View Full Version : A Question to Tyson Fans


Southpaw16
09-17-2005, 05:58 PM
I agree with Mike Tyson fans that Tyson is a legend. He revitalized the heavyweight division in the late eighties, he was the most feared fighter ever, and he was possibly the greatest physical specimen ever in boxing.

When he came onto the scene in the late eighties, with the way he tore through opponents he was said to be unbeatable. It has been proven time and time again that he was always very beatable when a good boxer could take him past the first five rounds. This was hinted at when mediocre heavyweight James Tillis won four of ten rounds against him on two judges scorecards. Going into the Tyson fight Tillis had eight losses on his record and was on a three fight losing streak. Of course people brushed this off and continued to say he was unbeatable.

Eventually him being beatable was confirmed when Buster Douglas whipped him. Because this happened right after he fired Kevin Rooney, to argue that he was unbeatable, Tyson fans have to claim he lost solely because of the firing of Kevin Rooney. This leads to an elaborate theory that Cus D'Amato was a boxing genius, and when Cus died it was OK since Rooney was his protege, but when Rooney was fired within a few months Tyson forgot everything he was taught, explaining his downfall.

There are a lot of Tyson fans who will cling to this Rooney theory like glue. In my opinion it is completely illogical and senseless. Especially since it was evidenced in the Tillis fight that he could be very vulnerable when taken the distance. Also, Rooney has never been able to train a championship calibre fighter before or after Tyson.

Here is my challenge to these Tyson fans : explain why Tyson never rehired Rooney.

I know that you all claim he fired Rooney because Don King brainwashed him. He has never rehired Rooney or even kept in touch with him long after his ties with King were severed. It is clear that Tyson does not think that his firing Rooney led to his downfall. Perhaps Tyson fans know more about Tyson from watching him on TV then Tyson knows about himself. So lets hear some explanations: why has Rooney never been rehired by Tyson.

KidBlackie
09-17-2005, 06:59 PM
[[[Here is my challenge to these Tyson fans : explain why Tyson never rehired Rooney.]]]
==============

Simple, Tyson is an idiot. He had a ton of natural talent, and had the best management and trainer in the world for his style and temperment, Jacobs and D'Amato. Once he signed with King, married Givens, and fired the last remnants of his team, Rooney and Cayton, it's obvious his training and style deteriorated. Add in the 5 yrs of jail, and only the oblivious can deny he was in a downward spiral.

Why do folks deny that his first fight with his new team under King featured three stooges using iced condoms for Endswell? Ain't you guys gonna figure it out?

Warhawk46
09-17-2005, 09:21 PM
Because they dont want to admit it. Admitting that Tyson WAS much different after he lost the catskills teams means that their argument doesnt hold as much merit.

By the way, to the dumbass who started this topic: Tyson had split with Rooney for well over a year before he lost to Douglas. In his fight with Bruno, it was evident that he had lost some of the great skills that made him special.

To those of you who argue he lost to someone who stood up to him, or who could control o fight with a jab: shut the **** up already. The old theory has been disproven time and again. Many big, strong men who could box effectively and were not afraid of him lost. I can name several, as can you if you actually watched his fights instead of blindly regurgitating what biased writers say...

Southpaw16
09-18-2005, 12:28 AM
So far the only answer to my question as to why Tyson has not rehired Kevin Rooney is that "Tyson is an idiot".

So he would have to be such an idiot that people watching him on TV know more about him than he knows about himself. I think this is very far-fetched.

Pariah21388
09-18-2005, 10:49 AM
Tyson did not like the way Rooney treated him. To Tyson, Rooney was to demanding and father-like. Thats why he has never rehired or kept in touch. And there are other reasons that the media does not know about. It's not like we know Tyson personally.

oakleyno1
09-18-2005, 11:26 AM
im a huge tyson fan, but the real answer is simple

he is thick and stupid

datneggajeep
09-25-2005, 11:39 PM
ok dude I don't know what you hold against Tyson, but you are an idiot. For your question about his trainer I have two words, Don King! Oh yeah I almost forgot, YOU ARE AN IDIOT.

chopper77
09-26-2005, 05:27 PM
Warhawk I respectfully disagree. Douglas had a good straight punch, accurate, and strong. The guys you are talking about that Tyson fought and beat that could box could not crack an egg in my opinion. And Pariah in my humble opinion Tyson was a lazy piece of crap after he got rid of the team that brought him out, and that showed up later when he didn't train properly, and then eventually quit on his stool.

kapersky
09-26-2005, 05:49 PM
i dont say he is unbeatable even in his prime, but in his prime when he train hard and was highly motivaded. guy like douglas would be punching bag for him. those who not like tyson what the ****, cant you see he was slower and lost basically all that make him great? watch bruno fight it seem like two different fighter even though he finished bruno.

kapersky
09-26-2005, 05:54 PM
here is the strongest argument. it was obviously that tyson had lost his jab,head movement, and combintions. wether it depend on him or because he didnt train properly i dont know.

Kimmy
09-26-2005, 08:08 PM
I agree with Tyson being stupid but i think another reason that he never had business with Rooney again is because Rooney wouldn't take his **** and made him work, Tyson lost his zest for boxing and Rooney would have made him make an effort, something Tyson didn`t want to do!

hellfire508
09-28-2005, 09:29 PM
Because they dont want to admit it. Admitting that Tyson WAS much different after he lost the catskills teams means that their argument doesnt hold as much merit.

By the way, to the dumbass who started this topic: Tyson had split with Rooney for well over a year before he lost to Douglas. In his fight with Bruno, it was evident that he had lost some of the great skills that made him special.

To those of you who argue he lost to someone who stood up to him, or who could control o fight with a jab: shut the **** up already. The old theory has been disproven time and again. Many big, strong men who could box effectively and were not afraid of him lost. I can name several, as can you if you actually watched his fights instead of blindly regurgitating what biased writers say...

Someone who stood up to him and had a decent jab WOULD dominate Tyson, if they had an ounce of talent themselves. I'm not talking about bums like Busster Douglas, who beat him anyway (I know it wasnt the best Tyson). I'm talking about someone like Joe Louis, Sonny Liston, George foreman, Muhammad Ali, Lennox Lewis... any of those guys would beat a prime Mike tyson, except MAYBE Lewis. Then you've got your Dempseys and your Marcianos, who would pressure Tyson so bad that he would quit.

Verstyle
10-03-2005, 02:42 AM
first of all in his prime i dont think he woulda quit from being pressured if n e thing he woulda of liked it since his style was to get inside so in a sense there doing his work for him plus with his short arms u put 1 and 1 together with a guy that maxes his strength on getting short compact punches.

Warhawk46
10-03-2005, 04:01 PM
Wrong, wrong, wrong.

That is all I ever hear from people who dont like Mike Tyson. "If someone who could jab stood up to him..." Blah, blah, blah.

The point is several big, strong, talented men stood up to him. Off the top of my head...James Tillis, Tyrell Biggs (loads of talent, footwork as good as Ali, bigger, not as much heart), Toney Tucker (the size of Lennox Lewis, with as much talent, not as much motivation), Pinklon Thomas, Larry Holmes (old, but still very good as evidenced by his fights in later years against top-10 opponents) etc.

There has been several "big, talented guys who could jab" who have stood up to Mike Tyson. The problem was he was too good in him prime to hold off for long. I get sick of hearing someone talk about how the fighters of yesteryear would make Tyson their *****...Tyson in his prime didnt give up, he didnt get too discouraged, he had a gameplan, and the confidence to take a clear decision victory. He had the fire in his belly and the motivation to do the necessary work to prepare himself for the fight.

The bottom line is that the fighters like Louis, like Liston, like Marciano never fought someone like Mike Tyson. They never faced someone with the awesome combination of strength, speed and power that prime Tyson displayed.

I think it is ignorant to flat-out say Tyson would have folded against these greats, because they fought in eras where they didnt have to contend with the type of fighter Tyson was, they didnt have to deal with the sheer physical brilliance of Tyson.

Verstyle
10-03-2005, 09:00 PM
can else can i say that was a good post i wish every1 can explain it like u jus did warhawk. bravo

Warhawk46
10-04-2005, 04:24 PM
I'm not saying Tyson couldnt be beaten in his prime. Anyone can be beaten on a given night.

A fighter has to be mentally prepared, has to train hard and be physically prepared as well.

But what bothers me is when people try to shortchange Tyson's greatness. They do this by saying he didnt fight anyone, or by saying he couldnt fight back if someone wasnt scared. In reality, he fought a lot of good fighters, some great ones. Sure, those fighters do not get the ink the seventies era fighters do...but with the exception of Ali and Foreman, the era is very, very comparable. The 80s had many talented big men, in fact, as far as talent goes...it might have been equal to or better that the 70s. At the least, it was comparable. The 1970s are remembered as being the Golden Age because of Ali and because of the great, exciting fights we saw.

Tyson was a great fighter, an all-time great. Same goes for Louis, Ali, Foreman, Holyfield, Marciano, Lewis, etc...

Dont shortchange a great fighter because you dont like him.

Gemini531
10-05-2005, 12:39 PM
Someone who stood up to him and had a decent jab WOULD dominate Tyson, if they had an ounce of talent themselves. I'm not talking about bums like Busster Douglas, who beat him anyway (I know it wasnt the best Tyson). I'm talking about someone like Joe Louis, Sonny Liston, George foreman, Muhammad Ali, Lennox Lewis... any of those guys would beat a prime Mike tyson, except MAYBE Lewis. Then you've got your Dempseys and your Marcianos, who would pressure Tyson so bad that he would quit.
foreman a jab in his prime .....yeah right.


Warhawk excellent posts Ifeel the same way.
Tyson is an alltime great and to think that he slunkoff for 2 decades and still can get 50000 people to chant Tyson,Tyson,Tyson I'll always be a tyson fan simply because he was the bestfighter for 2 decades and still is going.

Dempsey 1919
11-01-2005, 06:01 PM
Wrong, wrong, wrong.

That is all I ever hear from people who dont like Mike Tyson. "If someone who could jab stood up to him..." Blah, blah, blah.

The point is several big, strong, talented men stood up to him. Off the top of my head... Tyrell Biggs (loads of talent, footwork as good as Ali, bigger, not as much heart)
ok, now nobody, including "tyrell biggs" had footwork as good as ali.

Dempsey 1919
11-01-2005, 06:04 PM
foreman a jab in his prime .....yeah right.


Warhawk excellent posts Ifeel the same way.
Tyson is an alltime great and to think that he slunkoff for 2 decades and still can get 50000 people to chant Tyson,Tyson,Tyson I'll always be a tyson fan simply because he was the bestfighter for 2 decades and still is going.
only people blinded by their devotion to tyson chants his name. that doesn't mean he's a great fighter.

Mike Tyson Jr.
11-01-2005, 06:05 PM
ok, now nobody, including "tyrell biggs" had footwork as good as ali.



mike tyson had better footwork than ali

leff
11-01-2005, 06:18 PM
mike tyson had better footwork than ali

let me gues he allso was faster than ali

had a better chin than ali

and had better stamina and heart than marciaon

and was a beter technical fighter than joe louis

and had better power than foreman

whatdahieu
11-01-2005, 09:28 PM
to tell the truth in prime wise i really don't feel ali had the best footwork. i believe it to be either prime frazier or duran. look at their fights with movers, especially fraziers first with ali notice how he steps to the side and in instead of following him around, or duran with ken buchanan.

Dempsey 1919
11-02-2005, 01:03 PM
mike tyson had better footwork than ali
his feet were not as fast though.