Everyone always mentions Chavez as one of the greatest fighters of all time and indeed he was. However, there were some things that, in my opinion, he lacked. He was not that fast, his Ko's were accumulation of punishment. Not actually a one punch destroyer. Also I think he was never unbeatable. Just that he had a big heart and iron will determination and this helped him to overcome tough opponents who could have beaten him.

On the other hand, DLH(in the early days and up to welter) had great footwork and his combinations were very fast. He also had a good left hook and a terrific jab. The con is that he probably was not half as brave as Chavez.

All in all. I say DLH would rank higher. My opinion.

I agree! More championship in different weight classes!

I dont know man. I like both guys, but power or not, Chavez would **** people up. I got into boxing because of him. I think the great part about him was his heart and his relentlessness that enabled him to break people down over a fight and take them out. I would have Chavez higher on an all time list than DLH.

DLH couldn't hold Chavez's jockstrap. Chavez was dominant fighting machine. DLH not so much.

Chavez was definitely the better p4p fighter of the 2 it isnt even up for debate.

DLH couldn't hold Chavez's jockstrap. Chavez was dominant fighting machine. DLH not so much.

I think a prime DLH gets a prime Chavez at 140. If you want to know the reasons why I believe this, check my first post.

I agree! More championship in different weight classes!

Oh, how today's boxing fans just love those guys jumping from division to division, collecting a bunch of meaningless title belts. :rolleyes:

In my opinion, neither of those two fighters are very high on a ranking of the greatest fighters of all-time.

Everyone always mentions Chavez as one of the greatest fighters of all time and indeed he was. However, there were some things that, in my opinion, he lacked. He was not that fast, his Ko's were accumulation of punishment. Not actually a one punch destroyer. Also I think he was never unbeatable. Just that he had a big heart and iron will determination and this helped him to overcome tough opponents who could have beaten him.

On the other hand, DLH(in the early days and up to welter) had great footwork and his combinations were very fast. He also had a good left hook and a terrific jab. The con is that he probably was not half as brave as Chavez.

All in all. I say DLH would rank higher. My opinion.

I think you are penalizing Chavez for not being fast and not having one punch power. No fighter is unbeatable. I think if you rank either one above the other it should be on accomplishments not what they can do in the ring.

Chavez was definitely the better p4p fighter of the 2 it isnt even up for debate.

Would you care to give some details? Why is that? I ask for objective discussion.

I think in thier prime Chavez breaks Oscar down after losing about 3 or 4 rounds early. He would be too rough and tough for Oscar too handle a full 12 rounds.

I think a prime DLH gets a prime Chavez at 140. If you want to know the reasons why I believe this, check my first post.

The outcome of that fight would be meaningless to p4p rankings. A p4p matchup between them on the other hand would be meaningful. And p4p, Chavez beats DLH.

I think you are penalizing Chavez for not being fast and not having one punch power. No fighter is unbeatable. I think if you rank either one above the other it should be on accomplishments not what they can do in the ring.

What would be your point? Accomplishments are based on what you do in the ring. Different factors contribute to your sucess and legacy. By the way I ain't penalizing anyone. I am giving my opinion. I never discredited Chavez, I acknowledged he is an all time great.

The outcome of that fight would be meaningless to p4p rankings. A p4p matchup between them on the other hand would be meaningful. And p4p, Chavez beats DLH.

I don't think that makes nuch sense. You mean to tell me that even if DLH beats Chavez in his prime, Chavez would still be better than DLH?

When DLH made Chavez come up to 147 for their second bout, (keep in mind Chavez was WELL PASSED HIS PRIME) He connected repeatedly on Oscar, but he didnt have the same stamina, speed (believe it or no chavez wasnt exactly slow), movement, or drive, he had in his prime. Yet it was a comptetitive fight till Chavez quit in the 8th round. Oscar's eye was pretty swolled up.


At 140lbs the Chavez that ruined Taylor would have stopped Oscar, Chavez simply had more experience, one of the most technically sound fighters ever, the stronger wiskers, incredible work rate regarless of the offense his opponent would dish out, Could take almost anything without showing any real damage (swelling, cuts). I think prime chavez at 140lbs, beats Oscar into submission, repeated left hooks to the body, and punches to the face, by the 10th Oscar is ready to go.

When DLH made Chavez come up to 147 for their second bout, (keep in mind Chavez was WELL PASSED HIS PRIME) He connected repeatedly on Oscar, but he didnt have the same stamina, speed (believe it or no chavez wasnt exactly slow), movement, or drive, he had in his prime. Yet it was a comptetitive fight till Chavez quit in the 8th round. Oscar's eye was pretty swolled up.


At 140lbs the Chavez that ruined Taylor would have stopped Oscar, Chavez simply had more experience, one of the most technically sound fighters ever, the stronger wiskers, incredible work rate regarless of the offense his opponent would dish out, Could take almost anything without showing any real damage (swelling, cuts). I think prime chavez at 140lbs, beats Oscar into submission, repeated left hooks to the body, and punches to the face, by the 10th Oscar is ready to go.

I respect the fact that you explain why you think Chavez would take DLH at 140. I just think that DLH's movement and jab would be enough to get a points win over Chavez. I know Taylor was a mover but DLH was very strong at 140 while Meldrick was feather fisted like Corey Spinks.

wasn't it a left hook 2 the body that KO'd DLH..........And isn't cHAVEZ considered as one of the greatest body punchers?

wasn't it a left hook 2 the body that KO'd DLH..........And isn't cHAVEZ considered as one of the greatest body punchers?

I would have to say that the rumor is almost a fact. DLH took a dive there. Anyways, yes Chavez was a terrific body puncher but a punch from Hopkins is much harder.

P4p Chavez is greater period.

Everyone always mentions Chavez as one of the greatest fighters of all time and indeed he was. However, there were some things that, in my opinion, he lacked. He was not that fast, his Ko's were accumulation of punishment. Not actually a one punch destroyer. Also I think he was never unbeatable. Just that he had a big heart and iron will determination and this helped him to overcome tough opponents who could have beaten him.

On the other hand, DLH(in the early days and up to welter) had great footwork and his combinations were very fast. He also had a good left hook and a terrific jab. The con is that he probably was not half as brave as Chavez.

All in all. I say DLH would rank higher. My opinion.
I think he said P4P FIGHTER not puncher or see who lacked this and that.Its everything that has to do with being a fighter and P4P Chaves by a mile.

chavez would break down Dlh remember in there matchups when chavez was mixing it up, he always came out on top but Dlh wa young quicker and better at the time. wait your talkin about p4p well p4p Chavez was a better body puncher.

alright i want you 2 mention Dlh accomplishments and the best boxers he's beaten and compare it 2 chavez.

I respect the fact that you explain why you think Chavez would take DLH at 140. I just think that DLH's movement and jab would be enough to get a points win over Chavez. I know Taylor was a mover but DLH was very strong at 140 while Meldrick was feather fisted like Corey Spinks.

You have a good point but i believe if his jab, movement, and power, wasnt enough for Oscar to keep a over-weight, spent, slower, inmobile, and older Chavez from landing vicious shots to his face.

The prime 140lb Chavez would have been much more effective and destructive. his defensive movements were also better then by the way.

alright i want you 2 mention Dlh accomplishments and the best boxers he's beaten and compare it 2 chavez.

I respect opinions and all but your point is not what I wanted to discuss. I ain't taking anything from Chavez. He beat great fighters fair and square. Guys like Camacho, Haugen, Rosario, Hernandez, and so on. But I was talking about skills and physical attributes. I think everything was crystal clear on my original post.

oh duh many boxers looked prettier then chavez in the ring but all that counted was the win and the pride and courage he had.

You have a good point but i believe if his jab, movement, and power, wasnt enough for Oscar to keep a over-weight, spent, slower, inmobile, and older Chavez from landing vicious shots to his face.

The prime 140lb Chavez would have been much more effective and destructive. his defensive movements were also better then by the way.


Point accepted. But I also think that DLH was a force to be reckoned with at 140 and a much better fighter than he is today. I'll say it would be a highly contested battle between two awesome fighters. Determination and courage might win it for one of them.

oh duh many boxers looked prettier then chavez in the ring but all that counted was the win and the pride and courage he had.

I never questioned the guy's courage and determination. It's all on the first post. I am done discussing about that.

well everyone has there opinion.

delahoya will never be better than chavez!!!

Both are great fighters but comparing both at the prime of their careers at welterweight I would have to lean with Chavez. The guy was just too determined and would give Oscar pain like he never expierienced before with body shots and complete round by round pressure. He actually was trying to fight like this when he and Oscar met in the ring but was too slow to avoid punches and his face just had been through too many wars. Oscar is still fighting and could regroup to overtake Chavez if he wins a legitimate Middleweight title from Tito or Hops.... its not likely but I'd have to give Oscar the edge if he does this.

A prime Chavez already fought a prime De La Hoya...... In the mold of Meldrick Taylor. Taylor and De La Hoya are pretty much mirror images of each other in terms of athletic ability, and we all saw what happened to Taylor. I also think that Chavez's athletic ability is a bit underrated, I mean how else would you explain Chavez repeatedly catching a guy w/ catlike reflexes in Taylor w/ left hooks. I wouldn't count out the possibility of JCC winning by k.o. or t.k.o. against De La Hoya Oscar has proven that he shys away from physical fights.

I really don't think this is even an issue. Julio Cesar Chavez is by far the better fighter who has has achieved more in his career.

DLH the more P4P boxer for. Smart, Skillful and a technician.

I cant see DLH out-boxing Chavez for 12 rounds. I can see him winning early rounds, but Chavez wouldn't stop. He'd keep coming, and DLH would crack.
I'd rank Chavez higher then DLH fo sure

The guy chavez had over a hundred fights he knew his way around a ring without a doubt DLH has accomplished great things but not as much as Chavez.
Late stoppage or UD and the winner Chavez.

I'd say Chavez

DLH couldn't hold Chavez's jockstrap. Chavez was dominant fighting machine. DLH not so much.

i couldn
t have said it better

They are both punk azz mark beeyotchs but DeLaHoya is better. First of all Oscar whooped that azz twice bloodied up that little punk azz Chavez. Not only that Chavez got all those gift decisions-like when Whitaker whooped his azz. Then the little ho would cry when he lost and not accept the defeat like against Frankie Randall. Not to mention that fight with Tszyu....holy batwings batman....LOL...Tsyzu beat that little punk into oblivion I was waiting for that little punk Chavez to say "no mas" but he was getting beat like a stray dog by Tsyzu anyway. So hell yeah Oscar deserves more credit than that nothin but hype punk Chavez.

They are both punk azz mark beeyotchs but DeLaHoya is better. First of all Oscar whooped that azz twice bloodied up that little punk azz Chavez. Not only that Chavez got all those gift decisions-like when Whitaker whooped his azz. Then the little ho would cry when he lost and not accept the defeat like against Frankie Randall. Not to mention that fight with Tszyu....holy batwings batman....LOL...Tsyzu beat that little punk into oblivion I was waiting for that little punk Chavez to say "no mas" but he was getting beat like a stray dog by Tsyzu anyway. So hell yeah Oscar deserves more credit than that nothin but hype punk Chavez.

yeah and chavez was about 50yrs in that fight, this guy won like his 1st 90 fights, and against great comp. chavez was the man. if you beleive that, then u may also beleive the ALI and Holyfield also sucked because they lost to younger guys when they got old

yeah and chavez was about 50yrs in that fight, this guy won like his 1st 90 fights, and against great comp. chavez was the man. if you beleive that, then u may also beleive the ALI and Holyfield also sucked because they lost to younger guys when they got old





Man, please Chavez aint even in Holyfield and Ali's class dont mention that little punk in the same breath as these greats. Chavez went undefeated in his first 90 cuz he fought a lot of Tijuana cab drivers anyway. Once again Oscar is a punk too but he sure did beat Chavez like a red headed step child not once but TWICE. :D

Man, please Chavez aint even in Holyfield and Ali's class dont mention that little punk in the same breath as these greats. Chavez went undefeated in his first 90 cuz he fought a lot of Tijuana cab drivers anyway. Once again Oscar is a punk too but he sure did beat Chavez like a red headed step child not once but TWICE. :D

y not, JCC was a great fighter. and his 100 plus wins speaks for it self. DLH had some tough fights, bad thing is he lost them all.(Tito,Hopkins,Shane twice) all his his prime. so in no way is he better. and P4P you can't rank Ali's or Holyfields chin, heart, stamina or power over JCC. maybe speed but he showed against meldrick taylor that he could get around that.

I'd have to go with Chavez even though i admire Oscar's willingness to face anyone, but i just don't think he was ever as invincible as Chavez was during his time. My opinion.

agreed. chavez was the truth back in the day

DLH had better opposition. Chavez is overrated.

DLH couldn't hold Chavez's jockstrap. Chavez was dominant fighting machine. DLH not so much.


....Chavez resume is filled with stiffs. I think he was one of the most overated guys out there. Meldrick Taylor was flat kicking his ass when he got caught. I was never impressed with Chavez and always thought it was all about the hype.

....Chavez resume is filled with stiffs. I think he was one of the most overated guys out there. Meldrick Taylor was flat kicking his ass when he got caught. I was never impressed with Chavez and always thought it was all about the hype.

Definitely.

hahahaha hey that fool known as nasthandspeed sounds like someone from another board. da fuk are u guys talkin about go check the Rings greatest fighters i think that chavez was ranked ahead of holyfield and de la hoya and they know more about boxing then u.

hahahaha hey that fool known as nasthandspeed sounds like someone from another board. da fuk are u guys talkin about go check the Rings greatest fighters i think that chavez was ranked ahead of holyfield and de la hoya and they know more about boxing then u.

You felt that I wanted to discredit Chavez but I never did. These two did.

i know, they just sound familiar maybe a former smack talker?

I saw DLH-Chavez I today and I must say that a prime Chavez would have given DLH hell. But still, I see DLH getting a close points win.

Every One Has There Opinions Its Cool.

....Chavez resume is filled with stiffs. I think he was one of the most overated guys out there. Meldrick Taylor was flat kicking his ass when he got caught. I was never impressed with Chavez and always thought it was all about the hype.


Were you actually watching what was going on in the ring?

Taylor did'nt get caught.. he was broken down and beaten up. The getting caught by flush shots from chavez started, since Round 1!!! The swallowing blood Started in Round 2.

hahahaha hey that fool known as nasthandspeed sounds like someone from another board. da fuk are u guys talkin about go check the Rings greatest fighters i think that chavez was ranked ahead of holyfield and de la hoya and they know more about boxing then u.




How very observant my Mexican homeboy. Yes Nasty Handspeed is known in other boards as well, for speaking his mind and not being a nut hugger. Fact is Chavez got beat by Whitaker and the judges robbed Whitaker by calling it a draw. Chavez got beat fair and square by Frankie Randall then cried like a little beeyotch in the ring about it. Then got his azz beat like a red headed step child by that pretty boy Oscar DeLahoya not once but TWICE. And last but not least I never seen a man get beat so bad like how Tsyzu whooped the hell out of Chavez, it was in humane what Tszyu was doing to him it looked like someone beating a stray dog. They should have called the animal abuse shelter for the beating Tszyu gave Chavez. So now all these things including the fact that Chavez beat a lot of bums to fatten up his record. I would say DeLahoya has more credibility than that punk Chavez. And dont forget Oscar whooped his azz TWICE. :D

How very observant my Mexican homeboy. Yes Nasty Handspeed is known in other boards as well, for speaking his mind and not being a nut hugger. Fact is Chavez got beat by Whitaker and the judges robbed Whitaker by calling it a draw. Chavez got beat fair and square by Frankie Randall then cried like a little beeyotch in the ring about it. Then got his azz beat like a red headed step child by that pretty boy Oscar DeLahoya not once but TWICE. And last but not least I never seen a man get beat so bad like how Tsyzu whooped the hell out of Chavez, it was in humane what Tszyu was doing to him it looked like someone beating a stray dog. They should have called the animal abuse shelter for the beating Tszyu gave Chavez. So now all these things including the fact that Chavez beat a lot of bums to fatten up his record. I would say DeLahoya has more credibility than that punk Chavez. And dont forget Oscar whooped his azz TWICE. :D


Everything you mentioned is in the decline of his career. And why do you gotta call everything a punk? Something is seriously wrong with you. Its obvious you know nothing about Chavez by the way.

And you know what people who talk about what they dont know are called?

In your words,
"punk azz byoootches"

:D :p

How very observant my Mexican homeboy. Yes Nasty Handspeed is known in other boards as well, for speaking his mind and not being a nut hugger. Fact is Chavez got beat by Whitaker and the judges robbed Whitaker by calling it a draw. Chavez got beat fair and square by Frankie Randall then cried like a little beeyotch in the ring about it. Then got his azz beat like a red headed step child by that pretty boy Oscar DeLahoya not once but TWICE. And last but not least I never seen a man get beat so bad like how Tsyzu whooped the hell out of Chavez, it was in humane what Tszyu was doing to him it looked like someone beating a stray dog. They should have called the animal abuse shelter for the beating Tszyu gave Chavez. So now all these things including the fact that Chavez beat a lot of bums to fatten up his record. I would say DeLahoya has more credibility than that punk Chavez. And dont forget Oscar whooped his azz TWICE. :D

if u never seen some one get beat that bad then u never saw holmes vs. Ali. don't forget both ali and chavez where at the end of there career's in those fights. and that doesn't take away from what they did in there prime. i don't even know y i am talking to u, it is obvious u either don't know what u r talking about or, u just hate chavez and can't give an honest opinion on him. just because u may not like a fighter u shouldn't take away from his skill.

I say it's Chavez bro. Chavez in his prime would be another b-hop nightmare for ODLH. Damn! how I wish they primed in the same era to settle this question!

its funny how you guys keep saying oh yeah Chavez would have worked on Oscars body and beat him down.....What?.....did you not see the Oscar fights in which he thouroughly beat dwon Chavez into embarrassment? Yall are living in fantasy land. Hellooo....Oscar whooped that punk azz twice.

its funny how you guys keep saying oh yeah Chavez would have worked on Oscars body and beat him down.....What?.....did you not see the Oscar fights in which he thouroughly beat dwon Chavez into embarrassment? Yall are living in fantasy land. Hellooo....Oscar whooped that punk azz twice.God please forgive me for responding to this ignorant. So I guess Jerry Rice ain't really the best receiver to ever play the game 'cause he can't seem to even get off the line and doesn't even get to start these days, I wonder why. Larry Donald is also better than Holyfield ever was.

God please forgive me for responding to this ignorant. So I guess Jerry Rice ain't really the best receiver to ever play the game 'cause he can't seem to even get off the line and doesn't even get to start these days, I wonder why. Larry Donald is also better than Holyfield ever was.




Give me a freakin break Chavez wasnt that old when he got beat by Oscar. Fighters today fight well into thier 40's. Look at Hopkins.

smaller boxers age quicker then bigger boxers.

Give me a freakin break Chavez wasnt that old when he got beat by Oscar. Fighters today fight well into thier 40's. Look at Hopkins.Hopkins and who else.... Plus Hopkins only big fights in his "advanced" age have come against guys who started their careers 20 - 30lbs below the middleweight limit. And as far as you making a point that Chavez wasn't really that old when he fought De La Hoya, well 90 plus fights is enough to make anybody old(Chavez had already gone over 95 fights prior to fighting De La Fruity)!

oscar was a better pound for pound boxer in my view