i was rooting for pac since i do have filipino blood. but after the marquez fight i knew all morales had to do was box to win. erik exceeded my expectations even more when he DELIBERATLEY taunted manny by switching to south paw in the 12th.

first off...the gloves- anyone who has been in the ring will tell you that no matter what kind of gloves you have and at the level these guys are fighting it won't matter. besides, erik threw more compact short punches and the reyes gloves would have given pac more problems.

secondly...morales can jab. he kept pac at a distance (HIS distance) and smacked him with right strights alternating to the body and to the head. pac has a 'feeler' jab that kinda marks for his straight left...which if you think about it will telegraph where it is headed. pac needed to have a jab that stung...or at least learn how to counter like a southpaw and go over morales' jab with his left straight. nope...all he knows is to go foward and give out that 1-2, 1-2 combo.

thirdly...short punches. my god. after barrera having such success with short hooks to the body and uppercuts up close to moroales...you would think pac would train for it. nope. his manilla ice was a dud. his left uppercut was non-existent. he fought at a distance and backed up straight with a taller bigger guy.

fourthly...let's be honest. 115-113?...i rooted for pac but gimme a break. morales dictated that fight. watch that fight again. the rounds where manny won (except the 1st the 12th) morales was taking a breather.

this was not close. i've watched the fight 3 times already.pac needs to go back to the drawing board and learn some lateral movement and to school up on some short punches (plus get some discipline on not to press the issue...a good counter is just as good as running foward....lol).

my hat goes off to these two fighters. but pac needs to lay off and more ring smart.

good points, PacMan fans resemble Tyson fans, they always have lousy excuses as to why their guy got his a$$ kicked, and it's never the fighter's fault it's always the promoter/gloves/weather/weight/etc....Manny fans know that their boy got trounced but many of them (not all of em, but many) won't concede to the fact that PacMan is about 15 pounds past his prime weight and his best days are way way behind him

thing is...fighters are usually what they are born to be...Pacman is a speedy slugger with power...no one is going to turn him into Floyd Mayweather Jr at this point...

so taking time off and learning something new in sparring isn't exactly going to change who he is as a fighter...sure he may be able to jab more after working on it in the gym (Gatti), but in the end when the time comes, he will most likely resort back to what he has been doing for so long...

I like them both though...Morales clearly won the fight...it was somewhat competative in the sense that Manny was always there and still able to hurt El T late, but Morales clearly won

[QUOTE=cvt]i was rooting for pac since i do have filipino blood. but after the marquez fight i knew all morales had to do was box to win. erik exceeded my expectations even more when he DELIBERATLEY taunted manny by switching to south paw in the 12th.



Can't see the point of your filipino blood dude. Guess you must be related to Recah Trinidad or Hermie Rivera. Come on!

first off...the gloves- anyone who has been in the ring will tell you that no matter what kind of gloves you have and at the level these guys are fighting it won't matter. besides, erik threw more compact short punches and the reyes gloves would have given pac more problems.

I have been in the ring. Rockin' has also been in the ring, and we both will say that gloves do make a difference. The difference is mental and physical. Some argue that Erik's punches would have been harder, however, Erik has brittle hands, which is why he asked for winning gloves in the first place. Let's not forget it was Morales' camp who got that into the contract.

Secondly, the fight was close. Close doesn't mean controversial, because we all knew Pac lost and Erik won. This is what we call a "close but clear" decision. Another examples of a close but clear decision might be Jones-Hopkins I. Erik won either 7 rounds or 8 rounds in most people's eyes. That means either Manny lost by one round or he lost by 2, in each case it is indeed a close fight.

I myself do not claim the gloves won or lost the fight for either man. I will give my full opinion after watching the fight closely but I think the heabutt might have affected Pac, as well as not-so-great training habits. Still, anyone would be a fool not to give credit to Morales because he trained very hard and it is not his fault that Pac didn't look like Pacman.

The bottom line is, I think the fight was close enough that in a rematch (say, in a year or two) things could be different, although not dramaticaly different, just enough difference to get Pac the nod. We will see I hope.

Yeah I saw it again and it wasn't. It was closer to many people's eyes cuz Pac provided excitement. He was getting tagged but he wasn't going down withouta fight. It was funny cuz it was like watching DLH. The crowd responded to MP's punches and made them look more effective than they were. I guess he really did appeal to the public.

won't concede to the fact that PacMan is about 15 pounds past his prime weight and his best days are way way behind him

Some might have said similar things about Morales after his performances vs Chavez and Barrera, so let's not get carried away.

As for Pac fans being like Tyson fans...no fans are that bad except maybe some of those Tito guys. All the Pac fans (I've seen) have been very reasonable in their estimation of the fight. There's no evidence to sugest they would have done anything other than celebrate if their guy had won.

After the Morales fight, if Pac fans were so bad, we wouldn't have seen so many of them admitting, and even finding comradery with Morales fans in defeat.

All the Pac fans (I've seen) have been very reasonable in their estimation of the fight. .

I have not seen those posters.

all I saw were predictions reading:
Pacman K.O. 1, Pac K.O. 2, etc. In a chronological round fashion. Blind ignorance towards the superior fighter in Erik Morales.

i was rooting for pac since i do have filipino blood. but after the marquez fight i knew all morales had to do was box to win. erik exceeded my expectations even more when he DELIBERATLEY taunted manny by switching to south paw in the 12th.

first off...the gloves- anyone who has been in the ring will tell you that no matter what kind of gloves you have and at the level these guys are fighting it won't matter. besides, erik threw more compact short punches and the reyes gloves would have given pac more problems.

secondly...morales can jab. he kept pac at a distance (HIS distance) and smacked him with right strights alternating to the body and to the head. pac has a 'feeler' jab that kinda marks for his straight left...which if you think about it will telegraph where it is headed. pac needed to have a jab that stung...or at least learn how to counter like a southpaw and go over morales' jab with his left straight. nope...all he knows is to go foward and give out that 1-2, 1-2 combo.

thirdly...short punches. my god. after barrera having such success with short hooks to the body and uppercuts up close to moroales...you would think pac would train for it. nope. his manilla ice was a dud. his left uppercut was non-existent. he fought at a distance and backed up straight with a taller bigger guy.

fourthly...let's be honest. 115-113?...i rooted for pac but gimme a break. morales dictated that fight. watch that fight again. the rounds where manny won (except the 1st the 12th) morales was taking a breather.

this was not close. i've watched the fight 3 times already.pac needs to go back to the drawing board and learn some lateral movement and to school up on some short punches (plus get some discipline on not to press the issue...a good counter is just as good as running foward....lol).

my hat goes off to these two fighters. but pac needs to lay off and more ring smart.


I agree that short compact punches were the way to go. The few times that Pac was able to get in he wasn't landing hard nor clear on the inside. Morales would turtle up and protect himself. So those barrage of punches didn't do ****. He needed short and compact uppercuts and hooks like you said.

He was too far for his lead right hook and almost reached in. Morales would just pop teh jab to keep Pac at bay.
When his gameplan was nulified, he couln't adapt cuz he didn't any additional arsenal in his repertoire. Amazing athelete, tons of potential but needs to be groomed.

I had it 116-112 for Erik in, what I believed, was a clear victory for EM. Morales, baring the 12th round, put on a great boxing match. The 12th was more of a let-it-all-hang-out type round. Plus, him switching to southpaw was a stupid move. He only did it to mess with Pac's head and it could've cost him the fight.

Nothing pacman could have done would of prepared him getg over it already.

Nothing pacman could have done would of prepared him getg over it already.

lol...useless....

Plus, him switching to southpaw was a stupid move. He only did it to mess with Pac's head and it could've cost him the fight.

Very true. It reminded me of Barrera smashing hameds head into the ring post in there fight in the 12th round! Stupid move but he won anyways!

[QUOTE=Super_Lightweight]I have been in the ring. Rockin' has also been in the ring, and we both will say that gloves do make a difference. QUOTE]

what size/oz do you guys use? cuz no matter what brand we use they still hurt the same...lol! maybe i should just start sparring with guys in my weight class...lol

seriously.........

Nothing pacman could have done would of prepared him getg over it already.

he could have adopted MAB's style and kicked the snot out of him...lol

but seriously. in a way you are right. it was too soon to change styles anyway. MAB layed the blueprint out on how to beat morales and freddie roach was too busy nicknaming a 'prototype right hook' and blaming contracts and gloves...

The scorecards were closer than what the action of the fight was. It was competitive but competitive doesn't mean close. Tito/Mayorga was competitive at times but the fight wasn't close. Pacquiao wasn't blownout but he was beaten soundly. I scored it 116-112 it could of been 117-111 if Morales fought the 12th round the way he did the 11th.

I think in the last round he knew Pacquiao couldn't knock him out that's why he turned southpaw and fought toe to toe with Pacquiao. Even when Morales put his hands at his side I said to myself that he was in contol because he only does that when he is in complete control of the fight.

The scorecards were closer than what the action of the fight was. It was competitive but competitive doesn't mean close. Tito/Mayorga was competitive at times but the fight wasn't close. Pacquiao wasn't blownout but he was beaten soundly. I scored it 116-112 it could of been 117-111 if Morales fought the 12th round the way he did the 11th.

I think in the last round he knew Pacquiao couldn't knock him out that's why he turned southpaw and fought toe to toe with Pacquiao. Even when Morales put his hands at his side I said to myself that he was in contol because he only does that when he is in complete control of the fight.

Pac was outclassed but fought till the bitter end. I had trouble watching it the second time.

I had trouble watching it the second time.

why? i can't wat to watched it a 4th time....morales was brilliant!

yeah, it was NOT close... and MAB completely dominated EM in their last fight.

PAC won some rounds because EM allowed PAC to win it. He will never lose a round if he wants it because he's a genius.

And one more thing, do you know that a square has three sides?

Kidding aside, this will be a candidate for the Fight of the Year.

Kidding aside, this will be a candidate for the Fight of the Year.

agreed. i don't see any fights on the horizon topping this...uless maybe hatton vs tszu

why? i can't wat to watched it a 4th time....morales was brilliant!

Well being a filipino, it was sad. The kid had sooooo much expectation carried a whole country on his back and he was helpless. He tried everything till he just went for broke...One of the bravest showing I've seen but I felt for th kid as well.

One of the bravest showing I've seen but I felt for th kid as well.

Which fight are you going to promote next Mooks. Castillo/Corrales? :)

Well being a filipino, it was sad. The kid had sooooo much expectation carried a whole country on his back and he was helpless. He tried everything till he just went for broke...One of the bravest showing I've seen but I felt for th kid as well.

being a filipino as well i was pleased. why? because he's learned a lesson (hopefully). i've seen brawlers turn into calculating boxers with power...aka MAB, gatti, b-hop,etc.

all I saw were predictions reading: KO1, etc.

Erik Morales fans were saying the same thing, and besides, we were talking about the fan behavior AFTER the fight...duh. :confused:

Which fight are you going to promote next Mooks. Castillo/Corrales? :)

Bette believe it :D Maybe Tito/Wright stay tuned lol

we were talking about the fan behavior AFTER the fight...duh. :confused:

estimation of the fight. .

Could have fooled me.

I thought you were citing speculations homeboy. :)

ala:

estimating as to the outcome of the fight.

being a filipino as well i was pleased. why? because he's learned a lesson (hopefully). i've seen brawlers turn into calculating boxers with power...aka MAB, gatti, b-hop,etc.

So you don't think it's too late?

Bette believe it :D Maybe Tito/Wright stay tuned lol

Sweet. I cant friggin wait. :)

The discussions prior to saturday's fight were excellent. Speculation at its finest. I firmly believe Castillo/Corrales deserves its due, as the next big fight. ;)

He should prolly get a new trainer. Maybe somones else can take him in other than Roach. Freddie doesn't believe in reinventing fighters I think.

He should prolly get a new trainer. Maybe somones else can take him in other than Roach. Freddie doesn't believe in reinventing fighters I think.


Mcgirt did wonders for the one dimensional Gatti (as we can see)...Yes I am dropping a hint.

You can check my scoring in my sig.

Mcgirt did wonders for the one dimensional Gatti (as we can see)...Yes I am dropping a hint.

You can check my scoring in my sig.

Yeah but Gatti was already a boxer in his early career.....

Yeah but Gatti was already a boxer in his early career.....


True but Roach didnt give **** in guidance towards Pacquiao. Mcgirt I think would be able to help him, especially with lateral movement. But take nothing away from Roach but he needs to train pac to rely on more than his fists with power shots.

estimating as to the outcome of the fight.

Oh no that's not what I had in mind. When I say estimation I mean a summation, or a summary of the fight. It was multiple meanings. I apologize for the confusion.

True but Roach didnt give **** in guidance towards Pacquiao. Mcgirt I think would be able to help him, especially with lateral movement. But take nothing away from Roach but he needs to train pac to rely on more than his fists with power shots.

Teh bad thing is Manny's prolly so loyal, he woulddnt even dream of changing trainers....

So you don't think it's too late?

was it too late for MAB, gatti or b-hop? this kid is only 26...it really all depends on him.

as for gatti being a boxer at the beginning. yeah he was. it's the 'unlearning' what you've learned that's hard. my point is that if these vets did it...then a kid like pac should have no probs....unless he's a hard headed stubborn idiot. lol.

Oh no that's not what I had in mind. When I say estimation I mean a summation, or a summary of the fight. It was multiple meanings. I apologize for the confusion.

No problem dude. Ill communication between our 2 parties.

My bad as well. :o

Teh bad thing is Manny's prolly so loyal, he woulddnt even dream of changing trainers....


Manny made a move on his managers. His new mgt may have another idea.

was it too late for MAB, gatti or b-hop? this kid is only 26...it really all depends on him.

as for gatti being a boxer at the beginning. yeah he was. it's the 'unlearning' what you've learned that's hard. my point is that if these vets did it...then a kid like pac should have no probs....unless he's a hard headed stubborn idiot. lol.

Well he's got a lot of pride. But hopefully he realizes he got beat, maybe after watching the fight again. And I dont think Roach is the irght guy to re-invent him. I don't think he believes in that.

So you don't think it's too late?

sorry for buttin in guys but i gotta say that i don't think its too late. manny can use his determination towards perfecting his style into a boxer/puncher. manny at present is very 1 dimensional. manny is young and seems to love the sport. he prolly lives by the old saying "what does not kill me, makes me stronger" roach is a good trainer but manny needs someone else to transform him. if he doesn't change he will not last long as a top contender. i hope we see more of this guy personally.

sorry for buttin in guys but i gotta say that i don't think its too late. manny can use his determination towards perfecting his style into a boxer/puncher. manny at present is very 1 dimensional. manny is young and seems to love the sport. he prolly lives by the old saying "what does not kill me, makes me stronger" roach is a good trainer but manny needs someone else to transform him. if he doesn't change he will not last long as a top contender. i hope we see more of this guy personally.

Who's the best guy for the job?

mcgirt, hands down.

hat off great thread :cool:
that exactly the way i saw it

i had this fight 8 rounds to 3. if thats what you call close then by all means it was close. but what made most feel that it was a closer fight were those that were only counting punches. while manny landed several great shots most of his punches were missing or grazing the target. sure he made it exciting by charging and throwing wildly. but most didn't connect. taking all things that go into scoring a fight into consideration, morales blew him away. ring generalship, effective aggressivness, defense, and clean punches landed. now about this cut. if you can watch the fight again and watch manny after round 2. he's breathing heavy, spitting blood and coughing. erik was calm and collected. manny was already swallowing blood. once the cut came manny felt like he was way behind and came out in the sixth looking for the ko. if anything the cut made manny dangerous fo a breif period in 6 and 7. but morales was smart and battled when he had too. when you lose blood you lose power. morales dictated the fight beginning to end. i mean c'mon even in the 12th round he had manny doing what he wanted him to. thats why he switched southpaw, he wanted to go to war and prove that he could not be ko'd by manny. was it a close fight? depends on who you were pulling for i guess.

Morales and Pacquiao should join forces and create a promotion team ala DLH/Hop. It should be called, "El Pinoyble" promotions or something like that. Actually they shouldn't nevermind.

Who's the best guy for the job?

maybe mcgirt..maybe one of the mayweathers.

i had this fight 8 rounds to 3. if thats what you call close then by all means it was close. but what made most feel that it was a closer fight were those that were only counting punches. while manny landed several great shots most of his punches were missing or grazing the target. sure he made it exciting by charging and throwing wildly. but most didn't connect. taking all things that go into scoring a fight into consideration, morales blew him away. ring generalship, effective aggressivness, defense, and clean punches landed. now about this cut. if you can watch the fight again and watch manny after round 2. he's breathing heavy, spitting blood and coughing. erik was calm and collected. manny was already swallowing blood. once the cut came manny felt like he was way behind and came out in the sixth looking for the ko. if anything the cut made manny dangerous fo a breif period in 6 and 7. but morales was smart and battled when he had too. when you lose blood you lose power. morales dictated the fight beginning to end. i mean c'mon even in the 12th round he had manny doing what he wanted him to. thats why he switched southpaw, he wanted to go to war and prove that he could not be ko'd by manny. was it a close fight? depends on who you were pulling for i guess.

Excellent post. As much as it pained me to see, thats' what I saw the second time around. But when Morales switched to southpaw, ah **** I was just praying for a KO to teach that punk Morales a humility lesson lol That would have been stupid and funny.

i liked the interview in the end:

Larry Merchant:'..honestly Erik, you loved standing toe to toe with him...'

Morales:'...<in spanish grinning>'did you like it?...'

Larry Merchant:'....<with a smile>' I LOVED IT! '


definately a night for warriors...

Excellent post. As much as it pained me to see, thats' what I saw the second time around. But when Morales switched to southpaw, ah **** I was just praying for a KO to teach that punk Morales a humility lesson lol That would have been stupid and funny.


I haven't seen the fight yet STILL, but its sounds like he almost really made a mistake with his raging machismo. Erik and his ****in pride...

That woulda been like the Campbell/Peden fight. If Pac did knock him out after doing that, Morales would have had to hide under a rock for the rest of his life.

I think everyone needs to give credit where it is due for christ's sake. Manny is a hell of a fighter, and warrior with great punching power and stamina. One can question his ring intelligence, which I think is his worst facet. If he learns from this loss, this will only make him stronger. Look at the physical condition he is in, and the tools he has.

That being said though, Morales is just on another level IMO. He has been beating Class "A" competition in the states for years. Manny has had a few decent matchups, but one can ultimately question his fights in the Phillipines, where he was beating up fishermen.

Manny is a hell of a fighter, but look at the 1st tier guys. They surpass him in ring intelligence...and it shows when manny was made semi-akward against JMM and Morales.

Someone mentioned the "Shane Mosley Syndrome". That is a pretty decent comparison.

Excellent post. As much as it pained me to see, thats' what I saw the second time around. But when Morales switched to southpaw, ah **** I was just praying for a KO to teach that punk Morales a humility lesson lol That would have been stupid and funny.

you know i am not a huge morales fan but i really did want him to win. i have to pull for my mexican bros. i like manny but not most of his fans. alot of you guys on this site are awesome though. so i can say that in the 12th i was scared but knew manny couldn't hurt him too bad.

you know i am not a huge morales fan but i really did want him to win. i have to pull for my mexican bros. i like manny but not most of his fans. alot of you guys on this site are awesome though. so i can say that in the 12th i was scared but knew manny couldn't hurt him too bad.


Who were you before dammit? I've been meaning to ask this forever.

you know i am not a huge morales fan but i really did want him to win. i have to pull for my mexican bros. i like manny but not most of his fans. alot of you guys on this site are awesome though. so i can say that in the 12th i was scared but knew manny couldn't hurt him too bad.

He sure sold you and all of us to the drama though.
Morales has that one of a kind skill. But of course if he was as conservative as mayweather, b-hop or roy jones (in his prime)... he wouldn't have amaassed such a large fan base. Guy does it on purpose which makes him fun to watch.

I think the fight seemed closer than it really was to some people because they were counting the amount of punches pac was throwing and not actually measuring how effective he was.

Morales Was the more effective guy most of the fight. Pac would throw a 4 punch combo up close but they were at such a close distance and erik smothered them and came back with crisper jabs and right hands that repeatedly caught pacquiao off balance and stunned him in quite a few rounds and snapped his head back.

The fight was good but if you go by Effective aggressiveness and Ring Generalship it was Morales hands down.

I think the fight seemed closer than it really was to some people

the fight seemed closer than it really was to MOST people, including the judges. Maybe you were rooting for EM while watching the fight.

c'mon guys, admit it. if this was a blowout, then EM had a BLOWOUT loss to MAB.

this will not be fight of the year candidate if it was one-sided. and i'm confident it will be.

the fight seemed closer than it really was to MOST people, including the judges. Maybe you were rooting for EM while watching the fight.

c'mon guys, admit it. if this was a blowout, then EM had a BLOWOUT loss to MAB.

That works both ways, Maybe you were rooting for pac.

No matter who i was rooting for i watched the fight objectively and have watched it numerous times. Fights are scored on effectiveness and ring generalship right? Admit it that was Morales most of the fight.

It wasnt a blow out but i had Morales winning the fight 8 rounds to 4.

PEOPLE!!! Morales WON THE FIGHT! Who cares if it was by 1 point or 12, a win is a win is a win!!!!!

That works both ways, Maybe you were rooting for pac.


oops, 'got you there. i won lots of money for EM via UD on this one. HAHA! I got one post that says EM will win.

oops, 'got you there. i won lots of money for EM via UD on this one. HAHA! I got one post that says EM will win.

Put Your Money Where Your Name is.

at least place it in your wallet so we can see exactly how you are "rolling in dough" or "holdin the goldin goose" or some other cheesy addeage.

is it possible to look at my other posts? help me out here so you will be able to see. i'll try to look for it.

Here was my take before the fight:
i really thought Pac has no chance moving up at 130 and making his first fight against Erik. I really thought EM will be stronger than Pac for this fight, ring brilliance aside.