Everyone has their list of top ten heavyweights of all time here is mine. feel free to share yours also.


1)Muhammad Ali- It was amazing that a man of his physical size can move with such swiftness and agility. Was undefeated (30-0)when the title was wrongfully stripped from him in '67. Forced to stay out of boxing for three years, he went through ups and downs and 2 defeats to finally get another title shot at the age of 32 in 1974 and shocked the whole world by defeating the invincinble Big George Foreman. Two amazing title reigns and Ali was also the first man to win the Championship 3 times.

2)Joe Louis- The Brown Bomber was a deadly technician in the ring. During his title reign he faced anyone and anything that was put in front of him. Amazing number of title defenses(25!) and length of title reign.

3)George Foreman- In his early career Big George Foreman was a fighter that had the heavyweight division in fear, with an aura of invinciblity comparable to Tysons and Listons big George would have adversaries shaking in thier boots at the mention of his name. That is until he met Ali in '74. Big George was 42-0 when he lost to Ali. After the loss he went into a downward spiral that caused him to retire from boxing and becoming a preacher, didnt box for ten years. In 1988 Foreman came back with a drive to regain the heavyweight title again. And going through ups and downs he finally won back the title at the age of 45 in 1994 by KO against Michael Moorer. Amazingly regaining the title 20 years after losing it to Ali. Foreman is in the record books for the oldest man ever to win the championship at 45 years old, and also for having the 2nd highest knockout percentage in heavyweight history.

4. Rocky Marciano - The Rock was known for his amazing stamina in the ring like the energizer bunny you can keep beating him down but he just kept on coming. Incredible stamina, iron chin, unbeatable will to win, ability to knock you out with both hands, deadly body shots. What more can you ask for in a fighter. His 49-0 record still stands to this day.

5. Larry Holmes- The Easton Assassin was known for his lightning jab that was strong enough to knock you down. Holmes never got respect because unlike Ali he lacked an arch nemesis liek Ali had with Frazier, and he also ruled during a bleak period in heavyweight history. Spent 8 years as heavywieght Champ and went 48-0 before losing to Spinks almost tying Marciano's 49-0 record.

6. Joe Frazier- one word to describe him- relentless . Like Marciano you can throw everything at this guy and he'd still keep on coming. Owner of one of the deadliest left hooks in heavyweight history. The first man to beat Ali. His 3 dramatic fights with Ali made Smokin Joe Frazier a legend.

7. Lennox Lewis- During his title reign the British lion fought and defeated all the top heavyweights of his day including Holyfield and Tyson. Look at the list of all the fighters The British Lion has defeated and you'll see his place in history cannot be denied. Possessed one of the deadliest right hands in heavyweight history.

8.Evander Holyfield - Evander The Real Deal Holyfield is a man with incredible heart. Possesses one of the greatest chins of all time , this man didnt know the meaning of the word -quit. Proved the critics wrong time after time. Saying he wasnt big enough to be a Heavyweight he went on to win the title a record 4 times. His most dramtic win was when he defeated Iron Mike Tyson for the Title in 1996 when everyone wrote Holyfield off as a hasbeen.

9. Mike Tyson- Iron Mike Tyson's place in history is bittersweet to me because I feel had he stayed with trainer Kevin Rooney, Mike Tyson had the POTENTIAL to become the greatest Heavyweight Champ of all time. Everyone knows Tysons story. Tyson had incredible speed, incredible KO power, great finisher, a violent blood lust to destroy his opponent. Many of Tysons fight would not go past the 2nd round. During Tyson's 3 year reign of terror opponents feared Tyson so much that they would forget to fight back. With his black shoes no socks, black trunks, fade haircut and gym towel draped on his shoulders he had an aura of invincibility that the ring had never seen before or since. In 1988 this man was frightening, his 90 second annihilation of Michael Spinks and 4 round destruction of Larry Holmes truly made him the "Baddest man on the planet".

10. Jack Dempsey- the Monnassa Mauler- was a devestating force to be reckoned with back in his day. Knocked out Jess willard in violent fashion knocking Willards teeth out literally to win the Heavyweight Title,,,,and Dempsey was outweighed by Willard by more than 50 lbs!!!. Dempsey style was the prototype to Tyson, Tyson even borrowed Dempseys style of wearing black shoes, black shorts, fade haircut from Dempsey. Going for the knock out Dempsey could knock you out with either hand. Pure assassin.

***special note - Jack Johnson is my #11. The reason I dont have him ranked higher is because he ruled in an old time era when heavyweights would fight middleweights and even welterweights. In fact Johnson himself fought many fights with many weight mismatches. Had Johnson ruled in a "Modernised Era" he would have placed higher on my list. With that being said I believe Johnson was extremely talented and can even defeat some of the men that rank higher in my list.***



***ReVISED 5/26/2007-Tyson has proven himself to be unworthy and is now replaced by James J. Braddock.

James J. Braddock is #9

thats a nice top ten and I cant disagree with anything as far as the fighters but i might have dempsey ahead of lennox and holyfield

thats a nice top ten and I cant disagree with anything as far as the fighters but i might have dempsey ahead of lennox and holyfield


That's interesting but i could see where you would think that.

My top-10 ranking of the greatest heavyweights, would look something like this;

1. Muhammad Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Jack Johnson
4. Larry Holmes
5. Jack Dempsey
6. George Foreman
7. Rocky Marciano
8. James Jeffries
9. Joe Frazier
10. Mike Tyson

Honourable mentions to (in no order); Sonny Liston, Gene Tunney, Evander Holyfield, Ezzard Charles, Sam Langford, and Lennox Lewis.

1) Joe Louis
2) Jack Johnson
3) Ali
4) George Foreman
5) Larry Holmes
6) Sonny Liston
7) Joe Frazier
8) Jack Dempsey
9) Rocky Marciano
10) Jim Jefferies

1. Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Larry Holmes
4. George Foreman
5. Rocky Marciano
6. Jack Dempsey
7. Joe Frazier
8. Sonny Liston
9. Evander Holyfield
10. Lennox Lewis

1. Ali
2. Larry Holmes
3. Joe Louis
4. Rocky Marciano
5. Joe Frazier
6. George Foreman
7. Jack Dempsey
8. Jack Johnson
9. Lennox Lewos
10. Mike Tyson

Though I have not seen the fights of some of the older figthers in your list, I can say that it's a pretty good lineup based on what I have read about them.

My top ten

1. Ali
2. Joe louis
3. Jack Dempsey
4. Joe fraizer
5. Jack Johnson
6. George Foreman
7. Evander Holyfield
8. Rocky Marciano
9. Larry Holmes
10. Ken Norton

Honourable mentions
Sonny Liston, John L Sullivan, Peter Jackson, Jim Jeffries, Mike Tyson, maybe Lennox Lewis 15-20.

That was hard either one of them guys could be higher up in the list or lower down. It's all about opinions and that's mine.

I think it's cool that some of you guys have Jeffries on there, I'm glad he isn't completely forgotten. I still need to find video of him.

If Rocky Marciano could beat George Foreman, then he is the greatest heavyweight of all time, because that would mean his chin is unbreakable, and he could never be stopped. But unfortunately, I think he would get destroyed.

I also see that Jack Johnson is ranked in the Top 3 sometimes, I'd love to see some good quality video of him so I could see his technique.

3)George Foreman- In his early career Big George Foreman was a fighter that had the heavyweight division in fear, with an aura of invinciblity comparable to Tysons and Listons big George would have adversaries shaking in thier boots at the mention of his name. That is until he met Ali in '74. Big George was 42-0 when he lost to Ali. After the loss he went into a downward spiral that caused him to retire from boxing and becoming a preacher, didnt box for ten years. In 1988 Foreman came back with a drive to regain the heavyweight title again. And going through ups and downs he finally won back the title at the age of 45 in 1994 by KO against Michael Moorer. Amazingly regaining the title 20 years after losing it to Ali. Foreman is in the record books for the oldest man ever to win the championship at 45 years old, and also for having the 2nd highest knockout percentage in heavyweight history.

Who has the highest percentage?

Rocky Marciano has the highest. 43 KOs in 49 fight.
I was wondering if you calculate the percentage by dividing number of KO's by number of wins, or dividing by number of fights?
Like if a guy has a record of 10-6 (8), is his percentage 80%, or 50%?

Rocky Marciano has the highest. 43 KOs in 49 fight.
I was wondering if you calculate the percentage by dividing number of KO's by number of wins, or dividing by number of fights?
Like if a guy has a record of 10-6 (8), is his percentage 80%, or 50%?

Knockouts are always divided into the total number of fights, therefore that example you gave would've had a KO% of 50.

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Hard to say.
4. Hard to say.
...

1. Ali
2. Lennox Lewis
3. Joe louis
4. George Foreman
5. Jack Johnson
6. Rocky Marciano
7. Larry Holmes
8. Gene Tunney
9. Jack Dempsey
10.John L Sullivan
+ Mike Tyson :)

1. Ali
2. Lennox Lewis
3. Joe louis
4. George Foreman
5. Jack Johnson
6. Rocky Marciano
7. Larry Holmes
8. Gene Tunney
9. Jack Dempsey
10.John L Sullivan
+ Mike Tyson :)



just curious are you from the uk? :)

just curious are you from the uk? :)
No, from the Ukraine :)

Whats your top ten TysonForeman.
Your probably right about Marciano and Foreman it would end in the same way as Foreman Fraizer fights but I just really like Marciano and his never say die attitude.
If half the fighters had the desire that Marciano had boxing would be a better sport. Only a few have it today. Hopkins to name one.

Very True!!!!!

Louis
Holmes
Ali
Jack Johnson
Evander Holyfield
Foreman
Frazier
Gene Tunney
Lennox Lewis
Jack Dempsey

Everyone has their list of top ten heavyweights of all time here is mine. feel free to share yours also.


1)Muhammad Ali- It was amazing that a man of his physical size can move with such swiftness and agility. Was undefeated (30-0)when the title was wrongfully stripped from him in '67. Forced to stay out of boxing for three years, he went through ups and downs and 2 defeats to finally get another title shot at the age of 32 in 1974 and shocked the whole world by defeating the invincinble Big George Foreman. Two amazing title reigns and Ali was also the first man to win the Championship 3 times.

2)Joe Louis- The Brown Bomber was a deadly technician in the ring. During his title reign he faced anyone and anything that was put in front of him. Amazing number of title defenses(25!) and length of title reign.

3)George Foreman- In his early career Big George Foreman was a fighter that had the heavyweight division in fear, with an aura of invinciblity comparable to Tysons and Listons big George would have adversaries shaking in thier boots at the mention of his name. That is until he met Ali in '74. Big George was 42-0 when he lost to Ali. After the loss he went into a downward spiral that caused him to retire from boxing and becoming a preacher, didnt box for ten years. In 1988 Foreman came back with a drive to regain the heavyweight title again. And going through ups and downs he finally won back the title at the age of 45 in 1994 by KO against Michael Moorer. Amazingly regaining the title 20 years after losing it to Ali. Foreman is in the record books for the oldest man ever to win the championship at 45 years old, and also for having the 2nd highest knockout percentage in heavyweight history.

4. Rocky Marciano - The Rock was known for his amazing stamina in the ring like the energizer bunny you can keep beating him down but he just kept on coming. Incredible stamina, iron chin, unbeatable will to win, ability to knock you out with both hands, deadly body shots. What more can you ask for in a fighter. His 49-0 record still stands to this day.

5. Larry Holmes- The Easton Assassin was known for his lightning jab that was strong enough to knock you down. Holmes never got respect because unlike Ali he lacked an arch nemesis liek Ali had with Frazier, and he also ruled during a bleak period in heavyweight history. Spent 8 years as heavywieght Champ and went 48-0 before losing to Spinks almost tying Marciano's 49-0 record.

6. Joe Frazier- one word to describe him- relentless . Like Marciano you can throw everything at this guy and he'd still keep on coming. Owner of one of the deadliest left hooks in heavyweight history. The first man to beat Ali. His 3 dramatic fights with Ali made Smokin Joe Frazier a legend.

7. Lennox Lewis- During his title reign the British lion fought and defeated all the top heavyweights of his day including Holyfield and Tyson. Look at the list of all the fighters The British Lion has defeated and you'll see his place in history cannot be denied. Possessed one of the deadliest right hands in heavyweight history.

8.Evander Holyfield - Evander The Real Deal Holyfield is a man with incredible heart. Possesses one of the greatest chins of all time , this man didnt know the meaning of the word -quit. Proved the critics wrong time after time. Saying he wasnt big enough to be a Heavyweight he went on to win the title a record 4 times. His most dramtic win was when he defeated Iron Mike Tyson for the Title in 1996 when everyone wrote Holyfield off as a hasbeen.

9. Mike Tyson- Iron Mike Tyson's place in history is bittersweet to me because I feel had he stayed with trainer Kevin Rooney, Mike Tyson had the POTENTIAL to become the greatest Heavyweight Champ of all time. Everyone knows Tysons story. Tyson had incredible speed, incredible KO power, great finisher, a violent blood lust to destroy his opponent. Many of Tysons fight would not go past the 2nd round. During Tyson's 3 year reign of terror opponents feared Tyson so much that they would forget to fight back. With his black shoes no socks, black trunks, fade haircut and gym towel draped on his shoulders he had an aura of invincibility that the ring had never seen before or since. In 1988 this man was frightening, his 90 second annihilation of Michael Spinks and 4 round destruction of Larry Holmes truly made him the "Baddest man on the planet".

10. Jack Dempsey- the Monnassa Mauler- was a devestating force to be reckoned with back in his day. Knocked out Jess willard in violent fashion knocking Willards teeth out literally to win the Heavyweight Title,,,,and Dempsey was outweighed by Willard by more than 50 lbs!!!. Dempsey style was the prototype to Tyson, Tyson even borrowed Dempseys style of wearing black shoes, black shorts, fade haircut from Dempsey. Going for the knock out Dempsey could knock you out with either hand. Pure assassin.

***special note - Jack Johnson is my #11. The reason I dont have him ranked higher is because he ruled in an old time era when heavyweights would fight middleweights and even welterweights. In fact Johnson himself fought many fights with many weight mismatches. Had Johnson ruled in a "Modernised Era" he would have placed higher on my list. With that being said I believe Johnson was extremely talented and can even defeat some of the men that rank higher in my list.***

Good list but id but louis number one, and where is liston?

First of, my list is not a "who beats who" list. For instance, Foreman would probably demolish both Marciano and Dempsey, but I still rank him below those guys. It is a matter of who was greatest over all. Marciano never lost a fight and had more heart than most all-time fighters. He also had power and a impressive chin. Foreman had a shorter reign and retired at age 27. Making him the third greatest heavyweight of all time is not fair to guys like Marciano and Dempsey. Had Ali never made his comeback in the 70s, Foreman would probably reign for a looong time and thus becoming a greater all-time heavyweight.

1. Joe Louis
Joe Louis had the longest reign, the most title defences, met decent opponents and was without a doubt the most complete heavyweight of all time. Further, he might very well have beaten every other fighter on this list.

2. Muhammad Ali (a close second, and far ahead of number 3)
3. Rocky Marciano (undefeated against mediocre opponents - alot of heart!)
4. Jack Dempsey (everything Tyson ever WANTED to be...)
5. Gene Tunney (underrated - best BOXER of all time in my book)
6. Larry Holmes (had great overall tools, combined with heart and a great chin)
7. George Foreman (could beat almost everyone on this list - awesome in his prime, boggled my mind as a fat old guy!)
8. Joe Frazier (superb left hook, a lions heart, great stamina)
9. Sonny Liston (alot like Tyson, power, a solid chin and no heart, but a better boxer though)
10. Evander Holyfield (the best of the 1990s)

(11. Mike Tyson).

I do not know where to rank Jack Johnson and Jeffries. I have heard good things about both of them, but I have never seen any fights. The vote is not in yet when it comes to Lennox Lewis. He handled an aging Tyson very well and also defeated Holyfield. Still, I just cannot bring my self to consider him truly great. If I were forced to place him, it would be at number 12..

***special note - Jack Johnson is my #11. The reason I dont have him ranked higher is because he ruled in an old time era when heavyweights would fight middleweights and even welterweights. In fact Johnson himself fought many fights with many weight mismatches. Had Johnson ruled in a "Modernised Era" he would have placed higher on my list. With that being said I believe Johnson was extremely talented and can even defeat some of the men that rank higher in my list.***

Good man, Johnson is way overrated.

Rocky Marciano
Mike Tyson
Larry Holmes
Joe Frasier
Muhammad Ali
Sonny Liston
Floyd Patterson
Joe Louis
Jack Dempsey
Evander Holyfield

1. Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Larry Holmes
4. Geo. Foreman
5. Joe Frazier
6. Jack Johnson
7. Rocky Marciano
8. Ezzard Charles
9. Gene Tunney
10. Lennox Lewis (just becasue he changed the size of the common heavyweight forever)

First of, my list is not a "who beats who" list. For instance, Foreman would probably demolish both Marciano and Dempsey, but I still rank him below those guys. It is a matter of who was greatest over all. Marciano never lost a fight and had more heart than most all-time fighters. He also had power and a impressive chin. Foreman had a shorter reign and retired at age 27. Making him the third greatest heavyweight of all time is not fair to guys like Marciano and Dempsey. Had Ali never made his comeback in the 70s, Foreman would probably reign for a looong time and thus becoming a greater all-time heavyweight.

1. Joe Louis
Joe Louis had the longest reign, the most title defences, met decent opponents and was without a doubt the most complete heavyweight of all time. Further, he might very well have beaten every other fighter on this list.

2. Muhammad Ali (a close second, and far ahead of number 3)
3. Rocky Marciano (undefeated against mediocre opponents - alot of heart!)
4. Jack Dempsey (everything Tyson ever WANTED to be...)
5. Gene Tunney (underrated - best BOXER of all time in my book)
6. Larry Holmes (had great overall tools, combined with heart and a great chin)
7. George Foreman (could beat almost everyone on this list - awesome in his prime, boggled my mind as a fat old guy!)
8. Joe Frazier (superb left hook, a lions heart, great stamina)
9. Sonny Liston (alot like Tyson, power, a solid chin and no heart, but a better boxer though)
10. Evander Holyfield (the best of the 1990s)

(11. Mike Tyson).

I do not know where to rank Jack Johnson and Jeffries. I have heard good things about both of them, but I have never seen any fights. The vote is not in yet when it comes to Lennox Lewis. He handled an aging Tyson very well and also defeated Holyfield. Still, I just cannot bring my self to consider him truly great. If I were forced to place him, it would be at number 12..


Ali should be #1 and Holmes did more at heavy than Tunney.He should be ranked higher.

1. Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Larry Holmes
4. Geo. Foreman
5. Joe Frazier
6. Jack Johnson
7. Rocky Marciano
8. Ezzard Charles
9. Gene Tunney
10. Lennox Lewis (just becasue he changed the size of the common heavyweight forever)

Looks like my list, except Larry Holmes is replaced by Sonny Liston and Lennox Lewis is replaced by Jersey Joe Walcott.

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Holmes
4. Lewis
5. Holyfield
6. Foreman
7. Frazier
8. Tyson
9. Charles
10. Marciano

I think it's cool that some of you guys have Jeffries on there, I'm glad he isn't completely forgotten. I still need to find video of him.

If Rocky Marciano could beat George Foreman, then he is the greatest heavyweight of all time, because that would mean his chin is unbreakable, and he could never be stopped. But unfortunately, I think he would get destroyed.

I also see that Jack Johnson is ranked in the Top 3 sometimes, I'd love to see some good quality video of him so I could see his technique.
If Ken Jennings had a top 10 heavyweight list I wouldn't question it. :boxing:

I want to change my list to:

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Holmes
4. Lewis
5. Holyfield
6. Foreman
7. Frazier
8. Tyson
9. Charles
10. Patterson

1. tyson
2. Louis
3. Holmes
4. Lewis
5. Holyfield
6. Foreman
7. Frazier
8.ali
9. Charles
10. Patterson

This, unlike all other weight classes is a hard question. for example. I'd rank Marciano ahead of Holyfield for what the Rock did but at 185 pounds i don't think he'd be competitive against a 220 Holyfield or 250 Lennox. Other than that I'd have the topic starters 6,7,8 reading 8,7 Mike Tyson at eight Jack Johnson 9 Dempsey 10.

1.Marciano best stamina and heart ever undeafeted.
2.Louis longest tittle reign.
3.Ali fought and beat great competiton.
4.Foreman worst bear to ever enter a ring.
5.Frazier amazing will, staying power and left hook.
6.Holmes.
7.Liston.
8.Holyfield.
9.Tyson.
10.Lewis.

1. tyson
2. Louis
3. Holmes
4. Lewis
5. Holyfield
6. Foreman
7. Frazier
8.ali
9. Charles
10. Patterson

NO OFFENCE, but are you kidding with us?

I think it's cool that some of you guys have Jeffries on there, I'm glad he isn't completely forgotten. I still need to find video of him.

If Rocky Marciano could beat George Foreman, then he is the greatest heavyweight of all time, because that would mean his chin is unbreakable, and he could never be stopped. But unfortunately, I think he would get destroyed.

I also see that Jack Johnson is ranked in the Top 3 sometimes, I'd love to see some good quality video of him so I could see his technique.

mike tyson lennox holyfield

1. Hasim Rahman (for length of reign alone)
2. John Ruiz (for exciting style)
3. Riddick Bowe (for respect for the title)
4. Evander Holyfield (cause he knows when to quit)
5. Erik Morales (wait... I don't understand the game)

I think the strongest and the best heavyweight fighter of all time is Rocky "The Brockton Blockbuster" Marciano with his incredibly powerful quick hands and his steel chin. His 49-0 record speaks for itself, the only boxer to have an undefeated boxing career.

I can't rate top 10, because I haven't seen enough older fights. I do want to say that there are a lot of Tyson nuthuggers on this board, though. A lot of people have him too high, and don't have others that should be on a list there.

Seriously, Muhammad Ali would pwn anyone who ever held the title ...



... TEN TIMES!

Tyson does not deserve to be in top 10...

I am not going to try to do a top ten because I have not scene enough of the old fighters to attempt to do so. But I will say the number 1 greatest champion in my opinion was Joe Louis, Simply because he defended the undisputed Heavyweight Championship over 20 consecutive times.

Tyson does not deserve to be in top 10...
i agree with you, i even think he belongs to the bottom ten

Definately not Tyson in the top ten. Not even close. People forget that a prime Mike Tyson got knocked out by Buster Douglas. Some people here may want to argue that it should be overlooked since Lewis got kayoed by Rahman, but Lewis's knockout was a lucky punch. Buster Douglas dominated the fight against Tyson before stopping him.

Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
Jack Johnson
Rocky Marciano
Jack Dempsey
Joe Frazier
John L Sullivan
Gentleman Jim Corbitt
Larry Holmes
Sonny Liston

1. Muhammad Ali

2. Joe Louis
3. George Foreman
4. Larry Holmes

5. Evander Holyfield
6. Lennox Lewis

7. Sonny Liston
8. Rocky Marciano
9. Joe Frazier
10. Mike Tyson

11. Riddick Bowe
12. Jack Johnson

I guess you don't like Dempsey but c'mon, you don't even include him in your top twelve?

No, actually I do like Dempsey. I just don't personally think he belongs with the others.

Muhammad Ali
Joe Loise
mike tyson
Lennox Lewis
George foreman
jack dempsey
Marciano
Evander Holifield
Joe Frazier
jersey joe walcott

Muhammad Ali
Manny Pacquiao
mike tyson
Lennox Lewis
Thomas Hearns
Flash Elorde
Marciano
Roberto Duran
Marvin Hagler
Sugar Ray Leonard

Muhammad Ali
Manny Pacquiao
mike tyson
Lennox Lewis
Thomas Hearns
Flash Elorde
Marciano
Roberto Duran
Marvin Hagler
Sugar Ray Leonard
i thought this thread is for the top 10 heavyweight champs? LOL

1. Ali / Joe Louis
I Cant Seperate Never Have Been Able To
3. Lennox Lewis
4. Larry Holmes
5. George Foreman
6. Jack Johnson
7. Marciano
8. Holyfield
9. Liston
10. Tyson

Honourable Mentions For Smokin Joe /dempsey / Ezzard Charles / John L Sullivan And Gentleman Jim.

1. Marciano - Highest KO percentage ever, undefeated, only ever KNOCKED DOWN once, beat Joe Louis (late), beat Ezzard Charles, twice. Best ever, period.
2. Ali - Did a ton for the sport as far as making it accessible to the masses. His defeat of a young, top-of-his game Foreman solidified him as one of the greatest.
3. Joe Louis - 26 title defenses? Forget it.
4. Jack Johnson - Did it when men where men. Boxing was a different game then (if you want to call it that). The end of his career was disappointing and tragic to say the least.
5. Tyson - No one ever could touch him in his prime, but he has since ruined his legacy. Unfortunately, he can't be ranked much higher.
6. Foreman - Most powerful puncher ever. His comeback will go unprecidented for years to come.
7. Frazier - Straight up beat Ali. There's something to be said for taht.
8. Lewis - The loss to Rahman hurts him, but he did the wise thing and left at the top of his game.
9. Holyfield - Please stop fighting.
10. Vitali Klitchko - Time will tell. The Lewis fight spoke volumes for his skill.

I'd say that Marciano should be a little higher on the totem pole considering he faced reasonable opposition, never lost, and was the only heavyweight champion in boxing history to retire as the champ with an undefeated record.

This is really hard and off the top of my head, I would say:

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Foreman
4. Dempsey
5. Liston
6. Holmes
7. Jack Johnson
8. Max Schmelling
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Evander Holyfield

would be my pics. I expect to see some angry criticism I suppose. Rocky Marciano was overrated to the max.

My top 10 HW all time could be like this:

1) Ali
2) Joe Louis
3) Jack Johnson
4) Jack Dempsey
5) George Foreman
6) Mike Tyson (My preferred HW, but unfortunaly he could not be the best for many reasons, you know..)
7) Larry Holmes
8) Joe Frazier
9) Rocky Marciano
10) Lennox Lewis

#1 Marciano - Undefeated Heavyweight Champ - That record will go unmatched for a LONG LONG TIME. Think 100 pt game in basketball
#2 Lennox Lewis (faced all the greats of his time, only lost twice and avenged both)
#3 Ali - I think he was to much of a mouth. To much of a chicken shit to go fight in Nam but liked fighting in the ring. Pussy
#4 George Foreman - Great Champ with a wonderful personality
#5 Jack Dempsey
#6 Iron Mike - The count on Douglas was slow and he was never the same after Cus died
#7 Evander Holyfield - Evander if there is anyway you are reading this, please retire.
#8 Joe Fraz - He met his match with Foreman but Fraz was a great champ
#9 Joe Louis - Great Champ
#10 Klitchko - We will have to see on this one. Time will tell.

#1 Marciano - Undefeated Heavyweight Champ - That record will go unmatched for a LONG LONG TIME. Think 100 pt game in basketball
#2 Lennox Lewis (faced all the greats of his time, only lost twice and avenged both)
#3 Ali - I think he was to much of a mouth. To much of a chicken shit to go fight in Nam but liked fighting in the ring. Pussy
#4 George Foreman - Great Champ with a wonderful personality
#5 Jack Dempsey
#6 Iron Mike - The count on Douglas was slow and he was never the same after Cus died
#7 Evander Holyfield - Evander if there is anyway you are reading this, please retire.
#8 Joe Fraz - He met his match with Foreman but Fraz was a great champ
#9 Joe Louis - Great Champ
#10 Klitchko - We will have to see on this one. Time will tell.


You are a ****ing idiot.........

















go watch some real boxing and learn

You callin ali a pussy? ur a pussy

Marciano b4 Louis? wtf
Marciano just beat up bums his whole career

Prime Louis KO's Marciano

Really, how do you know? Where you there? No so shut the **** up.

Marciano beat Louis.

Isn't my fault he didn't know when to retire.

In fact you are such a stupid **** I don't expect much out of you. Keep typing you internet soldier. Stupid dumb ass.

Matter of fact the guy was asking for people's opinion.

Learn to ****ing read. Everybody has their own views.

Shouldn't you be in school? Be it in "Ali style, slow class" or gradeschool. Window licking short bus rider :<

Top 10 of Champs I've seen - to me, a great champ is based on talent, influence on the sport, dominance during their primes and eras, and length of reign.

1. Ali - if only he didn't lose the best 3 years of his fight life. I'm convinced young Ali could dominate anyone during his era, as long as he fought smart. Pretty much changed the way people believed boxing should be fought with his innovative style.

2. Louis - incredible reign of title defenses, great power in both hands, amazing quickness.

3. Marciano - never gave up, incredible warrior - especially at 135 - fought and beat the best of his time, including charles, walcott, and an old Louis. I'm surprised that people don't respect the rock - 49 wins, 43 KOs. He didn't fight anyone? He fought and knocked out 3 former champs, which is more than I can say for Tyson - yet Tyson gets so much respect and the Rock doesn't.

4. Lewis - Despite some questionable losses - avenged them, and when on his game, dominated all 90's competition - including the best.

5. Johnson - Amazing defensive specialist, and was just so much bigger than fighters of his era. Way ahead of his time.

6. Holyfield - Mainly a sentimental pick, my personal favorite fighters because of his great heart and never die mentality. Fights with Riddick Bowe and Tyson define him.

7. Dempsey - Created the style that marciano, frazier and tyson would follow, one of the most charismatic champs ever.

8. Frazier - another sentimental pick - sure people will complain that he's ahead of foreman, but Frazier was much more diverse, and just had a much better flow to his style. He could give the great boxers a tough time, Foreman couldn't.

9. Tunney - Not an active champ but beat the best.

10. Foreman - Pure intimdation, could beat any slugger in heavyweight history, but would get destroyed by the boxers.

Some very questionable ones I've seen posted - Ezzard Charles, without mentioning Walcott, and also Floyd Patterson? No way - might as well put Roy Jones in there if you're going to include Patterson. Young Tyson might deserve to be on there, but I can't overlook the fact that he lost to Buster Douglas and has never beaten a great fighter in his prime.

1.dempsey ( none could have handled HIM in his prime) maybe ali
2. ali beacuse he was the greatest
3.marciano because he was undefeated
4.holmes would have beat marciano,s record (the fix was in)
5.louis was great champion
6.tyson could have been the greatest EVER
7.???
8. WHO CARES
9. THAT,S MY LIST

1.Joe Louis
2.Muhammad Ali
3.Larry Holmes
4.Jack Johnson
5.George Foreman
6.Joe Frazier
7.Rocky Marciano
8.Lennox Lewis
9.Evander Holyfield
10.Jack Dempsey

well here goes1.marciano2.louis3.dempsey4.holmes5.ali6.johns on7.foreman8.frazier9.tunney10.lewis..11.liston 12.tyson13.charles14.holyfield15.walcott

This thread is a joke.
Mike Tyson is the greatest
of all time and should be
rated #1. Nobody dominated like
Tyson when he was champ. NOBODY.

This thread is a joke.
Mike Tyson is the greatest
of all time and should be
rated #1. Nobody dominated like
Tyson when he was champ. NOBODY.


Nut
Hug-
ger

Nut
Hug-
ger



ok name one heavyweight that
dominated his opponenets and
had them shitting in their pants
the way that tyson did for 4 years.
you cant because nobody else did it.
NOBODY

ok name one heavyweight that
dominated his opponenets and
had them shitting in their pants
the way that tyson did for 4 years.
you cant because nobody else did it.
NOBODY



Tyson was nasty in his prime, but how many top tier opponents has he beaten?

Tyson was nasty in his prime, but how many top tier opponents has he beaten?


You got to be kidding. He beat Larry Holmes
who is one of the greatest of all time. And he
wiped out a hall of famer in 90 seconds(Spinks).
Not to mention all the top ten fighters he
destroyed on his way to the championship.

Here is my list:
1. Muhammad Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Rocky Marciano
4. George Foreman
5. Larry Holmes
6. Jack Dempsey
7. Joe Frazier
8. Sonny Liston
9. Jack Johnson
10. Evander Holyfield
11. Mike Tyson
12. Gene Tunney
13. Jim Jeffries
14. Lennox Lewis
15. Jersey Joe Walcott

Stop making out as if Tyson is so damn great. "He beat an atg in larry holmes" -- holmes was way past it.
Michael spinks was GREAT at LH, not HW.
Tyson's opposition dont compare to my top 10 list, and he never got off the canvas. He was a gREAt fighter no doubt, but he has his flaws.

1.dempsey ( none could have handled HIM in his prime) maybe ali
2. ali beacuse he was the greatest
3.marciano because he was undefeated
4.holmes would have beat marciano,s record (the fix was in)
5.louis was great champion
6.tyson could have been the greatest EVER
7.???
8. WHO CARES
9. THAT,S MY LIST

Thats pretty sad if you say "who cares". Dempsey was very vulnerable in his prime. Foreman would have beaten him (bad styles clash), Ali would have, and i think Holmes and Louis probably would have too. Marciano would have been a war.

This thread is a joke.
Mike Tyson is the greatest
of all time and should be
rated #1. Nobody dominated like
Tyson when he was champ. NOBODY.
LMAO!
Nuthugger.
So why isnt his reign as long as Louis, or Holmes, or ali? And his quality of opposition is second tier.

wassup fellow boxing heads. My list of top ten are mainly all hard hitting aggressive fighters because that's what i think makes a great fighter.
1.) Muhammad Ali - although i did say hard hitting agressive fighters are what makes a fighter great, the fact that Ali fought against those type of guys doing the complete opposite and winning makes him the greatest.
2.)Mike Tyson - Iron mike may have suffered brutal losses in his last few fights, but back in the day he was a wrecking ball that no one could last a full twelve with until don king and lawers screwed his head up.
3.) Joe Louis - The brown bomber is my father's favorite. 68-3, he ran through opponents, and would've ran through Marciano if he was younger.
4.) Rocky Marciano - 49-0 speaks for itself. Gotta give respect to that.
5.)George Foreman - Big George was one of the most intimidating fighters of all time. Haymaker after haymaker, this guy couldn't be stopped even in his 40's
6.) Sonny Liston - Sonny Liston was a beast. Before the fight began he would scare the crap out of his opponents, and then knock em out.
7.) Joe Frazier - Smoking Joe was real cool with me. He was able to take multiple blows to the head and still come through and knock you out.
8.) Larry Holmes - You simply just gotta give him a big round of applause. My man was fighting from '73 to '02 and retired with 69 wins and only 4 losses!!!
9.) Jack Johnson - Great fighter, and you gotta love him for showing the world just how equally good us african americans are at boxing. You gotta at least respect him unless your some type of racist.
10.Lennox Lewis - i'm not a fan of Lennox. In fact i hate him, but i do know that he ruthlessly ruled the heavyweight division and retired for no reason. When i was watchin the last fight of his career i thought that Klitscko was the man, but watching him fight now, i think Lewis should come out of retirement and knock out that bum and his brother.

-popsikal, aka c-dough, aka the highschooler

1.tyson
2.tyson
3.tyson
4.tyson
5.tyson
6.tyson
7.tyson
8.tyson
9.tyson
10.tyson
oh and number 11 is
tyson

1.tyson
2.tyson
3.tyson
4.tyson
5.tyson
6.tyson
7.tyson
8.tyson
9.tyson
10.tyson
oh and number 11 is
tyson

Gee great list. Are you a Tyson fan at all?

I might have to agree with Pugnacious_Z. He may be right

I might have to agree with Pugnacious_Z. He may be right
Are you being serious or not? Cos damn you are uneducated in and unaware of boxing history if you think that.

Just ****in around dog. Relax

Here are my top ten..

1)Ali (the great one)
2)Rocky Marciano
3)Joe Louis
4)Jack Dempsey
5)Jack Johnson
6)Joe Frazier
7)George Foreman
8)Evander Holyfield
9)Ken Norton
10)Mike Tyson

My top twenty are:
1 Muhammad Ali
2 Joe Louis
3 Rocky Marciano
4 George Foreman
5 Lennox Lewis
6 Jack Johnson
7 Mike Tyson
8 Joe Frazier
9 Teofilo Stevenson
10 Jack Dempsey
11 Evander Holyfield
12 Sonny Liston
13 Larry Holmes
14 Felix Savon
15 John L Sullivan
16 Gene Tunney
17 Floyd Patterson
18 Jim Jeffries
19 Ken Norton
20 Jim Corbett.
If you take out the amateurs then the next two would be Riddick Bowe & Joe Walcott.
I agree Foreman would knock out Marciano but most of these fighters have lost to lower ranked fighters.

Welcome to BoxingScene!

my top 10 are:

1. Joe Louis (longest reign and most defenses ever)
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Rocky Marciano
4. Jack Dempsey
5. Jack Johnson
6. Mike Tyson
7. Larry Holmes
8. Evander Holyfield
9. George Foreman
10. Joe Frazier

i hate lennox lewis, but ill put him up there if you want...

1. Marciano
2. Ali
3. Foreman
4. Louis
5. Dempsey
6. Frazier
7. Holmes
8. Holyfield
9. Liston
10. Charles

1. Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. George foreman
4. Larry Holmes
5. Rocky Marciano
6. Lennox Lewis
7. Evander Holyfield
8. Joe Frazier
9. Mike Tyson
10. Sonny Liston

Tyson does not deserve to be in top 10...

I know....hes probably in the top 50 and he is probably number 50..

I'm laughing at some of the negative comments made concerning Iron Mike...."maybe top 50?" WTF?? Pure, unadulturated bias.

1. Joe Louis: simply put, the most complete heavyweight fighter I
have ever seen. Yeah, he had the Bum-of-the-Month club, but he
was so technically sound.
2. Muhammed Ali: Awesome feet, incredibly fast hands (although
his flicking jab is not like throwing a three punch power
combo), incredible heart and arrogance. He fought great
competition and won almost every time, although he
definately was given his share of "gift" decisions.
3. Foreman: Two distict title reigns are very impressive. He was
simply a monster back in his day (although he is average-sized
compared to the last couple decades). Hardest one-punch hitter
ever.
4. Holmes: Awesome jab, incredible generalship, heart. Very solid
chin. He could've beat Ali when Ali was younger. His KO loss
to Tyson hurts a bit because he was still a very, very good
fighter even at his age. He showed by going on and winning
several fights against top-10 fighters.
5. Marciano: 49-0 (43 KOs) Hard to dispute the facts. He often
gets knocked for not having fought "elite competition" but
then again so did Louis and Holmes, Tyson and others. In fact,
writers tend to say this about anyone but those who fought
during the 1970s
6. Jack Johnson, a fighter who fought before modern times yet
still had the skills of modern fighters. His defense was
outstanding, however consider the crude skills of the type of
fighter he usually fought. Still, Johnson is an all-time
great.
7. Mike Tyson: He was the most complete fighter since Louis in
terms of skill and technical prowess. He was the greatest
puncher since Louis. Every punch was thrown correctly and on
balance. His environment and personal losses contributed to a
shorter prime. However, no fighter has been more dominant
during their prime years. He could have been rated up there
with Louis and Ali, but unfortunately personal problems would
never allow this to happen.
8. Lennox Lewis: A great, highly skilled giant. His sheer size
and ability makes him the odds on favorite in head-to-head mat
ches. He beat both Holyfield and Tyson (although Iron Mike was
so far faded it hardly counts). Still, Lewis was a master
general in the ring and really only lost when he got lazy. He
was lucky enough to get the rematches and proved he was the
superior fighter to both men.
9. Jack Dempsey: A mauler who originated the bob and weave
technique employed by Frazier and (somewhat, considering
Tyson's style was a little different) Tyson, he was hugely
popular. He could, however be KO'd. He didnt fight often
enough as champion, but his legendary excitement warrants
status; his skills and aggressive style are enduring.
10. Holyfield/Frazier: I cant decide. Frazier was great, had a
lethal left hook and was dogged. His style was made to give
Ali fits. He got annihilated by Big George. Holyfield was all
heart and incredible skills. He orginally fought at a
cruiser, but his fram is definately big enough to be a
legitimate heavyweight. He has been up and down during his
reign, but has always provided excitement. He should have
retired a few years ago.

Honorable Mentions: Liston, Jeffries, Tunney, Jersy Joe Walcott, Moore, Norton, Smith, Langford, Patterson, Baer

wow ken norton at 10 over tyson, lewis, liston

Ali
Louis
Holmes
Holyfield
Marciano
Liston
Frazier
Tyson
Lewis
Foreman

My list is the true list of all time great heavyweight champs:

1) Muhammad Ali
2) Sonny Liston
3) Joe Louis
4) Jack Johnson
5) Larry Holmes
6) George Foreman
7) Mike Tyson
8) Joe Frazier
9) Jack Dempsey
10) Rocky Marciano

My list is the true list of all time great heavyweight champs:

1) Muhammad Ali
2) Sonny Liston
3) Joe Louis
4) Jack Johnson
5) Larry Holmes
6) George Foreman
7) Mike Tyson
8) Joe Frazier
9) Jack Dempsey
10) Rocky Marciano

Why is the true list? :confused:

because it is. Number 1 could beat 2, and 2 beat 3, and 3 4, and so on.

Jeffries was the forerunner of the modern athelete, strong and lightning fast. Videos of him are rare. I would like to have seen him fight Johnson both in prime. I think because of the Johnson/Jeffries fight, Jeff is underrated, Johnson overrated. Johnson had no chin but thick skin as he did take a lot of crap.

jeffries? are you serious? he was trash. he is trash because he was small, slow and overrated because he was white and he was supposed to be the great white hope. johnson exposed him. and even though they say jeffries was old, jeffries said himself he couldn't beat johnson in his prime. the first real great heavyweight was jack johnson, all others were bums my grandma could beat. get over it!

1)ali
2)louis
3)maricano
4)tyson
5)foreman
6)frazier
7)liston
8)holmes
9)max baer
10)lewis

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Dempsey
4. Jack Johnson
5. Foreman
6. Marciano
7. Frazier
8. Liston
9. Tyson
10. Holmes

I have two lists. One is the KO ratio of ten champions. The other is the total time as undisputed champion for those same ten. By undisputed, I mean the universal champion or holding at least 3 out of 4 of the world title belts. To be on the list a champion had to be undisputed for a total of at least 2 years. Holmes, Foreman, and Liston don't make the cut.


KO ratio
1. Marciano 88%
2. Tyson 79%
3. Louis 76%
4. Frazier 73%
5. Lennox Lewis 73%
6. Jack Dempsey 65%
7. Floyd Patterson 63%
8. Ali 61%
9. Holyfield 52%
10. Jack Johnson 44%

Time as champ
1. Louis 11y 9m
2. Dempsey 7y 2m
3. Johnson 6y 4m
4. Patterson 4y 10m
5. Ali 3y 10m
6. Marciano 3y 7m
7. Frazier 2y 11m
8. Tyson 2y 6m
9. Lewis 2y 3m
10. Holyfield 2y 1m

For determining the ten greatest in order, I think duration as undisputed champ is the most important. But you can combine it with KO ratio or several other factors to make up your own mind.

[[[I have two lists. One is the KO ratio of ten champions. The other is the total time as undisputed champion for those same ten.]]]
============================

Interesting concept, but you forgot Jeffries, 5 yr 338 days/68% and Willard 4 yrs 90 days/57%. Seeing as it's almost impossible in the modern era to unify a title, I conclude being undisputed is not a good criteria for overall judgement. KO% is a good way though it tends to penalize the stylists a bit. The reason is that a guy like Louis or Tyson rarely if ever win controversially like an Ali did, though even Ali's KOs sometimes were controversial. However you have to normalize for the era. For example, Jeffries and Dempsey fought in the NC era and had one of the highest KO% of their eras. Modern fights are stopped earlier and KO% have risen because of it.

The number of title fights is a better indicator of excellence, though again, the modern era has many more title fights because of the split belts and modern rules.

jeffries? are you serious? he was trash. he is trash because he was small, slow and overrated because he was white and he was supposed to be the great white hope. johnson exposed him. and even though they say jeffries was old, jeffries said himself he couldn't beat johnson in his prime. the first real great heavyweight was jack johnson, all others were bums my grandma could beat. get over it!
Kid, empty trash cans always make the most noise. Just have your granny give you a kick to verify this.

In Jeff's 3rd pro fight he knocked out Hank Griffin and later won a lopsided 4 rd decision over him when Jeff held the belt. Johnson was 0-1-2 against Griffin. In Jeff's 8th pro fight he drew against Choynski in a 20 rd brawl. Past prime Choynski knocked Jack Johnson cold for 5 mins. Mexican Pete Everett could only last 3 rds against Jeffries, but he made the 20 rd limit against Johnson.

Facts are that Jeff was a natural talent from his first fight on. Johnson had a lot of setbacks and had to learn to fight defensively to protect a soft chin. When you look at the overlap in their careers and common fighters, Jeff dominates and it ain't even close. If it wasn't for Jeff being lured out of retirement for huge money and the White Hope Hype penned by Jack London, Johnson would be nothing but a footnote in history. His title reign was the weakest in history next to Tommy Burns. This was hammered home when an inexperienced raw cowboy name Willard knocked him dead for another 5 min.

Kid, empty trash cans always make the most noise. Just have your granny give you a kick to verify this.

In Jeff's 3rd pro fight he knocked out Hank Griffin and later won a lopsided 4 rd decision over him when Jeff held the belt. Johnson was 0-1-2 against Griffin. In Jeff's 8th pro fight he drew against Choynski in a 20 rd brawl. Past prime Choynski knocked Jack Johnson cold for 5 mins. Mexican Pete Everett could only last 3 rds against Jeffries, but he made the 20 rd limit against Johnson.

Facts are that Jeff was a natural talent from his first fight on. Johnson had a lot of setbacks and had to learn to fight defensively to protect a soft chin. When you look at the overlap in their careers and common fighters, Jeff dominates and it ain't even close. If it wasn't for Jeff being lured out of retirement for huge money and the White Hope Hype penned by Jack London, Johnson would be nothing but a footnote in history. His title reign was the weakest in history next to Tommy Burns. This was hammered home when an inexperienced raw cowboy name Willard knocked him dead for another 5 min.

no way was jeffries better than johnson. johnson took a dive in that fight because some whites said they would kill his wife if they didn't.

the only reason jeff was good was cuz he hit hard. johnson would outbox him any day in his life

the original post is same with mine, but i would put dempsey ahead of holyfield

1.Joe Louis
2.Muhammad Ali
3.Rocky Marciano
4.George Foreman
5.Joe Frazier
6.Larry Holmes
7.Sonny Liston
8.Lennox Lewis
9.Evander Holyfield
10.Jack Johnson

ALi
Tyson
Marciano
Frazier
Foreman
Liston
Patterson
Louis
Holmes
Johnson

you put patterson ahead of louis! what the hell did patterson do that made him so great

My list is the true list of all time great heavyweight champs:

1) Muhammad Ali
2) Sonny Liston
3) Joe Louis
4) Jack Johnson
5) Larry Holmes
6) George Foreman
7) Mike Tyson
8) Joe Frazier
9) Jack Dempsey
10) Rocky Marciano

i'll change some of that.

1) Muhammad Ali
2) Sonny Liston
3) Larry Holmes
4) George Foreman
5) Joe Frazier
6) Mike Tyson
7) Jack Johnson
8) Joe Louis
9) Evander Holyfield
10) Lennox Lewis

1) Muhammad Ali
2) Sonny Liston
3) Larry Holmes
4) George Foreman
5) Joe Frazier
6) Mike Tyson
7) Jack Johnson
8) Joe Louis
9) Evander Holyfield
10) Lennox Lewis

Sonny Liston above Joe Louis? Jack Johnson present when Dempsey and Marciano are missing?


:bsflag:

I've been reading some of your earlier posts on this thread and am embarassed by your lack of historical knowledge in boxing. Jim Jeffries small? He was one of the naturally strongest men who've won the title. His dimensions were huge and he never lifted a weight. In terms of endurance he was a 6'1" 220 lb Rocky Marciano.

http://www.ibop.tv/gallery/images/Jim%20Jeffries%204_jpg.jpg

http://coxscorner.tripod.com/Images/jeff1.jpg

http://coxscorner.tripod.com/Images/jeffries1900.jpg

Yep, a real twerp!

1) Muhammad Ali
2) Sonny Liston
3) Larry Holmes
4) George Foreman
5) Joe Frazier
6) Mike Tyson
7) Jack Johnson
8) Joe Louis
9) Evander Holyfield
10) Lennox Lewis

Sonny Liston above Joe Louis? Jack Johnson present when Dempsey and Marciano are missing?


:bsflag:

liston is too big for louis and his hands are too fast for louis to avoid them, and he has ko power. johnson would embarass and destroy dempsey and marciano. marciano was unskilled and small, and dempsey was not as fast as johnson and kind of small, plus johnson could tie you up pretty easily to the point that you would get frustrated.

liston is too big for louis and his hands are too fast for louis to avoid them, and he has ko power. johnson would embarass and destroy dempsey and marciano. marciano was unskilled and small, and dempsey was not as fast as johnson and kind of small, plus johnson could tie you up pretty easily to the point that you would get frustrated.
i disagree i believe marciano would knock johnson out but thats also a hard fight to call because they fought in two totally different times but the reason johnson was good was because he was 6'0 or 6'1 and the average heavy weight was 5'7 i think Marciano would knock johnson out, know dempsey marciano that would be a fight

my top 10 heavyweights (first three are in that order the rest are in no paticular order)

Marciano
Louis
Foreman
Holmes
Tyson
Ali or Frazier
frazier or ali
Jersey Joe Walcott
ezzard charles
Archie Moore (i don't remember if he was heavy or light heavy but he packed a wallop)

not to take away from johnson's skill as a boxer

ut thats also a hard fight to call because they fought in two totally different times but the reason johnson was good was because he was 6'0 or 6'1 and the average heavy weight was 5'7 i think Marciano would knock johnson out, know dempsey marciano that would be a fight


That is just not true. The average heavyweight was about 5'11", 6' or so, and there were many who were 6'2" and taller. In fact the only notable 5'7" heavyweight at the time was Tommy Burns if I recall correctly.

Johnson was good because he had great defensive skills, was as strong as a bull, and could really punch.

His only fault was a weak jaw. A lack of a chin is one of the reasons I favor both Marciano and especially Dempsey over him. The other is that I just don't see his flatfooted parrying style being effective against either man. You needed movement and a good jab against Marciano and Dempsey. You could not expect to stand in front of either and go the distance.

That is just not true. The average heavyweight was about 5'11", 6' or so, and there were many who were 6'2" and taller. In fact the only notable 5'7" heavyweight at the time was Tommy Burns if I recall correctly.

Johnson was good because he had great defensive skills, was as strong as a bull, and could really punch.

His only fault was a weak jaw. A lack of a chin is one of the reasons I favor both Marciano and especially Dempsey over him. The other is that I just don't see his flatfooted parrying style being effective against either man. You needed movement and a good jab against Marciano and Dempsey. You could not expect to stand in front of either and go the distance.

excuse me, johnson flatfooted? he wasn't a dancer like sugar ray robinson or ali, but he certainly wasn't flatfooted. he moved constantly and he had lightning fast reflexes, faster than dempsey's and especially faster than marciano's.

He was definitely flatfooted. More so than Joe Louis. That's just the way he fought, it was his style. He was a power counter puncher. He moved to some degree but he was never, ever up on his toes. He was no Gene Tunney that's for sure, and that's what you needed to be to stay away from Dempsey. Tom Gibbons was a much better mover than Johnson and even he couldn't escape Dempsey's fury.

I don't see Johnson surviving Dempsey's assault, not with that style. Johnson never faced a bodypuncher like Jack Dempsey. The picking and parrying works well against guys who are headhunters but without mobility the body is always a viable target. When the opponent is Jack Dempsey, whose hands weren't much slower than Johnson's, it becomes increasingly dangerous to try and catch and parry those punches.

Dempsey would wear him out with a body attack and stop him/KO him late in the fight.

He was definitely flatfooted. More so than Joe Louis. That's just the way he fought, it was his style. He was a power counter puncher. He moved to some degree but he was never, ever up on his toes. He was no Gene Tunney that's for sure, and that's what you needed to be to stay away from Dempsey. Tom Gibbons was a much better mover than Johnson and even he couldn't escape Dempsey's fury.

I don't see Johnson surviving Dempsey's assault, not with that style. Johnson never faced a bodypuncher like Jack Dempsey. The picking and parrying works well against guys who are headhunters but without mobility the body is always a viable target. When the opponent is Jack Dempsey, whose hands weren't much slower than Johnson's, it becomes increasingly dangerous to try and catch and parry those punches.

Dempsey would wear him out with a body attack and stop him/KO him late in the fight.

worst post ever. so dempsey wasn't a headhunter? johnson moved well, when he needed to, he didn't waste energy by dancing around all the time, if dempsey threw a punch, johnson would quickly tie him up and frustrate him. you're fighting a losing battle, dempsey wasn't that good, someone like johnson could tie up any big puncher that was smaller than him, like dempsey was. and dempsey had a glass chin too, so how do you know johnson wouldn't overwhelm him, which he would, cause johnson is bigger and taller and more powerful and faster and has quicker reflexes. it's no contest.

i remember from a documentary that johnson hed his feet weel plantet on the canvas, i think the guy is slightly overrated as boxer because he was the first black champion.

i dont see him beating either marciano ore dempsey.

top ten

ali
louis
marciano

the 3 first are in no particular order, hard to decide.

foreman
frazier
liston
holmes
dempsey
tunney
lewis

top ten

ali
louis
marciano

the 3 first are in no particular order, hard to decide.

foreman
frazier
liston
holmes
dempsey
tunney
lewis

why is marciano in your top three? marciano is better that foreman, frazier, liston, holmes, dempsey, and lewis? i don't think so. they all would crush marciano with no problem at all.

why is marciano in your top three? marciano is better that foreman, frazier, liston, holmes, dempsey, and lewis? i don't think so. they all would crush marciano with no problem at all.

I can definitely agree with Leff's top 3.

I can definitely agree with Leff's top 3.
i'll repeat myself. marciano can beat foreman, liston, holmes, frazier, tyson, louis, johnson, holyfield, dempsey, lewis, ect ect ect?

i'll repeat myself. marciano can beat foreman, liston, holmes, frazier, tyson, louis, johnson, holyfield, dempsey, lewis, ect ect ect?


marciaon could probably beat dempsey,tunney,johnson,frazier,liston and tyson.

i see him getting trouble from lewis ali and holmes

marciaon could probably beat dempsey,tunney,johnson,frazier,liston and tyson.

i see him getting trouble from lewis ali and holmes

no sense arguing with a marciano lover.

Dempsey a glass-chinned headhunter?

For your own sake please stop here. You might look back on this post in a few years, when you've learned a little more about the sport's history, and cringe at your words.

For the purpose of your education, Dempsey was at his best on the inside and was a tremendous body puncher. If boxing matches were fought inside phone booths, Dempsey would have retired undefeated. Short blindingly fast punches thrown with complete bodyweight behind them were his specialty. His chin has always been considered well above average, and his recovery was astounding, perhaps the best of any heavyweight champion. You are the first person I've ever heard to suggest that Dempsey had a glass chin. Congratulations.

You've likely only seen him against Willard where 1. He was fighting a giant and so was forced to fight on the outside in the first moments of that fight 2. Caved in his cheek bone with the first flush hook that landed, and so he went out of his way to knock Willard out while he had him hurt. Yes he was wild in that fight because Willard was momentarily defenseless (showing primte Dempsey's great fighting instinct and awareness of his opponents condition) and had no way of hurting him back. You can see that in the second and third rounds where Willard has regained his senses and Dempsey, in reaction, boxes conservatively.

Your top ten list shows an apparent lack of knowledge concerning boxing pre-1960's, but you seem like a decent enough guy so it's forgivable. Stick to writing about Ali and leave the top ten lists to people who are more objective in their debates, who've done research (fight films and essays written by men who've actually seen these guys fight live), and are more interested in the truth than in some ulterior motive as in your case (your motive being building up Ali and his opponents of course).

I apologize if that comes across as harsh, but that's just how I see your list.

no sense arguing with a marciano lover.

LOL!

Shit Butterfly...99.9% of the posts that I've read from you has to with your "love" for Ali, and YOU accuse somebody else of being bias towards a fighter?

That's comical, man.

Dempsey a glass-chinned headhunter?

For your own sake please stop here. You might look back on this post in a few years, when you've learned a little more about the sport's history, and cringe at your words.

For the purpose of your education, Dempsey was at his best on the inside and was a tremendous body puncher. If boxing matches were fought inside phone booths, Dempsey would have retired undefeated. Short blindingly fast punches thrown with complete bodyweight behind them were his specialty. His chin has always been considered well above average, and his recovery was astounding, perhaps the best of any heavyweight champion. You are the first person I've ever heard to suggest that Dempsey had a glass chin. Congratulations.

You've likely only seen him against Willard where 1. He was fighting a giant and so was forced to fight on the outside in the first moments of that fight 2. Caved in his cheek bone with the first flush hook that landed, and so he went out of his way to knock Willard out while he had him hurt. Yes he was wild in that fight because Willard was momentarily defenseless (showing primte Dempsey's great fighting instinct and awareness of his opponents condition) and had no way of hurting him back. You can see that in the second and third rounds where Willard has regained his senses and Dempsey, in reaction, boxes conservatively.

Your top ten list shows an apparent lack of knowledge concerning boxing pre-1960's, but you seem like a decent enough guy so it's forgivable. Stick to writing about Ali and leave the top ten lists to people who are more objective in their debates, who've done research (fight films and essays written by men who've actually seen these guys fight live), and are more interested in the truth than in some ulterior motive as in your case (your motive being building up Ali and his opponents of course).

I apologize if that comes across as harsh, but that's just how I see your list.

cute post kid achilles, but if he had a strong chin, then how come firpo knocked him down like twelve times. firpo is not that big a puncher. if he had a strong chin as you say then he wouldn't be knocked down. and tunney? tunney's even worse. he can't punch at all, and he knocked dempsey down. if he had a chin he wouldn't be floored by the soft punching marine. and i'm building up ali and his opponents? i don't think i am, maybe because they were that good? just because i put them in the top ten doesn't mean i'm building them up. basically everyone on this boxing forum would have foreman and frazier in the top ten, so i'm definetely not building them up. holmes is arguably the most underrated boxer ever, so i believe he is top ten material. liston is also, like foreman someone only seen as a bafoon who got embarrased by ali, but if you watch him in his prime, the speed, power and accuracy of his punches, and the heart he showed prior to and after the ali fights then you would have him as a top ten as well, so no you're all wrong.

LOL!

Shit Butterfly...99.9% of the posts that I've read from you has to with your "love" for Ali, and YOU accuse somebody else of being bias towards a fighter?

That's comical, man.

i can understand someone liking and admiring marciano, there's nothing wrong with that. but to have him beating foreman, liston, tyson, and others would you know would be too big, strong, fast, and skilled for him and would crush him in two rounds or less, is just plain stupid! :cool:

no sense arguing with a marciano lover.

lol and that comes from the world biggest ali lover, yeah sure i love the rock but i dont live in ali`s ass like you

i can understand someone liking and admiring marciano, there's nothing wrong with that. but to have him beating foreman, liston, tyson, and others would you know would be too big, strong, fast, and skilled for him and would crush him in two rounds or less, is just plain stupid! :cool:


uuuum

didnt say foreman

uuuum

didnt say foreman

i don't mean just you, but marciano lovers in general on this forum.

how about ali lovers than?

how about ali lovers than?

one could make a case for ali being the greatest. he beat the best competition, bar none. he was the fastest moving and fastest hitting hw. he could hit somewhat hard. he shocked the world twice against liston and foreman, and he cleaned out two decades of boxing. what did marciano do? he cleaned out arguably the weakest modern era of boxing where the top contenders were all blown up, and everyone weighed 180 to 189 or so. he defended the title six times and then retired. so who is more the greatest, ali or marciano?

We can make a case for Marciano being the best. Undefeated, KTFO Joe Louis (old or not), highest win-knockout ratio, broke bones, almost killed people, beat Ali in the computer fight (scripted is under debate), and the most determined fighter.

:bottle:

Firpo not a strong puncher? Again you're the first person I've ever encountered to try and claim that. He was the Foreman of his times, who beat better boxers on brute power alone. You pull facts out of your ass, but you don't really know what you're talking about. As for Tunney, he hit about as hard as your hero Ali, not extremely hard for a heavyweight but he would put a guy on his ass if his right hand landed flush, or at least stagger him.

You dig yourself deeper with every post you make. Half truths and bullshit is all you can throw at me. That's your debating style. Make some shit up and then make more shit up to try and smother your opponent's arguments. It's tiresome to deal with, so I'm done with this thread.

We can make a case for Marciano being the best. Undefeated, KTFO Joe Louis (old or not), highest win-knockout ratio, broke bones, almost killed people, beat Ali in the computer fight (scripted is under debate), and the most determined fighter.

:bottle:

undefeated, undefeated, undefeated. that's all you marciano fans ever talk about. well, where you wan't to ignore it or not, ali had the potential to be unbeaten too, and he wouldn't be fighting the bums that marciano did. he was stripped of his prime years, where he would have stayed in shape and wouldnot have lost to frazier or norton, or spinks, then he would have retired. UNDEFEATED!

lol. I'm not against Ali at all. Him and Marciano are my favorite boxers, I'm just saying Marciano is considered the best by many people. As for my opinion; thats tough to decide. Louis, Ali, or Marciano. Robinson somewhere in there if you want to count any weight class.

undefeated, undefeated, undefeated. that's all you marciano fans ever talk about. well, where you wan't to ignore it or not, ali had the potential to be unbeaten too, and he wouldn't be fighting the bums that marciano did. he was stripped of his prime years, where he would have stayed in shape and wouldnot have lost to frazier or norton, or spinks, then he would have retired. UNDEFEATED!

thee greatest thee greatest thee greatest,he danced and stung, thats all u ali fans ever talk about if he was so great why did he have to convince ppl that he was the greatest? Marciano was humble and never disrespected anyone

Marciano was the best guy in and out of the ring
sure his hand speed wasn't the greatest and he didn't have good boxing skills but i'm not talking about the best boxers we're talking about best heavywieghts and I know marciano was better then foreman but foreman is my 2nd favorite fighter

so even if you reply saying this is the worst post u ever read Marciano was still a more humble fighter and i can see him beating a prime ali

so i'll repost tomorrow arguing what ur response is of course :boxing:

like archie moore said "marciano's style was wam bam i don't give a damn" and everybody always talks about how all he fought was bums but Jersey Joe Walcott in there first fight was in his prime that was his best fight.

"He could hurt you, sure, but it was the quantity of his punches. He just had more stamina than anyone else in those days. He was like a bull with gloves." -archie moore said that and archie moore was a hard hitter (most ko's)
and i'd bet anything that a prime ali didn't have anywhere as much stamina and no where near the heart marciano had

My list changed. It won't be changing again for a while...

...at least, until I build my collection up some more. :)

1. Joe Louis - I think my sig says it all. LOL! But seriously, 25 title defenses over 11 1/2 years as champion. No mortal man ever took his title from him in the ring. A terrifying fighter in his day, some opponents were beaten as soon as they began walking to the ring. Definitely the best finisher in history, as no opponent ever got hurt and escaped the round. Fighters who brought the fight to him were brutally destroyed, while the runners who tried to outbox him found that it was nearly impossible to run from him for 15 full rounds, survive and get the decision all at the same time. The Brown Bomber also has a football team named after him.

2. Muhammad Ali - More than a fighter, he was an entertainer as well. One of only two heavyweights that are well-known for their quotes, as well as their ring ability. The first 3 time heavyweight champion, knocking this man out was found to be next to impossible. Generally agreed to possess: a set of the fastest hands, one of the hardest chins and the biggest mouth in heavyweight history.

3. Joe Frazier - Winner of one of the biggest fights in history. Exciting to watch, even his decisions. Had a heart the size of Asia and a chin of iron and fought one way: in the trenches. Smokin' Joe was said to be the first heavyweight champion since Rocky Marciano to get stronger as the fight progressed.

4. Lennox Lewis - The "Pugilist Specialist". Fought his way up to, and consistently fought at, the elite level of fighters. Always thinking one step ahead of his opponents, fighting him was like playing a game of chess where checkmate is a sledgehammer to your head. Being a larger fighter, Lewis, wisely, fought a smart battle behind his poleaxe jab in order to preserve his stamina. The only real legendary fighter since Larry Holmes.

5. Rocky Marciano - UNDEFEATED. Like it or not, no other heavyweight champion ever achieved the level of consitency that the Rock did. Especially since he did everything "ass backwards". Watching him slug his opponents into submission gives me goosebumps. His punching power, rock-like chin and never say die attitude always made the difference for him when his boxing skill failed.

6. George Foreman - Unbridled RAGE. Foreman is agreed to be the strongest puncher in boxing history. Street punk turned Olympic gold medalist turned 2 time heavyweight champion, Foreman was a picture of raw power tempered with youthful doubt. Came back 21 years after his prime and regained his title with a one punch KO to become the oldest fighter to ever become the champion.

7. Jack Johnson - The Galveston Giant battered and humiliated Tommy Burns to become the first Negro to hold the real world heavyweight title. Aside from the racism and bigotry he faced outside the ring, in the ring, he was nearly unstoppable. He muscled his opponents around the ring, swatted their punches aside and made a mismatch out of nearly every one of his fights. After losing the title, he continued fighting until he was nearly 60 years old.

8. Jack Dempsey - I can't get enough watching Dempsey. His bob and weave defense as he crawled his way in was certainly ahead of its time. He was deceptively fast and his hand speed is the stuff of legend. Against Jess Willard, he proved that his punch could crack just about any jaw. Against Luis Firpo, he proved that his recuperative ability backed him up when his chin let him down. Against Gibbons, he showed that he could win a decision over a "slick boxer" whose plan is to go the distance.

9. Larry Holmes - Spent most of his career frustrated at the fact that he was in Ali's shadow. However, looking at his body of work, one would wonder how that could happen. 20 successful title defenses, 7 year title reign. His is an example of what is expected of a champion. Domination. His ability in the ring is very nearly flawless. Shotgun-like jab, blistering combinations and a damaging right hook. He was like Ali with more power.

10. Still working on it...

thee greatest thee greatest thee greatest,he danced and stung, thats all u ali fans ever talk about if he was so great why did he have to convince ppl that he was the greatest? Marciano was humble and never disrespected anyone

Marciano was the best guy in and out of the ring
sure his hand speed wasn't the greatest and he didn't have good boxing skills but i'm not talking about the best boxers we're talking about best heavywieghts and I know marciano was better then foreman but foreman is my 2nd favorite fighter

so even if you reply saying this is the worst post u ever read Marciano was still a more humble fighter and i can see him beating a prime ali

so i'll repost tomorrow arguing what ur response is of course :boxing:

ok, now what does being huumble have to do with being a better boxer? ali probably had more drive than anyone, including marciano. do you know why? well, most great fighters aspire and strive to be champions and great fighters. but this guy wanted to be the best fighter ever. his goal wasn't to be hw champion, or a great hw champion, or a top 10 hw all-time, or even a top 10 boxer period of all-time, this guy wanted to be the best there is, the best there was and the best there ever will be! that was his only drive. now if a fighter wants to be a great fighter, he would have to really work at it, and have drive like no other. but if a fighter wants to be the best ever, man he is going to have to do alot more than that! and that's what he did. many people believed that ali was a natural talent and gifted and all that. well, and most of ya'll think that i'm the biggest ali nuthugger on this forum, but i will say that he probably was 10 times as uncoordinated as marciano when he first started boxing when he was 12! when he would spar with the other boys in louiville, they kicked his ass, cause he couldn't fight that well. but he had one quality that the other boys didn't have. he was a hard worker. he spent about 5 hours in the gym even when he still was in grade school. he worked at it, and he became better. and soon, he started to beat everyone. he kept getting better and better through hard work. he worked hard on the speed bag to increase his hand speed. he sparred with the smaller kids to increase his foot speed and reflexes. by the time he was 18 he had already won 4 amateur awards in two weight classes, hw ans lhw. one of them were statewide, two of them national and one international (olympics) all because of hard work, not because of natural talent. and he worked hard to become the greatest, because that's what he wanted to become, no less than that. that is just out of this world! frazier beat him, cause ali was suffering from a layoff, and wasn'nt ready yet. norton beat him cause he trained for years just to fight him, and ali lost some of his speed during the layoff, and spinks beat him cause he didn't take him seriously. ali destroyed fighters that would destroy marciano, so how does marciano stand a chance? marciano wouldn't be able to hit him, and if by some luck rocky did catch him, ali's chin wouldn't be bothered, cause ali has one of the top 3 or 4 chins in history! so marciano either couldn't hit him, or hurt him, take your pick. ali's midsection is the strongest in history, by far, if he took foreman's frazier's and chuvalo's punishment. so your argument with marciano is pretty weak compared to mine, ali is lightyears ahead of marciano. in fact foreman is lightyears ahead, so is frazier, holmes, liston, tyson, louis, lewis, holyfield, vit. klitchko, johnson. i'll even pick dempsey to beat marciano, also patterson for that matter.

well he's not the greatest fighter and i beleve that the reason everyone thinks he's #1 instead of like #6 or so is because he convinced ppl he was the greatest, he wasn't thee greatest he didn't have the strenght or heart of marciano, he didn't have larry holmes jab because holmes' jab was actually ali's jab but better, the only thing he did have was a good midsection and footwork and that sounds more defensive then offensive

well he's not the greatest fighter and i beleve that the reason everyone thinks he's #1 instead of like #6 or so is because he convinced ppl he was the greatest, he wasn't thee greatest he didn't have the strenght or heart of marciano, he didn't have larry holmes jab because holmes' jab was actually ali's jab but better, the only thing he did have was a good midsection and footwork and that sounds more defensive then offensive

i guess your backed in the corner so much that now you're spewing lies! holmes had a better jab than ali? just because a 38 year old ali with parkinson's and that was strung out on drugs fought a prime holmes and got crushed, doesn't mean holmes is better."the reason everyone thinks he's #1 instead of like #6 or so is because he convinced ppl he was the greatest". i think you just put your foot in your mouth right there. do you know how he convinced everyone that he's the greatest? because he demonstrated it in the ring. there is an undorstood norm that in sports, athletes evolve over time, but if a prime ali boxed today, he would crush anyone here. if marciano fought today he would be crushed by anyone here! in fact, he would be crushed in any era after the early 50s. ali did things that were thought of as impossible. he beat liston, he beat foreman, he leaned back on punches and were successful, he layed on the ropes and was sucessful. given the circumstances he was in at the time, he had the best legacy, cause louis wasn't stripped of the title and forced into 4 years of inactivity. "ali had a good midsection". name one person with a better one. you can't! ali took foreman's best shots, and foreman punched harder than anyone, including your idol marciano, so he didn't have a good midsection, he ha the best ever! i said it before but ali crushed people that would obliterate marciano, such as liston, foreman, williams, chuvalo, folley, even terrel. he beat people that would crush him like frazier, shavers, norton, and lyle. so how does marciano stand a chance?

i'm not spewing lies
Holmes had a better jab then ali and i've never heard that disputed
i mean that doesn't make holmes better then ali cause i will give u one thing that the fight between holmes and ali should have never happened, and no cause a common saying lately has been saying "if u dug up marciano's bones and put gloves on him he'd reunite the belts", so don't say he'd get crushed cause thats not even true,of course if u dug up alot of old champs they'd reunite the belts cause good heavyweights to day are in short supply, also its not like i'm just sticking with marciano and saying he's the best i can admit that he had flaws too but it seems u can't all u want to do is talk about haow bad he was, he had a good chin and good body and he'd beat ali

i'm not spewing lies
Holmes had a better jab then ali and i've never heard that disputed
i mean that doesn't make holmes better then ali cause i will give u one thing that the fight between holmes and ali should have never happened, and no cause a common saying lately has been saying "if u dug up marciano's bones and put gloves on him he'd reunite the belts", so don't say he'd get crushed cause thats not even true,of course if u dug up alot of old champs they'd reunite the belts cause good heavyweights to day are in short supply, also its not like i'm just sticking with marciano and saying he's the best i can admit that he had flaws too but it seems u can't all u want to do is talk about haow bad he was, he had a good chin and good body and he'd beat ali

if he had a good chin then how come he was knocked down by middleweights? he'd beat ali? you keep saying that, but you have not supported it yet. yet i have bent over backwards to support it, and you haven't. the computer fight was a phony and everyone knows it. ali was throwing bodyshots at rocky, when he barely did that in a fight. ali was a headhunter, especially with guys as short as marciano. only people like cleveland williams and ernie terrel who were 6-6 ali would hit the body, so that was a fake. the whole thing was a fake. like i said before ali is not the only one who could beat him. i named about ten or twelve fighters who would crush him. before you worry about marciano beating ali, worry about him beating, liston, holmes, foreman, frazier, tyson, johnson, louis, holyfield, lewis, dempsey, ect, ect, ect.

i'm not spewing lies
Holmes had a better jab then ali and i've never heard that disputed

what makes holmes' jab better? cause it was stronger? that doesn't mean it was better. in that case you could say liston's jab was better cause it was stronger, foreman too, also lewis, tyson, shavers, lyle, frazier, lewis, klitchko etc. but ali's was faster, more accurate, and stung more cause of the way he threw it and it cut you up faster. no way is a young 25year old ali's jab matched, better yet even at 28, 29, 30, 31, or 32.

ok i've supported the fact that ali would lose to marciano in about 9 different threads against you i'm not bringin it all up again the stuff again so i'm done with that. and he only got knocked down once maybe twice and i believe it was against Jersey Joe Walcott and Archie Moore, and both were very hard hitters who he got up and beat, archie moore had over 100 knockouts so how u can say that he's not a respectable person to knocked down by, what middle weights knocked him down?
now who's spewin lies

ok i've supported the fact that ali would lose to marciano in about 9 different threads against you i'm not bringin it all up again the stuff again so i'm done with that. and he only got knocked down once maybe twice and i believe it was against Jersey Joe Walcott and Archie Moore, and both were very hard hitters who he got up and beat, archie moore had over 100 knockouts so how u can say that he's not a respectable person to knocked down by, what middle weights knocked him down?
now who's spewin lies

give me a break, moore was a natural middleweight and he floored him. and moore didn't hit hard as a hw so it is a disgrace for a hw to be floored by moore a natural middleweight.

not to get off the topic of u arguing me and everything but a fight give alot of credit to both fighters in was wepner against ali
i mean i understand that wepner knocked ali down cause ali was off balance but man that guy just took a beating

wasn't ali out of shape in that fight though?

you've got to be kidding me Moore was a great hitter and its no disgrace
100+ ko's and ur gunna say he was bad

you've got to be kidding me Moore was a great hitter and its no disgrace
100+ ko's and ur gunna say he was bad

moore was a great middleweight and lightheavy. but he just wasn't a good hw. a young, inexperienced and weak clay beat him to a pulp. a young patterson annihilated him. but moore still gave marciano trouble, so what does that say about marciano?

not to get off the topic of u arguing me and everything but a fight give alot of credit to both fighters in was wepner against ali
i mean i understand that wepner knocked ali down cause ali was off balance but man that guy just took a beating

wasn't ali out of shape in that fight though?

yeah, ali was out of spape a little. he weighed 221 1/2, and in his previous fight, the foreman fight, he was an in-shape 216 1/2.

a young patterson would have been when moore was older so that would've been a mismatch

a young patterson would have been when moore was older so that would've been a mismatch

older? let me see, moore was 42 when he fought rocky, and 43 when he fought patterson. that's not much older, and look at the contrast. he gave a good account of himself against rocky, but petterson crushed him in their fight, so age has nothing to do with it.

older? let me see, moore was 42 when he fought rocky, and 43 when he fought patterson. that's not much older, and look at the contrast. he gave a good account of himself against rocky, but petterson crushed him in their fight, so age has nothing to do with it.
styles make fights, moore only won maybe 2 or 3 rounds out of 9 with rocky how is that giving him trouble had he not ko'd him rocky wouldve easily got the decision

good list for the modern day thinker...ring magazine in '62 had dempsey listed as number 1..i think it is the generation gap that we tend to stick to...as an old timer from the old school i would say ali, dempsey, louis, johnson, jeffries, tunney, marciano, charles, foreman, holmes..

Tyson does not deserve to be in top 10...Yes he does, He was the youngest heavyweight ever.The only person would give a young mike tyson problems (80s Tyson) would be Ali.

Yes he does, He was the youngest heavyweight ever.The only person would give a young mike tyson problems (80s Tyson) would be Ali.

not just ali, but liston, holmes, foreman, and frazier. he might struggle a little with holyfield too!

not just ali, but liston, holmes, foreman, and frazier. he might struggle a little with holyfield too!
SORRY BRO YOUR WRONG ALI AND HOLMES BUT NEVER FOREMAN HE WAS TO SLOW AND IF ALI KO'D HIM........... AND FRAZIER PLEASE TYSON IS AN UPGRADE BY 200% SONNY LISTON WOULD BE INTERESTINGBUT TYSON WASTOO FEROCIOUS IN HIS PRIME.


ALI AND HOLMES ONLY.
:boxing: :boxing: :boxing: :boxing:

Ali is the greatest of all time. You gotta love the guys attitude and brilliant fighting style.

not just ali, but liston, holmes, foreman, and frazier. he might struggle a little with holyfield too!



Tyson knocked out Holmes.

My top 10

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Foreman
4. Marciano
5. Dempsey
6. Frazier
7. Tyson
8. Lewis
9. Liston
10. Holmes

My top 10

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Foreman
4. Marciano
5. Dempsey
6. Frazier
7. Tyson
8. Lewis
9. Liston
10. Holmes


very good list but i would put in holyfield instead off tyson, not as high though

SORRY BRO YOUR WRONG ALI AND HOLMES BUT NEVER FOREMAN HE WAS TO SLOW AND IF ALI KO'D HIM........... AND FRAZIER PLEASE TYSON IS AN UPGRADE BY 200% SONNY LISTON WOULD BE INTERESTINGBUT TYSON WASTOO FEROCIOUS IN HIS PRIME.


ALI AND HOLMES ONLY.
:boxing: :boxing: :boxing: :boxing:

foreman would destroy tyson by the third round. tyson is just like frazier and look what happened to frazier. it's a bad style matchup. tyson ducked foreman cause he knew he would get crushed! liston is just like foreman, so just about the same thing would happen.

Tyson knocked out Holmes.

holmes was 37 years old, and not as fast, and didn't get enough training time. a prime holmes would have confused, frustrated, then ko'd tyson in 10 or 12 rounds.

holmes was 37 years old, and not as fast, and didn't get enough training time. a prime holmes would have confused, frustrated, then ko'd tyson in 10 or 12 rounds.


Holmes didn't have the power to KO Tyson. In their fight, Holmes landed plenty of clean punches. But Tyson kept moving in landing his hooks. Holmes fell like a tree.

Holmes didn't have the power to KO Tyson. In their fight, Holmes landed plenty of clean punches. But Tyson kept moving in landing his hooks. Holmes fell like a tree.

so he didn't have the power to ko tyson, if holyfield could?!

so he didn't have the power to ko tyson, if holyfield could?!


A washed up, unmotivated, inconsistent fighter that would resort to ear biting is not the fighter that Holmes met in 1988. But whether you think Tyson was washed up when he fought Holyfield or not, Holyfield did have a better style and strategy for beating him.

Why is Tyson being given full credit for knocking out a far past his prime Larry Holmes? :thinking:

I guess then McBride gets his credit for making the ferocious Mike Tyson quit on his stool...

A washed up, unmotivated, inconsistent fighter that would resort to ear biting is not the fighter that Holmes met in 1988. But whether you think Tyson was washed up when he fought Holyfield or not, Holyfield did have a better style and strategy for beating him.

holyfield had a better style? if holmes had ali's style then how would there be a better style than that? holmes would not be hit by tyson that much in his prime, plus holmes had a strong chin. holmes would carry it to the later rounds and ko tyson, after hitting his face countless times.

holyfield had a better style? if holmes had ali's style then how would there be a better style than that? holmes would not be hit by tyson that much in his prime, plus holmes had a strong chin. holmes would carry it to the later rounds and ko tyson, after hitting his face countless times.


There's no invincible style. In fact, Ali with his stick and move style had the most trouble with a bobbing and hooking Frazier. Tyson could throw more powerful hooks with either hand. Holmes didn't really stand a chance.

There's no invincible style. In fact, Ali with his stick and move style had the most trouble with a bobbing and hooking Frazier. Tyson could throw more powerful hooks with either hand. Holmes didn't really stand a chance.

yeah, but douglass, holyfield, lewis, williams, and bride does huh? lol!

Tyson's style was different than Frazier's. I've said this a million times, I guess I'll say it more. It wasn't Frazier's bob and weave that troubled Ali, it was his relentless agression and attack. Tyson didn't come straight at people like Frazier did. And even if the bob and weave troubled Ali, he did put Joe in the hospital for a few months. If Ali did that damage to Tyson, Tyson wouldn't have the heart to finish the fight. Have you seen how bad Ali batters Joe in the 9th round of FOTC? It's surprising Joe came out after that round (yet it's surprising Ali came out from the 11th round).

So no, it doesn't come close. Once Tyson realized that Ali wasn't terrified of him, and started to trade blows with Tyson, Tyson would crumble. And anyway, Ali would have ****ed with Tyson's head before the fight, so Tyson wouldn't be able to think straight anyway.

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Tyson's style was different than Frazier's. I've said this a million times, I guess I'll say it more. It wasn't Frazier's bob and weave that troubled Ali, it was his relentless agression and attack. Tyson didn't come straight at people like Frazier did. And even if the bob and weave troubled Ali, he did put Joe in the hospital for a few months. If Ali did that damage to Tyson, Tyson wouldn't have the heart to fini