The greatest's defensive boxers of all time?

I pride myself on my defensive and counter punching style (hitting whilst not being hit), using my footwork and speed. I was just wondering who you guys thought were the best defensive boxers of all time?

toney or mayweather currently

toney he has that defensive shoulder roll that makes it almost impossible to get a clean punch on him

pernell "sweat pea whitaker" had some great defense.
james toney has some nice defence too as does winky wright both fighters are very slick

Willie Pep
Pernell Whitaker
Miguel Canto
Jack Johnson
Wilfred Benitez

pernell "sweat pea whitaker" had some great defense.
james toney has some nice defence too as does winky wright both fighters are very slick


I think winky wright has a alright defense....He comes forward sort of like micky ward with that peek a boo defense......I think hooks can get to him..

I would also throw in

Cris Byrd
and possibly Oscar DLH

If we throwing in people than, cause the best...I dont know? :
Roy Jones Jr.
Mayweather
Ivan Calderon
Cotto
Bernard Hopkins

I love how the topic question just gets ignored.

He asked of all time, not today.

I find myself, as I always do concerning boxing history, agreeing with CPLE.

'sweet pea'...hands down.

I love how the topic question just gets ignored.

He asked of all time, not today.

I find myself, as I always do concerning boxing history, agreeing with CPLE.

Most "all-time" questions on this site tend to get answers that only have to deal with the last 15 years or so.

And yes, Cple gave some great answers as per usual. I'll add a few more all-time names though, like; Nicolino Locche, Mike Gibbons, Young Griffo, Benny Leonard, Luis Rodriguez, Eder Jofre, Jim Driscoll, Maxie Rosenbloom, Joey Giardello, Benny Lynch, etc., etc. etc.

All of those fighters were known to have a very strong defensive game and were very tough to hit cleanly when in that mode.

I would have to say, Pernell, Floyd, and Spinks.

If we throwing in people than, cause the best...I dont know? :
Roy Jones Jr.
Mayweather
Ivan Calderon
Cotto
Bernard Hopkins
Yes, definitely Roy Jones Jr. and Bernard Hopkins.

Missed those two..

Eventhough I prefer fighters that will take a couple punches just to land one, (Gatti, LaMatta, Ward, Cooney, DeMarco)

The Answer is without question Willie "Will O' the Wisp" Pep. Pep alledgedly won a round on all the judges scorecards w/out throwing a punch, Thats defense!

And whoever said Cotto(and I believe it was IWatchBoxing) is on the pipe. It is an obvious hometown pick, We've all seen Cotto's great defensive skills against Corely.

all time sweet pea.............and mayweather could be a alltime great

Herol 'Bomber' Graham has to be the most elusive defensive fighter I've seen.

sven ottke though i dont like his defensive its boring sometime when he hold etc...and toney also got great defensive.

If we throwing in people than, cause the best...I dont know? :
Roy Jones Jr.
Mayweather
Ivan Calderon
Cotto
Bernard Hopkins

No, definitely not Cotto. He gets hit TOO MUCH.

Roy Jones is one of the fastest and most dominant boxers of all time, but let's be honest, his defence sucks. Tarver exposed him TWICE

Roy Jones is one of the fastest and most dominant boxers of all time, but let's be honest, his defence sucks. Tarver exposed him TWICE

you obviously have not seen jones at super middleweight...

Most "all-time" questions on this site tend to get answers that only have to deal with the last 15 years or so.

And yes, Cple gave some great answers as per usual. I'll add a few more all-time names though, like; Nicolino Locche, Mike Gibbons, Young Griffo, Benny Leonard, Luis Rodriguez, Eder Jofre, Jim Driscoll, Maxie Rosenbloom, Joey Giardello, Benny Lynch, etc., etc. etc.

All of those fighters were known to have a very strong defensive game and were very tough to hit cleanly when in that mode.


Those are some great names in there. I was going to say Leonard and another one I think would be worth mentioning is Duran. He was pretty hard to hit cleanly in his prime and took a lot of punches on his gloves and arms. I've never seen Jofre fight, and I've heard very little about his defense. Was he just very hard to hit cleanly?

Jones, similiar to Ali in his prime, was almost impossible to hit solidly. However, it was due to his tremendous reflexes, speed, and anticipation that made him so elusive, not fundamental defensive technique.

One fighter that not many people relate to defense, but was a master at it was Roberto Duran. To me, he possessed probably the best defense of any infighter i've ever seen. He did it all on both spectrums of the game. Of course, his defensive prowess is overshadowed by his incredible offensive skill and tenacity. Look closely. He rarely got hit by a solid punch at his best.

Willie Pep..then Sweet Pea......then the rest...
Ali was good as the guy above said, HE leaned a lot of tactics from Archie Moore. Prime Tyson with HIS variation of the peek-a-boo doesn't get enough credit.
Among today's guys Mayweather is tops and Spaddy looks good defensively (when he is not showing off his offence up side his old lady's head)!
Byrd is very "cute" of course....

Muhammad Ali

James Toney

Pernell Whitaker

I will not give credit to fighters for being great defensive fighters who fight like complete ******* 90% of the time and run.

Roy Jones Jr
Pernell Whitaker

I've never seen Jofre fight, and I've heard very little about his defense. Was he just very hard to hit cleanly?

Unless you're an aggressive buzzsaw like Fighting Harada, who can throw the punches all night (a few were bound to get through from him when he threw that many), Eder Jofre was very tough to hit cleanly. Jofre had tremendous upper body defensive reflexes when in close, good set of legs for moving in and out of range, and always abided by that main rule of boxing, "keep your hands up". Very good at blocking punches or knocking them down with his gloves.

Muhammad Ali

I will not give credit to fighters for being great defensive fighters who fight like complete ******* 90% of the time and run.

so if a ***** wins..what does that say about the opponent?...lol

so if a ***** wins..what does that say about the opponent?...lol

It means the opponent could not catch the ***** running around the ring all night. I hate fighters that fight like that....run around the ring, dance around the ring, then win rounds on landing like 15 jabs, its disgracefull boxing style. It exploits the 10 point must system. Its also the fault of the 10 point must system that fighters can consistantly win in that style, when they ought not to. I hear judges are discouraged from scoring even rounds, that is bull****, alot more rounds in boxing should be called even. If niether fighter does a thing descisive in a round score the f***er even. I hate seeing fights where one ***** ass fighter wins a shutout UD without landing a single meaningfull punch in the entire bout.

It means the opponent could not catch the ***** running around the ring all night. I hate fighters that fight like that....run around the ring, dance around the ring, then win rounds on landing like 15 jabs, its disgracefull boxing style. It exploits the 10 point must system. Its also the fault of the 10 point must system that fighters can consistantly win in that style, when they ought not to. I hear judges are discouraged from scoring even rounds, that is bull****, alot more rounds in boxing should be called even. If niether fighter does a thing descisive in a round score the f***er even. I hate seeing fights where one ***** ass fighter wins a shutout UD without landing a single meaningfull punch in the entire bout.

i agree with you. my definition of defense is more slipping and sliding in angles while creating punching room for yourself...but you can't fault a boxer for taking a win...i agree i hate the 10 point must system.

Unless you're an aggressive buzzsaw like Fighting Harada, who can throw the punches all night (a few were bound to get through from him when he threw that many), Eder Jofre was very tough to hit cleanly. Jofre had tremendous upper body defensive reflexes when in close, good set of legs for moving in and out of range, and always abided by that main rule of boxing, "keep your hands up". Very good at blocking punches or knocking them down with his gloves.


Thanks for the info. Jofre was certainly an excellent fighter.

pernel whitaker
wilfred benitez
james toney
floyd mayweather

Pernell Whitaker was a defensive innovator

the young Tyson had awesome head-movement & barely got touched

Johnny Tapia didn't get hit square on the chin but maybe 2-3 times in his biggest match vs. Romero

Winky Wright's arm-D can't be penetrated

joe gans jack johnson sweat pea archie moore
modern young tyson toney duran hopkins

Currently

Toney
Mayweather
Wright
Hopkins

History

Willie Pep
Pernell Whitaker

Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker.

Tie between Wlad Klitschko and Michael Grant, They got that "cant hit me while I am down" style mastered :D



Real Awnser : Pernell Whitaker

how about hagler?

Yeah, Hagler and Mickey Ward both come to mind immediately.

Not so sure about their chins though. :D

Yeah, Hagler and Mickey Ward both come to mind immediately.

Not so sure about their chins though. :D
hagler has the best chin.... never been downed

best defense is with out a doubt pernell whittaker the guy won 40 fights 23 by decesion and obviously you needed great D do win by decesion that much plus he never got koed in his career and outboxed a prime delahoya when pernel was on crack also roy jones had great defense even in his last fight vs tarver his d was decent he moved around like mj in a boxing ring if u kno what i mean

Willie Pep once won a round without even throwing a single punch. He had extraordinary defense.

Pernell Whitaker also comes to mind. He had a bad chin, bad power but He still always won fights by UD. He had great upper body movement along with great foot speed.

Benny Leonard also comes to mind. I remember reading an article about him He used to always say "didn't even muss up my hair".

Jack Johnson also comes to mind.

Willie Pep and Seet Pea Whitaker are maybe the two greatest EVER. Hard to find any two that beat those two. Spaddy Spadafora put on a great defensive display against Pito Cardona when he won the vacant title and your own Iceman John Scully held Michael Nunn to a crazy low connect pct. I think it was 19 percent). Nobody held Nunn to a percentage that was THAT low. You also got to give it up to Cassius Clay in the first Liston fight. Also Marlon Starling and Don Cobra Curry were masters at the "peek-a-boo defense." They both came under the heading AIRTIGHT DEFENSE. And what about Wilfredo Benitez and his radar defense???? The guy could sit on the ropes right in front of you and just make you miss all day and nite. "The Bible of Boxing" is what they called him. O, yeah, and Billy Conn against Joe Louis, his defense was nice.

Willie Pep once won a round without even throwing a single punch. He had extraordinary defense.


WOOW! really a year ago i would have though that would be impossible! but truely…?
OMG! going a round without getting hit fab… :D

Willie Pep Did Win That Round Against Jackie Graves, Thats What Im Telling You All. That Guy Is The Par For The Course With Defense, He Is The One All Other Defnse Specialists Are Measured. Also, Let Me Say That Right To The Very Last Fight Of His Career Michael Nunn Was A Defnsive Genius. He Almost Shut James Toneyout For 11 Rounds Until Toney Caught Him With That Huge Left Hand And Then Followed Up

Willie Pep,Winky Wright, Pernell Whitaker, Macho Camacho,DLH.

Cotto??????????????
If we throwing in people than, cause the best...I dont know? :
Roy Jones Jr.
Mayweather
Ivan Calderon
Cotto
Bernard Hopkins

all i know is this woman is not http://www.igormeyer.com/nss-folder/pictures/beaten.jpg

Defense isn't a textbook. There is no Bible on defense. Defense simply means avoiding the punches.

Roy Jones Jr.
Pernell Whitaker
James Toney
Roberto Duran
Jack Johnson

ali, louis, johnson, holmes, and tyson.

If I had to pick 1 I would probably say Whittaker.

That is what he relied on to become a solid champ.

i'd go for tyson and pbf

I love how, looking at some names on the list from 4-28, greatest defensive boxers of all time....the name Miguel Cotto is mentioned.....which if you look at it now.....not even in the top 5 defensive boxers in his division.....hit and not get hit my ass....

Peeeekaboo...... Floyd Patterson, Marlon Moochie Starling, Donald Cobra Curry, Iceman John Scully, Winky Wright, Livingstone Bramble. Those Guy Used The Wrap Around Defense To Great Effect But Nobody As Consistently As Marlon Moochie Starling Or As Famously As Floyd Patterson.

Roberto Duran is the single most deceptively defensive fighter I ever saw. His defensive skills often went unnoticed as a result of his offensive prowess. He had an uncanny ability to block, slip and counter punches while in attack mode. Most fighters find it difficult to practice defense while on the offensive and often leave themselves open to counter-punches. Not Duran, he was the quintessential multitasker.

Most fighters at Duran's skill level of defense (e.g. Pernell Whitaker) are boring to watch because they can only deploy one skill (offense/defense) at a time. In fact I rate "Sweet Pea" second - and not equal to - the "Hands of Stone" because of his propensity for defense and counter-punching instead of taking the offensive initiative. Boring, very boring...

Below is an example of Duran's ability (at age 32) to elude opponent's punches while delivering his own:

TF6at28s3wQ

Floyd Mayweather Jr.

No Question.

If we throwing in people than, cause the best...I dont know? :
Roy Jones Jr.
Mayweather
Ivan Calderon
Cotto
Bernard Hopkins

You do not watch boxing.

Willie Pep, Nicolino Locche, Pernell Whitaker.

sweet pea and willie pep, end of thread.

Roberto Duran is the single most deceptively defensive fighter I ever saw. His defensive skills often went unnoticed as a result of his offensive prowess. He had an uncanny ability to block, slip and counter punches while in attack mode. Most fighters find it difficult to practice defense while on the offensive and often leave themselves open to counter-punches. Not Duran, he was the quintessential multitasker.

Most fighters at Duran's skill level of defense (e.g. Pernell Whitaker) are boring to watch because they can only deploy one skill (offense/defense) at a time. In fact I rate "Sweet Pea" second - and not equal to - the "Hands of Stone" because of his propensity for defense and counter-punching instead of taking the offensive initiative. Boring, very boring...You took the words right out of my mind. I would also add that at close range, he (Duran) would use his own arms to arm-lock his opponent's in a clinch and land hooks and uppercuts. With this tactic he would beat his opponent to the punch and dominate the in-fighting.

My top 10 defensive fighters are:

Roberto Durán
Wilfred Benitez
Pernell Whitaker
Chris Byrd
Muhammad Ali*
John Ruiz
Mike Tyson
Corey Spinks
Sugar Ray Leonard
Floyd Patterson*"Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee; your hands can't hit what your eyes can't see..."

RUMBLE, YOUNG MAN, RUMBLE... AHH!

Willie Pep and Pernell

some all time greats to me are ali, patterson(underrated in my book defensively), leonard, whitaker of course, jones jr, of course mayweather, whose defense has been the best in boxing for the last decade, pep, duran, a younder tyson(underrated imo my book defensively also), and winky has to be mentioned also. that's it for me, these guys are the greatest in my book./

Pep, Rosenbloom, Pernell, Tommy Loughran was no slouch, lots of people say Toney but I think he's more of a flashy defensive fighter, he looks like a great defensive fighter because his style is so distincyive. But if we're honest Hopkins is a better defensive fighter because he uses his feet more than Toney does, even if he does it in an ugly way.

hagler has the best chin.... never been downed

That's actually a valid point though. How can you criticize his defense when he was never knocked down or anybody that never gets stopped or gets knocked down very seldomly.

Hagler was actually knocked down once, not bad though.

hagler has the best chin.... never been downedA good "chin" is not a reflection of great defensive skills; it is merely a testament to one's ability to take a punch. Hagler could very well have been a skillful defensive fighter; having the "best chin" is irrelevant and inmaterial. Jake LaMotta and George Chuvalo (to name two) had great chins, but they were human punching bags virtually devoid of any defensive skills. The chin fortitude of a great defensive fighter is rarely tested...

Yeah but if your never stopped and rarely ever knocked down and winning most of your fights then you having all the defense you ever need so there's really no room to criticize.

Willie Pep, Sweet Pea, PBF.

I guess a great defensive fighter would be somebody that wouldn't be able to win without having tremendous defensive skills. The way we're classifying it here.

Yeah, but if you've never been stopped and rarely ever knocked down, and winning most of your fights, then you're having all the defense you ever need, so there's really no room to criticize.Winning most fights - in and of itself - is no evidence of marginal, let alone great defense, which is what this thread is all about. One can win most fights by landing more punches than his opponent, regardless of how many he defends against.

I guess a great defensive fighter would be somebody that wouldn't be able to win without having tremendous defensive skills. The way we're classifying it here.Nonsense! Again, winning a boxing match consists of outscoring or stopping one's opponent. I believe someone once said: "The best defense is a good offense." Hmm. I think it might of been Aaron Pryor...;)

Floyd for me it was hard to choose between him & Whitaker however i went with Floyd cause i think Floyd is a less active than Whitaker in fights which can only be testiment to Floyd's defence

he did nothing in the Dela Hoya fight for 5/6 rounds yet Osacr hardly landed a clean shot

i think Whitaker is more mobile than Floyd not much however ,PBF Spends a lot of time in corners on the ropes etc

Christ, there have been some strange picks in here. BTW, there is an entire 150 post thread on this exact topic in boxing history.

Anyway, it's great to see Duran in here. As someone mentioned he would be, without a doubt, the greatest defensive fighter that was offensive based. Unlike the fighters that made defense their prime weapon like Whittaker, Locche etc Duran was in there, coming forward and throwing but very rarely ever getting hit. One of the best slip/counter fighters and also his ability to know when he was going to be hit and then roll with the punch was simply astonishing. Just check out DeJesus 3 or Leonard 1 for some of the greatest ever fighting combining defensive genius and offensive brilliance in one package!

As for purely defensive fighters some of the classic guys would be: Pep, Toney, Locche, Whittaker, Canto, Benitez, Leonard (Benny), Graham...On Graham, I saw someone else mention him which was exciting! Herol Graham never got his dues for his fighting ability. He was an exceptional defensive genius and fought in one of the best middleweight eras ever. A very underrated fighter and brilliant defensive great.

Of course there is Mayweather in todays era and Hopkins also. Those saying Mayweather is the greatest need to get out and watch some more boxing. He is great but there are many, many fighters as good and better defensively and offensively. Not trying to take anything away from him as he may well become this eras best fighter but in this era alone there are many fighters as good defensively as him...Hopkins, Toney, Nunn, etc. Maybe go watch some of the guys mentioned in this thread before immediately putting Mayweathers name as the greatest (although it certainly belongs here with these guys).

Check out Niccolino Locche against the great Antonio Cervantes for a defensive clinic that baffles the mind!!!

Also have a look at Toney vs Nunn. Two stunningly good counter punching boxers both with some of the best defense seen in the last twenty years. Whoever said Nunn was dominating until KO'ed needs to go check it out again. Great close fight with Nunn winning the middle rounds after a close start and Toney coming back to get the KO in a great set-up win. A fight with staggering skills and showing Toney in his young prime days as a fighter to be reckoned with. His first title win against the pound for pound king of the times.

Edit: Watch for a section in which Toney just leans back and uses his body and shoulder, while staying side on, to deflect about three or four jabs like they were nothing! These jabs coming from Nunn who had one of the best jabs in the business and was much taller and a southpaw! Incredible!

For me, it's Mayweather

someone has most likely said this already but i'll say it again...

Willie Pep

Haven't seen enough of the old guys to make an informed opinion on who was the best of all time, but Whitaker had the best defensive skills that I have actually observed.

[QUOTE=ThunderGatti;617506]Eventhough I prefer fighters that will take a couple punches just to land one, (Gatti, LaMatta, Ward, Cooney, DeMarco)

The Answer is without question Willie "Will O' the Wisp" Pep. Pep alledgedly won a round on all the judges scorecards w/out throwing a punch, Thats defense!

That is actually a Myth.

Mayweather
Whitaker
Pep
B-Hop
Toney