After Toney loses this fight with Ruiz I recommend he fights Evander Holyfield in Germany. After this he will definetly redeem himself as a heavyweight contender and then he can fight a rematch with Roy Jones to see which one of the two likes to hear themselves speak more.

After Toney loses this fight with Ruiz I recommend he fights Evander Holyfield in Germany. After this he will definetly redeem himself as a heavyweight contender and then he can fight a rematch with Roy Jones to see which one of the two likes to hear themselves speak more.
Jones is retired, Holyfield is done, beating him wont prove anything. Toney doesnt have to redeem himself, dont overlook the fight

Toney UD

are you seriuos about toney fighting holy?
that fight happened and it wasnt close
i agree though that toney is a fraud though but only at heavy because he hasnt proved himself

Toney is going to kill slow ass Ruiz.

I'm being a bit sarcastic. I'm just trying to point out that this guy did absolutely nothing to be considered a contender in the heavyweight division.

You're all wrong. Toney should've tried to lure Ali out of retirement. Even though I'd go with Ali in this one I'd love to see the press conferences.

I'm being a bit sarcastic. I'm just trying to point out that this guy did absolutely nothing to be considered a contender in the heavyweight division.

Why doesn't Toney deserve a title shot? He did beat Booker, who is lucky if he is a top 100 heavyweight. Notice how no one is whining at all about Toney, but everyone and their mother was whining about Wlad when he almost fought Byrd. Oh the hate for Wladimir Klitschko. :sad2:

You're all wrong. Toney should've tried to lure Ali out of retirement. Even though I'd go with Ali in this one I'd love to see the press conferences.

Those would be some fantastic press conferences.

Why doesn't Toney deserve a title shot? He did beat Booker, who is lucky if he is a top 100 heavyweight. Notice how no one is whining at all about Toney, but everyone and their mother was whining about Wlad when he almost fought Byrd. Oh the hate for Wladimir Klitschko. :sad2:

Uhm, with all the respect I have for Wladimir it is more about what has Toney not done. And as far as I'm informed he hasn't been knocked senseless by a walking left hand and a very limited figure in don kings collection. Everybody'd be happy at this stage if all Wladimir had done over the last two years was knocking out low-level competition. And he'd be a champion right now. If it just wasn't for the vasoline...

Uhm, with all the respect I have for Wladimir it is more about what has Toney not done. And as far as I'm informed he hasn't been knocked senseless by a walking left hand and a very limited figure in don kings collection. Everybody'd be happy at this stage if all Wladimir had done over the last two years was knocking out low-level competition. And he'd be a champion right now. If it just wasn't for the vasoline...

True but unlike Toney he has actually beaten a top 15 heavyweight, Williamson. Toney has beaten no one.

True but unlike Toney he has actually beaten a top 15 heavyweight, Williamson. Toney has beaten no one.

Well, I get your point but it's not like he sucked some **** to get a title shot. Jirov and Holyfield are wins that count in these days HW picture.

You gotta be fair pal. If you coun't Williamson as a win that legitimates for a title shot Toney should get one just for the press conference today. ;)

Uhm, with all the respect I have for Wladimir it is more about what has Toney not done. And as far as I'm informed he hasn't been knocked senseless by a walking left hand and a very limited figure in don kings collection. Everybody'd be happy at this stage if all Wladimir had done over the last two years was knocking out low-level competition. And he'd be a champion right now. If it just wasn't for the vasoline...

Are you saying Toney is much more deserving of a title shot, than Wladimir Klitshcko is? Because Toney is not a real heavyweight in comparison, and has not beat a legitimate fighter in the division. He beat a shell of Holyfield and a Fat Ridell Booker. And I think you speak for yourself when you say that "everyone would be happy if Wlad was knocking out low-level competition". I wanted to see him fight Lennox Lewis more than anything.

Walking left hand, and limited figure? are you saying Toney's credentials superceed Sanders and Brewster's? Because I think the both would knock Toney silly. If anything, for the guts Sanders has showed against Vitali, he deserves another shot at the title.

Well, I get your point but it's not like he sucked some **** to get a title shot. Jirov and Holyfield are wins that count in these days HW picture.

You gotta be fair pal. If you coun't Williamson as a win that legitimates for a title shot Toney should get one just for the press conference today. ;)

Because Jirov isn't going back to cruiserweight after being KO'd by a shot Moorer and soft hitting Larry Donald didn't almost KO Holyfied, and TOS didn't beat McCall. I understand completely now. :no:

Well, I get your point but it's not like he sucked some **** to get a title shot. Jirov and Holyfield are wins that count in these days HW picture.


In my opinion, the win over Holyfield is about as meaningless a win as you could possibly have as a heavyweight. He never fought Jirov at Heavy either. That would have been a completely different fight IMO.

Because Jirov isn't going back to cruiserweight after being KO'd by a shot Moorer and soft hitting Larry Donald didn't almost KO Holyfied, and TOS didn't beat McCall. I understand completely now. :no:

You know who'd really deserve a shot? What about Luan Krasniqi or even Samil Sam? I didn't want to defend Toney and I like Wladimir but you can't blame the audience for being a little pissed after Wladimirs loss to Brewster.

And btw. I was more reffering to how the bout against Williamson went. He won a TD after 5 rounds and the scores were split. That's not exactly what comes to my mind if I think of a win that sets up a title shot.

Toney is going to kill slow ass Ruiz.



I certainly hope so, but Ruiz is a fairly dangerous wrestler-boxer, so I would not write Ruiz off that easily.

Wlad's style has greately changed. I think he should fire Larry Merchant. Larry Merchant is trying to make Wlad into someone he isn't. The fight against Brewster was definetly fixed. If you say it isn't you fail to recognize the corruption in boxing. Why are we talking about Wlad anyway? The guy beat Byrd before, there it is, that qualifies him to be a contender even with his two loses. Toney beat no one. He is overhyped and come April 30th Ruiz will hug him untill Toney's silicon tities explode.

In my opinion, the win over Holyfield is about as meaningless a win as you could possibly have as a heavyweight. He never fought Jirov at Heavy either. That would have been a completely different fight IMO.

Of course it didn't mean **** when he beat Holyfield but it opened some doors for him. He fought the name and the fame. And most people don't give a **** about how he won as long as this name is on the record. If Klitschko would've KOed Holyfield instead of getting knocked out by Brewster he'd be a respected champion at this stage.

As far as Jirov is concerned, he fought him as cruiserweight so I don't think Toney benefited of the weight limit. But even if it might have been a completely different fight the record still says that Toney won his last 14 bouts. How many HWs can compete with that? Oh, well, somebodies gonna give Samuel Peter a shot then? You know what, that might just happen soon.

The division is so poor that they have bums as contenders ...and champions. Did it really took this post to open your eyes?

Wlad's style has greately changed. I think he should fire Larry Merchant. Larry Merchant is trying to make Wlad into someone he isn't. The fight against Brewster was definetly fixed. If you say it isn't you fail to recognize the corruption in boxing. Why are we talking about Wlad anyway? The guy beat Byrd before, there it is, that qualifies him to be a contender even with his two loses. Toney beat no one. He is overhyped and come April 30th Ruiz will hug him untill Toney's silicon tities explode.

Uhm, Larry Merchant? You mean Emanuel Steward, right? :D

...and champions. Did it really took this post to open your eyes?

It opened my eyes as to how you are simply justifying Toney as a "legitimate contender", which I never said he was not. All I said was, he was equal to or less deserving than Wlad.

Yea my fault. Emmanuel Stewart. I keep getting the two names mixed up constantely for some reason.

You know who'd really deserve a shot? What about Luan Krasniqi or even Samil Sam? I didn't want to defend Toney and I like Wladimir but you can't blame the audience for being a little pissed after Wladimirs loss to Brewster.

And btw. I was more reffering to how the bout against Williamson went. He won a TD after 5 rounds and the scores were split. That's not exactly what comes to my mind if I think of a win that sets up a title shot.

I'd like to see Sam rematch Gomez now that he is more highly regarded than Gomez is. If Krasniqi beats Whitaker he will fight the winner of Brewster vs. Golota. If you saw the TOS fight you know that there is no way that TOS was winning that fight.

It opened my eyes as to how you are simply justifying Toney as a "legitimate contender", which I never said he was not. All I said was, he was equal to or less deserving than Wlad.

Yes, right and then I pointed at the two losses in his last five fights and you stated that you believe that Sanders and Brewster would knock out Toney as well.

But that right there is the difference. Wlad has been knocked out badly. Toney hasn't. Wlad made some unpleasing excuses. Toney hasn't. Wlad had the talent to be an all time great HW. Toney hasn't. Doesn't matter what you think if it never happened. If title shots were given on fighters abilities and potentials we'd have one champion and boxing'd be televised live on national TV...

I'd like to see Sam rematch Gomez now that he is more highly regarded than Gomez is. If Krasniqi beats Whitaker he will fight the winner of Brewster vs. Golota. If you saw the TOS fight you know that there is no way that TOS was winning that fight.

There's always a way in HW boxing. There was no way Brewster was winning until Wladimir punched himself out. It just wasn't a convincing win. That's it. I'm not trying to cheat Wladimir out of earned credit. He'll climb the ladder once more and he'll get another chance.

I'd like to see Sam fighting anyone but Vitali if he turns up in the shape in which he fought Bahktov.

And are you sure about Krasniqi? That sounds like a great chance for him.

But that right there is the difference. Wlad has been knocked out badly. Toney hasn't.

You are bringing light another issue:

Their Chin. Toney does have one of the best chins in boxing, but that alone, his being able to get away with eating leather occasionally at lower weights......will not cut it. If you are looking at "Total losses" Wlad has 3. Toney has 4. I do realize Toney has had the longer career....and that is another issue in assesing his qualifications for being a contender.

Wlad has fought at heavyweight, and despite being "knocked out" he still far succeeds Toney in credentials at this weight. He is after all.....a real heavyweight.

You are bringing light another issue:

Their Chin. Toney does have one of the best chins in boxing, but that alone, his being able to get away with eating leather occasionally at lower weights......will not cut it. If you are looking at "Total losses" Wlad has 3. Toney has 4. I do realize Toney has had the longer career....and that is another issue in assesing his qualifications for being a contender.

Wlad has fought at heavyweight, and despite being "knocked out" he still far succeeds Toney in credentials at this weight. He is after all.....a real heavyweight.

According to your post Toneys accomplishments don't mean as much as Wladimirs because he has a better chin. I dearly hope I just misinterpreted that.

And well, what had Jones Jr. done to get a shot at the HW title? What had Spinks done to get a shot? What had Tunney done? It's not like you start at zero again once you enter a higher weight class is it?

There's always a way in HW boxing. There was no way Brewster was winning until Wladimir punched himself out. It just wasn't a convincing win. That's it. I'm not trying to cheat Wladimir out of earned credit. He'll climb the ladder once more and he'll get another chance.

I'd like to see Sam fighting anyone but Vitali if he turns up in the shape in which he fought Bahktov.

And are you sure about Krasniqi? That sounds like a great chance for him.

Yup the Krasniqi vs. Whitaker fight is a WBO heavyweight title eliminator.

Yup the Krasniqi vs. Whitaker fight is a WBO heavyweight title eliminator.

Thx pal. I didn't know that. Makes me feel happy for Luan as I think he really earned this chance.

According to your post Toneys accomplishments don't mean as much as Wladimirs because he has a better chin. I dearly hope I just misinterpreted that.


You were the one who said: "Toney was not brutally knocked out". I responded by saying that Wladimir, though has been knocked out "brutally" is still more qualified for contender status.

Dont twist what I said around. I simply mentioned "chin". Which is relevant in talking about knockout losses. Toney has more losses than Wladimir kiltchko as a fighter as well, and Wlad's accomplishments supercede Toney's at this weight.

You were the one who said: "Toney was not brutally knocked out". I responded by saying that Wladimir, though has been knocked out "brutally" is still more qualified for contender status.

Dont twist what I said around. I simply mentioned "chin". Which is relevant in talking about knockout losses. Toney has more losses than Wladimir kiltchko as a fighter as well, and Wlad's accomplishments supercede Toney's at this weight.

Aight, so Wladimir can get knocked out without losing his contender status because he hasn't got the chin other contenders have? You do realize that chin is one of the more important abilities that are required in boxing and especially in HW boxing?

And, yes, Wlad's accomplishments do supercede Toney's at this weight. But they do supercede Toney's accomplishment in both directions, positive and negative. Btw. Glen Johnsons accomplishments supercede Hopkins' accomplishments at Light HW. Does that mean that Hopkins should start building a record if he decides to move up in weight?

Does that mean that Hopkins should start building a record if he decides to move up in weight?

:confused:
What the hell would be wrong with his current record. And what the hell are you talking about. I did not understand that. Yes. Hopkins would not be a higher ranked contender than Johnson.

I dont understand how you guys can say that James is not worthy of the title shot when he will win in this fight against the champion. You may believe that James is nothing special, but Ruiz is not either and hes the damned reigning champion...........Rockin'

You guys talk about Toney's chin as if it were proven at heavyweight. It hasn't been. The guy is a natural middleweight fighting in the land of the giants. I have not seen Toney receive a flush heavyweight blow to the jaw yet. Not one. Let's wait until that happens before we claim that he has a better chin than a heavyweight like Wlad.

You guys talk about Toney's chin as if it were proven at heavyweight. It hasn't been. The guy is a natural middleweight fighting in the land of the giants. I have not seen Toney receive a flush heavyweight blow to the jaw yet. Not one. Let's wait until that happens before we claim that he has a better chin than a heavyweight like Wlad.


That is my point exactly. A deciding factor though relevant to "contender status".

toney has proven through out his career to be a great fighter, look at RJJ his 1st and only fight at HW was for a title. and he won, toney will do the same, why are so many hating on him.

toney has been a great fighter for more years than i care to remember, he's a future hall of famer, he's way ahead of ruiz in terms of ability. c'mon guys, hate him if you must, but he's anything but phoney.

Ruiz will beat toney and then hug the rest of the heavyweight division to become undisputed serial hugger.

Predictions for the amount of Ruiz Clinches - 177 clinches..

The only way RUiz can win is to bore the crowd with his hugging and squeeze out a close and crap decision