I think this would be a great fight.

I believe it would be a fight similiar to Louis-Conn,except Tunney has 20 lbs on Conn,and alot smarter.

Me thinks it would be a repeat of Louis-Conn,but Tunney is 20lbs heavier than Conn,and smarter....Smarter to box his way to a 15 round UD

In my opinion it could be a repeat of Dempsey-Tunney II, except Louis does what is necessary to finish Tunney off.

In my opinion it could be a repeat of Dempsey-Tunney II, except Louis does what is necessary to finish Tunney off.

Maybe,maybe not.....I have a real high regaurd for Jack Dempsey.

But the Dempsey that lost 19 out of 20 rounds to Tunney was no where near Prime Dempsey.

Maybe,maybe not.....I have a real high regaurd for Jack Dempsey.I'm going to post about the great Jack Dempsey soon.

But the Dempsey that lost 19 out of 20 rounds to Tunney was no where near Prime Dempsey.

My computer shut down....let me finish.

But as smart as Gene Tunney was,if he was in Conn's shoes he would definatley(sp) box his way to a 15 round UD.

I would bet on Tunney

My computer shut down....let me finish.

But as smart as Gene Tunney was,if he was in Conn's shoes he would definatley(sp) box his way to a 15 round UD.

I would bet on Tunney

I simply don't like Tunney's chances of going 15 rounds with a prime Louis. I think he could outpoint Louis but 15 rounds is a long time to go without getting hit by Joe.

Tunney could be hit too but he had a very solid chin. He was more patient than Conn and wouldn't get away from his gameplan but I think Conn bothered Louis more when he fought on the inside and landed terrific combinations.

Louis could have still won the fight had Conn given the last three rounds away so a strong finish was needed.

I simply don't like Tunney's chances of going 15 rounds with a prime Louis. I think he could outpoint Louis but 15 rounds is a long time to go without getting hit by Joe.

Tunney could be hit too but he had a very solid chin. He was more patient than Conn and wouldn't get away from his gameplan but I think Conn bothered Louis more when he fought on the inside and landed terrific combinations.

Louis could have still won the fight had Conn given the last three rounds away so a strong finish was needed.

Talking about fights.....Boyyyyyyyyy,what a fight Dempsey-Louis would be!!

dempsey and tunney would both kill louis. Boxing went way downhill after Tunney retired, just compare some videos. Prove me wrong greatA.

dempsey and tunney would both kill louis. Boxing went way downhill after Tunney retired, just compare some videos. Prove me wrong greatA.

I myself don't think of it as a weak era, then again I've seen more film of Louis, Baer, Sharkey, Schmeling, Carnera, Nova, Walcott, Farr, Loughran, Bivins, Stribling, Pastor than most.

These men had power, speed, skills, durability, stamina and most importantly they all fought each other, several times.

Even a second rater like Lee Q Murray was described as "one of the most powerful punchers in boxing history".

Does anyone really rate the heavyweight contenders of the 1920's aside from Jack Dempsey, Gene Tunney and Harry Wills?

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Such a tough fight to call this one. Everytime I think that Louis is too big, strong, powerful and accurate I find myself thinking that Tunney would cause him serious problems. I can see Tunney taking the early rounds with his jab and movement, but fifteen rounds is a long time to do this against someone like Louis (remembering that both Dempsey fights were 10 rounders), I think the late rounds are Joe's territory.

If it was anyone other than the iron jawed Tunney, who was never stopped I'd go with a late stoppage from Louis but I think we'd come down to a close decision which could go either way.

Boxing went way downhill after Tunney retired, just compare some videos.

I would point out the 1930s where a decent era for the Heavyweights while the 1920s where rather weak. Outside of Dempsey and Wills who was there? Tunney really can't be considered a Heavyweight as he had maybe 4 Heavyweight fights out of a 60+ fight career. The '30s had Schmeling, Sharkey, Max Baer, Louis, and a number of other decent contenders. It wasn't as strong as the 1970s or 1990s to be sure but certainly not bad as such things go.

Poet

I would point out the 1930s where a decent era for the Heavyweights while the 1920s where rather weak. Outside of Dempsey and Wills who was there? Tunney really can't be considered a Heavyweight as he had maybe 4 Heavyweight fights out of a 60+ fight career. The '30s had Schmeling, Sharkey, Max Baer, Louis, and a number of other decent contenders. It wasn't as strong as the 1970s or 1990s to be sure but certainly not bad as such things go.

Poet

Tunney tends to be a bit overrated at heavyweight seeing as he did little in the division besides beat a faded Dempsey.

As for this match-up, I favour Louis. Tunney was a tough guy for sure, and a clever fighter, but he was also plenty hittable, and anyone Louis could hit wouldn't last long. His skills and movement make it interesting, but I figure Louis would eventually catch up with him, especially in a 15 rounder.

I think this would be a great fight.

I believe it would be a fight similiar to Louis-Conn,except Tunney has 20 lbs on Conn,and alot smarter.
this would be one great fight to watch, Tunney is 2nd only to Muhammad Ali in ring-smarts, i see this being a very close fight with the outcome being a split-decision win for Louis

Can see Tunney building up a massive points lead before getting KO'd late.. Don't see how Dempsey comes into this.. His era was weak in quality, which is why he's so overrated..

I would point out the 1930s where a decent era for the Heavyweights while the 1920s where rather weak. Outside of Dempsey and Wills who was there? Tunney really can't be considered a Heavyweight as he had maybe 4 Heavyweight fights out of a 60+ fight career. The '30s had Schmeling, Sharkey, Max Baer, Louis, and a number of other decent contenders. It wasn't as strong as the 1970s or 1990s to be sure but certainly not bad as such things go.

Poet

I was just reading about all the great BLACK boxers that Dempsey didn't fight.

I believe the 20's had alot of very good Heavyweights.

The Schmelings,Sharkeys,Baers,Carneras that Louis beat had alot to be desired.Louis beat alot of ex-champions who don't rank in the top 15 Heavyweights of all-time.The 20's had Dempsey,Tunney,Firpo,and alot of good Black fighters.

I was just reading about all the great BLACK boxers that Dempsey didn't fight.

I believe the 20's had alot of very good Heavyweights.

The Schmelings,Sharkeys,Baers,Carneras that Louis beat had alot to be desired.Louis beat alot of ex-champions who don't rank in the top 15 Heavyweights of all-time.The 20's had Dempsey,Tunney,Firpo,and alot of good Black fighters.

Of the prime Heavyweights fighting in the 1920s only Dempsey and Wills are top-20 material. Firpo certainly wasn't and most of the great black Heavyweights that are usually named had their primes from 1900-1919. Schmeling was arguably a top-20 Heavyweight and Max Baer was arguably a top-25 to top-30 Heavyweight. Sharkey was something of an uneven quantity: He looked like an ATG in some fights, a second tier fighter in others. Either way he could easily be considered in the top-40.

Poet

Can see Tunney building up a massive points lead before getting KO'd late.. Don't see how Dempsey comes into this.. His era was weak in quality, which is why he's so overrated..

I beg to differ.....

Dempsey was the most fierce,ruthless,savage Heavyweight of all-time.

He was a cyclone with two fists,who was in rage at the sound of the bell.

Talk about KILLER INSTINCT!!

Read about Dempsey,and his life as I have.Watch his fights as I have.

He was truly a hungry fighter.And PLEASE don't even compare Marciano to the Great Jack Dempsey.

I believe a Dempsey-Louis fight would be a toss-up,ending very early one way or the other.But STYLE wise,Tunney gives Louis alot more fits than did Arturo Gody,and is a bigger Billy Conn.

But STYLE wise,Tunney gives Louis alot more fits than did Arturo Gody,and is a bigger Billy Conn.

Since both Tunney and Conn were Light-Heavyweights I presume they both weighed in around the 175 mark.

Poet

I beg to differ.....

Dempsey was the most fierce,ruthless,savage Heavyweight of all-time.

He was a cyclone with two fists,who was in rage at the sound of the bell.

Talk about KILLER INSTINCT!!

Read about Dempsey,and his life as I have.Watch his fights as I have.

He was truly a hungry fighter.And PLEASE don't even compare Marciano to the Great Jack Dempsey.

I believe a Dempsey-Louis fight would be a toss-up,ending very early one way or the other.But STYLE wise,Tunney gives Louis alot more fits than did Arturo Gody,and is a bigger Billy Conn.

Louis did say that his true weakness was that he didn't like to get crowded (and thus couldn't get his punches off). Godoy did exactly that in their first fight. In the rematch Louis had improved and created space between the two to land devastating uppercuts and hooks in combinations.

I also wouldn't compare Tunney with Conn. Conn to me had his best moments in the fight by outfighting Louis on the inside with quick combinations.

Tunney I feel would try to outbox him from a distance, using his movement and clinching but Louis would eventually adjust and start finding Tunney with regularity.

I really rate Tunney as a boxer as well, the man looked absolutely brilliant in his first fight with Dempsey and the fight with a somewhat worn out Tommy Gibbons.

According to Ali, he rates Tunney as the most scientific boxer next to himself.

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Of the prime Heavyweights fighting in the 1920s only Dempsey and Wills are top-20 material. Firpo certainly wasn't and most of the great black Heavyweights that are usually named had their primes from 1900-1919. Schmeling was arguably a top-20 Heavyweight and Max Baer was arguably a top-25 to top-30 Heavyweight. Sharkey was something of an uneven quantity: He looked like an ATG in some fights, a second tier fighter in others. Either way he could easily be considered in the top-40.

Poet

OMG....While Ali easily beats Big Bad Sonny Liston your naming fighters ranked in the top 40,the top 30,the top 20.

Which one you want Jack Dempsey to fight? A top 20,30,40 fighter would get starched quick by a Prime Dempsey.Tunney would win every round against the fighters you listed! PLEASE,you can do better than that?

OMG....While Ali easily beats Big Bad Sonny Liston your naming fighters ranked in the top 40,the top 30,the top 20.

Which one you want Jack Dempsey to fight? A top 20,30,40 fighter would get starched quick by a Prime Dempsey.Tunney would win every round against the fighters you listed! PLEASE,you can do better than that?

Well, Sharkey was on his way to outpointing Dempsey until being hit by low blows. He simply didn't have the same mentality that Tunney did, otherwise he was as talented a boxer as anybody.

Schmeling had a granite chin and always managed to land the powerful counter right hand on his opponents.

Baer was certainly better than Firpo, more powerful, durable and just as strong.

Unfortunately Dempsey and Tunney didn't hang around until their 30's so Louis never got to fight them.

Wow this an interesting one. Tunney could probably outbox Joe in the early rounds, but I don't see him making it 15 without getting tagged and brought down. Louis by KO in the late rounds.

Well, Sharkey was on his way to outpointing Dempsey until being hit by low blows. He simply didn't have the same mentality that Tunney did, otherwise he was as talented a boxer as anybody.

Schmeling had a granite chin and always managed to land the powerful counter right hand on his opponents.

Baer was certainly better than Firpo, more powerful, durable and just as strong.

Dempsey was no where near a Prime Dempsey against Sharkey.That was between the Tunney fights.

If Baer "tranined" for Firpo you have a case.

OMG....While Ali easily beats Big Bad Sonny Liston your naming fighters ranked in the top 40,the top 30,the top 20.

The question wasn't who Ali fought it was the quality of 1920s Heavyweights viz-a-viz 1930s Heavyweights. Please stay on topic.

I was just reading about all the great BLACK boxers that Dempsey didn't fight.

I believe the 20's had alot of very good Heavyweights.

The Schmelings,Sharkeys,Baers,Carneras that Louis beat had alot to be desired.Louis beat alot of ex-champions who don't rank in the top 15 Heavyweights of all-time.The 20's had Dempsey,Tunney,Firpo,and alot of good Black fighters.

Those quotes sound familier?


Which one you want Jack Dempsey to fight? A top 20,30,40 fighter would get starched quick by a Prime Dempsey.Tunney would win every round against the fighters you listed! PLEASE,you can do better than that?

And your point is? Louis starches any of Dempsey's opponents. More to the point, Schmeling, Baer and quite possibly Sharkey as well starch Willard, Charpentier, Firpo, and Gibbons: Dempsey's most notable opponents prior to losing the title. I would also point out that Louis starched every Light-Heavyweight he fought. Hint: Tunney's a Light-Heavyweight. Dempsey, on the other hand struggled against Gibbons and lost to Tunney.

Poet

Dempsey was no where near a Prime Dempsey against Sharkey.That was between the Tunney fights.

If Baer "tranined" for Firpo you have a case.

It wasn't a prime Dempsey but to be honest he was dominated in that fight until scoring the KO. If a past prime A-class of the previous era has that much trouble against a young B-class fighter of the next era, then it's a bit difficult to call either era much better than the other.

I don't think Baer would even have to train for Firpo. He would only have to land his big right hand, which he would since Firpo had no defense and wasn't exactly the most durable fighter around.

The question wasn't who Ali fought it was the quality of 1920s Heavyweights viz-a-viz 1930s Heavyweights. Please stay on topic.







Those quotes sound familier?




And your point is? Louis starches any of Dempsey's opponents. More to the point, Schmeling, Baer and quite possibly Sharkey as well starch Willard, Charpentier, Firpo, and Gibbons: Dempsey's most notable opponents prior to losing the title. I would also point out that Louis starched every Light-Heavyweight he fought. Hint: Tunney's a Light-Heavyweight. Dempsey, on the other hand struggled against Gibbons and lost to Tunney.

Poet

You were going pretty good until you mentioned Dempsey lost to Tunney.

We both know Dempsey wasn't near Prime Dempsey against Tunney,and he still managed to drop him for the 10 count.A prime Dempsey cathes and stops Tunney much earlier.

It cracks me up how you will use a fighter past his prime to make your point or "try" to win a debate.You and another poster are famous for this,Lol

You were going pretty good until you mentioned Dempsey lost to Tunney.

We both know Dempsey wasn't near Prime Dempsey against Tunney,and he still managed to drop him for the 10 count.A prime Dempsey cathes and stops Tunney much earlier.

It cracks me up how you will use a fighter past his prime to make your point or "try" to win a debate.You and another poster are famous for this,Lol

While I agree Dempsey was past prime, the point, which seems to have elluded you, is that Tunney was a LIGHT-HEAVYWEIGHT.

It cracks me up how you try and change the issue when you don't like the direction the debate is going.

BTW, the rule is a fighter is knocked out when the REFEREE'S count reaches 10.....NOT when a time-keeper or some smuck watching on TV sees 10 seconds expire.

Poet

It wasn't a prime Dempsey but to be honest he was dominated in that fight until scoring the KO. If a past prime A-class of the previous era has that much trouble against a young B-class fighter of the next era, then it's a bit difficult to call either era much better than the other.

I don't think Baer would even have to train for Firpo. He would only have to land his big right hand, which he would since Firpo had no defense and wasn't exactly the most durable fighter around.

Yes,I saw the Dempsey-Sharkey fight many times.He was being dominated! He also looked like a schell of the Prime Jack Dempsey.

BTW-I have seen every fight I can get my hands on.All the way back into the 1800's.

And I love Max Bear! I'm not going to argue against him. And yes,he would not train hard for Firpo.I still insist he had one of the hardest right hands in the HISTORY of boxing.

Yes,I saw the Dempsey-Sharkey fight many times.He was being dominated! He also looked like a schell of the Prime Jack Dempsey.

BTW-I have seen every fight I can get my hands on.All the way back into the 1800's.

And I love Max Bear! I'm not going to argue against him. And yes,he would not train hard for Firpo.I still insist he had one of the hardest right hands in the HISTORY of boxing.

Ohhhh,I forgot.I would love to see Jim Jefferies and Jack Johnson fight Joe Louis and Muhammad Ali too.I know there from another era,but it just popped in my mind.I have film on all of the old-time fighters.

While I agree Dempsey was past prime, the point, which seems to have elluded you, is that Tunney was a LIGHT-HEAVYWEIGHT.

It cracks me up how you try and change the issue when you don't like the direction the debate is going.

BTW, the rule is a fighter is knocked out when the REFEREE'S count reaches 10.....NOT when a time-keeper or some smuck watching on TV sees 10 seconds expire.

Poet

Boyyyyy,slow down.Can't you joke around or have any fun?.Of course Dempsey didn't KO Tunney.But you know what I'm saying....A prime Dempsey KO's Tunney.

Yes,I know Tunney was a LH.So was Billy Conn. If you read my posts you will read where I believe Tunney is the greatest LH of all-time.Ezzard Charles 2nd.

Lighten up or your going to have a stroke dude,lol

Yes,I saw the Dempsey-Sharkey fight many times.He was being dominated! He also looked like a schell of the Prime Jack Dempsey.

BTW-I have seen every fight I can get my hands on.All the way back into the 1800's.

And I love Max Bear! I'm not going to argue against him. And yes,he would not train hard for Firpo.I still insist he had one of the hardest right hands in the HISTORY of boxing.

Dempsey had definitely lost some of the fire he had during his days as a homeless man roaming around the streets. He wasn't exactly an old man though (at 30 years of age) but he simply didn't have the same determination.

I don't think Dempsey ever did particularly well against clever boxers however, Tommy Gibbons, Billy Miske (in his prime) and Willie Meehan gave him a plenty of trouble.

Ohhhh,I forgot.I would love to see Jim Jefferies and Jack Johnson fight Joe Louis and Muhammad Ali too.I know there from another era,but it just popped in my mind.I have film on all of the old-time fighters.

Here's some footage of Gene Tunney and Jim Corbett exchanging punches:

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=281109

Johnson never had much respect for Louis. He was 100% certain that Schmeling would beat him in their first fight and actually gave some advice to Schmeling on how to do it.

Dempsey had definitely lost some of the fire he had during his days as a homeless man roaming around the streets. He wasn't exactly an old man though (at 30 years of age) but he simply didn't have the same determination.

I don't think Dempsey ever did particularly well against clever boxers however, Tommy Gibbons, Billy Miske (in his prime) and Willie Meehan gave him a plenty of trouble.



Here's some footage of Gene Tunney and Jim Corbett exchanging punches:

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=281109

Johnson never had much respect for Louis. He was 100% certain that Schmeling would beat him in their first fight and actually gave some advice to Schmeling on how to do it.

When Louis was coming up through the ranks Johnson was always high of praise of him as a fighter. And always very impressed with him. But when he wanted to train Louis, and was rejected this frustrated him as he thought he could take Louis to the next step and he saw just how big Louis was going to be and wanted to be a part of it.

But Louis chose to stay with Johnson's rival Jackie Blackburn. Johnson did indeed give Schmeling advice on how to defeat Louis, and he cound't of been more pleased when Louis was defeated. He had bet heavily on Schmeling to win, when Johnson was seen boasting about this, a angry bunch of black fans would attack him and police were called.

At the beggining Louis liked Johnson, but after being bad mouthed by Johnson, Louis turned and held a strong dislike for Johnson.

Johnson would do everything in his power to get Louis beat. He wanted to help train Jim Braddock for Joe Louis, do Braddock didn't hire him. He helped train 6''5 Abe Simon who Louis would KO. And he later took the vetran Jersey Joe Walcott aside to volunter his services if and when Louis give him a chance

''Johnson's background was savary remembered Walcott, ''I knew whatever fame I may win would be in his shawdow, i did not want to march arm in arm to succes with him. He turned Johnson down.

ahhhhh prime louis? vrs any time in tunneys carrer louis will win ko first round tunney had dempsey on ring size thats all it was just ring size 20 ft was normal to louis unlike the 16 or less of dempseys day.

Louis would have stopped him honestly. Tunney was mobile but Louis would manage to catch him like Dempsey at some point, and wouldn't let him off the hook.