I couldn't decide whether he was trying to ape Toney or it was just a geriatric wandering the nursing home looking for prozac. Much respect to the guy for his effort, but didn't he look a right silly sod when he was gettin' jiggy with it?

He has no skills and got beat by a better man.

He has no skills and got beat by a better man.And this is relevant to the thread because......?

Ruiz was fleet footed like Ali in his prime. That's what's possible when you are brimming with raw talent.

And this is relevant to the thread because......?

If my comment was too vague, I'll explain.

John Ruiz has very little skills as a boxer. Boxers have many skills. One of them is to have great balance and good foot work. So when I said he had little skills and was beaten by a better man (coz he actually had boxing skills), I thought my comment would suffice. If Ruiz looked like a drunk to you, it's coz he had no answer for Toney's positioning to punch him.

There.

Toney hits like a girlscout. Ruiz lost because the boxing world conspired against him for not bringing in the money with his tactical style.

Toney hits like a girlscout. Ruiz lost because the boxing world conspired against him for not bringing in the money with his tactical style.

Heh! His tactical style fits very well with WWF. :)

If my comment was too vague, I'll explain.

John Ruiz has very little skills as a boxer. Boxers have many skills. One of them is to have great balance and good foot work. So when I said he had little skills and was beaten by a better man (coz he actually had boxing skills), I thought my comment would suffice. If Ruiz looked like a drunk to you, it's coz he had no answer for Toney's positioning to punch him.

There.
Am I really the only one with positive karma in this thread? :)

Nah, I just expected an answer like "yeah, he looked like a twat", not some generic Ruiz dissing...

What's "karma"? Never seen that in other forums. I'm kinda new here.

If you like a post, you click on the karma button and give good/bad k and a reason if you want to. You must have said things people didn't like, but that's cool. I've said plenty of things people didn't like, but for some reason I still have a good K rating.

Karma's for *****es. People just hate those who recognize that Ruiz is a great boxer and Top 5 of all time.

If you like a post, you click on the karma button and give good/bad k and a reason if you want to. You must have said things people didn't like, but that's cool. I've said plenty of things people didn't like, but for some reason I still have a good K rating.

I got negaitve karma? HA! That's sweet! Must be coz I'm not a huge fan of any one boxer. I try to be objective as possible. So I've made a few comments about boxer's skills that may have offended a few fans. :)

Karma's for *****es. People just hate those who recognize that Ruiz is a great boxer and Top 5 of all time.


I like this guy. He's funny!

click on User CP top left to see a K history...

click on User CP top left to see a K history...

Ah! I got negatives from niels7147933 and slipx. :D And it's all coz I had negative comments about Ruiz' lack of boxing skills! :D

Blasphemy. Ruiz rules.

Ah! I got negatives from niels7147933 and slipx. :D And it's all coz I had negative comments about Ruiz' lack of boxing skills! :DThey're two of the three biggest *******s on here anyway, don't worry about it. (Warrior Spirit is the third).

You know I was thinking the same thing Anorak. I knew Ruiz was painfully mediocre but his footwork was something you'd expect from a novice. He'd lean far in when he jabbed and sometimes even lift his rear foot off of the canvas slightly. His feet were rarely under him, which is the only reason he was knocked down.

The thing is, unlike handspeed and power, footwork is something that you can really improve on with practice so I don't understand why he hasn't concentrated on that area. I know the guy trains hard but what is he doing in the gym that he doesn't even know how to move like a boxer?

You know I was thinking the same thing Anorak. I knew Ruiz was painfully mediocre but his footwork was something you'd expect from a novice. He'd lean far in when he jabbed and sometimes even lift his rear foot off of the canvas slightly. His feet were rarely under him, which is the only reason he was knocked down.

The thing is, unlike handspeed and power, footwork is something that you can really improve on with practice so I don't understand why he hasn't concentrated on that area. I know the guy trains hard but what is he doing in the gym that he doesn't even know how to move like a boxer?He looked ridiculous didn't he, mate?

Karma's for *****es. People just hate those who recognize that Ruiz is a great boxer and Top 5 of all time.
keep up the good work :D

Future generations will look back upon Ruiz for the prodigy he is. History will show that he belongs with the greatest who ever stepped into the ring or laced up a pair of gloves.

You know I was thinking the same thing Anorak. I knew Ruiz was painfully mediocre but his footwork was something you'd expect from a novice. He'd lean far in when he jabbed and sometimes even lift his rear foot off of the canvas slightly. His feet were rarely under him, which is the only reason he was knocked down.

The thing is, unlike handspeed and power, footwork is something that you can really improve on with practice so I don't understand why he hasn't concentrated on that area. I know the guy trains hard but what is he doing in the gym that he doesn't even know how to move like a boxer?


Kid Achilles, your analysis are usually very good. You notice extremly small details, you have a good concept of how a paticular match fits in historically. You seem to be very intelligent, I could actually see you being a trainer somewhere.

Which makes me ask how could you pick Ruiz to beat Toney ????

Future generations will look back upon Ruiz for the prodigy he is. History will show that he belongs with the greatest who ever stepped into the ring or laced up a pair of gloves.
i think he's an inspiration to those of us who are not 100% naturally gifted but make the most of what we've got, and learn different ways of suceeding

Toney hits like a girlscout. Ruiz lost because the boxing world conspired against him for not bringing in the money with his tactical style.


thats what i think, everyone wants toney in the mix cause he talks trash, if thats what people want just go watch wrestling or something

I picked Toney primarily because the guy irritates me. I have to admit that I haven't seen enough of his fights but I knew he was somewhat of a cutie, that is a guy who does all kinds of little things very well. The shoulder rolls, the feints, etc.

And of course his great reflexes. Those still seem to be fairly intact even at his age, unfortunately for me.

I just didn't think it would be enough to beat Ruiz, as terrible as the guy is. I was not sold on Toney as a heavyweight, I don't think he has the functional strength. I wouldn't be surprised if he can benchpress and lift a lot but his frame just isn't that big. Ruiz is a lgit 6'2" heavyweight on the other hand. I figured Ruiz would maul him on the inside, grapple with him and tie his arms up. It turns out of course, Toney is one of the better inside fighters today and aside from clinching Ruiz is not an inside fighter. This is clearly evidenced when you look at pictures of Ruiz's battered torso.

What really made me pick Ruiz was the terrible, terrible shape Toney was in, and the fact that I've heard he broke training camp at 260 pounds! That's a hundred pounds over his original fighting weight and its completely inexcusable for anyone who calls himself a professional athlete to get into that kind of condition.

When you consider the recent injuries he's had and the things he's been saying to Ruiz to piss him off and possibly motivate the guy into getting into the best shape of his life (didn't happen), it just had upset written all over it.

Unfortunately for me, I was very wrong.

I have to admit though, Toney deserves credit and I tip my hat to him. The guy is an exceptional boxer in a division swamped with mediocrity. He is not a natural heavyweight, nor will he ever be, but he's so good that barring the giant brothers and physical marvels like Samuel Peter, David Tua, and Corrie Sanders (if he were to come out of retirement) he will easily have his way with the current crop.

I really need to see the Toney-Ruiz fight in better quality. I watched it over webcam (thanks again to Martin) and the video was choppy. I'll need to watch it a few times in good quality before I bet against Toney again. ;)

In an answer to the original point Ruiz probably did have some weird footwork, as was seen in many Naz fights:
- trying desperatly to gain confidence back.
- been hit and too many brain cells damaged.
either way he probably looked like a prat

-->similar fight is Armando Belcastro vs The Prince (Naseem)

-same sorta thing happens here. Naz starts celebrating and then the little mexican begins doin some weird Teletubbies dance (for those of you who live in England). for the rest of you lets just say he looked like a noodle. :o