View Full Version : Skinny Boxer ... What do I need


questionare
09-11-2010, 10:38 AM
Hello folks,

I am new to this form, and I have an issue with my weight:
I am 6' 4.8" tall, and 169.75 lbs, and have been training for around 8 months 6 days a week (avg 1.5 hours) (Boxing, Fitness, and jogging).

The issue is i don't have the desire or apetit to eat... although after workouts :?!:

I am planning to force my self to eat more, and to gain some muscles through the below program:

Diet:
-----
Having 6 meals per day (Protein & Carbs), two of them will be weight gainer shake "ON Pro Complex Gainer"

Workout:
---------
2 days weight lifting; (1 Day:Legs, Back, Biceps, Grip Strength, 1 Day: Chest, Shoulder, Triceps)
4 days boxing, fitness, and strength workouts
1 day jogging

My question is what do you think about the weight gainer, and about the weight lifting workouts.... Shall I take other supplements; such as amino acids? Any advices on my diet or workout program?

Thanks in advance,

Othello
09-11-2010, 11:54 AM
If I were you I would do a full body routine twice a week, with at least 2 days rest between each work-out. Only do compound exercises (squats, deadlifts, rows, presses) with FREE WEIGHTS and make sure you consume more calories than you burn if you want to gain weight. I think you're on the right track diet-wise. You don't need supplements. Instant amino acids for example are expensive as hell. If you don't gain weight after 3 weeks, add 300 - 500 calories a day, if you're getting fat too quickly (which I doubt), decrease your caloric intake by about the same. It can be a pain in the ass to find the right balance between nutrition, exercise and rest, and the calorie calculators you see on the Internet are usually way off. But you're not a pro bodybuilder or anything, so it doesn't have to be perfect.

josh-hill
09-11-2010, 11:56 AM
i think multivits are a must if you arent taking them. and joint supps such as glucosamine might be a good idea. but basicaly weight gainers are just full of calories so personaly i think they are a waste of money. just eat more. i have the opposite problem. im always hungry so i cant realy help with your appitite problem

questionare
09-11-2010, 02:51 PM
If I were you I would do a full body routine twice a week, with at least 2 days rest between each work-out. Only do compound exercises (squats, deadlifts, rows, presses) with FREE WEIGHTS and make sure you consume more calories than you burn if you want to gain weight. I think you're on the right track diet-wise. You don't need supplements. Instant amino acids for example are expensive as hell. If you don't gain weight after 3 weeks, add 300 - 500 calories a day, if you're getting fat too quickly (which I doubt), decrease your caloric intake by about the same. It can be a pain in the ass to find the right balance between nutrition, exercise and rest, and the calorie calculators you see on the Internet are usually way off. But you're not a pro bodybuilder or anything, so it doesn't have to be perfect.

Thanks Othello for the reply... I will take your advice, and will do full body workout... and am plaining to have 4 sets x 7-12 reps to gain muscles, and afterwards it will be 4 sets x 15-20 reps for endurance... Also, I am plaining to have a day for bulgarian bag strength training and make my boxing workout to 3 days....

I will repost my results after one month... and hopefully it will be good results

Thanks again for your advice....

questionare
09-11-2010, 02:55 PM
i think multivits are a must if you arent taking them. and joint supps such as glucosamine might be a good idea. but basicaly weight gainers are just full of calories so personaly i think they are a waste of money. just eat more. i have the opposite problem. im always hungry so i cant realy help with your appitite problem

thanks josh-hill, I am planning to take OPTI-MEN multivits, and regarding joint supps I already use JOINT-Q; since I was having a pain in my knee when I started jumping rope, and thanks god, it has gone....

#1Assassin
09-11-2010, 03:13 PM
dont force yourself to gain weight, thats the dumbest thing a boxer can do by far.

ppl have diffrent genes, some are just naturally thin. adding weight will make u less of a fighter, just learn how to fight tall and use it as an advantage. dont train for the mirror or the scales, train for ability. stamina, speed and strenght in that order. some ppl end up looking like tyson others like chico corrales, but thats your best fighting weight regardless of how u look in the mirror. bulking up will only get u ktfo, u look better skinny with your arm raised than ripped on a stretcher.

SBleeder
09-11-2010, 05:28 PM
I would kill to be 170 lbs., and I'm only 6'2".

TheTruthIs
09-11-2010, 06:46 PM
dont force yourself to gain weight, thats the dumbest thing a boxer can do by far.



not really.

if a boxer is looking to increase strength, often they need to hit the weights, and seeing as we often are doing cardio, we need fat to burn so we don`t find ourselves in a catabolic state and our hard work all for not in strength, only to be losing muscle. Eating lots, storing fats, from a good and smart diet tailored for it, is how one goes about it.

It`s really easy to burn that fat off later, or closer to fight time. Lots of cardio, restricting diet, etc. But important you have fat reserves there in place when training to build strength.

BG_Knocc_Out
09-11-2010, 07:45 PM
not really.

if a boxer is looking to increase strength, often they need to hit the weights, and seeing as we often are doing cardio, we need fat to burn so we don`t find ourselves in a catabolic state and our hard work all for not in strength, only to be losing muscle. Eating lots, storing fats, from a good and smart diet tailored for it, is how one goes about it.

It`s really easy to burn that fat off later, or closer to fight time. Lots of cardio, restricting diet, etc. But important you have fat reserves there in place when training to build strength.

I think what he means is that the majority of boxers box at their natural weight and don't really find success when forcing a higher weight than naturally gaining it.

royjoneschin
09-11-2010, 07:55 PM
i agree with what Othello said.

questionare
09-11-2010, 11:56 PM
dont force yourself to gain weight, thats the dumbest thing a boxer can do by far.

ppl have diffrent genes, some are just naturally thin. adding weight will make u less of a fighter, just learn how to fight tall and use it as an advantage. dont train for the mirror or the scales, train for ability. stamina, speed and strenght in that order. some ppl end up looking like tyson others like chico corrales, but thats your best fighting weight regardless of how u look in the mirror. bulking up will only get u ktfo, u look better skinny with your arm raised than ripped on a stretcher.

Thanks #1Assassin for your feedback. However, I am not really trying to bulkup, however, I am trying to add strength... and to eat more, in order not to loose muscles... since I have lost around 14 lbs during the last month, due to my bad apetit... What I am trying is to hit 185 lbs... and try to stay at that weight... If I find that weight is not helping me... I believe I can easily get back to 170

josh-hill
09-12-2010, 03:37 AM
tbh man sounds like we are trying to do the same thing. ive just started and am trying to bulk up to fix a shoulder instability. if you want to put on muscle maybe a supp like creatine but i dont know much about it. if you just want stregnth you probably wont put on much weight at all. make sure you are getting plently of protein. protein shakes might be a good idea as they usuraly have ~250 cals too. as for a weight lifting program. thats where i am falling down too. just not sure what to do. have you been weight lifting before in those 6 day/week workouts? cus if i where you i would have an extra rest day. even people that just lift weights can usuraly only manage 3 full body workouts a week and thats with unlimited recovery time. if you are training for boxing in between it will be much harder too. good luck

questionare
09-12-2010, 06:31 AM
tbh man sounds like we are trying to do the same thing. ive just started and am trying to bulk up to fix a shoulder instability. if you want to put on muscle maybe a supp like creatine but i dont know much about it. if you just want stregnth you probably wont put on much weight at all. make sure you are getting plently of protein. protein shakes might be a good idea as they usuraly have ~250 cals too. as for a weight lifting program. thats where i am falling down too. just not sure what to do. have you been weight lifting before in those 6 day/week workouts? cus if i where you i would have an extra rest day. even people that just lift weights can usuraly only manage 3 full body workouts a week and thats with unlimited recovery time. if you are training for boxing in between it will be much harder too. good luck

Really what I am trying is to add both muscles and strength, but I don't want to be huge, however, to be fit. I am planning to take protein shakes, since I don't eat that much, so I will take them as one or two meals replacement.

I haven't been lifting weights during my 6 days workouts, since I feel it boring... but I will force myself for 2 days weight lifting... and I get used to do workout for 6 days a week :)

St Lunatic
09-15-2010, 05:34 PM
I have the same problem with gaining weight. SO far I have really good luck with the Pro Complex gainer. I have tried a lot of gainers and that one seems to do the best with lean gaining. the multivitamin advice is something to look into too. I take GNC's and it seems to work for me.

questionare
09-15-2010, 06:59 PM
I have the same problem with gaining weight. SO far I have really good luck with the Pro Complex gainer. I have tried a lot of gainers and that one seems to do the best with lean gaining. the multivitamin advice is something to look into too. I take GNC's and it seems to work for me.

Thanks for the feedback; however, can you please inform me about the deit you were using? also, how much weight you were able to gain... I was thinking to substitute the procomplex gainer with Whey protein, and add Oats, peanut butter, honey to the whey protein, as this will increase the carbs amount... and will be cheaper...

St Lunatic
09-15-2010, 11:15 PM
Thanks for the feedback; however, can you please inform me about the deit you were using? also, how much weight you were able to gain... I was thinking to substitute the procomplex gainer with Whey protein, and add Oats, peanut butter, honey to the whey protein, as this will increase the carbs amount... and will be cheaper...



Alright here it goes.....

To start with this is the workout plan I followed and still follow now:
Day 1 - Chest, Legs, Triceps
Day 2 - Boxing workout
Day 3 - Back, Biceps, and Shoulders
Day 4 - Boxing workout
Day 5 - Off
--- and repeat ---
(I can give you a detail of what I exactly do on those days if your interested)

The Diet
Most important - MULTIVITAMIN
-Like I said GNC makes a good one and so does ON
I started out using Whey, and like you said, added extras. I felt that the whey helped me stay lean and really helped with recovery. After about a year I started taking ON Pro Complex gainer. I liked this option a lot better because it helped bulk up, but it was lean. I have tried many weight gainers and many of them put weight on but it was hard to stay as cut as i wanted to be. Make sure you eat a good breakfast. Try having eggs and maybe oatmeal in the morning.
I have to stop and ask you a question: Are you planning on getting serious with boxing (like having fights), or are you doing it for the workout?
For me I do boxing just for the workout but I spar every once in awhile. I'm sure there is a lot of people saying that lifting weights and all this other stuff about weight training will do you no benefit in boxing. I have had very good luck with mass building while being a good all around boxer. I think it all depends on how serious you want to be. For me I do boxing for fun; I dont plan on making it a career. So I do believe you can have a good mass building plan that will help you with boxing goals as well.

Anyways, I have tried things from Ross Training to just focusing on boxing to heavy lifting, and so far I have created a program that I am able to gain mass with having only a beneficial effect on my boxing workout.

Eat a lot, but eat clean and youll start gaining mass. Sometimes we are so skinny that our testosterone or HGH levels are low. We just have to adjust our workout and eating habits to raise these levels (without pro hormones or boosters of course)

questionare
09-16-2010, 03:29 AM
Alright here it goes.....

To start with this is the workout plan I followed and still follow now:
Day 1 - Chest, Legs, Triceps
Day 2 - Boxing workout
Day 3 - Back, Biceps, and Shoulders
Day 4 - Boxing workout
Day 5 - Off
--- and repeat ---
(I can give you a detail of what I exactly do on those days if your interested)

The Diet
Most important - MULTIVITAMIN
-Like I said GNC makes a good one and so does ON
I started out using Whey, and like you said, added extras. I felt that the whey helped me stay lean and really helped with recovery. After about a year I started taking ON Pro Complex gainer. I liked this option a lot better because it helped bulk up, but it was lean. I have tried many weight gainers and many of them put weight on but it was hard to stay as cut as i wanted to be. Make sure you eat a good breakfast. Try having eggs and maybe oatmeal in the morning.
I have to stop and ask you a question: Are you planning on getting serious with boxing (like having fights), or are you doing it for the workout?
For me I do boxing just for the workout but I spar every once in awhile. I'm sure there is a lot of people saying that lifting weights and all this other stuff about weight training will do you no benefit in boxing. I have had very good luck with mass building while being a good all around boxer. I think it all depends on how serious you want to be. For me I do boxing for fun; I dont plan on making it a career. So I do believe you can have a good mass building plan that will help you with boxing goals as well.

Anyways, I have tried things from Ross Training to just focusing on boxing to heavy lifting, and so far I have created a program that I am able to gain mass with having only a beneficial effect on my boxing workout.

Eat a lot, but eat clean and youll start gaining mass. Sometimes we are so skinny that our testosterone or HGH levels are low. We just have to adjust our workout and eating habits to raise these levels (without pro hormones or boosters of course)

Thank you very much for the detailed feedback...
Really am like you, not interested in making career through boxing, however, I like the workouts which give me strength and fitness... So I believe weight lifting won't harm me alot... but also, I don't want to be a big guy...

So you advice me to take Pro Complex Gainer, instead of having the whey and adding extras to it?

Also, I am planning to have ON Opti-Men MultiVit, what do you think?

I will be thankful if you can give me the details of your weight lifting workouts, I was planning to follow the workouts specified in the below article:

hxxp://zzz.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/intermediate-boxing-mma-workout.html
[Replace xx with tt, zzz with www]

Thanks again for your contribution...

Righthandbanger
09-16-2010, 06:01 AM
Thanks Othello for the reply... I will take your advice, and will do full body workout... and am plaining to have 4 sets x 7-12 reps to gain muscles, and afterwards it will be 4 sets x 15-20 reps for endurance... Also, I am plaining to have a day for bulgarian bag strength training and make my boxing workout to 3 days....

I will repost my results after one month... and hopefully it will be good results

Thanks again for your advice....

I think this is wrong.

1) 5x5 is a better workout program for building strength, and as a result for building muscle that actually does something

2) you shouldn't sacrifice skill training and conditioning for strength training. Although strength is important, it is the least important of these three things so 2 5x5 full body workouts a week should be enough.. make it fit instead of replacing things

Spartacus Sully
09-16-2010, 06:49 AM
id go with low weights high reps like hundreds to thousands. just a ncie 2 lb iron weight that you can use for shadow boxing along with other leg core chest arm neck and bck exercises.

the goal of course to get blood in the muscle and keep it there for long periods of time brining the muscle back to life creating new veins forcing your heart and lungs to evolve and adapt to the increase in needed blood as well as increasing the conductivity of the muscle thus more efficeinly using the energy from the nerves as steam in a locomotive and in turn empowering you with great nervous force and not just muscular force.

heavy weights strain your muscles poping blood veins and damaging the muscle and it fibers ......setting the structure of the entre muscle as an organ down a path of destruction.

while the low weights increase the blood flow and bring life back to the muslce while over the period of a few weeks adding inches to the muscle of not just muscle but blood and veins and nerves and increasing the oxygen out put of your lungs and intake of oxygen to the muscle.

of course if you want to be a **** boxer who spends all his time straining his muscles with weights and can never go 100% shadow boxing or hitting the bag in fear of injuring an allready damaged muscle go right ahead.

St Lunatic
09-16-2010, 11:10 AM
Thank you very much for the detailed feedback...
Really am like you, not interested in making career through boxing, however, I like the workouts which give me strength and fitness... So I believe weight lifting won't harm me alot... but also, I don't want to be a big guy...

So you advice me to take Pro Complex Gainer, instead of having the whey and adding extras to it?

Also, I am planning to have ON Opti-Men MultiVit, what do you think?

I will be thankful if you can give me the details of your weight lifting workouts, I was planning to follow the workouts specified in the below article:

hxxp://zzz.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/intermediate-boxing-mma-workout.html
[Replace xx with tt, zzz with www]

Thanks again for your contribution...


No problem man, I'm here to help.

Yes, I would try taking the Pro Complex Gainer instead of the whey. Especially if youre like me, your body will just eat through the whey and you will have very slow results. I am really sensitive to acne too, and Pro Complex gainer didnt give me any acne either. - Just thought I throw that FYI in.

I personally have never tried the ON multivitamin. If you try that one, for sure let me know how it goes, I was thinking of getting it myself.

Heres is a sample of my workout:
Day 1 - Flat Bench press
Cable Skull Crushers
Dips
Incline Dumbell Flyes
Leg Press
Leg Extension

Day 2 - Shadow Boxing
Pullups
Pushups
Heavy Bag
Double End bag
Speed Bag
Abs

Day 3 - Preacher Curls
Romanian Deadlift
Shoulder Press
Side Raises
Reverse Grip Curls
Cable Row
Hammer Curls

Day 4 - Same as Day 2

Day 5 - OFF


If you need anything else feel free to email me: jrvillafuerte@live.com

Righthandbanger
09-16-2010, 11:26 AM
id go with low weights high reps like hundreds to thousands. just a ncie 2 lb iron weight that you can use for shadow boxing along with other leg core chest arm neck and bck exercises.

the goal of course to get blood in the muscle and keep it there for long periods of time brining the muscle back to life creating new veins forcing your heart and lungs to evolve and adapt to the increase in needed blood as well as increasing the conductivity of the muscle thus more efficeinly using the energy from the nerves as steam in a locomotive and in turn empowering you with great nervous force and not just muscular force.

heavy weights strain your muscles poping blood veins and damaging the muscle and it fibers ......setting the structure of the entre muscle as an organ down a path of destruction.

while the low weights increase the blood flow and bring life back to the muslce while over the period of a few weeks adding inches to the muscle of not just muscle but blood and veins and nerves and increasing the oxygen out put of your lungs and intake of oxygen to the muscle.

of course if you want to be a **** boxer who spends all his time straining his muscles with weights and can never go 100% shadow boxing or hitting the bag in fear of injuring an allready damaged muscle go right ahead.

This is such a fallacy.

Everything I have seen you type on the subject of weights is just ludicrous.. please stop posting.

bobfoster
09-16-2010, 11:54 AM
you could always smoke pot :D

Spartacus Sully
09-16-2010, 12:37 PM
This is such a fallacy.

Everything I have seen you type on the subject of weights is just ludicrous.. please stop posting.

For muscle-hardening exercise, there is nothing better than the dumb-bell only it must be a very small dumb-bell not a very large one, as of old. The best size is an iron, two-pound dumb-bell. This is the size with which the strongest men exercise nowadays.

It is admitted, at last, that the object of exercise is not to strain but to strengthen. Heavy dumb-bells strain ; light ones strengthen.

" The effects of exercise," says an English medical authority on training, " are twofold : on the one hand a stimulus is given to the action of the heart and lungs, which enables the blood to be more thoroughly oxygenated and more rapidly circulated ; on the other hand, there is an expenditure of force accompanying the increased activity of the organic changes. Exercise strengthens the parts exercised, because it increases the nutrition of those parts. When any organ or muscle is inactive, the circulation in it becomes less and less; the smaller net-work of its blood-vessels are empty or but half filled; the streams gradually run in fewer channels, and the organ, ceasing to be thoroughly nourished, wastes away. When the organ is active all its vessels are filled; all the vital changes, on which depend its growth and power, proceed rapidly. The force expended is renewed, unless the expenditure has been excessive, in which case there is a disturbance of the mechanism, and depression, or disease, results.

The advantage of exercise to a student, politician, or any other brain-worker, is that it lessens the over-stimulus of his brain, distributes the blood more equally, calling to his muscles some of those streams which would impetuously be rushing through his brain."

In other words, exercise with the anus, legs, or trunk, relieves the congested brain as surely, and, of course, far more healthfully than bleeding.

To return to the need and superiority of the light over the heavy dumb-bell : exercise with the latter is necessarily brief. The single heavy dumb-bell can be lifted from four to twenty times, say, according to its weight. The whole body is violently strained for the brief effort. Quite often, if the lifting be not carefully graduated in weight, the in-rushing blood bursts some of the finer net-work of the vessels, or the delicate covering of the muscles is rudely torn, and the would-be athlete is an invalid for life.

The one-pound or two-pound dumb-bell strains nothing : it only adds to the swing of the hands. The exercise can be varied so as to develop upper and lower limbs and trunk. It is particularly adapted to those who are not trained athletes. Say, the arms are thin and weak and soft, and you want to increase their size, strength, and firmness. There are only a few regular motions for this, and they can be learned in a minute. The hands, grasping the dumbbells, are hanging by the sides: begin by raising them, lending the elbow and touching the front of the shoulder with the ball of the thumb ; down again, and up again : that is all. You repeat this motion twenty times, thirty, on to fifty or sixty before you are tired.

Then stop, always stop any exercise when it tires you : this is nature's advice.

But begin in a minute or so, and go over it again. You will probably this time reach seventy. Then change the motion : extend the arms like a cross, on a level with the shoulders, and double in from the elbow, alternately, just touching the tips of the shoulders with the hands. Keep this up till you are tired, and then go back to the first motion.

In a week you will be able to raise the hands in the first motion hundreds of times, in a few weeks a thousand times.

This means what ? It means that you keep the muscles of the arms working actively for from a quarter of an hour to an hour; that the lately dried-up blood-vessels are now full of warm blood, feeding the hot muscles as a trench full of water feeds a famished field. It means also that the girth of the arm is one, two, or more inches larger than it was a few weeks ago ; that the flesh is firm and solid; and that arm, shoulder, and hand are so strong that there is a new pleasure even in swinging an umbrella or shaking hands With an old friend. '

http://books.google.com/books?id=l1ECAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA136&dq=the+ethics+of+boxing+book&output=text#c_top

Righthandbanger
09-16-2010, 12:55 PM
LOL, here is the biography of the author
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Boyle_O'Reilly

he was not a personal trainer or qualified to make these assertions.

Try reading 'Science and Practice of Strength Training'
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Practice-Strength-Training-Vladimir-Zatsiorsky/dp/0736056289

or Practical Programming
http://www.amazon.com/Practical-Programming-Strength-Training-Rippetoe/dp/0976805413

and again.. please stop posting

dannnnn
09-16-2010, 01:15 PM
That book was published in 1888... times have changed.

Things like strength training, nutrition and boxing in general have all moved on and vastly improved since those days.

Like Righthandbanger said, for the benefit of this forum, please stop posting.

Spartacus Sully
09-16-2010, 02:10 PM
Try reading 'Science and Practice of Strength Training'
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Practice-Strength-Training-Vladimir-Zatsiorsky/dp/0736056289

or Practical Programming
http://www.amazon.com/Practical-Programming-Strength-Training-Rippetoe/dp/0976805413

and again.. please stop posting

and these people dont seem to be the kind of people to make boxing related assertions nor do they even try to id imagine while i mention a book that more then likely helped teach some of the greats of the earlier 1900-1920's like jim jeffries jack dempsey joe gans bob fitzsimmons as well as full of tactics that the greats of the 1890's were already using, a book that perhaps even sugar ray robinson might have picked up as a kid, a book that id bet money on bruce lee having owned, a book about boxing, i mean we are talking about boxing right? not how to get strong fast.

as the book says the best thing you can do for boxing is boxing the second best thing you can do for boxing is running.

if you sacrifice enough of your time to those two things you can go anywhere.

Righthandbanger
09-16-2010, 06:25 PM
You site an unreliable source and then provide 'facts' when most contemporary sources disagree with you.

You don't know what you are preaching. Bow out. Do yourself a favour.

Spartacus Sully
09-16-2010, 10:35 PM
You site an unreliable source and then provide 'facts' when most contemporary sources disagree with you.

You don't know what you are preaching. Bow out. Do yourself a favour.

so you plan to provide modern time boxing sources that disagree with me or just more personal training books from people who have never throw a punch at a heavy bag in their life?

really you dont know what your preaching and seem to be just parroting some person fitness trainer you know or have read about but that dosnt give me the right to be an ass hole twords you and tell you to stop posting while not providing one single credible boxing related argument (as you have done).

do you even box? cause if you do i bet your incredibly crappy at it.

Righthandbanger
09-17-2010, 06:34 AM
http://www.Rossboxing.com <agrees with weights. This is the most readily available contemporary source.

You can't discredit my sources because they aren't boxing based. Strength is strength and boxers are notoriously clueless about strength training.

And yes I do box. I also do judo, MMA and Muay Thai

Spartacus Sully
09-17-2010, 06:46 AM
http://www.Rossboxing.com <agrees with weights. This is the most readily available contemporary source.

You can't discredit my sources because they aren't boxing based. Strength is strength and boxers are notoriously clueless about strength training.

And yes I do box. I also do judo, MMA and Muay Thai

ross emant? so whats his pro record how many title defenses does he have? has he even boxed amature?

box judo mma and muay thai

ohhh so you do mma, you really shouldnt be giving any adive to some one that wants to box as you dont just box and you have no idea how something soely effects your boxing but instead only how it effects your mma and what is good for mma is often times very bad for boxing.

why dont you throw up a few rounds on the bag and ill throw up a few rounds and we can let the forum decied who hits harder and knows more about training for boxing strength, as well as speed endurance and skill?

say like 2 rounds with 16's on then maybe a round shadow with 16's then another round shadow with no gloves? all done straight through with the 1 min breaks between each round recorded.

TheTruthIs
09-17-2010, 08:16 AM
you're not helping your case by trying to discredit Ross Emanait. It's well known he is one of the foremost authorities on building fight strength and conditioning for boxing.

and lol @ the bagwork challenge.

Spartacus Sully
09-17-2010, 08:27 AM
you're not helping your case by trying to discredit Ross Emanait. It's well known he is one of the foremost authorities on building fight strength and conditioning for boxing.

and lol @ the bagwork challenge.

so whats his boxing record? he got any bag vids up or sparring?

can any one even cite where he recommends doing 5*5 sets for boxing conditioning?

Spartacus Sully
09-17-2010, 08:55 AM
http://www.Rossboxing.com
Strength is strength and boxers are notoriously clueless about strength training.


Many critics of strength training for fighters do not understand the numerous strength qualities that exist. Strength is commonly described as the ability to exert a force against a resistance. This simple definition is not enough however. We must instead examine more specific strength qualities.

Maximal Strength - Maximal strength is defined as the amount of force that one can exert under voluntary effort. Max-strength is developed by lifting heavy loads, or through bodyweight methods such as isometrics and the use of strenuous rep-for-rep movements.

Explosive Strength - Explosive strength is defined as the ability to express significant tension in minimal time.

Vladimir Zatsiorsky, highly regarded sport biomechanist and former strength and conditioning consultant for the Soviet Union Olympic teams, has stated specifically that:

"The ability to produce maximal forces in minimal time is called explosive strength. Strong people do not necessarily possess explosive strength." (1)

Clearly, the development of one strength quality (ex. max-strength) does not guarantee the development of another (ex. explosive strength). This information may come as a surprise to many athletes who focus all of their strength work to one specific strength quality (ex. the athlete who only lifts heavy loads to development maximal strength).

Explosive strength is a critical strength quality for all competitive athletes.

Speed Strength - Speed strength is defined as the ability to quickly execute an unloaded movement or a movement against a relatively small external resistance. For example, working with a punch-out drill against the heavy bag would equate to the execution of a relatively small external resistance, as the weight of the glove is insignificant.

For more information regarding punch-out drills, please refer to the link below:

Intensifying The Heavy Bag

Speed strength is also very important for fighters. Unfortunately, many athletes train improperly, hence sacrifice this strength quality. For example, world-renowned sport scientist Yuri Verkhoshansky and colleagues established that:

"Excessive maximum strength training can impair speed-strength and technical skill in boxers." (2)

Strength Endurance - Strength endurance is defined as the ability to effectively maintain muscular functioning under work conditions of long duration. Strength endurance is a vital strength quality for any combat athlete. Power and speed are useless without the stamina necessary to apply these physical attributes throughout the contest.

And contrary to the opinion of many, free weights can be effectively used to enhance a fighter's endurance. For example, this routine offers a high-speed conditioning challenge, ideal for any combat athlete.

As stated earlier (but worth repeating), the development of one strength quality does not ensure the development of another. Distinct strength properties are often unrelated. One can possess tremendous strength in one form (ex. max-strength), while lacking in other areas (ex. speed-strength).

The lesson to be learned is very simple. Don't put all of your eggs into one basket. A complete athlete must follow a complete plan. Each strength quality must be considered in the creation of the program.

http://www.rosstraining.com/articles/strengthtraining.html

Many critics of strength training for fighters do not understand the numerous strength qualities that exist

apparently its not just the critics that don't understand the numerous strength qualities that exist either.

sandysandara
09-17-2010, 12:06 PM
ppl have diffrent genes, some are just naturally thin. adding weight will make u less of a fighter, just learn how to fight tall and use it as an advantage. dont train for the mirror or the scales, train for ability. stamina, speed and strenght in that order. some ppl end up looking like tyson others like chico corrales, but thats your best fighting weight regardless of how u look in the mirror. bulking up will only get u ktfo, u look better skinny with your arm raised than ripped on a stretcher.

sandysandara
09-17-2010, 12:28 PM
heavy weights strain your muscles poping blood veins and damaging the muscle and it fibers ......setting the structure of the entre muscle as an organ down a path of destruction.

Righthandbanger
09-18-2010, 03:26 AM
ross emant? so whats his pro record how many title defenses does he have? has he even boxed amature?

box judo mma and muay thai

ohhh so you do mma, you really shouldnt be giving any adive to some one that wants to box as you dont just box and you have no idea how something soely effects your boxing but instead only how it effects your mma and what is good for mma is often times very bad for boxing.

why dont you throw up a few rounds on the bag and ill throw up a few rounds and we can let the forum decied who hits harder and knows more about training for boxing strength, as well as speed endurance and skill?

say like 2 rounds with 16's on then maybe a round shadow with 16's then another round shadow with no gloves? all done straight through with the 1 min breaks between each round recorded.

LOL. Actually my focus at the moment is boxing, MMA is a hobby of mine at this moment in time.

..oh and LOL at the challenge. That helps your point in the same way as chlamydia helps you pee

Spartacus Sully
09-18-2010, 03:45 AM
LOL. Actually my focus at the moment is boxing, MMA is a hobby of mine at this moment in time.

..oh and LOL at the challenge. That helps your point in the same way as chlamydia helps you pee

so then when can i expect the video?

how about this friday?

this is me a year ago. i mean i cant have improved that much in a year that you cant make a video better then me on the bag.

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3bEitDoqJuY?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3bEitDoqJuY?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

hell 9 of those months i was teaching my self and ive only started to go to a boxing gym since late july.

just let me know when you got the 2 rounds on the bag (with 16's) 1 round shadow (with 16's) and 1 round shadow (no gloves) and what the hell lets throw in another round on the bag with 16's to not only accentuate the levels of stamina but also to display the power remaining after 4 hard rounds. (with the 1 min breaks recorded of course)

so yeah just let me know when you got that up on you tube, and ill throw mine up and either you or me can make a thread with a poll and the vids.

Ive allready got a few i can put up

TheTruthIs
09-18-2010, 06:56 AM
http://msp20.photobucket.com/albums/b212/MUNIT2K5/Funny%20Pictures/AlTim1.jpg

Spartacus Sully
09-18-2010, 07:32 AM
http://msp20.photobucket.com/albums/b212/MUNIT2K5/Funny%20Pictures/AlTim1.jpg

Yeah i dont think the guy has to balls to put up a video either.

even more so i dont think he has the stamina to last 5 rounds.

Righthandbanger
09-18-2010, 07:39 AM
Im really not going to put a video up.. What you are doing is starting a 'challenge' because you have run out of evidence to support your argument.

drop the strawman and admit you're wrong

Spartacus Sully
09-18-2010, 07:45 AM
Im really not going to put a video up.. What you are doing is starting a 'challenge' because you have run out of evidence to support your argument.

drop the strawman and admit you're wrong

Ive already made my point and won.

as no one has cited any where that ross suggests 5*5 sets.

and as ross himself states that strength is not strength and there are many kinds of strength.

and as ross him self states that heavy loads only activate fast twitch muscles, but nowhere does he state why fast twitch muscles are better then others.

I simply want to see how good you are at boxing and if im better, as well as display to the entire internet world the difference between a boxer who only boxes and a boxer who spends most his time lifting weights and recovering.

Righthandbanger
09-18-2010, 08:15 AM
Ive already made my point and won.

as no one has cited any where that ross suggests 5*5 sets.

and as ross himself states that strength is not strength and there are many kinds of strength.

and as ross him self states that heavy loads only activate fast twitch muscles, but nowhere does he state why fast twitch muscles are better then others.

I simply want to see how good you are at boxing and if im better, as well as display to the entire internet world the difference between a boxer who only boxes and a boxer who spends most his time lifting weights and recovering.

Ross uses a compromise between strength and athleticism. He is not purely talking about strength training, although he does stress the use of weights for fighters, which is why I brought him up.

The fact you show is that you know nothing of strength training. This is my point, and your pedantic arguments and false advice show that in fact I have won.

What you are doing now is issuing a challenge of videos.. which btw has no bearing on how good you are at boxing. Bag no hit back.

Spartacus Sully
09-18-2010, 08:22 AM
Ross uses a compromise between strength and athleticism. He is not purely talking about strength training, although he does stress the use of weights for fighters, which is why I brought him up.

The fact you show is that you know nothing of strength training. This is my point, and your pedantic arguments and false advice show that in fact I have won.

What you are doing now is issuing a challenge of videos.. which btw has no bearing on how good you are at boxing. Bag no hit back.

spineless coward.

and an idiot at that...its brick no hit back and breaking a brick only consists of 1 motion, hitting a bag consists of foot work slipping head movement guard and proper punch technique, and top of that to do it for 5 rounds involves stamina as well.

to claim how some one looks hitting a bag has no claim on how they are going to look in a ring is the most stupid thing ive ever read on this site.

Righthandbanger
09-18-2010, 08:52 AM
LOL actually common sense is what tells me not to put videos up. If someone from my gym saw it I would never hear the end of it.. but its ok you can refer to me as a coward all you like. It honestly doesn't hurt me what a random old man on the internet types.

Obviously as I'm not putting a vid up I'll refrain from commenting on yours, but I have no doubt others on here have and will give you feedback on what you were doing wrong there.

Spartacus Sully
09-18-2010, 08:55 AM
LOL actually common sense is what tells me not to put videos up. If someone from my gym saw it I would never hear the end of it.. but its ok you can refer to me as a coward all you like. It honestly doesn't hurt me what a random old man on the internet types.

Obviously as I'm not putting a vid up I'll refrain from commenting on yours, but I have no doubt others on here have and will give you feedback on what you were doing wrong there.

Im sorry but you have no right to talk to me untill youve put up a video.

and your more then welcome to critique it, just dont expect a reply.

dannnnn
09-18-2010, 11:59 AM
Oh my God... you've posted that bag vid up before under a different name, I remember it because I can't forget how f.ucking awful it is. Seriously.

A quote by Vitali Klitschko just about sums you up: "In chess, nobody is an expert, but everybody plays. In boxing, everybody is an expert, but nobody fights."

You claim to have this vast knowledge of everything related to boxing, but you don't actually have a clue what to do when it comes time to put it into practice.

You're a joke.

Spartacus Sully
09-18-2010, 12:03 PM
Oh my God... you've posted that bag vid up before under a different name, I remember it because I can't forget how f.ucking awful it is. Seriously.

A quote by Vitali Klitschko just about sums you up: "In chess, nobody is an expert, but everybody plays. In boxing, everybody is an expert, but nobody fights."

You claim to have this vast knowledge of everything related to boxing, but you don't actually have a clue what to do when it comes time to put it into practice.

You're a joke.

same name, well same account ive changed the name a few times.

if you want to critique a year old bag video go ahead.

no but really please do critique it and tell me what is so f**king awful about it.

if want to throw one up ill throw up a more recent one and we can make a poll.

2 rounds on the bag 1 shadow 1 shadow no gloves 1 round on the bag.

St Lunatic
09-18-2010, 12:28 PM
same name, well same account ive changed the name a few times.

if you want to critique a year old bag video go ahead.

no but really please do critique it and tell me what is so f**king awful about it.

if want to throw one up ill throw up a more recent one and we can make a poll.

2 rounds on the bag 1 shadow 1 shadow no gloves 1 round on the bag.



Just because you can hit a bag or shadow box doesn't mean you can fight either. This thread has gotten out of control with this immature forum fighting. If you guys want to talk **** to each other, make a date to meet in person and then decide who the best is. Otherwise shut the hell up and go forum fight somewhere else.

Spartacus Sully
09-18-2010, 12:44 PM
Just because you can hit a bag or shadow box doesn't mean you can fight either. This thread has gotten out of control with this immature forum fighting. If you guys want to talk **** to each other, make a date to meet in person and then decide who the best is. Otherwise shut the hell up and go forum fight somewhere else.

threatening to meet some one and fight in real life is illegal.

for all i know these guys are little 12 year old kids 5'4" feather weights, while im at 6'4 195. what the hell is beating them up going to prove?

if you can hit a bag and shadow box it clearly shows nothing about reaction time and your chin....but those arnt things that lifting 5*5 sets of weights are going to improve either.

what shadow boxing and hitting the bag does prove is speed with technique, power, and stamina...all things that you could acquire with proper strength training.

assuming he does proper strength training compared to my strength training its obvious hes going to have better speed, power and stamina...which is what the series of bag work and shadow boxing would show.

now if you guys are adults at 190+ and want to meet up in PA just shoot me a pm when your around philly im about 30 miles north from there we can spar a few rounds and post it up on here and have people vote.

Id even meet one of you guys if your around the philly area.