View Full Version : The top 3 most important changes in 20th century boxing?


Clegg
07-15-2010, 12:56 AM
Considering the regular discussions that go on about the past vs the present, I was thinking about the changes that took place that made the eras different from one another.

What would you say are the top 3 changes that took place inbetween 1900 and 2000?

Some suggestions: change in number of rounds, change in gloves size, stricter rules on fouls, ring sizes (I believe they've gotten larger?), training techniques, diet, fighting styles, techniques and skills, ref stoppages being quicker, better regulation/less fixes, more weight divisions, more title belts, weigh-ins taking place the day before, legal and illegal supplements, mandatory 8 counts and going to a neutral corner after scoring a knockdown.

Miburo
07-15-2010, 01:09 AM
Neutral corner rule, limitation to 15 rounds max, clinches broken by the referee.

BennyST
07-15-2010, 01:26 AM
In my opinion, the two biggest that made the most change to boxing are the titles (ie the amount of new titles) and the pre fight-day weigh in.

With one title per division, boxing remains as it should. With ninety four, it is just strange.

The weigh in allows some bizarre things to happen such as MW fighters at WW, WW at lightweight, 'Flyweights' having no trouble fighting as a JWW because they were actually the size of a JWW.

JAB5239
07-15-2010, 02:25 AM
In my opinion, the two biggest that made the most change to boxing are the titles (ie the amount of new titles) and the pre fight-day weigh in.

With one title per division, boxing remains as it should. With ninety four, it is just strange.

The weigh in allows some bizarre things to happen such as MW fighters at WW, WW at lightweight, 'Flyweights' having no trouble fighting as a JWW because they were actually the size of a JWW.

I concur with all of this.

frankenfrank
07-15-2010, 02:44 AM
(1) 12 rounds are enough indeed : both for health damage which is big enough
in 12 , and for the interest of the viewer , which may be more than enough to
keep interest.
(2) 3 knockdowns rule : as long as it comes from real punches and not from
pushes and low blows , I think it is very rare for a fighter to remain competitive
after he went down 3 times in 1 round .
(3) new weight classes : it is good , weight classes are for a reason , and if
anything , a new SHW division should be introduced , with a weight limit of
220-230 on the HW division. Even among the biggest , there are very few
whom will be unable to make a 220-230 limit. Wlad , Lewis and Bowe could
make 225 for examples , and with the current weighing in rules , they could
even make 220. So maybe the CW limit should be lowered back to 190 , the
HW limit will be 210 , and the SHW will be 211+ , Valuev will still have a vast
size advantage over his opponents , but his size is actually a little above the
ideal size which is somewhere near Vitali's size. Fighters above 6'8" in reality
(Vitali is about 6'6" in reality) may usually be too heavy to be able to move
sufficiently for both training purposes and for their fights.

frankenfrank
07-15-2010, 02:45 AM
And Clegg , whose da ho in yo avatar ?

Clegg
07-15-2010, 02:52 AM
And Clegg , whose da ho in yo avatar ?

Thora Birch

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BennyST
07-15-2010, 08:08 AM
There are a few things which are major changes that I don't disagree with too much. Twelve rounds is fine for me. I wouldn't mind fifteen as it really separates the champions from the contenders but it also poses added health risks which we most definitely don't need in a sport that is already riddled with them.

The extra divisions is also something that, while it would be much better without, it doesn't really bother me too much. It is what it is. People can become champions much easier, it dilutes the overall talent pool in each division and can make someone who is a 'three division champion' much greater than they actually are. Do people still wonder why all of a sudden there are a million and one three/four/five/seven division champions all in the last decade or two? No, it's not because today's boxers are better, because then champions would still struggle to become two division champions like they used to. You add in pre fight day weigh ins, the amount of titles and divisions to Armstrong's era and you have what would also be a seven division champ. Same thing for Duran, Langford and Robinson. We don't even blink at someone becoming a three division champ anymore.

Anyway, not to stray too far off topic, even other little rules like mandatory eight counts, three KD rule, ten point must etc etc etc, aren't too bad. What is, to my mind, the real breaker for boxing is the titles per division and the weigh ins. It allows certain fighters to compete at divisions they should not be able to get to. There will always be some exceptions in which a fighter is tall and thin enough to get down to a smaller division and have a big size advantage but we have seen some real shockers of late in which fighters will come in with twenty pound extra and be literally a head above his opponent. More divisions should mean there is more equality in size, not less!

The extra divisions should also have been the answer to the extra titles. More divisions, more titles. Now, with five (or more now) titles to get in each division showing that you are the official world champion in that division, that have gone along with all the new weight divisions there are just too many. It's honestly become laughable. Even two champions is ok with me. The WBC and WBA. That sounds good. You can unify and all contenders sit underneath fighting for viability.

Now though, with five or more different champs along with all the other official 'titles' like Ring champion even though you don't necessarily have to beat someone in order to get it, it's just bizarre. We can all say who is the best of each division by performance and dominance but rarely do we know as we used to. Often someone we think will lose without even giving it much thought will win. That's why boxing is great.

So often we hear talk today like "Oh, he's the best, he doesn't even need to fight *add in contender/fighter/lesser known champs name* because we know he would win by KO easily! There isn't even any point." It defeats the purpose of boxing. We all knew Curry was going to beat Honeyghan and were shocked when Curry got KO'd. The number one contender from 1970 would honestly be one of the major champions today in his division. He was the second highest ranked fighter in the division which today is equal to being a big name champ. We have forgotten most of the number one contenders that never became champions and yet most were more than what makes a champ today. It's sad. But, with the new 'elite' boxer superstar that doesn't have to fight the main guys in his division but only the superfights of his choosing, often being the right style too, it means we miss out on what would be some of the greatest fights and most unexpected outcomes in history. We might have seen Bradley/Guzman/whoever and Pac go at it for twelve rounds in a grand fight in which Pac loses a stunning fight. We might have seen Mayweather lose to someone we thought was simply another 'name' on his resume. All just examples but you get my point.

Weight and titles. My only genuine complaints about boxing today. Champions that aren't champions, fighters with unfair advantages that shouldn't even be in a division. One thing that I always laugh at is when someone brings up boxers today being better because they are bigger and stronger because of new training and nutrition and other crap. They are bigger because they aren't really welterweights. Your typical welterweight back in fight day weigh ins was a lightweight or JWW today. That's the reason they are bigger. No other reason. Also, the only training techniques that have actually changed is cross training. Even most cross training is the same apart from a few plyometric exercises and weight lifting which has often had a noticeable impact for the worse on many boxers. The core training for what makes a boxer great is not new at all and the few new exercises that are genuinely new aren't good enough to change a fighter from good to great. Nothing in boxing has changed enough and nothing will. The core basics of sparring, bag work, running/skipping, shadowboxing are what makes a great fighter. Doing box jumps and other **** like that doesn't make you a better fighter.

frankenfrank
07-15-2010, 08:55 AM
For those who want to "separate the champions from the contenders" , why not make a 1 15 or 24 minutes round , or something like that , without a break (closer to a real fight) to really separate the fighters from the runners ?

frankenfrank
07-15-2010, 08:57 AM
Thora Birch

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good to know

SBleeder
07-15-2010, 10:04 AM
For those who want to "separate the champions from the contenders" , why not make a 1 15 or 24 minutes round , or something like that , without a break (closer to a real fight) to really separate the fighters from the runners ?

http://i905.photobucket.com/albums/ac256/Kohshee/Fail-Pregnancy.jpg

TheMagicMan
07-15-2010, 10:05 AM
Top 3 changes.

1. Boxing has gone global. Aint no Pac or Klitschko's back at the turn of the century.

2. Video tape and science has allowed boxers and trainers to study proper technique. you would be shocked to learn how much technique has been studied in other sports where youd think "not much has changed". Michael Phelps in a surfboard bathing suit broke the 1960 world record in every event...in one afternoon. Video tape and scietific tests have allowed trainers to see what punch is hardest, what stroke pulls more water, how to lower your hittable range etc...

3. Proper diet, nutrition, training not based on old wives tales, the ability to get surgery and not just you leg amputated etc... Medical science has allowed for healthier fighters. Vitali Klitschko tears a rotator cuff in 1930, he leaves the sport after the Byrd fight. Today he just gets a simple surgery etc...

frankenfrank
07-15-2010, 10:25 AM
http://i905.photobucket.com/albums/ac256/Kohshee/Fail-Pregnancy.jpg

:flush0::thumbsdow:op:

Sam Donald
07-15-2010, 10:28 AM
4 belts is a big change but I dont actually mind that tbh