In my opinion the most overrated fighter is the "rock". Rocky marciano i really dont think should be in any top 5 greatest heavy weight list. Rocky fought at a time where he was able to fight middle weights and im pretty sure most of his wins came from the middle weight division. When most people compare his swarming style to that of 86'-88' tyson their crazy he had no boxing ability close to tyson. He had NOOOO speed, his quickness or hand speed was nothing close to Mike. He had no real arsenal of pucnhes. The rock was 5'8 185 with short arms . His chin was never tested by the likes of a George Foreman, Joe Frazier , Sonny Liston, or prime iron Mike. His record should be honored but be real you could name about 5 heavyweights that would own that record if they fought in that era and 5 more that would have a chance.... oh yea jersey joe wouldn't even sniff the top 15

Jack Johnson whoever feels that he could be placed in the top ten must be under the influence of something. His boxing style was equivalent to a cave man while he was able to fight guys 20 pounds lighter then him. Need I say more?

Jack Dempsey not really overrated but STOP saying Mike wishes he could fight like dempsey.Mike is actually underrated. Demnpsey or anybody else wishes he could knock out the champ at 19. With cus and rooney mike was unbeatable thats why the most heard fantasy question is prime Mike against prime Ali. After cus died (who was a father figure to mike) and rooney left everything downward sprialed for Mike.

PLEASE I WANT RESPONSES PROOVE ME WRONG

In my opinion the most overrated fighter is the "rock". Rocky marciano i really dont think should be in any top 5 greatest heavy weight list. Rocky fought at a time where he was able to fight middle weights and im pretty sure most of his wins came from the middle weight division. When most people compare his swarming style to that of 86'-88' tyson their crazy he had no boxing ability close to tyson. He had NOOOO speed, his quickness or hand speed was nothing close to Mike. He had no real arsenal of pucnhes. The rock was 5'8 185 with short arms . His chin was never tested by the likes of a George Foreman, Joe Frazier , Sonny Liston, or prime iron Mike. His record should be honored but be real you could name about 5 heavyweights that would own that record if they fought in that era and 5 more that would have a chance.... oh yea jersey joe wouldn't even sniff the top 15



Jack Johnson whoever feels that he could be placed in the top ten must be under the influence of something. His boxing style was equivalent to a cave man while he was able to fight guys 20 pounds lighter then him. Need I say more?

Jack Dempsey not really overrated but STOP saying Mike wishes he could fight like dempsey.Mike is actually underrated. Demnpsey or anybody else wishes he could knock out the champ at 19. With cus and rooney mike was unbeatable thats why the most heard fantasy question is prime Mike against prime Ali. After cus died (who was a father figure to mike) and rooney left everything downward sprialed for Mike.

PLEASE I WANT RESPONSES PROOVE ME WRONG


Have you seen a Johnson fight?

When he lost the title is was to someone with 6 in on him. Hardly cave man style.

His style was better than anyone he faced. At his peak.


He also dominated the guy who took his title for the first 20 rounds. IF he had fought 12rnders he would have set the record for most title defenses for sure.

Have you seen a Johnson fight?

When he lost the title is was to someone with 6 in on him. Hardly cave man style.

His style was better than anyone he faced. At his peak.


He also dominated the guy who took his title for the first 20 rounds. IF he had fought 12rnders he would have set the record for most title defenses for sure.


Good point but u must admit Jack's stance looked some what crazy

In my opinion the most overrated fighter is the "rock". Rocky marciano i really dont think should be in any top 5 greatest heavy weight list. Rocky fought at a time where he was able to fight middle weights and im pretty sure most of his wins came from the middle weight division. When most people compare his swarming style to that of 86'-88' tyson their crazy he had no boxing ability close to tyson. He had NOOOO speed, his quickness or hand speed was nothing close to Mike. He had no real arsenal of pucnhes. The rock was 5'8 185 with short arms . His chin was never tested by the likes of a George Foreman, Joe Frazier , Sonny Liston, or prime iron Mike. His record should be honored but be real you could name about 5 heavyweights that would own that record if they fought in that era and 5 more that would have a chance.... oh yea jersey joe wouldn't even sniff the top 15

Jack Johnson whoever feels that he could be placed in the top ten must be under the influence of something. His boxing style was equivalent to a cave man while he was able to fight guys 20 pounds lighter then him. Need I say more?

Jack Dempsey not really overrated but STOP saying Mike wishes he could fight like dempsey.Mike is actually underrated. Demnpsey or anybody else wishes he could knock out the champ at 19. With cus and rooney mike was unbeatable thats why the most heard fantasy question is prime Mike against prime Ali. After cus died (who was a father figure to mike) and rooney left everything downward sprialed for Mike.

PLEASE I WANT RESPONSES PROOVE ME WRONG

MARCIANO:
I rate him the third greatest heavyweight of all time. His chin, stamina, power and heart is unquestionable. He lacked skill and size, and still managed to stay undefeated in 49 fights. Overrated? I think not. Who cares about Mike Tyson?? The dude has NO heart and bad stamina. And his opponents are not better than those on Marcianos record. An aging Holmes and a terrified Spinks? Please! Tyson is alot more overrated than Marciano. Thats a goddamned fact!

JOHNSON:
Very skilled, one of the best defensive boxers of all time. He was lightyears ahead of his time, and would be hell to fight for any of the top-ten heavyweights. He had a poor chin, but his style is by no means "cave man" like. Nat Fleicher rated him the greatest heavyweight he ever saw (he even saw the prime Ali).

DEMPSEY:
Both Tyson and Marciano was openly inspired by Dempsey. He was bad to the bone, with great power, fast hands and good reflexes. His chin was decent and his stamina better than that of Tyson. He might be a little small to be a threat to Tyson, Liston etc, but P4P he was surely greater than either of them. I rate him number 4 in my all-time list.

Tyson is the most overrated heavyweight in my opinion. Sure, he had his short prime in the late 80s, but he is no where near the level of the ones you call "overrated".

Like i said there are 5 guys who could of went undefeated like marciano in that era. Ali, Holmes, Foreman, Frazier and Tyson. So im basically asking you who has he fought and then that question branches off into the questioning of his chin and heart. To rate him as the third on the all time greatest heavyweights list and Dempsey fourth you get the cold shoulder. Ali, holmes, foreman, (prime) mike, none aging louis, frazier and liston mos definately come before those two. If not explain the fightin sequence of the guys they could beat and while explaining remember marciano is 5'8 185 that frame wont hold up to long my friend. Oh yea if anything dempsey comes before marciano at least he had an arsenal of punching with ok speed.

Oh yea before i forget if Tyson is overrated why do most people often ask who would win (the greatest of all time) prime Ali or prime Iron mike? hmmmmm.......... i know maybe because in any heavyweights prime these two were the greatest [/B] EVER i dont usually hear or see people asking the fantasy question who would win ali vs jack johson , marciano or dempsey and i dont think you hear or see it either. If your smart that should tell you something ma friend.

Oh yea before i forget if Tyson is overrated why do most people often ask who would win (the greatest of all time) prime Ali or prime Iron mike? hmmmmm.......... i know maybe because in any heavyweights prime these two were the greatest [/B] EVER i dont usually hear or see people asking the fantasy question who would win ali vs jack johson , marciano or dempsey and i dont think you hear or see it either. If your smart that should tell you something ma friend.

overrated = people rate him higher than he is

exactly for this reason they think he is the greatest hw ever, and match him up with the only other hw in history they usually know about: ali

or maybe because mike had amazing punching power with tremendous hand speed so most people feel that combination = YOUR GETTING KNOCKED THE **** OUT lol.

also ppl ask about tyson ali, because of the demographics of the forum users, most young ppl or ppl knew to boxing don't know of anyone before ali

Marciano is over-rated.

Tyson is extremely under-rated.

Tyson was and is steaming pile of shit compared to Ali, Louis, Holmes, Dempsey etc. He's top fifteen material if only for the ability he displayed on the way up. The fact that he's never won a fight where he was knocked down says everything about his heart.

Really just think about that for a moment. Can you name anyone else who is regarded as a top ten of all time heavyweight who never battled back from a knockdown to win a fight? There are none. The people who think Tyson displayed a lot of heart in the Lewis fight don't realize just how pathetic they sound. Yes it takes a bit of heart to keep getting up from knockdowns but the other great heavyweights got up from knockdowns and then fought back HARD. That takes ten times the heart. Tyson just went through the motions in that fight and rarely opened up to take chances. He fought like a man who was afraid to hurt Lewis in fear of what he would retaliate with. He fought like a scared little bitch.

Oh and don't give me that bullshit about all boxers being courageous. When Tyson was a teenager, he would mug old ladies. In my eyes that overrides the modicum of courage he may have displayed in the Ruddock fights or in remaining vertical (but not really doing much else) against Lewis. The guy was a coward and it shows in the way he has handled his life and his boxing career.

hey bro i said prime mike and i dont think anyone could knock out prime mike with Cus and Rooney in his corner. Also read my past posts im not gonna type the same things over n over jus cause your wrong

Oh yea before i forget if Tyson is overrated why do most people often ask who would win (the greatest of all time) prime Ali or prime Iron mike? hmmmmm.......... i know maybe because in any heavyweights prime these two were the greatest [/B] EVER i dont usually hear or see people asking the fantasy question who would win ali vs jack johson , marciano or dempsey and i dont think you hear or see it either. If your smart that should tell you something ma friend.

So you honestly believe that Tyson is one of the two greatest heavyweights of all time? That´s just weird, man. Tyson had a short prime where he beat up bums, and got beaten by a bum at 23. Once he faced some decent opponents, he lost. Once he faced someone that stood up to him, he lost. The man has no heart, and it is a damn shame to see people worship him as one of the greatest of all time. He was extremely talented, and had all the tools he needed, but he also had a lot of personal demons that haunted him. He was no toughguy, but a schoolyard bully with a weak mind.

By the way, I am actually a fan of the young Tyson. I truly am. But I am also able to realize the fact that he is not as great as some (usually young people) consider him to be. He was cool to watch, fast, powerful and entertaining. But thats about it.

And rating the greatest of all time, is not just putting together a "who beats who" list, buddy! One has to look at it from another angle. Fighters of today are usually considerably bigger than those of yesterday, and I have trouble seeing a fighter like Dempsey or Marciano surviving a slugfest with Foreman. But I still rate them higher on my all-time list. Another example; Joe Frazier. I consider him a greater fighter than George Foreman, even though he got his behind whupped both times they met. This probably boggles your mind a bit, but I see this as the right way to view it. One has to look at the over-all accomplishments of the fighter in question.

Tyson was and is steaming pile of shit compared to Ali, Louis, Holmes, Dempsey etc. He's top fifteen material if only for the ability he displayed on the way up. The fact that he's never won a fight where he was knocked down says everything about his heart.

Really just think about that for a moment. Can you name anyone else who is regarded as a top ten of all time heavyweight who never battled back from a knockdown to win a fight? There are none. The people who think Tyson displayed a lot of heart in the Lewis fight don't realize just how pathetic they sound. Yes it takes a bit of heart to keep getting up from knockdowns but the other great heavyweights got up from knockdowns and then fought back HARD. That takes ten times the heart. Tyson just went through the motions in that fight and rarely opened up to take chances. He fought like a man who was afraid to hurt Lewis in fear of what he would retaliate with. He fought like a scared little bitch.

Oh and don't give me that bullshit about all boxers being courageous. When Tyson was a teenager, he would mug old ladies. In my eyes that overrides the modicum of courage he may have displayed in the Ruddock fights or in remaining vertical (but not really doing much else) against Lewis. The guy was a coward and it shows in the way he has handled his life and his boxing career.



**** tyson, he has NO HEART, lamon brewster got knocked down 5 ****ing times before he knocked out Wladdy Klitschko, Nigel Benn got knocked down twice ( the second time he flew through the ropes and out of the ring ) and he got up off the canvas to **** the G man up. marciano fought two tough battles with ezzard charles, who busted him up worse than anyone else ever had and he still beat charles' ass. tyson nutlickers, don't kid yourselves, jack dempsey would beat the shit out of mike tyson.

also whoever started this thread needs to go here:

http://www.ibhof.com/ibhftape.htm

because somebody obviously can't read, rocky marciano was 5'10 1/4 " not 5'8"

tyson is way to underrated... with cus and rooney he would f* any hv.. though i like ali more but tyson would probably ko ali out if frazier with his wierd style can...

rocky is the most overrated boxer.. he could fough at lt hv or cruiserweight..toney and holyfield would give rocky trouble..in lt hv, crusier or hv...

Im starting to think its only white old guys who thik dempsey and rocky are sooooo great. i guess its because their the only good caucasion boxer's to really be considered great so you guys place them on the same platform as Ali, Holmes and Foreman (which you shouldn't). But hey if i were you i'd be pretty upset with 2 fighters also.

tyson is way to underrated... with cus and rooney he would f* any hv.. though i like ali more but tyson would probably ko ali out if frazier with his wierd style can...
.
Tyson was probably more skilled than Frazier but didn`t have anyhthing close to his heart and determination!

Mike Tyson's most significant win to date is probably the two wins over Razzor Ruddock... And we all saw how good Razzor Ruddock really was at the top level when he faced Lennox Lewis.

I'm with M26 - The only people that think Tyson was one of the greatest heavyweights of all time are either quite young, or don't know an awful lot about this sport.

Again, I'm a Tyson fan... I've got 65 of his fights on DVD, Coz' he's been fun to watch over the years! But a GREAT heavyweight, he definatly wasn't.

tyson beat many talent fighters in his primes..

tyson beat many talent fighters in his primes..
Who?... I know Mike Tyson's career very well, as my previous post explains my DVD collection.

Tyson was and is steaming pile of shit compared to Ali, Louis, Holmes, Dempsey etc. He's top fifteen material if only for the ability he displayed on the way up. The fact that he's never won a fight where he was knocked down says everything about his heart.

Really just think about that for a moment. Can you name anyone else who is regarded as a top ten of all time heavyweight who never battled back from a knockdown to win a fight? There are none. The people who think Tyson displayed a lot of heart in the Lewis fight don't realize just how pathetic they sound. Yes it takes a bit of heart to keep getting up from knockdowns but the other great heavyweights got up from knockdowns and then fought back HARD. That takes ten times the heart. Tyson just went through the motions in that fight and rarely opened up to take chances. He fought like a man who was afraid to hurt Lewis in fear of what he would retaliate with. He fought like a scared little bitch.

Oh and don't give me that bullshit about all boxers being courageous. When Tyson was a teenager, he would mug old ladies. In my eyes that overrides the modicum of courage he may have displayed in the Ruddock fights or in remaining vertical (but not really doing much else) against Lewis. The guy was a coward and it shows in the way he has handled his life and his boxing career.


George Foreman used to mug old ladies, too.

Who?... I know Mike Tyson's career very well, as my previous post explains my DVD collection.

He beat Holmes, and Spinks! How can you forget those two! Whoever says Holmes was out of his prime is wrong! Iron Mike was the greatest HW ever! He would NEVER have lost if he didn't fight such GREAT competition! The HW division in his time was undoubtedly one of the best ever; I don't see how ANYONE can say Mike wasn't #1 or #2...

He beat Holmes, and Spinks! How can you forget those two! Whoever says Holmes was out of his prime is wrong! Iron Mike was the greatest HW ever! He would NEVER have lost if he didn't fight such GREAT competition! The HW division in his time was undoubtedly one of the best ever; I don't see how ANYONE can say Mike wasn't #1 or #2...
You're quite witty for such a youngen... ;)

You're quite witty for such a youngen... ;)

Yeah, I know. By the way, say good bye to your 7 mil. Kostya's gonna KO Ricky within 6. And that ain't no joke..

Yeah, I know. By the way, say good bye to your 7 mil. Kostya's gonna KO Ricky within 6. And that ain't no joke..
Yeah... We'll see on Saturday!

I've gotta a sneaky feeling that 7 million of mine could turn into 17 million... ;)

Hatton UD!

Foreman never mugged any old ladies.

[QUOTE=BadMagick]He beat Holmes, and Spinks! How can you forget those two! Whoever says Holmes was out of his prime is wrong! Iron Mike was the greatest HW ever!QUOTE]
i've said this lots of times and i'll say it again, holmes couldn't have been at his best after such a long layoff when he wasn't training hard. it's nothing to to with prime, it's preparation, and holmes didn't exactly have good preperation.

[QUOTE=BadMagick]He beat Holmes, and Spinks! How can you forget those two! Whoever says Holmes was out of his prime is wrong! Iron Mike was the greatest HW ever!QUOTE]
i've said this lots of times and i'll say it again, holmes couldn't have been at his best after such a long layoff when he wasn't training hard. it's nothing to to with prime, it's preparation, and holmes didn't exactly have good preperation.

God, you're so ignorant. Holmes was undoubtedly in some of the best shape of his life. There's absolutely no excuse for the KO that Tyson gave him. And Spinks? Spinks was a great fighter, NEAR HIS PRIME, and he was torn to pieces by Tyson, which sent his ass packing (aka into retirement). Think of all the other quality opposition that Tyson demolished.. Marvis Fraizer, Tillis, Gross, Berbick, Smith, Bruno, Smith, all great opponents. Tyson is a top two heavyweight of all time. He would have broken Ali in half.

God, you're so ignorant. Holmes was undoubtedly in some of the best shape of his life. There's absolutely no excuse for the KO that Tyson gave him. And Spinks? Spinks was a great fighter, NEAR HIS PRIME, and he was torn to pieces by Tyson, which sent his ass packing (aka into retirement). Think of all the other quality opposition that Tyson demolished.. Marvis Fraizer, Tillis, Gross, Berbick, Smith, Bruno, Smith, all great opponents. Tyson is a top two heavyweight of all time. He would have broken Ali in half.
i'm not being ignorant of tyson's achievements, i just feel that the holmes that tyson beat was not a larry holmes in the prime of his life, no one can seriously disagree with that. larry holmes has said himself that he was not training hard for most of that layoff.

Pssst....you're being trolled!

*whistles innocently and sneaks away*

Pssst....you're being trolled!

*whistles innocently and sneaks away*

It's not trolled, man. I'm ****ing around, and I'm doing a knock up job at it. Why do you have to ruin everything that's good?

Yeah, man, I was just messing around. You didn't pick up on my first post, so I posted another asanine post, and you took that seriously, too.

I completely argree that Holmes was not himself in that fight. If it was the same Holmes who pounded Ali all night in 1980, we might have seen a different fight. Tyson might have gotten to him still, but he certainly wouldn't have ended it in four.

He beat Holmes, and Spinks! How can you forget those two! Whoever says Holmes was out of his prime is wrong! Iron Mike was the greatest HW ever! He would NEVER have lost if he didn't fight such GREAT competition! The HW division in his time was undoubtedly one of the best ever; I don't see how ANYONE can say Mike wasn't #1 or #2...


I am a HUGE TYSON fan, but don't tell me that the HW division in his time was one of the best ever. That is pure crap. Are you talking about the same era that had guys like Trevor Berbick, Terrel Biggs, and Bonecrusher Smith walking around with belts around their waist? You need to get your facts strait before making that bold of a statement. Besides Mike who else was considered "great" in the heavyweight division in the mid 80's? Again, I am a big Mike guy, but that comment was trash.

prince naseem is over-rated

I am a HUGE TYSON fan, but don't tell me that the HW division in his time was one of the best ever. That is pure crap. Are you talking about the same era that had guys like Trevor Berbick, Terrel Biggs, and Bonecrusher Smith walking around with belts around their waist? You need to get your facts strait before making that bold of a statement. Besides Mike who else was considered "great" in the heavyweight division in the mid 80's? Again, I am a big Mike guy, but that comment was trash.

Who WASN'T great, is a better question. Everyone Mike fought in the 80's will be a future hall of famer. I don't see how anyone can make a resonable disagreement.

Who WASN'T great, is a better question. Everyone Mike fought in the 80's will be a future hall of famer. I don't see how anyone can make a resonable disagreement.



wonder when hes gonna figure it out...

Yeah, I know. By the way, say good bye to your 7 mil. Kostya's gonna KO Ricky within 6. And that ain't no joke..

Yeah... We'll see on Saturday!

I've gotta a sneaky feeling that 7 million of mine could turn into 17 million...

Hatton UD!

I don't wanna sound like a boxing guy: "I know everything about everything don't you know!!!".

But I've started to notice that boxing is like learning a language.. i.e... Very difficult to do when you live in the same country and try to learn a different language, but much easier when you live in a different country.

You get a wider aspect of things. ;)

This thread should be moved to the Non Stop Boxing Forum.

I bet it could squeeze out at least 10 more posts.

The rock was 5'8 185

ur an idiot. rocky was 5'11







Rocky fought at a time where he was able to fight middle weights and im pretty sure most of his wins came from the middle weight division.


wow ur an even bigger idiot than i thought. rocky NEVER FOUGHT A GUY who weighed less than 175lb.

jersey joe walcott 197lb
joe louis 214lb
archie moore 188lb
rex layne 194lb
roland lastarza 187lb
ezzard charles 185lb and 192lb


in case u didnt know the big men rocky beat


6'2 214lb joe louis

6'5 220lb johnny shkor

6'5 213lb james patrick conelly

6'3 229lb big bill wilson

5'11 210lb don cockell

6'4 254lb jerry humprhey jackson

6'4 195lb carmine vingo

6'3 200lb keene simmons




thatruth, check ur facts before you spread false bullshit!


http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=009032

notice how rocky never fought a man below 172lb

Have you seen a Johnson fight?

When he lost the title is was to someone with 6 in on him. Hardly cave man style.

His style was better than anyone he faced. At his peak.


He also dominated the guy who took his title for the first 20 rounds. IF he had fought 12rnders he would have set the record for most title defenses for sure.


I agree. This guy doesn't know what he's talking about.

He also dominated the guy who took his title for the first 20 rounds. IF he had fought 12rnders he would have set the record for most title defenses for sure.

Not really, that is terrible logic. They fought longer rounds but the pace of those fights was a lot slower. Often they spent nearly the whole fight in a clinch only throwing a few punchers.

Marciano did what he did aginst the best there was...and could have gone on for a few years more still undefeated...thats great no doubts..he deserves to be up there..not the best but still up there...

In my opinion the most overrated fighter is the "rock". Rocky marciano i really dont think should be in any top 5 greatest heavy weight list. Rocky fought at a time where he was able to fight middle weights and im pretty sure most of his wins came from the middle weight division. When most people compare his swarming style to that of 86'-88' tyson their crazy he had no boxing ability close to tyson. He had NOOOO speed, his quickness or hand speed was nothing close to Mike. He had no real arsenal of pucnhes. The rock was 5'8 185 with short arms . His chin was never tested by the likes of a George Foreman, Joe Frazier , Sonny Liston, or prime iron Mike. His record should be honored but be real you could name about 5 heavyweights that would own that record if they fought in that era and 5 more that would have a chance.... oh yea jersey joe wouldn't even sniff the top 15

Jack Johnson whoever feels that he could be placed in the top ten must be under the influence of something. His boxing style was equivalent to a cave man while he was able to fight guys 20 pounds lighter then him. Need I say more?

Jack Dempsey not really overrated but STOP saying Mike wishes he could fight like dempsey.Mike is actually underrated. Demnpsey or anybody else wishes he could knock out the champ at 19. With cus and rooney mike was unbeatable thats why the most heard fantasy question is prime Mike against prime Ali. After cus died (who was a father figure to mike) and rooney left everything downward sprialed for Mike.

PLEASE I WANT RESPONSES PROOVE ME WRONG

Marciano isn't overrated he's underrated by most people here and its shown by some of the things said here

Jack Johnson- one of the most overrated hw in history

Dempsey- why bring his name up? He was a great fighter

The most overrated fighter on this board by far is Ali, i know everyone thinks he's good but holy crap he's not ****ing invincible

i am a big tyson fan and he is a great fighter with very fast and powerful punches but the only competition he had that were anywhere near the calibre of foreman ali frasier etc were lewis and holyfield and perhaps ruddock. if someone hurt tyson he wouldn't come back from it, i think it was his fight with lewis where he actually seemed scared to get close.

he had no heart
but then foreman had no heart first time round, he felt invincible having defeated frasier so easily. but when he made his comeback he had lost lots of speed, power and timing but his heart carried him through.

one thing worth noting is that both frazier and foreman who boxed in probably the best era of boxing said that louis was greatest followed by marciano

one thing worth noting is that both frazier and foreman who boxed in probably the best era of boxing said that louis was greatest followed by marciano
Then, using your logic, Ali must be the greatest. Because he was in the same era and was always going around saying "I am the greatest".

Ali is very overrated