View Full Version : Rate these guys in terms of boxing ability part 2


Toney616
07-31-2010, 09:02 AM
The fighters:
Michael Nunn
Roy Jones
Muhammad Ali
Pernell Whittaker

The judging criteria:
Offense
Defense
Footwork

Please give reasons for your order

Off topic: Can anyone here give me a breakdown of Pernell defensive technique?

TheHolyCross
07-31-2010, 11:06 AM
jones
whitaker
nunn
ali

reason: uhm...i guess the most complete in terms of the criteria

Toney616
07-31-2010, 11:08 AM
jones
whitaker
nunn
ali

reason: uhm...i guess the most complete in terms of the criteria
How would you describe Jones's defense?

TheHolyCross
07-31-2010, 11:20 AM
i dont know how you want me to answer that, but i think his defence at its best lied in his backfoot and the counter that followed when he moved back

as for pernell whitakers defence, imo it relied more on headmovement and a pepper jab, and there is his famous straight turning and running when getting trapped on the ropes

sonnyboyx2
07-31-2010, 11:20 AM
Ali - The Greatest
Jones ) 2nd
Whitaker ) 2nd
Nunn

Nunn falls short in this grouping

MeccaOfBoxing
07-31-2010, 11:24 AM
Michael Nunn is out of his depth with these fighters.

Toney616
07-31-2010, 11:25 AM
i dont know how you want me to answer that, but i think his defence at its best lied in his backfoot and the counter that followed when he moved back
Thanks for replying. I never been to sure how to define it myself. Joe Goossen said it was his ability to put all of his weight on his right leg and to lean back to avoid punches. I also noticed that he tended to parry punches with his right hand as well

as for pernell whitakers defence, imo it relied more on headmovement and a pepper jab, and there is his famous straight turning and running when getting trapped on the ropes
Im going to have to watch some of his fights again, I've always had a hard time trying to define his defense as well

Toney616
07-31-2010, 11:28 AM
Ali - The Greatest
Jones ) 2nd
Whitaker ) 2nd
Nunn

Nunn falls short in this grouping
In terms of footwork and offense Nunn was as good as Ali imo. Defensively im not so sure, but he was very adept at slipping punches, which is unusual for such a big guy

Toney616
07-31-2010, 11:29 AM
Michael Nunn is out of his depth with these fighters.
You think so?
He had great upper body movement, handspeed and combination punching

Toney616
07-31-2010, 11:43 AM
The fighters:
Michael Nunn
Roy Jones
Muhammad Ali
Pernell Whittaker

The judging criteria:
Offense
Defense
Footwork

Please give reasons for your order

Off topic: Can anyone here give me a breakdown of Pernell defensive technique?
My first attempt to order them, will most probably change it a bit after I watched some of their fights again:

Defense:
Jones
Whittaker
Ali
Nunn

Offense:
Jones
Nunn
Ali
Whittaker

Footwork:
Nunn
Ali
Jones
Whittaker

Toney616
07-31-2010, 11:50 AM
Ali - The Greatest

Moore is the greatest for me

Ziggy Stardust
07-31-2010, 12:07 PM
1. Muhammed Ali
2 Tied Roy Jones
2 Tied Pernell Whittaker
4 Michael Nunn

Nunn was a terrific boxer and would rate near the top in just about any other grouping but this one.

Poet

Toney616
08-01-2010, 07:50 AM
1. Muhammed Ali
2 Tied Roy Jones
2 Tied Pernell Whittaker
4 Michael Nunn

Nunn was a terrific boxer and would rate near the top in just about any other grouping but this one.

Poet
Interesting, you have Ali over Jones?
comparison: Ali vs Jones
Defense:Equal
Offense:Jones
Footwork:Jones

Ziggy Stardust
08-01-2010, 09:25 AM
Interesting, you have Ali over Jones?
comparison: Ali vs Jones
Defense:Equal
Offense:Jones
Footwork:Jones

I'd have footwork even and offense for Ali.

Poet

Toney616
08-01-2010, 09:29 AM
I'd have footwork even and offense for Ali.

Poet
I would have Jones on offense, his punches were just as fast, had more power (p4p) and came from unusual angles. Ali tended to rely on the jab, straight right and sometimes the lead right (Foreman fight)

On the flip side, I guess you can say Ali was more consistent with his offense while Jones tended to chose his moments

Ziggy Stardust
08-01-2010, 09:31 AM
I would have Jones on offense, his punches were just as fast, had more power (p4p) and came from unusual angles. Ali tended to rely on the jab, straight right and sometimes the lead right (Foreman fight)

On the flip side, I guess you can say Ali was more consistent with his offense while Jones tended to chose his moments

In his prime (pre-exhile) Ali was much more active offensively than Jones.

Poet

Toney616
08-01-2010, 09:35 AM
In his prime (pre-exhile) Ali was much more active offensively than Jones.

Poet
Any particular fight you have in mind?

Ziggy Stardust
08-01-2010, 09:38 AM
Any particular fight you have in mind?

Cleveland Williams certainly. Also very active with his hands for the 1st Liston fight and Earnie Terrell. Just off the top of my head.

Poet

Toney616
08-01-2010, 09:43 AM
Cleveland Williams certainly. Also very active with his hands for the 1st Liston fight and Earnie Terrell. Just off the top of my head.

Poet
Thanks for the reply. I'll check out that Liston I fight again, never watched Ali-Terrell (or Ali-Patterson) for obvious reasons

Ziggy Stardust
08-01-2010, 09:45 AM
Thanks for the reply. I'll check out that Liston I fight again, never watched Ali-Terrell (or Ali-Patterson) for obvious reasons

Watch as many pre-exhile Ali fights as possible: You'll be surprised especially when you compare them to the 70s Ali fights that you've seen.

Poet

Tyson.
08-01-2010, 09:45 AM
Prime RJJ is the GOAT P4P. The win over Toney shows it all.

1. RJJ
2. Ali
3. Pernell
4 Nunn

Toney616
08-01-2010, 09:58 AM
Watch as many pre-exhile Ali fights as possible: You'll be surprised especially when you compare them to the 70s Ali fights that you've seen.

Poet
Pre exile I have seen:
Williams
Liston I
Liston II (never watching this again, lol)
Moore
Cooper
London

post exile: I have seen most of his fights, Ali-Frazier I being my fav

off topic:
I also have noticed that Eubank's head movement during Watson I was very reminiscent of Ali's during the the first Liston fight

Toney616
08-01-2010, 09:59 AM
Prime RJJ is the GOAT P4P. The win over Toney shows it all.

Toney was tailor made for him

Ziggy Stardust
08-01-2010, 10:00 AM
Pre exile I have seen:
Williams
Liston I
Liston II (never watching this again, lol)
Moore
Cooper
London

post exile: I have seen most of his fights, Ali-Frazier I being my fav

off topic:
I also have noticed that Eubank's head movement during Watson I was very reminiscent of Ali's during the the first Liston fight

Eubank was a crafty fighter. The Brit Middleweights from the late-80s early-90s were a terrific batch.

Poet

Ziggy Stardust
08-01-2010, 10:02 AM
Pre exile I have seen:
Williams
Liston I
Liston II (never watching this again, lol)
Moore
Cooper
London

post exile: I have seen most of his fights, Ali-Frazier I being my fav

off topic:
I also have noticed that Eubank's head movement during Watson I was very reminiscent of Ali's during the the first Liston fight

The Zora Folley fight is another good one to watch although Ali took it easy on Zora because he liked him.

Poet

DONDIisBack
08-01-2010, 10:08 AM
The fighters:
Michael Nunn
Roy Jones
Muhammad Ali
Pernell Whittaker

The judging criteria:
Offense
Defense
Footwork

Please give reasons for your order

Off topic: Can anyone here give me a breakdown of Pernell defensive technique?

Nunn- Typical above average boxer.
Jones- Gifted
Ali- Great boxer with Great outside the ring life-What makes hin "the greatest".
Whitaker- Defensive Genius.

Toney616
08-01-2010, 10:11 AM
Eubank was a crafty fighter. The Brit Middleweights from the late-80s early-90s were a terrific batch.

Poet
Benn and Eubank were my favs from that bunch

Toney616
08-01-2010, 10:12 AM
The Zora Folley fight is another good one to watch although Ali took it easy on Zora because he liked him.

Poet
Cool, I'll check that one out as well

Toney616
08-01-2010, 10:14 AM
Nunn- Typical above average boxer.
Nunn was gifted as well

Jones- Gifted
true

Ali- Great boxer with Great outside the ring life-What makes hin "the greatest".

We are going to have to disagree on this

Whitaker- Defensive Genius.
I agree

TheHolyCross
08-01-2010, 11:36 AM
Interesting, you have Ali over Jones?
comparison: Ali vs Jones
Defense:Equal
Offense:Jones
Footwork:Jones
tho they both had very similar type of defence jones was more versatile and his upperbody and head movement is what gave him the awkward angled counter attacks

but since ali is a heavyweight, i guess you gotta give him some cred


i dont think it's arguable tho that jones has the better offense
since jones fought at heavyweight, with a 5'10 frame and 200 pounds
he has the left hook from outside, the uppercut, hook to head & body combo inside or hook and uppercut if he's on the outside, an uppercut to the body, a jab to the body, a right hand to the body and then you've got all those counters that can come from nowhere, so ike i said, imo it should'nt be arguable

Toney616
08-01-2010, 11:43 AM
tho they both had very similar type of defence jones was more versatile and his upperbody and head movement is what gave him the awkward angled counter attacks
Which fight would you recommend that highlights Jones defensive capabilities?

but since ali is a heavyweight, i guess you gotta give him some cred
This is p4p, so that doesnt matter

i dont think it's arguable tho that jones has the better offense
since jones fought at heavyweight, with a 5'10 frame and 200 pounds
he has the left hook from outside, the uppercut, hook to head & body combo inside or hook and uppercut if he's on the outside, an uppercut to the body, a jab to the body, a right hand to the body and then you've got all those counters that can come from nowhere, so ike i said, imo it should'nt be arguable
Good points

TheHolyCross
08-01-2010, 11:49 AM
i liked him against mccallum
he has some neat counters that are followed by speedy getaways
and shows the many dimensions to his defence

really like that fight, speakin of it reminds me, i have to re-download it
you know of any good quality versions?

Toney616
08-01-2010, 12:09 PM
i liked him against mccallum
he has some neat counters that are followed by speedy getaways
and shows the many dimensions to his defence
Its been a while since Ive seen that fight, im going to have to watch it again

really like that fight, speakin of it reminds me, i have to re-download it
you know of any good quality versions?
pm sent

Cassius Liston
08-01-2010, 12:15 PM
Cleveland Williams certainly. Also very active with his hands for the 1st Liston fight and Earnie Terrell. Just off the top of my head.

Poet

great fight.....