Not really a big fan personall, basically b/c i never watched it much. However I caught the replay of the " ultimate fighter " finale on ****e tv just now and I have to say those two guys in the second fight were awesoem. It seemed that it was raw , but an all out brawl with 4 oz gloves. They showed alot more heart than some big time boxers do. It was really a good brawl if any of ya missed it.

It was a great fight but what hurts it is the fact that they were two unknowns and probably did so well because they are two amateurs, to put it that way. When I see them fighting legit competition and not each other, I will know if they can really throwdown.

Forrest is in no way an amateur. He's fought Jeremy Horn, Dan Severn, Travis Fulton and Jeff Monson and has fought all over the world.
Stephan Bonnar trains with Carlson Gracie and has had 7 pro fights before TUF against other pro fighters. These guys are new to the UFC but are far from amateurs.

If you're interested in MMA watch the Pride middleweight grand prix on Saturday, April 23rd. The worlds best LHWs in a 16 man tournament.

http://groundnpound.ahost4all.com/grapplingconcepts/pridegppostrthumb.jpg (http://groundnpound.ahost4all.com/grapplingconcepts/pridegppostr.jpg)

ive never cared much for UFC but watching that replay on ****e kinda got me interested. i think im gonna have to order that coture- lidell (spelt rong) :o fight. i saw a few clips of their fights, both of those guys seem pretty bad ass.

That fight on Saturday was one of the best fight I have ever seen. Period. I think that the other guy should have won though, the American Psycho, Stephan whatever.

How about Ken Shamrock getting his ass beat huh?

that guy kept saying "this is the best shamrock we've ever seen"
but i dont know how any fighter can be better than their prime at age 41. i dont know much ufc so i wont talk much **** but, damn

yeah i quite like the bargain buckets they are good value and the chicken is not bad either. :D

what in the hell are you talkin about jw? :D

i watch UFC, thats some brutal **** right there.

what in the hell are you talkin about jw? :D

this is a thread about the colnoles favourite special chicken right...oooh UFC not KFC :D

sorry was being a smart arse. it didnt work. :p ;)

Mirko Cro Cop was the only reason I ever liked MMA.

Pride...etc is boring as hell without him. Bar none.

Pride...etc is boring as hell without him. Bar none.

HAHAHHAHAHAHA!!!!

Forrest is in no way an amateur. He's fought Jeremy Horn, Dan Severn, Travis Fulton and Jeff Monson and has fought all over the world.
Stephan Bonnar trains with Carlson Gracie and has had 7 pro fights before TUF against other pro fighters. These guys are new to the UFC but are far from amateurs.

If you're interested in MMA watch the Pride middleweight grand prix on Saturday, April 23rd. The worlds best LHWs in a 16 man tournament.

http://groundnpound.ahost4all.com/grapplingconcepts/pridegppostrthumb.jpg (http://groundnpound.ahost4all.com/grapplingconcepts/pridegppostr.jpg)

I did not mean that they are really amateurs. My point is that they are not stars and although they are experienced in a way, it is not the same level. Fighting Severn and Horn alone does not make you a force unless you beat them or give them a tough fight. Southworth fought Belfort but the guy is still pretty much a few classes below Vitor. That is my point. If Chuck and Randy had a war like that it would be more mainstream because the fans already know them. I know none of these guys were making their debuts because guys like Diego and Leben have been around for a while but it ain't the same.

Another thing was that even though the Forrest-Anthony fight was amazing, sometimes they were so reckless that it look like an amateu or street fight. Especially Forrest with those haymakers and Anthony with a few spinning tricks that he tried.

Mirko Cro Cop was the only reason I ever liked MMA.

Pride...etc is boring as hell without him. Bar none.

http://www.mmaringreport.com/pride/pride_fighter_photo's/silva_wanderlei_250.jpg

God begs to differ.

http://sportsnavi.yahoo.co.jp/fight/pict/200211/24/021124_kak_pride_sakuraba_b.jpg

My favorite fighters ever are Ken Shamrock, Pedro Rizzo, Marco Ruas, Royce Gracie, Mirko Filipovic, Kazushi Sakuraba, Nobuhiko Takada, and Vitor Belfort. That is in no particular order with the exception of the first two.

Ok my 2 cents:

I'm into MMA so much that sometimes I question if is a healthy relationship, my job evolves around MMA, I eat **** and breath MMA.

Now to call Forrest and Stephan amateurs is just not right. Here is the difference between MMA and Boxing. MMA fighters have dedicated most of thier lives to a particular martial art and mastered it, maybe not just a martial art but a combat sport. (wrestling is not a martial art). I'm not event going to et into my view of most boxing people.

This guys work endless hours to become proficient at what they do, unlike many boxers and beleive you me I know top boxers that do not put half the effort that this guys do.

The only reason why you might called them amateurs is because MMA does not have the exposure that this guys have in boxing nor the money.

SO plese out of respect to them do not call them amateurs. The are consumate pros, they have more respect for their opponents and the sport than most people have for their friends and family. And that is not an exageration since I know Forrest and Stephan persoanlly.

Changing the tone; the UFC and ****e Tv did a great job changing the view of the general public about MMA. They did a great match up with the fighters, from the beggining anyone that has a clue about MMA knew that Forrest and Bonnar would be the 2 in the finals and that happens to be a great match up. Not only that Forrest and Bonnar did a great job at wanting to get paid and layed it all out in the ring, but make no mistake, this is the way the fight ALL THE TIME!!! If any of you are fortunate enough to see them fight in other events you will understand why they fight the way they do.

Pride is a great event also, but understand that they do cater to a different culture and public, they cater to Japan where they make TONs of money compared to what iss made in the USA. Not only that MMA is main stream in Japan, unlike here in the US.

I look forward to the next TUF. :boxing:

I think I explained my amateur point, It's not an insult or anything. I also know they have fought but you have to admit that they are no Shamrocks or Sakurabas right now. I know they train their asses off, but I said that they are starting to be known now. About MMA not being too mainstream, that really makes no difference to me because I have been a fan for years and have followed it. I am writing this so you know that this is an opinion of a guy who really likes and understands the sport. Not some kid who started to watch MMA because he heard that Fernando Vargas would be in Tito Ortiz' corner.

what is your view of boxing people that you dont want to get into carlao? enlighten me please

what is your view of boxing people that you dont want to get into carlao? enlighten me please
I know the view he is talking about (forgive me if I am wrong Carlao). A lot of pure boxing fans look down on MMA. They see the ground work as "gay" and see the stand-up in MMA as sloppy and amature.

What a lot of boxing fans don't understand is that boxing is only one part of stand-up fighting. In boxing its easier to stay in the pocket because of the bigger gloves, the fact you can only strike with your hands and if someone does start to overwhelm you, you are able to clinch and get a clean break. In MMA, clinching will still put you in danger as dirty boxing and muay thai are very much legal. Knees and elbows to the head will do just as much, if not more, damage than a good left hook. Its harder to block and parry shots with 4oz grappling gloves also.

A lot of boxing fans say things like "oh, that guy would get knocked out in boxing" or "He wouldn't take me down, I would knock him out before he could" ect. ect. Yeah, not all boxing fans say that, hell most of them are genuinly curious about MMA. However what are you going to remember more? The guy that was sort of curious about MMA or the ******* that started talking **** on something he didn't understand?

i hear what your saying and i respect mma fighters to the fullest. i do have to admit that some stand up punching i saw did seem sloppy to me :D i figured it was because im used to seeing boxers, all they do is stand and punch so alot of them have great balance and fluidity even in heavy exchanges. mma fighters train for much more than that so it has to be expected that its not always gonna be the prettiest looking thing in the world.

exciterx21- Thanks for your explanation I understand, so in that case you know that they are not amateurs by any measure and it bother me so specially since I know them personaly.

Yoko- Man this might not be the thing to do in a boxing forum, but here we go:
I personally HATE most not all, but most boxing people. Why, they have very little values. The basis of Martial Arts is the phylosofical(sp) background, that is what makes it different from a combat sport. I was brought up the ranks as a martial artist with Judo. We teach respect, honor, values, self confidence and discipline. Above all respect. I know that not every martial artist will end up with this values and that people are different, but is just my opinion and experience.

Small example: I know a top boxer at welterweight, and he trained with us for his last fight. Note we are not a boxing gym only we are a full Combat Sports and Martial Arts facility. When they would ocme to train they wold blast the radio to the max, I would walk and courteusly ask them and let them know that I needed the radio to be a moderate level and lower the radio. Whiting 2 minutes the radio would be a full blast agian. Then I walked over and just lowered it, the manager adn coach told me if I knew how they where and that I had to leave the radio alone. So I told them that 1- it was not their gym or radio, 2- I was not able to carry a conversation on the phone, 3- and that I did not care if they where the second coming of Muhammed Ali. At this he wanted to fight me and I told him lets go, with LITTLE GLOVES (mma) and MMA rules. To where they just got all pissed and walked away.

This has not been a one time deal, I've encounter this problem or similar numerous times in boxing gyms. However I've encounter good people too, but the great majority is not.

Fallout, thank you you just help me clarify some things that I can get to translate in my head. But you sir are correct. Alos remember that MMA guys are not only worried about getting punched, but what if I miss this punch and I get takendown, regardless if I get right techineque in the punch.

Not really a big fan personall, basically b/c i never watched it much. However I caught the replay of the " ultimate fighter " finale on ****e tv just now and I have to say those two guys in the second fight were awesoem. It seemed that it was raw , but an all out brawl with 4 oz gloves. They showed alot more heart than some big time boxers do. It was really a good brawl if any of ya missed it.
I already made a thread about this

Judah goes down from two right hands. He tries to get up immediately but staggers and falls again.
Nady waves the fight over before Judah regains his feet again.
Judah becomes enraged at the stoppage and throws his corner stool across the ring.
Judah approaches Nady and places his glove under Nady's chin before being restrained by police and his cornermen.
The Nevada Boxing Commission suspends Judah for six months and fines him $75,000.

Just to jump in here for a second;

IMO, Bonnar or Griffin would hand Shamrock his ass right now. Most likely Sakuraba as well. Not to take anything away from Shamrock, but he is BY FAR the most hyped up fighter of all time, and he hasn't really done anything worth noting since he beat Dan Severn at UFC 6, or since his Pancrase days. Which is a hell of a long time ago.

Shamrock is good as an "attraction" fighter, as is Sakuraba. Great for match-ups that appeal to the fans, but really have no bearing on rankings or titles. Put them in the hunt for a title against fighters in their prime, and they get pounded.

Chuck Liddel all the way i have watched that guy since his Kickboxing days i am a huge fan of him.

Um i couldnt help but notice but Cotoures ears are really ****ed up looking... someone posted a picture of some asians guy on like page two and he has the same ears. Whats up with that??

Um i couldnt help but notice but Cotoures ears are really ****ed up looking... someone posted a picture of some asians guy on like page two and he has the same ears. Whats up with that??


It's called cauliflower ear. I believe it's caused when you damage the cartilage in your ear to the point where the cartildge calcifies and turns to bone. It's a true sign of cajones, IMO.

It's called cauliflower ear. I believe it's caused when you damage the cartilage in your ear to the point where the cartildge calcifies and turns to bone. It's a true sign of cajones, IMO.

True, alot of aussie rules footballers get it and Rugby Player get it too, I also hear that **** is Permenant and you cant repair it.

One of my good friends in college had tattoed on his back
cauliflower ears = wrestling's trophy

It is caused by damage to the cartilage and a lot of athletes get it in combat sports, yes even boxers that play inside a lot get banged in the ears. Hense the term "I'll box your ears off!"

Um i was looking at your quotes just want to say if you didnt know im pretty sure the Statistic one is from Stalin. And thx for the info on the ear

Judah goes down from two right hands. He tries to get up immediately but staggers and falls again.
Nady waves the fight over before Judah regains his feet again.
Judah becomes enraged at the stoppage and throws his corner stool across the ring.
Judah approaches Nady and places his glove under Nady's chin before being restrained by police and his cornermen.
The Nevada Boxing Commission suspends Judah for six months and fines him $75,000.

it was a single right hand that ended it.
judah was extremley emotional for the biggest fight of his career ending like that, im not trying to justify it, i know what he did was wrong. i hear what you say about respect and your right about not all boxers being that way, it just seems like you've had some bad experencies with boxers. talking about this makes me think of alexis arguello, he was the exact opposite of what you saw in the tszyu- judah fight. alexis was one of the most respectful and gracious fighters ever.

not to lash out at you but i think i remember hearing about a ken shamrock fight a few years ago, he got his opponent in a submission hold and after the guy taped out shamrock broke his arm anyway. i think it was on national tv to. respect?

peace :cool:

Most likely Sakuraba as well.

Blasphemy, you ****ing heathen... But I still love you, though.

Ultimate Fighter is 3x's (way) better than The Condenter, I like the UFC, fights are bloody, thats what I like to see, them giving both the guys contracts shows how they love the sport.

Yoko- You are right Alexis was a great athlete and carried himself as such. Regarding Shamrock, like I said not all MMA guy are respectable either, not only that in MMA is a bit different, 'cause sometimes you leg go at the tap and if the ref does not see it the guy will keep fighting and you might lose the fight. Perfect example is Murilo Bustamante vs. Matt Lindland, Murilo had to submit him twice in one fight.

Anyways, it just seem that there are so many scummy people in boxing, but for that matter, there are lots of scummy people in the world.

Konstantin- The quote is from Stalin, I have a friend that went to fight in Russia (M-1)and saw the quote on a statue, he told me about it and it stuck to me. No problem with info, I love to share info and learn from others.