What are your opinions of players in the NFL holding out for more money? I'll throw in my 2 cents later.

They are *****es for holding out. Where in wisconsin you from?

Oshkosh, yey.

My thoughts exactly, especially here in Wisconsin.

Green Bay has always been kind to its players and usually changed contracts. Had Walker most likely gone to the top dogs and been like, "Yo, I put up huge numbers last year and was your best offensive weapon. I deserve more money." The Packer's Orginization would've said either yeah, of if you have another great year we'll rewrite your contract.

It's ridicolous, as if they don't get paid enough. That pisses me off, anyone who does that doesn't love the game, and are embarassing.

Tell me about it. I'm a Pats fan and we are wondering if Seymour is going to report to camp or not. He still has 2 years left on his deal and should he hit his incentives, which is likely, the escalator clauses will bump his salary up to 8.4 mill or so. Does that sound like a guy who is underpaid?

Im pissed off about the Chargers 1st round pick, Shawn Merriman. He and his agent are being *****es about even preacticing before he has a contract. He wouldnt even show up to a mini camp, which as I understand is unprecedented. I think a lot of this **** is the fault of the agent, but if the player wasnt such a meat head moron, he wouldnt be so easy to influance.

What are your opinions of players in the NFL holding out for more money? I'll throw in my 2 cents later.

I think it sucks but I place a lot of the blame on these greedy f-ing agents.

Let me ask you fellas something.

When a player underachieves or gets hurt and the team cuts or waives the player and they don't honor the contract is that fair? I don't hear anyone blasting these rich ass owners that constantly raise the tickets prices every year even when they put a terrible product on the field. Look at the AZ Cardinals. They raised ticket prices this year and one of there home games is in Mexico City! There's something wrong with this picture!

I hope your answer is no, to the afore mentiopned question. If so:

Why isn't it alright for a player to want an improved contract when he overachieves? If you were the best at you what you do, would you ask for more money or wait unitl your annual review. These guys are gonna sit out and not get paid. To me that shows balls. Believe me I think these guys are way overpaid too, but from a complete business perspective you have to see that they are only doing what's best for them. Trying to get as much money as the possibly can while they can.

Let me ask you fellas something.

When a player underachieves or gets hurt and the team cuts or waives the player and they don't honor the contract is that fair? I don't hear anyone blasting these rich ass owners that constantly raise the tickets prices every year even when they put a terrible product on the field. Look at the AZ Cardinals. They raised ticket prices this year and one of there home games is in Mexico City! There's something wrong with this picture!

I hope your answer is no, to the afore mentiopned question. If so:

Why isn't it alright for a player to want an improved contract when he overachieves? If you were the best at you what you do, would you ask for more money or wait unitl your annual review. These guys are gonna sit out and not get paid. To me that shows balls. Believe me I think these guys are way overpaid too, but from a complete business perspective you have to see that they are only doing what's best for them. Trying to get as much money as the possibly can while they can.


When a player gets hurt, then gets cut, I dont think that is considered not honoring the contract. If it was in the contract that they could not be released if injured, then the team couldnt do that. So it is not a violation of the contract if a guy gets released because he cannot play. He signes the contract to get a certain amount of money while he is able to play. Thats why I think people like T.O who is doing what he is doing right now are not people of their word when they are still fit to play and they want to redo their contract. Especially him who just got a contract last year.

T.O is the biggest joke of all, since despite what he says, he intended to hold out the moment he signed the contract last year. The NFL even told him not to sign the deal, and he did it anyways. Why would he do that unless he knew he'd hold out or ask for more money? ***** move by a ***** man.

Some of you guys clearly do not understand the economics of the NFL

The NFL does not have guaranteed contracts they way the NBA and MLB does. That is part of what makes them the best pro league in all of sports. Players have to actually preform on the field if they want the big money. Wow, what a concept. :D

Due to salary caps, most contracts are structured in a way that the bulk of the money is paid toward the end of the contract. If the player isn't performing the team can cut him and not pay the remainder of the contract. Players understand this and that is why there is this little thing called a signing bonus. Players can get over 10 million dollars in some cases just for signing on the dotted line without ever playing a down. That up front money that they keep even if they are a total bust offsets the back-end loaded contract and the possibility of being cut if they don't pan out.

What he said.

When a player gets hurt, then gets cut, I dont think that is considered not honoring the contract. If it was in the contract that they could not be released if injured, then the team couldnt do that. So it is not a violation of the contract if a guy gets released because he cannot play. He signes the contract to get a certain amount of money while he is able to play. Thats why I think people like T.O who is doing what he is doing right now are not people of their word when they are still fit to play and they want to redo their contract. Especially him who just got a contract last year.


So answer my other question.....let's say TO only caught 30 balls last year for 2 TD's, is it alright for the team to waive him and not pay him the money negotiated on the contract?

So answer my other question.....let's say TO only caught 30 balls last year for 2 TD's, is it alright for the team to waive him and not pay him the money negotiated on the contract?


YES! If Terrell only caught 30 balls last year for 2 TD's he still would have made $9,160,700 dollars last year. 2nd most of all receivers last year. Was he the second best receiver in the NFL last year? Don't think too hard, the answer is NO. But you see, now he wants to be THE top paid receiver in the NFL and if he doesn't get what he wants he'll be a clubhouse cancer all season. T.O is a *****, plain and simple. I hope the Eagles tell him and that ******* Drew Rosenhaus(sp) to go **** themselves.

Im pissed off about the Chargers 1st round pick, Shawn Merriman. He and his agent are being *****es about even preacticing before he has a contract. He wouldnt even show up to a mini camp, which as I understand is unprecedented. I think a lot of this **** is the fault of the agent, but if the player wasnt such a meat head moron, he wouldnt be so easy to influance.

The problem with Merriman is if reports to camp and gets a serious injury he isn't under contract to the Chargers and therefore he won't get ****.

The problem with Merriman is if reports to camp and gets a serious injury he isn't under contract to the Chargers and therefore he won't get ****.

Training camp, not exactly a death march. If he's that worried about getting injured I'd say something is fishy.

YES! If Terrell only caught 30 balls last year for 2 TD's he still would have made $9,160,700 dollars last year. 2nd most of all receivers last year. Was he the second best receiver in the NFL last year? Don't think too hard, the answer is NO. But you see, now he wants to be THE top paid receiver in the NFL and if he doesn't get what he wants he'll be a clubhouse cancer all season. T.O is a *****, plain and simple. I hope the Eagles tell him and that ******* Drew Rosenhaus(sp) to go **** themselves.

No, he was the best, actually, statistically speaking (not the whole season since he missed three games, however, when he went out he was #1). If it weren't for him they would have gone 13-0 to begin with. He was such a threat on the field. If it weren't for him the Super Bowl would have been a total blowout, instead of the close first half, and one-sided second that it was.

That's the same guy Javon signed with, along with almost all the guys asking for more money. They're all under the same agent. It's not really a surprise that they're all holding out now, is it?

That's a stretch actually. Rosenhaus (sp?) has some big names holding out that are getting a lot of press, but there are more throughout the league holding out who he doesn't represent. But I do hate him.

Some of you guys clearly do not understand the economics of the NFL

The NFL does not have guaranteed contracts they way the NBA and MLB does. That is part of what makes them the best pro league in all of sports. Players have to actually preform on the field if they want the big money. Wow, what a concept. :D

Due to salary caps, most contracts are structured in a way that the bulk of the money is paid toward the end of the contract. If the player isn't performing the team can cut him and not pay the remainder of the contract. Players understand this and that is why there is this little thing called a signing bonus. Players can get over 10 million dollars in some cases just for signing on the dotted line without ever playing a down. That up front money that they keep even if they are a total bust offsets the back-end loaded contract and the possibility of being cut if they don't pan out.


...Yep, the only thing guaranteed in the NFL is that up front signing bonus. And in some cases(see Ricky Williams) not even that is guaranteed.

No, he was the best, actually, statistically speaking (not the whole season since he missed three games, however, when he went out he was #1). If it weren't for him they would have gone 13-0 to begin with. He was such a threat on the field. If it weren't for him the Super Bowl would have been a total blowout, instead of the close first half, and one-sided second that it was.

That's the same guy Javon signed with, along with almost all the guys asking for more money. They're all under the same agent. It's not really a surprise that they're all holding out now, is it?

Marvin Harrison, Randy Moss, Muhsin Muhammad, Javon Walker Are all better than TO.

Marvin Harrison, Randy Moss, Muhsin Muhammad, Javon Walker Are all better than TO.


I wouldn't go that far. T.O is a DB's nightmare with his size and speed combo.

I wouldn't go that far. T.O is a DB's nightmare with his size and speed combo.

TO is good. Maybe as high as #3, but he's definitely not the best. Marvin Harrison and Randy Moss are both unquestionably better. I can't believe this is even being argued. And as i explained, TO made more money than any receiver in the league last season with the exception of Harrison, so I don't understand the beef.

Another factor to consider is that he is a selfish, spoiled ******* who puts down his teammates and acts like he can do no wrong. Now you may not think that should matter, but character does go into the equation when owners and GM's are deciding who to pay the big bucks too and how much.

Marvin Harrison, Randy Moss, Muhsin Muhammad, Javon Walker Are all better than TO.


I'll give you Harrison and Moss, but not the other two. Moose had an unbelievable season last year, but he hasn't been very consistent in his career. He was great while Beuerlein was hurling him the rock, and then had down time and then just had the big season. TO is younger, faster, stronger and catches just as well. He gets better seperation too. Walker is still unproven, depite his great season last year.

I think Chad Johnson will be the best receiver this year. Carson Palmer is going to break out this year.

Marvin Harrison, Randy Moss, Muhsin Muhammad, Javon Walker Are all better than TO.


Randy Moss is the only receiver in the NFL better than TO, and I ****ing hate the guy. Harrison is a great receiver that runs great routes, but he also benefits from the system and the QB he has. Put TO in the Colts offense and the guy would have numbers never seen in the NFL. Mushin is consistent but not in that class and Javon hasn't proven it over the long haul yet.

I would agree that overall Owens is a better wide out than Muhammad and Walker. But those 2 guys had better seasons last year. That other cat was trying to say TO was the best player in the league last year and therefore deserves to be the highest paid player this year.

I would agree that overall Owens is a better wide out than Muhammad and Walker. But those 2 guys had better seasons last year. That other cat was trying to say TO was the best player in the league last year and therefore deserves to be the highest paid player this year.


I agree man, TO was not the best player in the league last year. That owner goes to Peyton!

So answer my other question.....let's say TO only caught 30 balls last year for 2 TD's, is it alright for the team to waive him and not pay him the money negotiated on the contract?

Only if it says that its ok to do so and that is understood by both parties as to what will happen if TO underperforms.

Only if it says that its ok to do so and that is understood by both parties as to what will happen if TO underperforms.


A contract is exactly that.....a contract! We can't be hypocritical on this. If it's ok for teams and owners to not honor a contract then it shouldn't be taboo for a player to not honor it. Regardless of the signing bonus thing.


It's understood by both parties that these "contracts" will most likely not be entirely fulfilled anyway.

I think contracts should be completely incentive driven. If the player plays well, he gets paid well if he sucks he gets paid accordingly. Since when is it wrong to be paid what you earn?

Im pissed off about the Chargers 1st round pick, Shawn Merriman. He and his agent are being *****es about even preacticing before he has a contract. He wouldnt even show up to a mini camp, which as I understand is unprecedented. I think a lot of this **** is the fault of the agent, but if the player wasnt such a meat head moron, he wouldnt be so easy to influance.
the thing that pissed me off the most was last year when manning said he wasnt going to play for the chargers, i was like who the **** is this cat to decide were he plays when he is a rockie?
i mean serisuly i know his dad and brother are very good but wtf, the kid hasnt even proven himself and he was acting like he was the big ****.

the thing that pissed me off the most was last year when manning said he wasnt going to play for the chargers, i was like who the **** is this cat to decide were he plays when he is a rockie?
i mean serisuly i know his dad and brother are very good but wtf, the kid hasnt even proven himself and he was acting like he was the big ****.

I thought that was bull**** too. And ftr Archie manning was never that great.

then of course all those players from the same agent holding out. yeah of course they are underpayed i mean pulling 8 mill a year is not much specially if you ar3e doing every other man would do for free PLAY FOOTBALL imo they should cancel their contracts and never allowthem to play again if they hold out.
kinda like when boxers dont wanna fight because they think they dont get payed enough.
GREEDY BASTARDS

I thought that was bull**** too. And ftr Archie manning was never that great.

Yea, the Giants are coming to SD this year and I hope little Eli gets creamed.

Yea, the Giants are coming to SD this year and I hope little Eli gets creamed.

I'm a giants fan but I don't agree with what the Mannings did. I also think the Giants gave up too much for him. I guess time will tell how good Manning will be but the expctations are pretty high and if he hasn't improved considerably by seasons end he will hear plenty of Boo's from the fans at the Meadowlands too.

remember his first game Vs the Eagles in one played he got gang raped by the Dend and the Dtackle it was great i had never been soo happy by someones pain, since the Soxs Yanks ALCS :D

remember his first game Vs the Eagles in one played he got gang raped by the Dend and the Dtackle it was great i had never been soo happy by someones pain, since the Soxs Yanks ALCS :D

Babe...
Buckner...
Bucky "****ing" Dent...
Aaron Boone...

:D :boxing:

Babe...
Buckner...
Bucky "****ing" Dent...
Aaron Boone...

:D :boxing:
Schilling
Ortiz
Manny
Damon
4 Game Choke
in all those in a one week Period
WHO IS Your Papi? !!!! :boxing:

I would agree that overall Owens is a better wide out than Muhammad and Walker. But those 2 guys had better seasons last year. That other cat was trying to say TO was the best player in the league last year and therefore deserves to be the highest paid player this year.

When he went out he was the leading reciever in the league.

Moss is not better. He's faster, and taller, but he won't take hits. You CANNOT count on Moss to make a clutch play, because he's such a *****. I rate TO ahead of Moss, simply because he's willing to risk his body in order to make a catch. Also, I didn't see anyone ripping balls out of TO's hands, unlike Randy's (Tillman anyone?). Harrison, as stated, benefits from the best QB in the league throwing to him.

I rate TO as the #1 receiver in the league. If Randy grows a pair, maybe he can take the spot.

then of course all those players from the same agent holding out. yeah of course they are underpayed i mean pulling 8 mill a year is not much specially if you ar3e doing every other man would do for free PLAY FOOTBALL imo they should cancel their contracts and never allowthem to play again if they hold out.
kinda like when boxers dont wanna fight because they think they dont get payed enough.
GREEDY BASTARDS

First, not allowing them to ever play is silly. Secondly, the boxing comparison is ridiculous, being that boxers get paid **** (comparitively to other athletes) to put themselves at more of a risk than any other athlete does (minus other combat sport athletes).

the thing that pissed me off the most was last year when manning said he wasnt going to play for the chargers, i was like who the **** is this cat to decide were he plays when he is a rockie?
i mean serisuly i know his dad and brother are very good but wtf, the kid hasnt even proven himself and he was acting like he was the big ****.

You know who else did that? John Elway. That's right, the Comeback Kid himself held out when the Colts drafted him when he wanted to go to the Broncos. Now he's regarded as one of the best NFL QB's ever. It's not such a bad thing, really.

Training camp, not exactly a death march. If he's that worried about getting injured I'd say something is fishy.
tell that to corey stringer


sorry if that coment has been posted already, i havent read all posts..... :o

When he went out he was the leading reciever in the league.

Moss is not better. He's faster, and taller, but he won't take hits. You CANNOT count on Moss to make a clutch play, because he's such a *****. I rate TO ahead of Moss, simply because he's willing to risk his body in order to make a catch. Also, I didn't see anyone ripping balls out of TO's hands, unlike Randy's (Tillman anyone?). Harrison, as stated, benefits from the best QB in the league throwing to him.

I rate TO as the #1 receiver in the league. If Randy grows a pair, maybe he can take the spot.



First, not allowing them to ever play is silly. Secondly, the boxing comparison is ridiculous, being that boxers get paid **** (comparitively to other athletes) to put themselves at more of a risk than any other athlete does (minus other combat sport athletes).



You know who else did that? John Elway. That's right, the Comeback Kid himself held out when the Colts drafted him when he wanted to go to the Broncos. Now he's regarded as one of the best NFL QB's ever. It's not such a bad thing, really.


Moss is much much better and so is harrison. Don't give me this best qb ****. McNabb is right there with Manning. And guess what your argument about him being the best before getting injured actually works against you. he got paid the second most of all the receivers in the league and only played 13 games. You have to take his stats for what they are, not what you think they could have been. Moss was maybe the 5th best receiver last year and he has been maybe the 3rd best reciever over the last half dozen years behind Moss and Harrison. he has also beren the biggest ***** in the league. Whining if he doesn't get enough balls thrown to him as he thinks he should. *****est that his teammates are no good and they are the reason for his teams losses. CLUBHOUSE CANCER!

And as for Elway, he was a Prima Donna too. And it had nothing to do with wanting to play for Denver. He just didn't want to play in Indy. And it is a bad thing because you **** up the integrity of the league that way. The worst team deserves the best player.