View Full Version : Jewish greats


roXy graziano
11-30-2004, 02:29 PM
hey I'm new to this forum I'm tryin to get a list of all the Jews who held titles from about the turn of the century to the late 30's, you know like Barney Ross and Abe Attell. Anyway, I got a list, I think I'm missin one or two though is anyone knows of any I'm missin I'd really appreciate it!!!

The Gold Star Champs
Abe Attell
Abe Goldstein
Al McCoy
Al "The Bronx Beauty" Singer
Ben Jeby
Barney Ross
Battling Levinsky
Benny Bass
Benny Leonard
Bob Olin
Charley Rosenberg
Harry Lewis
Harry Harris
Izzy Shwartz
Jack Bernstein
Jackie Berg
Jackie Fields
Louis "Kid" Kaplan
Maxie Rosenbloom
Monte Attell
Mushy Callahan
Pinky Silverberg
Solly Kreiger
Ted "Kid" Lewis
Victor Perez

No-Mas
11-30-2004, 05:08 PM
What about Heavyweight champ Max Baer?

plexmc
11-30-2004, 05:34 PM
What about Heavyweight champ Max Baer?
I feel u on that

roXy graziano
11-30-2004, 05:40 PM
I read this thing though, apparently it's a myth that he was Jewish. I just posted this story in another thread read it though, not sure if anyone'll get it though:

Contrary to popular opinion, one of the more popular heavyweights, Max Baer, was not Jewish, boxing historians say. Lawrence S. Ritter, author of "East Side, West Side," a chronicle of forgotten sporting clubs in New York, tells in the book of a time when Baer was in a gym hitting a heavy bag on Yom Kippur.

"What are you doing?" a reporter asked Baer, confused.

"Getting ready to fight Primo Carnera," he said.

"What about Yom Kippur?"

"I'll fight him next!" Baer replied

No-Mas
11-30-2004, 09:47 PM
I have never heard that Max Baer was not Jewish.

That story you related ("Yom Kippur...I'll fight him next") is emblematic of Mr. Baer's sense of humor. That story is probably true, but it doesn't reveal that Baer was not Jewish, it reveals a bit about Baer's personality - nothing serious, life is a ball, make a joke every chance I get.

Roxy, watch one of Baer's fights -- on his fighting trunks Baer wore the biggest Star of David you will ever see. You explain to me why that was there. Also, his fight against Schmeling was seen as the Jew vs. the Nazi.

Maybe Max might have been half-Jewish (I don't know), but Mr. Max Baer was a hell of a lot more Jewish than the Pope (that I'm certain of).

roXy graziano
11-30-2004, 10:04 PM
na I wasn't saying the story was evidence of him not being Jewish, what I've heard is that his father was Jewish which would make him a gentile.

In the crazy Jew world you're only Jewish if your mother is Jewish, weather you are religiously Jewish or not. That's why, Mike Rossman had a gentile father and a Jewish mother so he was Jewish. Had it been reversed he wouldn't be Jewish

Maybe I have it wrong maybe Baer did have a Jewish mother I dunno I've just always heard that it was really that he only had a Jewish father

No-Mas
11-30-2004, 10:19 PM
Roxy, I'll take your word that Baer might have been half-Jewish. Whether his mother was Jewish or his father was Jewish, Max Baer sure felt he was Jewish -- that Star of David he wore on his shorts could be seen a mile away. Max Baer was definitely proud of his roots.

roXy graziano
11-30-2004, 10:20 PM
na I don't doubt it for a second. Technically, I'm only half-Jewish (my father is Italian), I lucked out havin a Jewish mother, lots of Jews give me crap sayin I'm not a real Jew because I don't have two Jewish parents. Same way I'm half Italian and couldn't be prouder of my roots either way.

Fat Shamz
11-30-2004, 10:55 PM
hey I'm new to this forum I'm tryin to get a list of all the Jews who held titles from about the turn of the century to the late 30's, you know like Barney Ross and Abe Attell. Anyway, I got a list, I think I'm missin one or two though is anyone knows of any I'm missin I'd really appreciate it!!!

The Gold Star Champs
Abe Attell
Abe Goldstein
Al McCoy
Al "The Bronx Beauty" Singer
Ben Jeby
Barney Ross
Battling Levinsky
Benny Bass
Benny Leonard
Bob Olin
Charley Rosenberg
Harry Lewis
Harry Harris
Izzy Shwartz
Jack Bernstein
Jackie Berg
Jackie Fields
Louis "Kid" Kaplan
Maxie Rosenbloom
Monte Attell
Mushy Callahan
Pinky Silverberg
Solly Kreiger
Ted "Kid" Lewis
Victor Perez

your missing bob schneider, altho he wasnt considered a "great" he wasnt that bad, won canada the gold in mens boxing in 1920 olympics in belgium

Kid Achilles
12-02-2004, 06:40 PM
According to fighters who shared locker rooms with him, he was definitely NOT Jewish. I don't think I need to go into further detail. ;)

Fat Shamz
12-02-2004, 06:46 PM
According to fighters who shared locker rooms with him, he was definitely NOT Jewish. I don't think I need to go into further detail. ;)

Why would you talk to people who observe mens penis's?

neils7147933
12-02-2004, 06:55 PM
Elaine Dickinson: Would you like something to read?
Hanging Lady: Do you have anything light?
Elaine Dickinson: How about this leaflet, "Famous Jewish Sports Legends?"

Welterweight
12-02-2004, 11:10 PM
I have never heard that Max Baer was not Jewish.

That story you related ("Yom Kippur...I'll fight him next") is emblematic of Mr. Baer's sense of humor. That story is probably true, but it doesn't reveal that Baer was not Jewish, it reveals a bit about Baer's personality - nothing serious, life is a ball, make a joke every chance I get.

Roxy, watch one of Baer's fights -- on his fighting trunks Baer wore the biggest Star of David you will ever see. You explain to me why that was there. Also, his fight against Schmeling was seen as the Jew vs. the Nazi.

Maybe Max might have been half-Jewish (I don't know), but Mr. Max Baer was a hell of a lot more Jewish than the Pope (that I'm certain of).
Max Baer was not Jewish, but rather, allowed the ambiguity of his name and the hype that helped sell tickets color his fight with Schmeling. The late Eddie Arcel supposedly said of Baer, "I've seen him in the shower, and trust me, he ain't Jewish.
As a Jewish amateur boxer in the 70's I could never understand why people were surprised at my ethnicity. I just can't grasp what someone's religion or ethnic background has to do with anything.

roXy graziano
12-02-2004, 11:24 PM
Max Baer was not Jewish, but rather, allowed the ambiguity of his name and the hype that helped sell tickets color his fight with Schmeling. The late Eddie Arcel supposedly said of Baer, "I've seen him in the shower, and trust me, he ain't Jewish.
As a Jewish amateur boxer in the 70's I could never understand why people were surprised at my ethnicity. I just can't grasp what someone's religion or ethnic background has to do with anything.

oh come on man... you can't play ethnicity and background out of boxing. I mean, for me I look up to Jewish boxers and Italian boxers cus I'm Italian/Jewish.

I had two or three Mexican friends that were into boxing and their favorite fighters were Mexican. Who you are is who you are, that's who you're gonna be naturally drawn towards

roXy graziano
12-03-2004, 05:43 PM
not sure if anyone cares, but i just got this email from Mike DeLisa:

Max Baer's grandfather was Jewish but non practicing. His name was
Aschill
Baer from ALsaice-Lorraine. He married a non-jew from Vienna, Fanny
Fischel. They had seven sons and two daughters. Al the sons named
after
the tribes of Israel and they were educated in Jewish schools.

Baer's father did not practice the religion and married a girl of
Scotch
Irish desent in the USA.

Max and Buddy apparently did not practice any religion.

Baer wore the star more to honor Ancil Hoffman, his manager, than as a
religious statement.


Whether a person whose grandfather was Jewish is considered a Jew is
beyond
my expertise! I'd like to know if Jews would consider him Jewish.

Mike

No-Mas
12-03-2004, 06:41 PM
This thread has been pretty interesting.

That information provided by Mike DeLisa is very, very interesting.

Whether Baer practiced his religion or not is a moot point. I am Catholic and if I fail to practice that religion I can't erase the fact that I am still a Catholic.

Not that it matters, but I still say Max Baer is Jewish and the Star of David on his trunks tells me so. (It also tells the rest of the world.)

roXy graziano
12-03-2004, 07:46 PM
well, as I said, most practicing Jews would not recognize him as a Jew, simply because the descent comes from the mother and his mother was a gentile.

However, it's still his heritage, who he is (to an extent). Ontop of this he has raised his children as Jewish. The idea of recognizing the mother as the lineage comes from... er... actually I just asked my rabbi about this,
In Vayikrah 24:10 the verse talks about of the son of a Jewish woman and an Egyptian man as being "among the community of Israel" (ie, a Jew).
And in Ezra 10:2-3, the Jews returning to Israel vowed to put aside heir non-Jewish wives and the children born to those wives. They could not have put aside those children if those children were Jews.

I know a lot of Jews would think bad if I said this but I don't think it's any different than having pride in being Irish/Italian whatever. Your blood is your blood. Also, (again lots of Jews would get mad at me for saying this) Baer looked Jewish.

He may not be technically Jewish but he obviously had a lot of pride in his Jewish roots (he raised his kids Jewish, the star of david, etc.) I'll recognize him on my list of Jewish fighters! :cool:

No-Mas
12-04-2004, 12:00 AM
I'll recognize him on my list of Jewish fighters! :cool:

Finally! It only took a couple of pages of posts to put the poor guy on your list.

I've always seen Max Baer as a Jewish fighter. As a matter of fact (and this might seem strange), Max Baer was the first Jew I ever knew. I grew up in an all Italian/Catholic neighborhood and everyone I ever knew or met was Italian and Catholic. Italian and Catholic, as a little kid you think that's what the entire world is. As a little kid I used to watch tons of old fight films with my father and when it came to a Max Baer film I vividly remember asking my father, "What is that on that guy's shorts?" My father told me that the Star of David meant Baer was Jewish. I don't remember how he explained what Jewish is, but I remember Max Baer being the first time I heard about Jews. That may seem like an odd story, but it's true nonetheless.

No-Mas
02-21-2005, 06:40 PM
Yesterday's New York Daily News had a piece about Baer written by legendary boxing authority Bill Gallo.

Gallo writes that Baer always claimed that he was of German-Scotch background, but on the night of his fight with Schmeling he said he had the Star of David on his trunks because his great-great grandmother was Jewish.

So whether one's great-great grandmother makes one Jewish I don't know.

ophqui
02-22-2005, 02:44 PM
what word keeps getting censored in this thread? if its what i think it is (a three letter derogatory term for a jewish person) u people need to not use it, its unpleasant. If the word is j.e.w, it's ****ing stupid that it's getting censored.

It was always my assumption that Baer was jewish, but that was basically a product of his name, which really means nothing. Just a minor point, revered and legendary boxing writer A.J Leibling was jewish

NiGe2011
03-28-2005, 05:36 PM
Perhaps this is not the ideal thread for this question but I thought somebody might know the answer: what is up with the star of david that Judah is always rocking on his trunks and robe?

.::EnRiQuE::.
03-28-2005, 07:16 PM
i think he is Jewish. that would be the only reason to wear one... either that or he is an idiot.

sane0t0
03-28-2005, 08:22 PM
Perhaps this is not the ideal thread for this question but I thought somebody might know the answer: what is up with the star of david that Judah is always rocking on his trunks and robe?

He's a Black Jew, like Sammy Davis Jr.

NiGe2011
03-29-2005, 12:41 AM
Thanks, that is what I would have guessed but I just wanted to be sure...

Xecutioner
03-29-2005, 06:15 PM
duno, i remember james toney had a star on his trucks for his manager. but i do believe judah is jewish

No-Mas
03-29-2005, 07:54 PM
Zab Judah is not a Jew.

I'm pretty sure that Zab is not a Jew. He is of that sect called the Israelites - the Black Jews. It's crazy, but those guys call themselves the real Jews - descendants of Israel - and the Jews that you and I know Zab and the other Israelites call them "the so-called Jew".

There a lot of these Black Israelites around New York City and they sure ain't the most friendly or loving people. Very angry, militant, and most of them hate Jews - that's why they refer to them with that derogatory phrase "the so-called Jew".

I could be wrong about this, but I think I might be right.

franker01
04-25-2005, 11:04 PM
Michael Rossman? Beat Galindez once I think and got beat in rematch. Could be wrong.

Mighty Abe
04-26-2005, 02:25 AM
na I don't doubt it for a second. Technically, I'm only half-Jewish (my father is Italian), I lucked out havin a Jewish mother, lots of Jews give me crap sayin I'm not a real Jew because I don't have two Jewish parents. Same way I'm half Italian and couldn't be prouder of my roots either way.

SHALOM Y'ALL, Hey according to Jewish Law,(which you gotta respect Cause our basic American Laws are based on it -wetha you like it or not!) , If your Mom is Jewish you are - Period!( what you decide to do with it is your choice and Freedom) The fact that your Father is Italian ,or any other Ethnic backround just adds a little mote spice to Life! So My Brother ,Embrace all Lifes Treasures and Richness ! Enjoy , Avrum Shapiro

fight fan
04-27-2005, 10:19 PM
FYI

I found this on a site called Jewhoo a website based on famous Jews in all areas of fame from sports to science and hollywood and music.....etc. The following link is related to Boxing.....

http://www.jewhoo.com/display_entries.asp?p_category_id=7&p_parent_id=39

sidschneck
06-09-2005, 01:57 AM
Ooops missed Monte too--man I must be getting slow. One other maybe addition is Valentin Angleman who was recognized as flyweight champion of the world by the IBU, but he survived and boxed under the Nazi occupation of France, so maybe he converted. I have a very good Italian boxing record book that lists a number of fighters as being Jewish with what seems to be solid information and this book La Bibbia Del Pugilato has Angelmann as Jewish--so he could be another one to add to your Gold List.

moochi
06-09-2005, 06:11 AM
hey I'm new to this forum I'm tryin to get a list of all the Jews who held titles from about the turn of the century to the late 30's, you know like Barney Ross and Abe Attell. Anyway, I got a list, I think I'm missin one or two though is anyone knows of any I'm missin I'd really appreciate it!!!

The Gold Star Champs
Abe Attell
Abe Goldstein
Al McCoy
Al "The Bronx Beauty" Singer
Ben Jeby
Barney Ross
Battling Levinsky
Benny Bass
Benny Leonard
Bob Olin
Charley Rosenberg
Harry Lewis
Harry Harris
Izzy Shwartz
Jack Bernstein
Jackie Berg
Jackie Fields
Louis "Kid" Kaplan
Maxie Rosenbloom
Monte Attell
Mushy Callahan
Pinky Silverberg
Solly Kreiger
Ted "Kid" Lewis
Victor Perez
i thought most of those boxers were american? what's this b/s about jewish, that's their religion maybe, but they were/are americans.....period.

what are we going to do next, have fighters represent their religions at the olympics??? what a joke? hey, anyone got a list of champions of the many other religions and sects??

mjcohen
09-24-2005, 12:24 PM
How come nobody includes Robert Cohen and Alphonse Halimi, both world bantamweight champs. Then there's Monte Attell, Jackie "kid" Wolfe, Sid Smith and quite a few lesser title holders, and greats who never held a title but deserve recognition, Lew Tendler, Charley White, Benny Valgar, etc.undefined

KidBlackie
09-24-2005, 02:56 PM
Rossman was not Jewish the way I understood his heritage. He took the maiden name of his Jewish stepmother and cashed in. Maybe he was Jewish in being a converted Jew, sorta like Tyson is a coverted Muslim.

Joe Choynski may have been the earliest great Jewish boxer. He was a Polish Jew the way I understand it. Fought started his career fighting Corbett and Sharkey who were much larger than the 160 lb Joe and beat him. The experienced Choynski gave a young Jeffries hell in a draw and as an old grizzled fighter he KOed young Jack Johnson, chilling him out for a full 5 min. Never got a title shot in any division, but he is in the HOF.

Yogi
11-27-2005, 01:04 AM
Joe Choynski may have been the earliest great Jewish boxer.

Sure, Choynski may recieve that honour it you choose to ignore who many consider to be the first "superstar" of the sport in Daniel Mendoza, who also garners his share of support for being the greatest and especially the most talented bareknuckle boxer in history.

mokele
05-06-2006, 05:31 AM
I seem to recall that Abe Simon was Jewish.

http://www.boxrec.com/media/index.php/Boxer:Abe_Simon:012129
http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=12129

It mentions it clearly here:

http://www.jewsinsports.org/profile.asp?sport=boxing&ID=10

I've never seen him on film but he must have been a bit like Primo Carnera, a scary-looking fighter but with serious flaws in his boxing ability. He also didn't have a great chin or else Buddy Baer and Joe Louis wouldn't have stopped him so quickly.

When Simon's career was over he went into acting and played roles in some famous movies including "On the Waterfront" and "Requiem for a Heavyweight":

http://movies.msn.com/celebs/celeb.aspx?c=155979

I saw both of those movies many years ago when I wasn't much more than a kid and was profoundly affected. In "On the Waterfront" Marlon Brando was asked about his boxing style and he answered "I was a short puncher". In other words he was in inside fighter, my favorite kind. I can't remember Abe Simon's role in those movies.

Kid Achilles
05-06-2006, 12:47 PM
Simon's chin was okay. Buddy Baer and especially Joe Louis were extremely hard hitters.

K-DOGG
05-06-2006, 05:36 PM
Sure, Choynski may recieve that honour it you choose to ignore who many consider to be the first "superstar" of the sport in Daniel Mendoza, who also garners his share of support for being the greatest and especially the most talented bareknuckle boxer in history.

Yup..."Mendoza the Jew"...great Bareknuckle legend.

As far as the best p4p Jewish fighter...I'd have to go with Leonard (Benny, of course).

Starof David
04-05-2012, 09:28 PM
I didn't know about all these.

jaded
04-05-2012, 11:13 PM
Perhaps this is not the ideal thread for this question but I thought somebody might know the answer: what is up with the star of david that Judah is always rocking on his trunks and robe?

duno, i remember james toney had a star on his trucks for his manager. but i do believe judah is jewish

Zab Judah is not a Jew.

I'm pretty sure that Zab is not a Jew. He is of that sect called the Israelites - the Black Jews. It's crazy, but those guys call themselves the real Jews - descendants of Israel - and the Jews that you and I know Zab and the other Israelites call them "the so-called Jew".

There a lot of these Black Israelites around New York City and they sure ain't the most friendly or loving people. Very angry, militant, and most of them hate Jews - that's why they refer to them with that derogatory phrase "the so-called Jew".

I could be wrong about this, but I think I might be right.
Zab Judah converted to Christianity a few years ago. He was born a Jew...a Black Hebrew Israelite...they are a Jewish Tribe. Ethiopia used to be pretty much Jewish at one time in History and there are a lot of black Jews in Israel...and quite a few in NY. His father Yoel is a devout Jew.

James Toney when he was under the management of Jackie Kallen wore the Star of David on his trunks as a tribute to her...as did many if not all her fighters did.

Ogecca MaMa
04-05-2012, 11:16 PM
hey I'm new to this forum I'm tryin to get a list of all the Jews who held titles from about the turn of the century to the late 30's, you know like Barney Ross and Abe Attell. Anyway, I got a list, I think I'm missin one or two though is anyone knows of any I'm missin I'd really appreciate it!!!

The Gold Star Champs
Abe Attell
Abe Goldstein
Al McCoy
Al "The Bronx Beauty" Singer
Ben Jeby
Barney Ross
Battling Levinsky
Benny Bass
Benny Leonard
Bob Olin
Charley Rosenberg
Harry Lewis
Harry Harris
Izzy Shwartz
Jack Bernstein
Jackie Berg
Jackie Fields
Louis "Kid" Kaplan
Maxie Rosenbloom
Monte Attell
Mushy Callahan
Pinky Silverberg
Solly Kreiger
Ted "Kid" Lewis
Victor Perez

so ukranians are jews now?

jaded
04-05-2012, 11:25 PM
so ukranians are jews now?

Some are like him and Dmitry Salita

Ogecca MaMa
04-05-2012, 11:29 PM
Some are like him and Dmitry Salita

Dmitry Salita wasnt bored in slavic country in 1901. He was born in my city loong after WWII. there for he is a jew. not sure bout kid kaplan, can't find any info that says he got jewish roots

jaded
04-05-2012, 11:41 PM
Dmitry Salita wasnt bored in slavic country in 1901. He was born in my city loong after WWII. there for he is a jew. not sure bout kid kaplan, can't find any info that says he got jewish roots
Dmitry Salita is...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Salita

Kid Kaplan...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Kaplan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Jewish_Sports_Hall_of_Fame

Side Note/ Max Baer was inducted into the International Jewish Sports Hall of Fame...you can see it in the last link so I'm pretty sure he was Jewish.

Ogecca MaMa
04-05-2012, 11:44 PM
Dmitry Salita is...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dmitry_Salita

Kid Kaplan...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Kaplan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Jewish_Sports_Hall_of_Fame

Side Note/ Max Baer was inducted into the International Jewish Sports Hall of Fame...you can see it in the last link so I'm pretty sure he was Jewish.

Thanks for the link for Kaplan. And I said as it is about Salita..he was born in ODessa jewish etc... surprised we had jews during those times in Ukraine (1900s). We had tons of them after WWII..hell every country have them.

Scott9945
04-05-2012, 11:59 PM
so ukranians are jews now?

You're confusing location with religion.

TBear
04-06-2012, 01:24 AM
Ronnie Harris, olympian gold medalist and middleweight contender from the seventies converted to Jewish. Harris defeated Alan Minter and Ray Seales but lost a decision against Hugo Corro for the title.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronnie_Harris