View Full Version : Who was the best heavyweight in their prime?


Sugarr
12-13-2009, 08:31 PM
I'm not talking about who is considered to be the greatest heavyweight of all-time on a P4P list. I'm talking about which heavyweight, in their prime, was better than all other heavyweights in their prime.

I think I'd give it to Tyson. A prime Tyson would beat the prime versions of Ali, Louis, Holmes, Marciano, etc.

He was just too fast and too powerful. His defense was great and he always had an excellent chin.

RightCross94
12-13-2009, 11:06 PM
When will the Tyson worship end?

Any elite HW who was resilient enough to withstand his early onslaught, and then able to take him in to deep waters late would finish him.

Marcov
12-14-2009, 04:42 AM
I like Tyson but how he beat Berbick, P. Thomas and Tony Tucker are not the best measuring tools against the all time greats. Many of them met many different styles and fighters more qualified than the above fighters. Sometimes power can be decieving, a fighter stops his opponent and we might think, he is that good. Ask yourself after watching Tyson with James Tillis if he could beat many of the ATG, sure it's possible but I doubt it.

them_apples
12-14-2009, 04:51 AM
it will be a fighter with a lot of heart when it comes down to it, because every fighter is going to have a bad stylistic matchup.

I'd say Ali, Frazier and Holyfield would come out on top with the most wins over other greats.

Tyson did great against guys that backed up and gave him room to launch his assault. He did bad against those what could weather the storm and back him up.

Foreman did great against guys that liked to bang, but didn't do so well when presented with angled and movement.

etc etc

Marcov
12-14-2009, 05:07 AM
it will be a fighter with a lot of heart when it comes down to it, because every fighter is going to have a bad stylistic matchup.

I'd say Ali, Frazier and Holyfield would come out on top with the most wins over other greats.

Tyson did great against guys that backed up and gave him room to launch his assault. He did bad against those what could weather the storm and back him up.

Foreman did great against guys that liked to bang, but didn't do so well when presented with angled and movement.

etc etc

Very interesting post. Based on styles I picture Foreman doing very well against Tyson.

Spartacus Sully
12-14-2009, 05:22 AM
Best heavy weight in their prime? James J. Jeffries

steeluv
12-14-2009, 05:30 AM
When will the Tyson worship end?

Any elite HW who was resilient enough to withstand his early onslaught, and then able to take him in to deep waters late would finish him.

I think foreman could have with stood it, im not sure if the rest could have stood a peak tyson, ali would have to dancee well otherwise I think he would go.

cooper5
12-14-2009, 05:46 AM
Generally when people talk about Tyson's speed they are referring to his hand speed which was very good for a 5'10" puncher. He was not known for his foot speed or especially good at cutting off the ring. It might have seemed so because most opponents came to him or held on for dear life. The only fighter other than Tillis that offered him alot of movement besides Tillis was Larry Holmes and Holmes was returning from a near two year layoff and was near 40.

The Stone Roses
12-14-2009, 06:51 AM
George Foreman and Sonny Liston were more devastating puchers than Tyson IMO...neither of them managed to hurt Ali...so it will be crazy to think Tyson will be able to knockout Ali....and if Tyson doesn't knock Ali out, how is he going to win the fight??? Tyson outbox Ali and win on points??? no chance in hell...Prime Ali is the fastest heavyweight ever...sure, Tyson had his bobbing and weaving style, but so did Frazier....Ali pummeled Frazier's head into submission when Ali was 10 years past his prime....

Prime Muhammad Ali > everyone else

1SILVA
12-14-2009, 11:19 AM
I'm not talking about who is considered to be the greatest heavyweight of all-time on a P4P list. I'm talking about which heavyweight, in their prime, was better than all other heavyweights in their prime.

I think I'd give it to Tyson. A prime Tyson would beat the prime versions of Ali, Louis, Holmes, Marciano, etc.

He was just too fast and too powerful. His defense was great and he always had an excellent chin.

No heavy in the history of the sport was better than the Ali of 64-67. He would have made Tyson cry like a woman. He would have made him quit, period.

Sugarr
12-14-2009, 02:40 PM
No heavy in the history of the sport was better than the Ali of 64-67. He would have made Tyson cry like a woman. He would have made him quit, period.

That's sort of an over-exaggeration.

It's not like Ali wasn't hittable. He was in trouble at times, throughout his career, and I'm sure Tyson could get him in trouble, as well. The only question is whether he could capitalize on it, if it did happen.

paul750
12-14-2009, 02:48 PM
He may not have been putting punches together in the Holyfield fights, but the power was very much still there and Holyfield wasn't going anywhere. Combination punching or not, Holyfield would have always given him problems IMO. Tyson couldn't do a lot going backwards.

Lennox would have beaten him as long as he survived the first four rounds. Similar to his fight with the washed-up Tyson, only a Tyson with a much longer fuse. A younger Holmes would certainly be in with a shout. The Holmes Tyson beat was still a decent version [as Holmes would later go on to give problems to top fighters], but even so, it certainly wasn't a prime, prepared Holmes.

Sugarj
12-14-2009, 02:51 PM
I think old Larry Holmes showed enough in four rounds to indicate that he had the tools in his prime to beat Tyson. He looked great in cameos dancing and jabbing, but he didn't have the legs or reflexes to keep it up and was having his first fight in what 2 and a half, 3 years.

A 1978-1982 Holmes may well have stole a decision from Tyson.

Sugarr
12-14-2009, 02:52 PM
So many replies with so little opinions on the actual question?

RightCross94
12-14-2009, 04:53 PM
I think Ali and Evander would have probably done the best if all the HW greats in their primes fought each other. They can box, brawl and both have top chins and big hearts.

Marcov
12-14-2009, 04:57 PM
So many replies with so little opinions on the actual question?

I though my first response could have been ok for what you originally posted.

But it was a statement not a question, with no question marks. I thought you were just opening a discussion with it which was ok with me.

Sugarj
12-14-2009, 04:58 PM
No problem Sugarr, Sugarj will have a go.....

Honestly, prime for prime I think that 1967 Ali and 1980 Holmes are as close to heavyweight perfection as I've seen.

1988 Tyson, 1991-92 Bowe and 1990 Holyfield were fabulous too, all would be very difficult for any heavyweight in history to handle.

For me 1969 Frazier, 1938 Louis, 1960 Liston, 1973 Foreman and 2000 Lewis were terrific heavyweights too but would complete the lower half of my prime for prime heavyweight top ten.

Much as I love 1910 Johnson, 1921 Dempsey, 1926 Tunney or 1954 Marciano I wouldn't expect them to beat my top five. Just my opinion of course, based on all the fight films I've seen.

sleazyfellow
12-14-2009, 05:49 PM
Best heavy weight in their prime? James J. Jeffries

Hahaha, yeah I agree, if he's able to wrestle and foul his opponents like he was able to back then and get away with it, he's the best in his prime.

Theres not much to say to this thread besides Muhammed Ali, Joe Louis was also a killer in his prime as well.

Spartacus Sully
12-14-2009, 10:50 PM
i dont know so much about fouling (i think your thinking of dempsey if your talking nut shots) but wrestling.....most these heavies wouldnt have known what to do once they got in his clinch, and even less to do after 10 rounds when they realize they havnt even damaged him and hes just getting started.