was exhausted from turning Vitali's face into a sex organ.

All the fans at Staples Center cheered for Vitali and booed Lewis after the fight because, hey, everyone loves puzzy on their faces.

Lewis promised Vitali another facial vagina.

Vitali destroyed Kirk Johnson because he was embaressed by having a vagina on his face.

Lewis turned down 30 million dollars because he knew Vitali would retire on his stool like a coward like he did with Byrd.

Vitali dominated with vagisil and scared his face vagina into retirement.

Lewis is scared to death of getting a yeast infection from Vitali's face vagina.

Glad to see you telling like it is :allhail9:

BigStereotype
04-16-2011, 01:02 AM
Steelhammer is nothing if not persistent. We're gonna get the truth if he has to spam that post for thirty years.

Barn
04-16-2011, 07:56 AM
Klitschko just flat-out isn't a puncher, though. His brother, yes, but size doesn't mean all that much if you don't know how to properly generate power, & Klitschko simply does not. He doesn't have that talent, & his actual punching technique is infamously poor. When you throw in how deep he's throwing down at a sub-6' rival who is fighting out of a crouch, I just cannot see this argument that Klitschko is going to badly batter & bruise Marciano.

If Klitschko wins (& he may very well), it's a decision all the way based on fighting tall well & leaning on Marciano, in addition to using his jab as much as he can. I don't think he'd get near to stopping Marciano.
I agree, Vitali Decision/ Cut stoppage or more likely IMO Rocky Late KO.

CarlosG815
04-16-2011, 10:26 AM
wow, these old school nuthuggers are totally delusional.

Vitali Klitschko vs Rocky Marciano = TOTAL MISMATCH

Vitali easily destroys Marciano.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is a delusional retarded hater.

You just do not know enough, that's all.

SBleeder
04-16-2011, 01:33 PM
For all the size whores: Why has Valuev gotten knocked around by guys who weighed almost 100 pounds less than him?

Ziggy Stardust
04-16-2011, 02:14 PM
For all the size whores: Why has Valuev gotten knocked around by guys who weighed almost 100 pounds less than him?

:biggthump:biggthump:biggthump:biggthump

Scott9945
04-16-2011, 09:01 PM
For all the size whores: Why has Valuev gotten knocked around by guys who weighed almost 100 pounds less than him?

1) Sometimes you can be TOO big. Just being big by itself doesn't make you capable of beating Rocky Marciano. Whether you want to admit it or not, Vitali Klitschko does have legitimate skills and more importantly knows how to take advantage of his size.

2) Valuev has actually shown a pretty good chin. He has only lost by decision and has never been off his feet.

Mugwump
04-17-2011, 08:18 PM
The size difference is just too much. And let's not draw comparisons between Vitali and Valuev. I mean, it's like arguing a battleship is the same as an ocean liner because they are both big and can float.

Vitali is a tough proposition. For anyone - including the likes of Frazier, Liston, Holmes, Ali and Foreman.

I'm not saying he beats those guys, but he'd certainly give all of them something to think about.

A fifty pound disadvantage against some tomato can is achievable. Look at Haye vs Valuev (okay, he's not a bum - but he's no Sonny Liston either). But twelve (or fifteen) rounds against a guy who hits hard enough to stagger Lennox Lewis (whose chin was, contrary to popular opinion, rock solid when his mind was on the job) and who can take a fully powered Lewis uppercut on the button and still stand up is just not realistic.

Quick experiment: find someone who is taller than you and just thirty pounds heavier - and then get him to lean on you for three minutes. It's exhausting. Marciano would be a physical wreck by the middle rounds and Vitali would simply jab him to death.

And this is no K-nuthugger speaking.

Scott9945
04-17-2011, 11:59 PM
The size difference is just too much. And let's not draw comparisons between Vitali and Valuev. I mean, it's like arguing a battleship is the same as an ocean liner because they are both big and can float.

Vitali is a tough proposition. For anyone - including the likes of Frazier, Liston, Holmes, Ali and Foreman.

I'm not saying he beats those guys, but he'd certainly give all of them something to think about.

A fifty pound disadvantage against some tomato can is achievable. Look at Haye vs Valuev (okay, he's not a bum - but he's no Sonny Liston either). But twelve (or fifteen) rounds against a guy who hits hard enough to stagger Lennox Lewis (whose chin was, contrary to popular opinion, rock solid when his mind was on the job) and who can take a fully powered Lewis uppercut on the button and still stand up is just not realistic.

Quick experiment: find someone who is taller than you and just thirty pounds heavier - and then get him to lean on you for three minutes. It's exhausting. Marciano would be a physical wreck by the middle rounds and Vitali would simply jab him to death.

And this is no K-nuthugger speaking.

Excellent comments. Hopefully you won't be labeled a "size whore".

Holtol
04-18-2011, 04:01 AM
Quick experiment: find someone who is taller than you and just thirty pounds heavier - and then get him to lean on you for three minutes. It's exhausting. Marciano would be a physical wreck by the middle rounds and Vitali would simply jab him to death.

And this is no K-nuthugger speaking.

Some one who is taller and bigger is not going to have more endurance then someone who is shorter and lighter. The volume of blood the heart has to pump to the muscles in a bigger man is much greater. The heart and lungs have to work much harder to supply oxgen to the muscles.

You don't have to let a big man lean on you all night either. Marciano is not going to just hold Vitali's weight up for him all night. Vitali would end up having to manipulate his own weight Marciano would not do it for him. Vitali's wieght would tire Vitali out not Marciano. Marciano was also a very good grappler he would not fall for such a simple trick.

winky's right
04-18-2011, 04:14 AM
Some one who is taller and bigger is not going to have more endurance then someone who is shorter and lighter. The volume of blood the heart has to pump to the muscles in a bigger man is much greater. The heart and lungs have to work much harder to supply oxgen to the muscles.

You don't have to let a big man lean on you all night either. Marciano is not going to just hold Vitali's weight up for him all night. Vitali would end up having to manipulate his own weight Marciano would not do it for him. Vitali's wieght would tire Vitali out not Marciano. Marciano was also a very good grappler he would not fall for such a simple trick.

So you're arguing that Vitali's size would actually be a disadvantage in this match-up? Interesting..

Holtol
04-18-2011, 05:10 AM
So you're arguing that Vitali's size would actually be a disadvantage in this match-up? Interesting..

There are advantages and disadvantages in everything. What matters is who utlizes their advantages the best.

When I was a boy I had a yorkshire terrier that only wieghed about 12 pounds. I was walking Jimmy down the road one day and from across someones yard a Rottweiler came charging, about 100 pounds muscles rippling and in its prime. It came right at Jimmy and me full of aggresion and lowered his head to likely tear my dog in half. But as the Rottweiler lowered his head Jimmy jumped up and bit down into the top of the Rottweilers head. And did not let go.

I had never really thought of it before but when a dog as small as my dog bites onto the top of a big dogs head. The big dog can not get it off because his mouth has litterly nothing to bite but air. Jimmy just heald on to the top of the Rottweilers head and did not let go. The owner and me eventually were able to get Jimmy off but it actually took a long time. And at one point I had to kick my dog to get him off.

The Rottweiler later died of some sort of serious infection for some reason dogs can not bite dogs or humans bite humans for some reason there is a risk of a serious infection.

Thats one exsample of something small having an advantage over something that is big. There are many others also it is just one exsample that played out in my life that I found interesting.

JAB5239
04-18-2011, 05:19 AM
I'd be rooting for Marciano but betting on Vitaly. In terms of greatness.....it isn't even close.

winky's right
04-18-2011, 07:10 AM
There are advantages and disadvantages in everything. What matters is who utlizes their advantages the best.

When I was a boy I had a yorkshire terrier that only wieghed about 12 pounds. I was walking Jimmy down the road one day and from across someones yard a Rottweiler came charging, about 100 pounds muscles rippling and in its prime. It came right at Jimmy and me full of aggresion and lowered his head to likely tear my dog in half. But as the Rottweiler lowered his head Jimmy jumped up and bit down into the top of the Rottweilers head. And did not let go.

I had never really thought of it before but when a dog as small as my dog bites onto the top of a big dogs head. The big dog can not get it off because his mouth has litterly nothing to bite but air. Jimmy just heald on to the top of the Rottweilers head and did not let go. The owner and me eventually were able to get Jimmy off but it actually took a long time. And at one point I had to kick my dog to get him off.

The Rottweiler later died of some sort of serious infection for some reason dogs can not bite dogs or humans bite humans for some reason there is a risk of a serious infection.

Thats one exsample of something small having an advantage over something that is big. There are many others also it is just one exsample that played out in my life that I found interesting.

It's one thing to say that size is a detriment in some circumstances; it's another to say that it is advantageous for Rocky to be 5'10 187lbs against a 2'8 250lb Vitali.

I'd be rooting for Marciano but betting on Vitaly. In terms of greatness.....it isn't even close.

Thanks for your objectivity, that's what I've always liked about your posts. I agree that Vitali is a hard match-up for Rocky.

Holtol
04-18-2011, 07:57 AM
It's one thing to say that size is a detriment in some circumstances; it's another to say that it is advantageous for Rocky to be 5'10 187lbs against a 6'8 250lb Viali

There are advantages and disadvantages in everything. What matters is who utilizes their advantages the best.


What I meant is that there are advantages to all different sorts of body types. For instance Marciano had short arms they can be an advantage though and Marciano made an advantage out of having short arms. Also smaller people have more stamina then big people look at the weights of long distance runners or cyclists. I never meant that Marciano is automatically better because he is smaller. I was just pointing out some of the advantages of Marciano's body type compared to Vitali's.

Barn
04-18-2011, 12:52 PM
The size difference is just too much. And let's not draw comparisons between Vitali and Valuev. I mean, it's like arguing a battleship is the same as an ocean liner because they are both big and can float.

Vitali is a tough proposition. For anyone - including the likes of Frazier, Liston, Holmes, Ali and Foreman.
.

Ali, Liston Foreman, Holmes would all beat Vitali.

Im not as confident with Frazier although I do believe he would get the KO.

The_Demon
04-18-2011, 01:08 PM
People also need too take into consideration just how weak Vitalis resume is,its almost a moot point but he really hasnt beaten anybody too get excited about,which is part of the reason he has such a high KO ratio and often looks good in winning,the two guys of note on his record are Byrd and Lewis,funny that dont you think

jimmy1569
04-18-2011, 02:41 PM
Klitschko just flat-out isn't a puncher, though. His brother, yes, but size doesn't mean all that much if you don't know how to properly generate power, & Klitschko simply does not. He doesn't have that talent, & his actual punching technique is infamously poor. When you throw in how deep he's throwing down at a sub-6' rival who is fighting out of a crouch, I just cannot see this argument that Klitschko is going to badly batter & bruise Marciano.

If Klitschko wins (& he may very well), it's a decision all the way based on fighting tall well & leaning on Marciano, in addition to using his jab as much as he can. I don't think he'd get near to stopping Marciano.

I stopped reading at Klitschko "don't know how to properly generate power"
Ask every one of his knockout victims if they take homage to that assinine comment of yours.

For all of you's picking the Rock.... gimme some of what y'all are smoking as I 'd like to get high myself. Any version of Vitali would utterly destroy Rocky Marciano. The Rock was easy to hit..doesn't have any special defensive abilities so Klitschko would NOT be missing the target. Let Rocky go to the crouch....he'll be met by debillitating jabs he's never had the luxury of facing before. How much reach did Rocky have..he'd literally fall over throwing a telegraphed left from left field.... Rocky Balboa has a better chance to pull the upset.

Barn
04-18-2011, 04:23 PM
I stopped reading at Klitschko "don't know how to properly generate power"
Ask every one of his knockout victims if they take homage to that assinine comment of yours.

For all of you's picking the Rock.... gimme some of what y'all are smoking as I 'd like to get high myself. Any version of Vitali would utterly destroy Rocky Marciano. The Rock was easy to hit..doesn't have any special defensive abilities so Klitschko would NOT be missing the target. Let Rocky go to the crouch....he'll be met by debillitating jabs he's never had the luxury of facing before. How much reach did Rocky have..he'd literally fall over throwing a telegraphed left from left field.... Rocky Balboa has a better chance to pull the upset.
I stopped reading at the part where you said "I stopped reading".

JAB5239
04-18-2011, 04:25 PM
I stopped reading at the part where you said "I stopped reading".

......:lol1:..........

Joeyzagz
04-18-2011, 04:31 PM
Rocky is getting stopped.

I love Rock but I dont see what he could do in this fight outside of hitting Vitali in the testicles. Bad matchup.

Ziggy Stardust
04-18-2011, 04:42 PM
Ask every one of his knockout victims if they take homage to that assinine comment of yours.

You mean those dudes that quit on their stools because they fell behind on the cards, artificially inflating Vitili's KO%? You mean THOSE dudes? :dunno9:

Poet

Mugwump
04-18-2011, 08:16 PM
People also need too take into consideration just how weak Vitalis resume is,its almost a moot point but he really hasnt beaten anybody too get excited about,which is part of the reason he has such a high KO ratio and often looks good in winning,the two guys of note on his record are Byrd and Lewis,funny that dont you think

I agree that Vitali doesn't have the greatest resume. However, he proved he was - at the very least - a credible contender for the #1 position at HW in that torrid battle with Lewis.

I don't subscribe to the opinion that Vitali was robbed of the result. There's a mountain of guff that's been written in defence of VK by an army of Knuthuggers. None of it counters the two key points: 1. The bout was stopped by a fully qualified physician whose professional opinion weighs more than a boatload of excuses. 2. The art of boxing is hitting whilst not getting hit. Vitali's attacking strategy worked superbly and he whipped Lewis in the opening rounds. Even when Lennox started throwing returns Vitali kept up the pressure. However, his defence was not up to the job. He allowed himself to be caught too often (by a fighter whose punches were known to cause cuts) and his face paid the price. It's simply ludicrous to claim you've been robbed when your face looks like a ragged slab of meat.

With this in mind there is indeed reason to question Vitali's validity as a truly outstanding HW. However, I'm sure that if he fought as he did against Lewis (with a few adjustments to his guard) there isn't a HW in history who wouldn't find him troublesome - or more.

SeattleSeahawks
05-04-2011, 12:42 PM
So the people of this forum are just as stupid as ********boxing when it comes to sucking off Marciano? Marciano = average cruiserweight in todays boxing. Vitali = overrated heavyweight but he is still a heavyweight.

Vitali by 1st round murder.

Barn
05-04-2011, 12:50 PM
Marciano = average cruiserweight in todays boxing.

:?!:...............

bklynboy
05-04-2011, 01:08 PM
So the people of this forum are just as stupid as ********boxing when it comes to sucking off Marciano? Marciano = average cruiserweight in todays boxing. Vitali = overrated heavyweight but he is still a heavyweight.

Vitali by 1st round murder.


Cruiserweight maybe. Average? Don't think so. I also don't think VK is going to find it as easy as you think to hit Marciano. Not if he stands tall and tries to keep his chin up and away from any punches.

SeattleSeahawks
05-04-2011, 01:17 PM
Frazier had better head movement skill and everything else. Could he avoid Foreman's punches? Nope and I am not saying Vitali is Foreman but Marciano was hit by Moore until Moore gased out. Yep a washed up Archie Moore knockd him down.

Marciano's whole career is based on fighting mob controlled fighters and past their prime fighters.

As I said Marciano is one of the most overrated boxers ever and Vitali smashes him.

bklynboy
05-04-2011, 01:57 PM
Frazier had better head movement skill and everything else. Could he avoid Foreman's punches? Nope and I am not saying Vitali is Foreman but Marciano was hit by Moore until Moore gased out. Yep a washed up Archie Moore knockd him down.

Marciano's whole career is based on fighting mob controlled fighters and past their prime fighters.

As I said Marciano is one of the most overrated boxers ever and Vitali smashes him.

I'm not saying that Marciano would beat Foreman or VK. It's a bad match-up for him (except if goes into rounds 10-11-12-13-14-15). If it goes into the latter rounds ... anything goes. I think that Marciano was so overrated by nut huggers that now people think he was a bum. The man was gifted. He started boxing in his 20s while in the Army. He was short, with short arms and he didn't just beat bums or washed-up fighters.

Jersey Joe Walcott was the Bernard Hopkins of his day. He didn't think he could possibly lose to Marciano. Ezzard Charles was like 32-33 when he fought Marciano. He was past-prime but they were good wins for Marciano nonetheless.

Was Marciano vastly overrated by many of his fans? Yeah, of course. But we shouldn't go too far the other way. If you think Dempsey, Frazier or Tyson would have sparked VK and WK then Marciano would have given them trouble too.

Marchegiano
05-04-2011, 10:56 PM
From where i'm sitting it seems pretty silly to suggest Vitali's got a chance. Vitali's who game centers around using the jab to keep his opponents away.....you find me a clip video or newspaper where Rocky step backwards due to a jab. I havn't seen anyone with the last name Klitschko succeed when their jab fails. Since Rocco's going to negate the idea that the jab will keep him back what's Vitali got for him? Constitution advantage goes Rocky. Punch power advantage goes Rocky. Blockbuster can cut the ring with the best of them. Suggesting that Vitali can handle Rock's power is silly. Rocco's too tough, hits too hard, and too intent on getting that KO.


Archie Moore LWH Champ KO record holder
Don ****ell BHW Champ
Ezzard Charles Former HW Champ
Roland La Starza Only SD closest thing to a revenge match Rocco's got
Joe Walcott Former HW Champ
Harry Mathews for title contention 90(61 ko's)-7
Bernie Reynolds 52-13, can? yes. Rocco hit him in the jaw and lifted him three or four feet in the air.
Lee Savold EBU HW Champ
Joe Louis Former HW Champ 12 year reign

Who the **** else needed to be KO'd to prove Rocco's greatness? I mean you can claim the whole era's weak, but you can't say he didn't beat the **** out of the who's who of the time.

Scott9945
05-04-2011, 11:46 PM
From where i'm sitting it seems pretty silly to suggest Vitali's got a chance. Vitali's who game centers around using the jab to keep his opponents away.....you find me a clip video or newspaper where Rocky step backwards due to a jab. I havn't seen anyone with the last name Klitschko succeed when their jab fails. Since Rocco's going to negate the idea that the jab will keep him back what's Vitali got for him? Constitution advantage goes Rocky. Punch power advantage goes Rocky. Blockbuster can cut the ring with the best of them. Suggesting that Vitali can handle Rock's power is silly. Rocco's too tough, hits too hard, and too intent on getting that KO.


Archie Moore LWH Champ KO record holder
Don ****ell BHW Champ
Ezzard Charles Former HW Champ
Roland La Starza Only SD closest thing to a revenge match Rocco's got
Joe Walcott Former HW Champ
Harry Mathews for title contention 90(61 ko's)-7
Bernie Reynolds 52-13, can? yes. Rocco hit him in the jaw and lifted him three or four feet in the air.
Lee Savold EBU HW Champ
Joe Louis Former HW Champ 12 year reign

Who the **** else needed to be KO'd to prove Rocco's greatness? I mean you can claim the whole era's weak, but you can't say he didn't beat the **** out of the who's who of the time.

You lost me when you casually dismissed Rocky being dominated by Vitali's jab. How about showing me a clip where Marciano fought someone even resembling the 6'7 250 lb Klitschko?

Marchegiano
05-04-2011, 11:49 PM
Tyson weighed 220 in his prime and Marciano weighed 180. Because he is white he is above logic? He wouldnt of made it of 1 round with Vitali or any other 205 plus heavyweights. Why the hell cant you get that?

Charles was washed up period. I dont care what his age was he was done as a top level fighter, Walcott was done. Dont give me the Bernard Hopkins thing. Hopkins is still winning. Walcott fought Maciano 2 times and then retired at around 40 years old. Moore was done. He had over 150 bouts by the time Marciano fought them and Marciano struggled against all of these people.

Neither Charles, Walcott, or Moore were heavyweights by modern standard but he would beat a real heavyweight? Get out of here. Then you see people say this. " If the fight goes late Marciano would win because of his stamina" Number 1 all smaller guys have better stamina than larger ones. 2 Marciano would of never made out of the first round with guys like Tyson, Foreman, Lewis or Bowe to began with.

This racially biased putting Marciano on a pedistal is played out. At best Marciano was a average fighter with average power. Taking 10 rounds to knock out glass chin fighters past their primes and getting credit for it only works if you are Marciano or a hispanic, latino, or asian fighter like Manny Pac.

Marciano is a joke, Get over it.



Size? Do you have a clue how much power, in any unit of measurement, is needed to cause a KO? How big a role is hand size? How much power has been reported Rocky puts out? How much power is necessary to break the average man's skull? How much does the size of the man effect the density of his skull? Once you've answered these questions for yourself you'll realize how ****ing ****ed ignorant it is to attack his size.

Old beaters? Well who the **** was he supposed to KO? He beat every up and comer on his way up than took out the champs and former champs. Here's a stat for you: out of 43 KO's over 25 of those men quit boxing with in five fights after facing Rocky. That's Majority son. That's to say Rocky no only put more people into retirement than any other boxer, but when facing Marciano your facing a high probability of getting hit so hard you don't want to a boxer anymore.

Last and the most obviously ignorant statement in your post the stamina. Rocky's going to hit harder in the 15th than the 1st.....that has got nothing to do with size. go hit a ****ing heavy bag dumb ass.

Marchegiano
05-04-2011, 11:56 PM
You lost me when you casually dismissed Rocky being dominated by Vitali's jab. How about showing me a clip where Marciano fought someone even resembling the 6'7 250 lb Klitschko?

My point is it the jab in no way will stop Rocky from throwing. Now will the over hand stop Klitschko from jabbing? I mean it is a potential skull break...not crack but break...read where I attack attacking size. There is a point where you've become too big to add extra power due to the hand proportion.

RAV3N
05-05-2011, 12:17 AM
VK has this, too big, too tall and has the skills to keep rocky on the outside, backing him up with the jab or double and triple jabs, if not then a straight or overhand right will have Rocky thinking.

It would either be a ko or tko victory, the fight would be stopped in the middle rounds (12 round fight, wouldnt need 15 imo).

Scott9945
05-05-2011, 12:29 AM
My point is it the jab in no way will stop Rocky from throwing. Now will the over hand stop Klitschko from jabbing? I mean it is a potential skull break...not crack but break...read where I attack attacking size. There is a point where you've become too big to add extra power due to the hand proportion.

And my point is that Rocky would absolutely get stopped by the jab, and Marciano would be taking too much punishment to land any skull breaking punches. When Vitali leans back then Rocky couldn't hit nothing. He wasn't big enough or fast enough. You're buying into mythology. Marciano was a great heavyweight in a long gone era. It would be a lot more difficult for him now.

Spartacus Sully
05-05-2011, 02:04 AM
Marciano would destroy vitali, soooo much going for Marciano in this.

Marciano's right at his chin and crouch would negate the jab and his stamina plus his ability to work on the inside would negate any leaning that vitali would do or want to do, vitali would lean and marciano would throw him back up on his feet while firing off clean shots and with the work marcianos going to be doing to vitalis body hes going to be out of energy and leaning well before the 4th which only puts him in a worse position when dealing with some one like marciano. it might start off like a good fight but by the 5th i see vitali just falling down in pain, not even from getting hit in the face just falling down unable to take the barrage of punches, or out on the stool before the 6th starts.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 03:01 AM
There is no possible way Rocky would beat VK, sh1t Chad Dawson easily schools Rocky to a 120-107 UD.

The fanatical nostalgic zeal I see in here amazes me everytime I come into this section.

Spartacus Sully
05-05-2011, 03:13 AM
There is no possible way Rocky would beat VK, sh1t Chad Dawson easily schools Rocky to a 120-107 UD.

The fanatical nostalgic zeal I see in here amazes me everytime I come into this section.

why? because VK is 50-60 lbs heavier?

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 03:16 AM
why? because VK is 50-60 lbs heavier?

Its one factor yes, but I know where I am and I know I am in the wrong damn town here so anyone from 60-80 years ago would ko anyone from today regardless of size.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 03:26 AM
Its one factor yes, but I know where I am and I know I am in the wrong damn town here so anyone from 60-80 years ago would ko anyone from today regardless of size.

Myth #1 on Boxing Scene: Fighters today are better then they've ever been and would school all those old pre-historic dudes (pre-historic usually being defined as anybody from more than 10 years ago). It seems to me that it's the conceit of every generation to believe that they're better than their forebears, and every generation is proved wrong. And then the next generation of self-important fools comes along.....

Poet

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 03:28 AM
Myth #1 on Boxing Scene: Fighters today are better then they've ever been and would school all those old pre-historic dudes (pre-historic usually being defined as anybody from more than 10 years ago). It seems to me that it's the conceit of every generation to believe that they're better than their forebears, and every generation is proved wrong. And then the next generation of self-important fools comes along.....

Poet

Not saying I have seen no old school fighter who could compete with the best today but c'mon over all they are better.

Spartacus Sully
05-05-2011, 03:31 AM
Its one factor yes, but I know where I am and I know I am in the wrong damn town here so anyone from 60-80 years ago would ko anyone from today regardless of size.

theres sooo many factors in marcianos favor....when marciano is close enough to hit, VK isnt going to have any leverage or distance. hes 50-60 lbs lighter so hes obliviously going to be faster on his feet in closing the gap then Vk is going to be able to back pedal and theres no way VK is keeping up with Marciano's stamina. VK will be dead tired by the 4th trying to out maneuver marciano just so he can have some distance on his shots while being pummeled to the body. by the 5th marcianos got the jab pattern down and has no problem slipping to the out side and coming in with a lunging overhand right. by the 6th VK pulls a No mas, he might continue on to be Ko'ed in the 8th but id imagine hes exhausted and realizes the futility of continuing into the 6th.

while VK has 50-60 lbs in his favor...

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 03:44 AM
Not saying I have seen no old school fighter who could compete with the best today but c'mon over all they are better.

I've been watching boxing a LONG time and no they aren't better.....they may not be worse per se but they aren't better.

Poet

JAB5239
05-05-2011, 03:51 AM
There is no possible way Rocky would beat VK, sh1t Chad Dawson easily schools Rocky to a 120-107 UD.

The fanatical nostalgic zeal I see in here amazes me everytime I come into this section.

Come in bro, Chad Dawson, really? Every version of Charles was miles better than Dawson.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 03:53 AM
theres sooo many factors in marcianos favor....when marciano is close enough to hit, VK isnt going to have any leverage or distance. hes 50-60 lbs lighter so hes obliviously going to be faster on his feet in closing the gap then Vk is going to be able to back pedal and theres no way VK is keeping up with Marciano's stamina. VK will be dead tired by the 4th trying to out maneuver marciano just so he can have some distance on his shots while being pummeled to the body. by the 5th marcianos got the jab pattern down and has no problem slipping to the out side and coming in with a lunging overhand right. by the 6th VK pulls a No mas, he might continue on to be Ko'ed in the 8th but id imagine hes exhausted and realizes the futility of continuing into the 6th.

while VK has 50-60 lbs in his favor...

Vitali is a guy who has been known to throw 1k punches in 12 rd fights, I can't think of any other HW regularly has done that.

So your basis that he is somehow going to just tire out is pretty flawed and not based on anything we know about him, you might have a better argument if we were talking about Wladdy though.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 03:58 AM
Come in bro, Chad Dawson, really? Every version of Charles was miles better than Dawson.

I don't think its inconceivable at all to think that with bad Chad's speed and height advantage if he fought very cautiously he could win a boring UD over Rocky but sure at any point Rocky could ko any man his own size like Chad.

Spartacus Sully
05-05-2011, 04:01 AM
Vitali is a guy who has been known to throw 1k punches in 12 rd fights, I can't think of any other HW regularly has done that.

So your basis that he is somehow going to just tire out is pretty flawed and not based on anything we know about him, you might have a better argument if we were talking about Wladdy though.

my basis has nothing to do with his punching but instead his leg endurance.....dosent he like not even run? or is that his bro that only swims?

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 04:06 AM
my basis has nothing to do with his punching but instead his leg endurance.....dosent he like not even run? or is that his bro that only swims?

Your thinking of Haye, he said he doesn't do road work in an interview.

JAB5239
05-05-2011, 04:08 AM
I don't think its inconceivable at all to think that with bad Chad's speed and height advantage if he fought very cautiously he could win a boring UD over Rocky but sure at any point Rocky could ko any man his own size like Chad.

With all due respect to you, Dawson lost to Pascal and was beaten up in his first fight with Johnson. Marciano was much more relentless and a much harder puncher than either of those two. I like Dawson a lot.I got to see him fight live on a few occasions when he was coming up. But he's simply over matched here. VK on the other hand.....like I've already said, I'd be rooting for "The Rock", but I certainly wouldn't be betting on him against Vitaly.

Holtol
05-05-2011, 04:11 AM
I don't think its inconceivable at all to think that with bad Chad's speed and height advantage if he fought very cautiously he could win a boring UD over Rocky but sure at any point Rocky could ko any man his own size like Chad.

He punched hard enough to ko boxers the likes of Lewis, Wladimir and Vitali. Marciano's punch was tested and it had enough exsplosive energy to lift 1000 pounds 1 foot off the ground. He punched hard enough to lacerate brains and brake elbows and knocked out men well over 200 pounds.

House of Stone
05-05-2011, 04:11 AM
Other than Vitalli dislocating his shoulder or a freak cut or something I don't see anyway that rocky could win this fight.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 04:11 AM
With all due respect to you, Dawson lost to Pascal and was beaten up in his first fight with Johnson. Marciano was much more relentless and a much harder puncher than either of those two. I like Dawson a lot.I got to see him fight live on a few occasions when he was coming up. But he's simply over matched here. VK on the other hand.....like I've already said, I'd be rooting for "The Rock", but I certainly wouldn't be betting on him against Vitaly.

He was not beaten up by Johnson who he very well could have shutout in a rematch I gave Johnson 1 rd in that fight but yes the 1st one was very close and could have went to Johnson.....as for Pascal, so the guy can't have one off night? He hasn't even gotten the chance to redeem himself.

Spartacus Sully
05-05-2011, 04:12 AM
Your thinking of Haye, he said he doesn't do road work in an interview.

Im pretty sure i read some where that one if not both of the brothers prefer swimming to road work because its bad on their knees. Ill have to look around and see if i can find where i read it.

seems its wlad that switched up his routine to be more swimming oriented for his cardio and dosnt run as much as he did. Vit still has his road wok in the mornings.

though i still dont think vits going to have the leg speed or stamina to keep away from marciano for more then a few rounds.

House of Stone
05-05-2011, 04:21 AM
Im pretty sure i read some where that one if not both of the brothers prefer swimming to road work because its bad on their knees. Ill have to look around and see if i can find where i read it.

seems its wlad that switched up his routine to be more swimming oriented for his cardio and dosnt run as much as he did. Vit still has his road wok in the mornings.

though i still dont think vits going to have the leg speed or stamina to keep away from marciano for more then a few rounds.

I'm not sure about klits but haye certainly doesn't do road work, though he does do 'sprint work' he believes that helps him generate short bursts of explosive speed in the ring ... but now that you've said it i don't really recall ever seeing wlad or vitali doing roadwwork either - as for vit v rocky I don't see Vit bothering to stay away from marciano he would stay toe to toe ... i think the more interesting match up would be wlad v rocky cause i could see rocky landing something on Wlad's fine china

JAB5239
05-05-2011, 04:23 AM
He was not beaten up by Johnson who he very well could have shutout in a rematch I gave Johnson 1 rd in that fight but yes the 1st one was very close and could have went to Johnson.....as for Pascal, so the guy can't have one off night? He hasn't even gotten the chance to redeem himself.

My point is, what is going to happen when a harder punching, more relentless and with a higher work rate Marciano is continually attacking? I would bet everything I have that it would be lights out for Chad.

<iframe width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Zywe23o2rtM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

House of Stone
05-05-2011, 04:27 AM
My point is, what is going to happen when a harder punching, more relentless and with a higher work rate Marciano is continually attacking? I would bet everything I have that it would be lights out for Chad.

<iframe width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Zywe23o2rtM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

yup gotta agree with that infact I don't see any cruiserweight beating rocky

Holtol
05-05-2011, 04:34 AM
yup gotta agree with that infact I don't see any cruiserweight beating rocky

Not even Evander Holyfield? Who almost beat Lennox Lewis when he was past his prime. As you know a past prime Lewis beat Vitali.

House of Stone
05-05-2011, 04:40 AM
Not even Evander Holyfield? Who almost beat Lennox Lewis when he was past his prime. As you know a past prime Lewis beat Vitali.

I'd give my right arm to see Evander v Rocky at either heavy or cruiser that would be a hell of a fight ... worthy of a thread all to itself ... if you were to call rocky a cruiser as he probably would be today that would be the top two cruisers of all time imo squaring off :drool:

Holtol
05-05-2011, 04:50 AM
I'd give my right arm to see Evander v Rocky at either heavy or cruiser that would be a hell of a fight ... worthy of a thread all to itself ... if you were to call rocky a cruiser as he probably would be today that would be the top two cruisers of all time imo squaring off :drool:

I don't call Marciano a crusier because he fought men as big as were willing to fight. He did not fight men just at crusier weight. He may have been only about 185 pounds but he fought 250 pound men and would have likey fought 300 pound men if need be. If you think Marciano has a good chance against Holyfield I don't see why you think he can't beat Vitali. Don't forget Marciano was trained for endurance he ran up to 15 miles a day even on christmas. Trust me not many people weight over 200 pounds if they are running the kind of distances Marciano ran. I used to weight about 160 pounds when I was running bettween 10 and 19 kilometers a day now since I don't run I weigh 240.

House of Stone
05-05-2011, 05:10 AM
I don't call Marciano a crusier because he fought men as big as were willing to fight. He did not fight men just at crusier weight. He may have been only about 185 pounds but he fought 250 pound men and would have likey fought 300 pound men if need be. If you think Marciano has a good chance against Holyfield I don't see why you think he can't beat Vitali. Don't forget Marciano was trained for endurance he ran up to 15 miles a day even on christmas. Trust me not many people weight over 200 pounds if they are running the kind of distances Marciano ran. I used to weight about 160 pounds when I was running bettween 10 and 19 kilometers a day now since I don't run I weigh 240.

The main reason I see him doing badly against Vitali is Vitali's power and the size advantage really is a lot even for a guy like rocky. He's also the type of fighter that just plods forward and comes straight at you (and I don't mean that in a bad way it worked for him) but I think thats the sort of style that imo would play into Vitali's hands. To beat vitali unless your a beast like foreman or can stand eye to eyewith him like Lewis you really need great movement. Marciano doesn't have that he's a pressure fighter who wears guys down and Vitali would take a hell of a lot of wearing down.
(I think rocky might do well against wlad though - wlad doesn't like it up him)

On the other hand a good small guy to fight Vitali would be Holyfield fighting like he did in Bowe 2 I think he'd beat either brother. I guess its just how I see them mixing and matching ... check out that exhibiution fight between rocky and ali (just to see the size difference) and then imagine rocky with his come forward style fighting vitali ... it just seems like a big ask to me.

Holtol
05-05-2011, 05:28 AM
The main reason I see him doing badly against Vitali is Vitali's power and the size advantage really is a lot even for a guy like rocky. He's also the type of fighter that just plods forward and comes straight at you (and I don't mean that in a bad way it worked for him) but I think thats the sort of style that imo would play into Vitali's hands. To beat vitali unless your a beast like foreman or can stand eye to eyewith him like Lewis you really need great movement. Marciano doesn't have that he's a pressure fighter who wears guys down and Vitali would take a hell of a lot of wearing down.
(I think rocky might do well against wlad though - wlad doesn't like it up him)

On the other hand a good small guy to fight Vitali would be Holyfield fighting like he did in Bowe 2 I think he'd beat either brother. I guess its just how I see them mixing and matching ... check out that exhibiution fight between rocky and ali (just to see the size difference) and then imagine rocky with his come forward style fighting vitali ... it just seems like a big ask to me.

Personaly I think Marciano's power is greater then Vitali's. Look at some of Marcaino's knock outs then look at Vitali's.

Your mistaken about Vitali having a size advantage. But I understand your thinking because of weight classes being the way they are. Rest assured weight classes are not in exsistance for the benefit of small or big boxers. They are in place for the reason of having more relevant fights that fans pay money for.

physiker
05-05-2011, 08:52 AM
What happened to the old adage that "a good big man beats a good little man."
Rocky vs K bros is really like a CW vs a superheavyweight class fighter. This is the equivalent of asking what happens if a good or great WW at 147 pounds fights the LHW champ at 175. (Actually the weight difference is even more, and here a great height difference as well.) Few people would question the outcome of the 147 pound champ fighting the LHW champ.

As far as Rocky vs Dawson, I'd go with Rocky.

But Vitali (and I am not a fan of his) took Lenox Lewis best bombs which cut him but he didn't go down. Do you really think Lewis didn't have at least as much power as Rocky?

The truth is that Vitali would be the one walking Rocky down and bombing him out of there. Rocky's footwork and ability to slip punches were not great. Old, well pastprime boxers weighing 180-190 dropped him. His 49 and 0 is highly suspect based on who he fought and who he didn't fight. That 0 can't be used to justify anything.

Based on who dropped Rocky, and everything else, Vitali wins by early KO.

Spartacus Sully
05-05-2011, 09:20 AM
What happened to the old adage that "a good big man beats a good little man."



never herd that one....but what about

"the bigger they are the harder they fall"

all this talk about klitschko standing toe to toe with marciano....he would have no leverage...to actaully punch and do damage with his punches he would have to make distance.....this isnt foreman and marciano where all forman has to do is swing and the punches will hurt....this is Vk vs marciano.....distance matters and marciano is going to have no problem closing the distance and smothering everything vk throws....

and really....not good at slipping? have you ever watched marciano fight?

bklynboy
05-05-2011, 10:44 AM
What happened to the old adage that "a good big man beats a good little man."
Rocky vs K bros is really like a CW vs a superheavyweight class fighter. This is the equivalent of asking what happens if a good or great WW at 147 pounds fights the LHW champ at 175. (Actually the weight difference is even more, and here a great height difference as well.) Few people would question the outcome of the 147 pound champ fighting the LHW champ.

As far as Rocky vs Dawson, I'd go with Rocky.

But Vitali (and I am not a fan of his) took Lenox Lewis best bombs which cut him but he didn't go down. Do you really think Lewis didn't have at least as much power as Rocky?

The truth is that Vitali would be the one walking Rocky down and bombing him out of there. Rocky's footwork and ability to slip punches were not great. Old, well pastprime boxers weighing 180-190 dropped him. His 49 and 0 is highly suspect based on who he fought and who he didn't fight. That 0 can't be used to justify anything.

Based on who dropped Rocky, and everything else, Vitali wins by early KO.

There's a difference here. After a certain point your skull doesn't get thicker, your ability to handle a head shot doesn't get better. A bantamweight fighting a lightweight is facing a much bigger hurdle in knocking him out, or even hurting him than a cruiserweight have with a heavyweight or even a "super" heavyweight.

The major advantage of the bigger guy are his ability to handle body shots (but not shots to the solar plexus or kidney); his ability to wear you down by leaning and wrestling with you; and of course his punches, esp the jab, will be heavier than someone your own weight.

Disadvantages of being 60 pounds heavier - stamina and quickness.

Barn
05-05-2011, 11:46 AM
What happened to the old adage that "a good big man beats a good little man."
Rocky vs K bros is really like a CW vs a superheavyweight class fighter. This is the equivalent of asking what happens if a good or great WW at 147 pounds fights the LHW champ at 175. (Actually the weight difference is even more, and here a great height difference as well.) Few people would question the outcome of the 147 pound champ fighting the LHW champ.

As far as Rocky vs Dawson, I'd go with Rocky.

But Vitali (and I am not a fan of his) took Lenox Lewis best bombs which cut him but he didn't go down. Do you really think Lewis didn't have at least as much power as Rocky?

The truth is that Vitali would be the one walking Rocky down and bombing him out of there. Rocky's footwork and ability to slip punches were not great. Old, well pastprime boxers weighing 180-190 dropped him. His 49 and 0 is highly suspect based on who he fought and who he didn't fight. That 0 can't be used to justify anything.

Based on who dropped Rocky, and everything else, Vitali wins by early KO.

I'm sorry but, Vit does not have Archie Moore power.

RubenSonny
05-05-2011, 12:33 PM
Not saying I have seen no old school fighter who could compete with the best today but c'mon over all they are better.

Anything to back this claim up?

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 12:44 PM
Anything to back this claim up?

Don't know where I would get any solid footage of something like that unless there is a time machine you know of that I don't with which I could use to take a modern fighter and pit him against an old timer.

bklynboy
05-05-2011, 12:46 PM
Not saying I have seen no old school fighter who could compete with the best today but c'mon over all they are better.


Anything to back this claim up?

To continue what RubenSonny said:

Which of today's middleweights would have taken out Hagler or Hearns? or Nino Benvenuti or Emile Griffith? or SRR?

All props to Martinez but is he head and shoulders above the men I just mentioned? Hell no. Is Pavlik? Sturm? Oh, how about JCCJr? How would he do?

Holtol
05-05-2011, 12:48 PM
never herd that one....but what about

"the bigger they are the harder they fall"

all this talk about klitschko standing toe to toe with marciano....he would have no leverage...to actaully punch and do damage with his punches he would have to make distance.....this isnt foreman and marciano where all forman has to do is swing and the punches will hurt....this is Vk vs marciano.....distance matters and marciano is going to have no problem closing the distance and smothering everything vk throws....

and really....not good at slipping? have you ever watched marciano fight?

Thats an old common saying. Any old saying there is a lot of wisdom and truth in otherwise how would it had survived so long. Anything that survives a long time has a lot of truth and reality in it. Just like chinese medicine or even wheels.

The bigger they are the harder they fall into punches also. And these big heavy people are still just made of flesh and bone.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 12:52 PM
Which of today's middleweights would have taken out Hagler or Hearns? or Nino Benvenuti or Emile Griffith? or SRR?

All props to Martinez but is he head and shoulders above the men I just mentioned? Hell no. Is Pavlik? Sturm? Oh, how about JCCJr? How would he do?

They don't qualify as old timers, I consider them modern.

Barn
05-05-2011, 12:53 PM
They don't qualify as old timers, I consider them modern.
When do you consider them "Modern"?

RubenSonny
05-05-2011, 12:54 PM
Don't know where I would get any solid footage of something like that unless there is a time machine you know of that I don't with which I could use to take a modern fighter and pit him against an old timer.

Ah, so you were just blowing hot air.....again.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 12:58 PM
Ah, so you were just blowing hot air.....again.

Only as much as anyone in threads about FFs.

RubenSonny
05-05-2011, 01:03 PM
Only as much as anyone in threads about FFs.

Deflecting...great poster, right here :fing02:

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 01:05 PM
Deflecting...great poster, right here :fing02:

I answered your question what do you want, can you prove old timers are better than modern fighters? If so can I use your time machine to try and set up some fights?

RubenSonny
05-05-2011, 01:21 PM
I answered your question what do you want, can't you prove old timers are better than modern fighters? If so can I use your time machine to try and set up some fights?

Yeah and your answer was a cop out, I never made any such claim, I think there has been special fighters in every year that would be special or competitive any other era, in fact I probably wouldn't favor anyone against the 'modern' Whitaker at lightweight (I think I'd put even money with Duran). Having said that, I definately think the talent pool of today is smaller and some techniques are almost extinct, barely anyone has skills on the inside, people called friggin' Hatton a top infighter, I also see that feinting is rarely used as well. Its clear you've come to talk **** again without backing any of it up, unless you will tell me your reasons for believing fighters of today are better...

bklynboy
05-05-2011, 01:23 PM
I answered your question what do you want, can you prove old timers are better than modern fighters? If so can I use your time machine to try and set up some fights?

In one sense we can't PROVE anything. I think Muhammad Ali is better than Eddie Chambers but perhaps humanity has evolved so much over the years that even an also-ran of today is better than the greats of yesterday.

OK - that was a bit snarky, but if Hagler is modern and "good" than how can Carlos Monzon (who I forgot in my earlier post) Nino Benvenuti and Emile Griffith not be "modern" fighters?

I can see you saying that it's much harder to judge earlier fighters. We have less film, usually only one camera, much lower resolution, sometimes (as in the 1920s) it's hand-cranked and jerky. So. When do we start "old-timers."

I would say the line is in the 1920s. Boxing became legal. We had decisions - not "newspaper" accounts. We got away from the fight-until-KOed 45 round fights; the neutral-corner rule began to be required and enforced; the "illegal" tactics began going away.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 01:24 PM
Yeah and your answer was a cop out, I never made any such claim, I think there has been special fighters in every year that would be special or competitive any other era, in fact I probably wouldn't favor anyone against the 'modern' Whitaker at lightweight (I think I'd put even money with Duran). Having said that, I definately think the talent pool of today is smaller and some techniques are almost extinct, barely anyone has skills on the inside, people called friggin' Hatton a top infighter, I also see that feinting is rarely used as well. Its clear you've come to talk **** again without backing any of it up, unless you will tell me your reasons for believing fighters of today are better...

Back it up with what? Its all just opinions like VK vs Rocky no one has anything to back any of it up with.

When I watch old fighters who are classified as the best ever I am pretty unimpressed usually.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 01:27 PM
In one sense we can't PROVE anything. I think Muhammad Ali is better than Eddie Chambers but perhaps humanity has evolved so much over the years that even an also-ran of today is better than the greats of yesterday.

OK - that was a bit snarky, but if Hagler is modern and "good" than how can Carlos Monzon (who I forgot in my earlier post) Nino Benvenuti and Emile Griffith not be "modern" fighters?

I can see you saying that it's much harder to judge earlier fighters. We have less film, usually only one camera, much lower resolution, sometimes (as in the 1920s) it's hand-cranked and jerky. So. When do we start "old-timers."

I would say the line is in the 1920s. Boxing became legal. We had decisions - not "newspaper" accounts. We got away from the fight-until-KOed 45 round fights; the neutral-corner rule began to be required and enforced; the "illegal" tactics began going away.

I guess its all opinion where you cut off modern from different eras but even the early 80's isn't so far away from today that it couldn't be comparable.

RubenSonny
05-05-2011, 01:37 PM
Back it up with what? Its all just opinions like VK vs Rocky no one has anything to back any of it up with.

Yeah and you should have something to be able to back up your opinion, stop playing dumb.

When I watch old fighters who are classified as the best ever I am pretty unimpressed usually.

Which fighters are you speaking of and who is classifying?

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 01:42 PM
Yeah and you should have something to be able to back up your opinion, stop playing dumb.

So you don't have an answer other than biased opinions like the many used in this FF thread?



Which fighters are you speaking of and who is classifying?

Lets start with Rocky since he is the topic of this thread and he is viewed as one of the best HWs ever by ppl who post here not to mention apparently he would break down VK in 5 or 6 rounds.

RubenSonny
05-05-2011, 01:53 PM
Lets start with Rocky since he is the topic of this thread and he is viewed as one of the best HWs ever by ppl who post here not to mention apparently he would break down VK in 5 or 6 rounds.

Rocky did a lot more than VK, Quitali is a contender nothing more, thin resume, no doubt about that.

So far you have one example...strong argument right there:fing02:

bklynboy
05-05-2011, 01:57 PM
Lets start with Rocky since he is the topic of this thread and he is viewed as one of the best HWs ever by ppl who post here not to mention apparently he would break down VK in 5 or 6 rounds.

Rocky is hard example. Even in his day he wasn't respected for his boxing skill. Didn't Walcott, before their first fight say that he couldn't lose as Rocky was too easy to hit - pretty much saying that Rocky was a bum?

Rocky succeeded because of will and real KO power. Talk about skill from that era and before how about looking at Walcott and Archie Moore and Joe Louis and SRR and Henry Armstrong and Willie Pep. Each of these men, in my opinion, would have competed just fine in today's world.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 02:30 PM
Rocky did a lot more than VK, Quitali is a contender nothing more, thin resume, no doubt about that.

So far you have one example...strong argument right there:fing02:

So him beating some older guys on their way out makes up for all of the disadvantages he would have physically and technically against VK?

I mean I could imagine prime Tua being in his place during his time and posters here would be hyping him in FF matches about how he would ko Lewis in 1 or 2 rounds.

Spray_resistant
05-05-2011, 02:32 PM
Rocky is hard example. Even in his day he wasn't respected for his boxing skill. Didn't Walcott, before their first fight say that he couldn't lose as Rocky was too easy to hit - pretty much saying that Rocky was a bum?

Rocky succeeded because of will and real KO power. Talk about skill from that era and before how about looking at Walcott and Archie Moore and Joe Louis and SRR and Henry Armstrong and Willie Pep. Each of these men, in my opinion, would have competed just fine in today's world.

Lets not forget Locche, he is one of the special cases I think could be the best in any era.

ChopperRead
05-05-2011, 02:38 PM
Vitali by stoppage against the cruiserweight Marciano in a lopsided contest.

physiker
05-05-2011, 02:40 PM
I'm sorry but, Vit does not have Archie Moore power.

Rocky was dropped by others besides Moore.

And I think the K bros (not a fan BTW) have power equal or greater than Moore.

They knew when to retire Rocky. Rocky is kinda like a smaller, lesser version of prime pre-Douglas Tyson. Most of the HW champs starting with Liston would probably have beat the Rock. Too big, strong, fast, etc. and I certainly do not subscribe to the "curent generation would beat the older generation" philosophy. I try to judge these matters individually. E.g when Floyd says he'd beat SRR and SRL, as a welterweight, I think that's ludicrous, as they were bigger, longer arms, better offense, better footwork, etc.

RubenSonny
05-05-2011, 03:09 PM
So him beating some older guys on their way out makes up for all of the disadvantages he would have physically and technically against VK?

I mean I could imagine prime Tua being in his place during his time and posters here would be hyping him in FF matches about how he would ko Lewis in 1 or 2 rounds.

:grumble:.........So Marciano is your only argument for fighters being better now?

The_Demon
05-05-2011, 03:15 PM
Looks like the Klithuggers are out in force today,im sorry guys but the klits arent that good,especially VK who has an extremely weak resume,the 'Marciano would be a CW today' argument wont cut it im afraid,size is only important when a fighter needs too have it in order too be effective,such as Wlad and Vitali

bklynboy
05-05-2011, 03:30 PM
Lets not forget Locche, he is one of the special cases I think could be the best in any era.

Locche was awesome. What a pleasure to watch.

IronDanHamza
05-05-2011, 03:44 PM
Lets not forget Locche, he is one of the special cases I think could be the best in any era.

Best of any area? He's not even the best fighter from his own era.

Locche is a great fighter. no doubt. But he's not 'could be the best in any era' great.

Barn
05-05-2011, 03:51 PM
Rocky was dropped by others besides Moore.

And I think the K bros (not a fan BTW) have power equal or greater than Moore.
They knew when to retire Rocky. Rocky is kinda like a smaller, lesser version of prime pre-Douglas Tyson. Most of the HW champs starting with Liston would probably have beat the Rock. Too big, strong, fast, etc. and I certainly do not subscribe to the "curent generation would beat the older generation" philosophy. I try to judge these matters individually. E.g when Floyd says he'd beat SRR and SRL, as a welterweight, I think that's ludicrous, as they were bigger, longer arms, better offense, better footwork, etc.

You obviously haven't watched much Moore or even looked at his record.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 03:56 PM
What happened to the old adage that "a good big man beats a good little man."

Like every other cliche that floats around sports it has little practical validity.

Poet

bklynboy
05-05-2011, 04:03 PM
Locche was awesome. What a pleasure to watch.

Best of any area? He's not even the best fighter from his own era.

Locche is a great fighter. no doubt. But he's not 'could be the best in any era' great.

No, but for pure skill, pure boxing mastery he surely is among the best. If he trained hard, didn't smoke between rounds, he would *probably* have been better. :-)

IronDanHamza
05-05-2011, 04:15 PM
No, but for pure skill, pure boxing mastery he surely is among the best. If he trained hard, didn't smoke between rounds, he would *probably* have been better. :-)

Oh absolutely, skill wise he is arugablly up there with the best. But greatness isn't based off ability, of course.

That's the thing, though. Those things did happen, otherwise he would be a different fighter.

And I also think his lack of power would give him trouble in any era, and the fact he isn't the best in his own era tells me he most likely wouldn't be the best of any era.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 04:23 PM
Oh absolutely, skill wise he is arugablly up there with the best. But greatness isn't based off ability, of course.

That's the thing, though. Those things did happen, otherwise he would be a different fighter.

And I also think his lack of power would give him trouble in any era, and the fact he isn't the best in his own era tells me he most likely wouldn't be the best of any era.

I seriously need to watch more Locche. At some point I'm going to have to really put the pedal down and search for his fights.....I only have one or two right now.

Poet

IronDanHamza
05-05-2011, 04:33 PM
I seriously need to watch more Locche. At some point I'm going to have to really put the pedal down and search for his fights.....I only have one or two right now.

Poet

I used to have quite alot of footage of Locche when I was younger but I have lost most of them having moved around so many times since then and even then some of what I did have wasn't full length fights.

There is also a bit of footage of him on youtube too....as unsatisfying as the Youtube experience is. :lol1:

physiker
05-05-2011, 04:35 PM
You obviously haven't watched much Moore or even looked at his record.

You obviously do not know me or much else.

I've seen many fights Moore had, and I even saw the ones he had with 6'7" 250 pound guys.

Barn
05-05-2011, 04:42 PM
You obviously do not know me or much else.

I've seen many fights Moore had, and I even saw the ones he had with 6'7" 250 pound guys.
You still stand by the claim that Klitchko's > Moore powerwise?

physiker
05-05-2011, 04:43 PM
Like every other cliche that floats around sports it has little practical validity.

Poet

Well Obi Wan (or other fantasy lover)--otherwise known here as "pick and choose": the rest of my post dealt with specifics of the two men, including their physical attributes.

That cliche probably was meant to apply to two men with a vastly smaller weight difference. Not the slaughter that is inherent in this comparison.

And the "Rock" got dropped by several well past prime fighters in the 180-190 pound range. This thread is a joke, and I am no fan of the K bros.

Barn
05-05-2011, 04:46 PM
You obviously do not know me or much else.

I've seen many fights Moore had, and I even saw the ones he had with 6'7" 250 pound guys.
1. Joe Louis
2. Sam Langford
3. Jimmy Wilde
4. Archie Moore

Ring Magazines greatest punchers list.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 04:49 PM
that's anakin u ****ing n00b :lol1:

He needs to read the caption at the bottom of the pic :cool9:

Barn
05-05-2011, 04:52 PM
Well Obi Wan (or other fantasy lover)--otherwise known here as "pick and choose": the rest of my post dealt with specifics of the two men, including their physical attributes.

That cliche probably was meant to apply to two men with a vastly smaller weight difference. Not the slaughter that is inherent in this comparison.

And the "Rock" got dropped by several well past prime fighters in the 180-190 pound range. This thread is a joke, and I am no fan of the K bros.

Obi Wan: you are really slipping here. The farce is with you.
No idea why you are getting angry as many in this thread including I said V could well win by decision or cut stoppage. You just can't rule out a Marciano KO against anyone.

physiker
05-05-2011, 04:58 PM
No idea why you are getting angry as many in this thread including I said V could well win by decision or cut stoppage. You just can't rule out a Marciano KO against anyone.

I'm not angry. I think you and you tag team bud are.

This thread is a joke. Maybe a # out of 10 is better for you geniuses.

9/10 times, V beats Rocky. Most likely by early brutal KO.

Sure if Vitali got distracted, say took a nap, and Rocky got in on him, he could KO him.

physiker
05-05-2011, 05:01 PM
Ring Magazines greatest punchers list.



This thread was about Rocky's alleged power to KO Vitali, and that list did not have Rocky there.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 05:09 PM
Well Obi Wan (or other fantasy lover)--otherwise known here as "pick and choose": the rest of my post dealt with specifics of the two men, including their physical attributes.

That cliche probably was meant to apply to two men with a vastly smaller weight difference. Not the slaughter that is inherent in this comparison.

And the "Rock" got dropped by several well past prime fighters in the 180-190 pound range. This thread is a joke, and I am no fan of the K bros.

Obi Wan: you are really slipping here. The farce is with you.



Try this adage: "It ain't the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog." It's an adage with more validity than the cliche you trotted out.

Any fighter, even those with great chins can suffer flash knockdowns. Even Ali, whose chin is a byword, had the occasional flash knockdown hence why the "so-and-so was knocked down by so-and-so" argument doesn't work. If you knew anything about boxing at all you'd know that; but you don't which makes YOU a joke regardless of whether you're a fan of Klits or not.


Poet

IronDanHamza
05-05-2011, 05:15 PM
Well Captain Needa, otherwise known as "Captain Choke-On-This", the rest of your post was irrelivent as the cliche you chose to base it on is irrelivent.

Try this adage: "It ain't the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog." It's an adage with more validity than the cliche you trotted out.

Any fighter, even those with great chins can suffer flash knockdowns. Even Ali, whose chin is a byword, had the occasional flash knockdown hence why the "so-and-so was knocked down by so-and-so" argument doesn't work. If you knew anything about boxing at all you'd know that; but you don't which makes YOU a joke regardless of whether you're a fan of Klits or not.

Captain Needa: Your windpipe is really slipping here. If you only knew the POWER of the Darth Side.....wait, they're dragging your carcass out so I guess you know the power now :cool9:

Poet

But but but...Tony Galento knocked down Joe Louis! Even if Louis did go on to destroy him like no one else did.....so there!!!

Do you know how many times I have had to suffer listening to the great 'Tony Galento' argument?

Even moron's in NSB used it yesterday to justify why Wlad's resume is "on par with Louis'"

That's what stage this idiocy is getting to.

Vadrigar.
05-05-2011, 05:15 PM
Well Captain Needa, otherwise known as "Captain Choke-On-This", the rest of your post was irrelivent as the cliche you chose to base it on is irrelivent.

Try this adage: "It ain't the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog." It's an adage with more validity than the cliche you trotted out.

Any fighter, even those with great chins can suffer flash knockdowns. Even Ali, whose chin is a byword, had the occasional flash knockdown hence why the "so-and-so was knocked down by so-and-so" argument doesn't work. If you knew anything about boxing at all you'd know that; but you don't which makes YOU a joke regardless of whether you're a fan of Klits or not.

Captain Needa: Your windpipe is really slipping here. If you only knew the POWER of the Darth Side.....wait, they're dragging your carcass out so I guess you know the power now :cool9:

Poet

hahahaha poet :rofl:

BTW how does this fight go?

physiker
05-05-2011, 05:20 PM
Well Captain Needa, otherwise known as "Captain Choke-On-This", the rest of your post was irrelivent as the cliche you chose to base it on is irrelivent.

Try this adage: "It ain't the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog." It's an adage with more validity than the cliche you trotted out.


Poet



I didn't "base" my post on a cliche. The post had facts in it, the adage merely was an adjunct.

And then after saying cliches were all worthless, you post your own.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 05:21 PM
But but but...Tony Galento knocked down Joe Louis! Even if Louis did go on to destroy him like no one else did.....so there!!!

Do you know how many times I have had to suffer listening to the great 'Tony Galento' argument?

Even moron's in NSB used it yesterday to justify why Wlad's resume is "on par with Louis'"

That's what stage this idiocy is getting to.

Yeah, I pretty much stopped trying to use reason with those idiots.....it's a pretty much a thankless task that really doesn't accomplish much. Retards will be retards regardless of how much reason, logic, and imperical evidence you use with them; so why bother? It's easier just to make fun of their window licking stupidity :chuckle9:

Poet

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 05:25 PM
hahahaha poet :rofl:

BTW how does this fight go?

Depends on the era it's set in. Post 1960s, given Rocky's tendancy to bleed, I could easily see him getting stopped on cuts or having his plug pulled for sponging punches. Set the fight pre-1960 with much more permissive refs and Rocky wins in a war.

Poet

physiker
05-05-2011, 05:29 PM
Even Larry Homes said Rocky couldn't carry his jockstrap to indicate that Rocky was much too small, slow, flat footed etc. etc. to have been in his league. Didn't go over well. He paid the price for a bit of reality. It's like a religion with some retards because someone said something decades ago.

Barn
05-05-2011, 05:29 PM
When Sam Langford beat Joe Jeanette he was weighing 165.

A few fights earlier Jeanette was 208.

Sam Langford also beat the 215 Sandy Ferguson.

Joe Walcott weighing around 145 fought to a draw with Ferguson.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 05:30 PM
Another epic fail from a windbag who thinks he's a literary mastermind. It takes more than purple text.

I didn't "base" my post on a cliche. The post had facts in it, the adage merely was an adjunct.

And then after saying cliches were all worthless, you post your own.

Pseudo-intellectual, this thread was about Rocky v Vitali. Anyone who thinks Rocky would have won should be writing "poetry" within the white walls--or are they pink now--you tell me, PSEUDO.

Getting angry are you? What I posted wasn't a cliche as the definition of a cliche is a saying that's been beaten to death by the ignorant and nobody uses the adage I posted. You, on the other hand, seem to suck up sayings that actually ARE cliches and in your ignorance take them as the Gospel truth.



Poet

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 05:33 PM
(And I am no fan of theirs, I keep saying.)

And you keep saying it so frequently that it implies you're being disingenous and think if you repeat it often enough people will actually believe it.

Poet

Vadrigar.
05-05-2011, 05:36 PM
When Sam Langford beat Joe Jeanette he was weighing 165.

A few fights earlier Jeanette was 208.

Sam Langford also beat the 215 Sandy Ferguson.

Joe Walcott weighing around 145 fought to a draw with Ferguson.

Charley Burley at 151 lb savaged a 219 lb Jay D Turner.

physiker
05-05-2011, 05:41 PM
And you keep saying it so frequently that it implies you're being disingenous and think if you repeat it often enough people will actually believe it.

Poet

I battled here on my first day with this Klit bro-loving racist (who they told me was KNN or some thing here before). He wrote the K's would beat Ali and everyone else. And I told him that was a joke. It's on record here. But you've proven you have no interest in the truth. Someone who thinks Rocky would have beaten Vitali.

physiker
05-05-2011, 05:44 PM
When Sam Langford beat Joe Jeanette he was weighing 165.

A few fights earlier Jeanette was 208.

Sam Langford also beat the 215 Sandy Ferguson.

Joe Walcott weighing around 145 fought to a draw with Ferguson.

That is fine and totally irrelevant to Rocky vs Vitali.

No one ever said fighter A couldn't beat fighter B regardless of weights.

The thread was about 2 specific individuals: Rocky and Vitali and THEIR records and THEIR physical attributes.

Barn
05-05-2011, 05:45 PM
Charley Burley at 151 lb savaged a 219 lb Jay D Turner.
Somehow, I have a funny feeling these examples will get ignored.

Barn
05-05-2011, 05:47 PM
That is fine and totally irrelevant to Rocky vs Vitali.

No one ever said fighter A couldn't beat fighter B regardless of weights.

The thread was about 2 specific individuals: Rocky and Vitali and THEIR records and THEIR physical attributes.

Another moronic and epic desperate fail. Imbeciles thinking they are geniuses is the saddest thing.
I never stated I was "genius" in fact there are many greater posters on these boards than me but, that is irrelevant and I have no idea why you brought it up.

You haven't presented much of an arguement anyway.

physiker
05-05-2011, 05:56 PM
Are you out of tampons or something? :thinking9: Seriously dude: Plug the hole, take a Xanax, and come back when you're off the rag :cool9:

Poet



I merely cited the physical attributes and records of the 2 specific fighters this thread was suppsoed to be about.


To paraphrase Holmes' statement about Rocky, "You couldn't carry my jockstrap.

Barn
05-05-2011, 05:58 PM
I merely cited the physical attributes and records of the 2 specific fighters this thread was suppsoed to be about.


To paraphrase Holmes' statement about Rocky, "You couldn't carry my jockstrap.
You didn't state a hellish lot actually.

Ziggy Stardust
05-05-2011, 06:01 PM
I merely cited the physical attributes and records of the 2 specific fighters this thread was suppsoed to be about.

To paraphrase Holmes' statement about Rocky, "You couldn't carry my jockstrap.

The following is the first insulting post in this thread:
Well Obi Wan (or other fantasy lover)--otherwise known here as "pick and choose": the rest of my post dealt with specifics of the two men, including their physical attributes.

That cliche probably was meant to apply to two men with a vastly smaller weight difference. Not the slaughter that is inherent in this comparison.

And the "Rock" got dropped by several well past prime fighters in the 180-190 pound range. This thread is a joke, and I am no fan of the K bros.

Oooooh looky there! Look who started with the insults.....that would be YOU Junior :cool9:

Poet

Spartacus Sully
05-05-2011, 07:41 PM
And the "Rock" got dropped by several well past prime fighters in the 180-190 pound range. This thread is a joke, and I am no fan of the K bros.

so? how many of those times that the rock got dropped did it take more then one hit? None? did it ever occur to you that going down from the one hit that slightly dazed him was the better option then staying standing trying to recover and getting hit even more?

the fact that he went down only shows that if he got dazed or hit off balance he knew to go down to avoid further punishment. it shows that he was a smart fighter.

plus of those times he was knocked down how many of them was he down for more then 5 seconds? none? the better option is to fall down and get right back up over attempting to regain his balance and get hit even more.