View Full Version : How Would Bernard Hopkins Do Against ATGs In Their Primes? (No Haters/Huggers Please)


Ziggy Stardust
01-12-2010, 07:11 PM
In Prime Bernard Hopkins Versus In Prime:

Ray Robinson
Bob Fitzsimmons
Marvin Hagler
Stanley Ketchel
Charley Burley
Harry Greb
Jake LaMotta
Carlos Monzon
Tony Zale
Panama Joe Gans
Marcel Cerdan
Les Darcy
Holman Williams
Mickey Walker
James Toney
Mike McCallum

Your thoughts Gentlemen?

Poet

Southpaw16BF
01-12-2010, 07:17 PM
In Prime Bernard Hopkins Versus In Prime:

Ray Robinson
Bob Fitzsimmons
Marvin Hagler
Stanley Ketchel
Charley Burley
Harry Greb
Jake LaMotta
Carlos Monzon
Tony Zale
Panama Joe Gans
Marcel Cerdan
Les Darcy
Holman Williams
Mickey Walker
James Toney
Mike McCallum

Your thoughts Gentlemen?

Poet

To be honest Poet. I find it hard to do fantasy fights between fighters that were so many years apart.

As alot of things were different in say Fitszimmons era to Hopkins's era. So I find it hard to invision what the fight would look like and play out like, as they fought in totally different era's of boxing and rules.

Ziggy Stardust
01-12-2010, 07:24 PM
To be honest Poet. I find it hard to do fantasy fights between fighters that were so many years apart.

As alot of things were different in say Fitszimmons era to Hopkins's era. So I find it hard to invision what the fight would look like and play out like, as they fought in totally different era's of boxing and rules.

Not a problem :) If you think a fighter is too far out of era to make a comparison just pass on the matchup.

My conception with these is to take an active fighter that gets a lot of print on Boxing Scene and get the good posters here (ie. not haters or huggers) to put their thoughts in on how they stack up. It's just seems to me that it's been getting a bit dry around here for Boxing History's heavy hitters what with the all the trolls and people with agendas taking over every thread.

Poet

Southpaw16BF
01-12-2010, 07:37 PM
Not a problem :) If you think a fighter is too far out of era to make a comparison just pass on the matchup.

My conception with these is to take an active fighter that gets a lot of print on Boxing Scene and get the good posters here (ie. not haters or huggers) to put their thoughts in on how they stack up. It's just seems to me that it's been getting a bit dry around here for Boxing History's heavy hitters what with the all the trolls and people with agendas taking over every thread.

Poet

Yeah, I agree threads like these make the History section a much better place. One match up that I really like here is Hopkins vs McCallum.

Two of the soundest techincal fighters of all time. I edge towards Hopkins taking a decision, but I imagine it's a close affair, with both men having success.......:boxing:

Ziggy Stardust
01-12-2010, 07:49 PM
Yeah, I agree threads like these make the History section a much better place. One match up that I really like here is Hopkins vs McCallum.

Two of the soundest techincal fighters of all time. I edge towards Hopkins taking a decision, but I imagine it's a close affair, with both men having success.......:boxing:

It's amazing the sort of thoughtful discussions these threads get: I simply block the known trolls from posting in them and abracadabra the discussions generate light instead of heat :D

Hopkins Vs. McCallum is VERY intriguing: A few years shift in age on the part of one or the other and it could very well have actually occured. Can you imagine the display of skills? :boxing:

Poet

ShatteredGlass
01-12-2010, 07:54 PM
He beats them all easily, no-one can touch a prime BHOP on his best day.

some of them would do well, but he's just better than all of those guys.

mickey malone
01-12-2010, 08:13 PM
He beats everyone on points apart from

Carlos Monzon
Harry Greb
Ray Robinson
Marvin Hagler
Roy Jones
Charley Burley

who I believe would all outpoint him..

50/50 matches (to be decided on points)

LaMotta
Zale
Fullmer
Darcy
Walker
Fitzsimmons

Only fight that may not go the distance would be against Ketchell, but Stanley would be lucky to catch Hopkins flush, so i'll go for Hopkins UD..

Ziggy Stardust
01-12-2010, 08:15 PM
He beats them all easily, no-one can touch a prime BHOP on his best day.

some of them would do well, but he's just better than all of those guys.

No Hugging Sir :nono:

Poet

Southpaw16BF
01-12-2010, 08:36 PM
It's amazing the sort of thoughtful discussions these threads get: I simply block the known trolls from posting in them and abracadabra the discussions generate light instead of heat :D

Hopkins Vs. McCallum is VERY intriguing: A few years shift in age on the part of one or the other and it could very well have actually occured. Can you imagine the display of skills? :boxing:

Poet

Yep agreed there mate. I just like coming on and having a serious and enjoyable discussion about the history of boxing, discussing and debating the past ATG's.

And enjoy reading posts from the intellegent posters on here.

One more round
01-12-2010, 11:48 PM
In Prime Bernard Hopkins Versus In Prime:

Ray Robinson
Bob Fitzsimmons
Marvin Hagler
Stanley Ketchel
Charley Burley
Harry Greb
Jake LaMotta
Carlos Monzon
Tony Zale
Panama Joe Gans
Marcel Cerdan
Les Darcy
Holman Williams
Mickey Walker
James Toney
Mike McCallum

Your thoughts Gentlemen?

Poet

On his best day, I can see Bernard beating every single one of those guys.

Ziggy Stardust
01-13-2010, 12:23 AM
On his best day, I can see Bernard beating every single one of those guys.

Of course, on THEIR best days a case can be made for all of them beating Bernard ;)

Poet

One more round
01-13-2010, 02:10 AM
Of course, on THEIR best days a case can be made for all of them beating Bernard ;)

Poet

For some of them, but I could never see a guy like Les Darcy beating Bernard Hopkins.

General Zod
01-13-2010, 06:20 AM
In Prime Bernard Hopkins Versus In Prime:
Marvin Hagler
James Toney
Mike McCallum

I can't comment on the other mw's you listed, but I can on the above three, we are also going to have to assume that all these guys are the same size i.e Hagler today would be a ww.

Hopkins looks good against come forward punchers, with not to good hand speed like Johnson and Pavlik and little guys who don't have the power to hurt him like Oscar and Tito. Who he could also bully and rough up on the inside.

Against Toney he would most probably lose by ud, Toney hand speed would be to much for him to effectively counter and Toney would make the necessary adjustments throughout the fight to neutralise Hopkins favourite attacks. Like the right hand, lead headbutt combo.

McCallum beats him as well by ud, McCallum was an amazing boxing with solid technical skills, a case could be made that a past prime McCallum beat Toney in both of their fights, so I can see a prime McCallum beating Hopkins

I think Hagler outworks him to a ud as well, fast hands, aggressive, iron chinned and a high work rate, a nightmare combination for Hopkins. Who always struggled with boxers, who had fast hands and a high work rate.

Ziggy Stardust
01-13-2010, 12:24 PM
I can't comment on the other mw's you listed, but I can on the above three, we are also going to have to assume that all these guys are the same size i.e Hagler today would be a ww.

Hopkins looks good against come forward punchers, with not to good hand speed like Johnson and Pavlik and little guys who don't have the power to hurt him like Oscar and Tito. Who he could also bully and rough up on the inside.

Against Toney he would most probably lose by ud, Toney hand speed would be to much for him to effectively counter and Toney would make the necessary adjustments throughout the fight to neutralise Hopkins favourite attacks. Like the right hand, lead headbutt combo.

McCallum beats him as well by ud, McCallum was an amazing boxing with solid technical skills, a case could be made that a past prime McCallum beat Toney in both of their fights, so I can see a prime McCallum beating Hopkins

I think Hagler outworks him to a ud as well, fast hands, aggressive, iron chinned and a high work rate, a nightmare combination for Hopkins. Who always struggled with boxers, who had fast hands and a high work rate.

The presumption is same day weigh-ins. I don't think it would be a problem for B-Hop as he has never been one to let his weight fluctuate much in between fights. He's one of the few current fighters I can believe same-days wouldn't have much impact on.

Poet