View Full Version : Robinson Or Ali Who Shall Be Remebered As The Greater Fighter?


winky44
06-28-2009, 07:39 PM
Well?????????

Discuss

The Iron Man
06-28-2009, 09:45 PM
By boxing fans/historians - Sugar Ray Robinson

By the general public - Muhammed Ali

0Rooster4Life0
06-30-2009, 03:22 AM
Sugar Ray Robinson was gifted with everything you need to be a the Greatest, Speed, Skill, Great chin, footwork and somthing Ali wish he had good punching power.


As Ali said "Pound for Pound Ray Robinson is the Greatest"


But history will be more kind to Ali then to Robinson in the General public.

But i can't place anyone above Robinson, Though Henry Armstrong comes close.

CCobra
06-30-2009, 07:48 AM
Sugar Ray Robinson and it isn't even close.

Robinson defeated Angott (x3), Zivic (x2), LaMotta (x5), Armstrong, Gavilan (x2), Olson, Turpin, Graziano, Fullmer, Basilio, Servo (x2), Shank, Bell, Villemain and I could continue but I don't want to bore you.

Robinson was beaten in years that can be considered his prime only by LaMotta, who outweighed him by a lot and Randy Turpin, both of which losses he avenged (LaMotta on more then one occasion). Any loss after that Robinson was past his prime and he was still able to compete at a high level defeating some all time greats.

Whilst it's debateable, Ali should be 53-8 losses. Two extra losses to Ken Norton as well as Jimmy Young, who was robbed blind. Ali has a terrific resume as well with victories over Foreman, Frazier (x2) & Norton (x2; Norton was robbed on BOTH occasions that he lost), Liston (x2; second fight was dubious), Quarry, Lyle, Ellis & Young (who was robbed blind). But his resume doesn't beat SRR's and SRR had longevity to go with it and remained world class for a longer period of time.

Robinson is consistently ranked as the P4P#1 by most credible historians and is consistently ranked among the sports elite Welterweight & Middleweight fighters and also defeated future Lightweight champion and future hall of famer in his early career AS a Lightweight.

Ali will perhaps be remembered as the greater fighter by the general public due to his gimmick and Ali is, without doubt, the most well known sportsman EVER. But anybody with basic boxing knowledge should know that Robinson is the P4P greatest.

fight_professor
06-30-2009, 08:14 AM
SRR. Ali happily states SRR is the greatest fighter boxing has seen. His skills were superlative.

Slimey Limey
06-30-2009, 08:39 AM
Ali by a fooking country mile. Salty Gay Robinson isn't going to be remembered by the big public anyway(and most of it has to do with his era) so this answer is actually a fact.

Ali has around 10 ATG's on his resume, fought in the greatest era ever, displayed some of the greatest skills ever and has many ATG fights, fought through adversity more than anyone i've seen since he was robbed of his prime years and still came back and won the title back several times too.

hemichromis
06-30-2009, 10:08 AM
ALI!
simnply because there is more and better quality video footage

Chr0nic
06-30-2009, 11:20 AM
2/3 of the worlds population dont know robinsons but know ali

Davros?
06-30-2009, 12:49 PM
By boxing fans/historians - Sugar Ray Robinson

By the general public - Muhammed Ali

Thats exactly what i was going to say.

mickey malone
06-30-2009, 12:58 PM
Ali... For his stands against political racism...

Boxing wise... There's little to choose... Both ATG's in my opinion....

paulsinghnl
06-30-2009, 02:24 PM
bert sugar said that Sugar ray robinson was the only man that could score a knockout with his left hand going backwards.

billionaire
06-30-2009, 06:51 PM
bert sugar said that Sugar ray robinson was the only man that could score a knockout with his left hand going backwards.

ali knocked out bonavena going backwards.....**** even edwin valero knocked his last guy out going backwards....bert sugar is just a clown

robinson at welterweight is p4p #1

TheGreatA
06-30-2009, 06:56 PM
ali knocked out bonavena going backwards.....**** even edwin valero knocked his last guy out going backwards....bert sugar is just a clown

robinson at welterweight is p4p #1

Bert Sugar doesn't let facts get in the way of a good story. He is a good storyteller and an entertaining character for sure but I must question his status as a legit historian. He keeps repeating things that have been proven wrong over and over.

As George Foreman puts it, Ali was the greatest man to ever box. But he wasn't the greatest boxer in my opinion.

Bushbaby
07-01-2009, 02:37 AM
Did SRR really have over 200 pro fights that he won,doesnt that speak for itself,if u think about that could Ali or any other notable fighter come close to that??

JAB5239
07-01-2009, 02:42 AM
did srr really have over 200 pro fights that he won,doesnt that speak for itself,if u think about that could ali or any other notable fighter come close to that??

173-19-6 (108)

Kinetic Linking
07-01-2009, 02:43 AM
yes harry greb.

Anyway, this is a tough call for me. I was going to say robinson simply because of that lead left hook, but ali's footwork against liston was pretty special as well.

Kid McCoy
07-01-2009, 05:16 AM
Bert Sugar doesn't let facts get in the way of a good story. He is a good storyteller and an entertaining character for sure but I must question his status as a legit historian. He keeps repeating things that have been proven wrong over and over.

As George Foreman puts it, Ali was the greatest man to ever box. But he wasn't the greatest boxer in my opinion.

Foreman also said Ali wasn't the greatest heavyweight, but he was the bravest. Which is a fair assessment.

As to the question, Ali has more crossover appeal than Robinson. Even now he and Tyson are probably the two best-known boxers on the planet, so among the general public I imagine his standing will always be higher. But boxing historians will always see Robinson as the greater of the two (and he was). That's no slur on Ali, who was also great, but I doubt even he would complain about coming second to Robby.

billionaire
07-01-2009, 07:00 PM
Did SRR really have over 200 pro fights that he won,doesnt that speak for itself,if u think about that could Ali or any other notable fighter come close to that??

the numbers game is dumb as ****, willie pep and harry greb had way more wins.....plus those late wins also came with a bunch of losses in his comeback...

Home town hero
07-01-2009, 07:11 PM
Ali is only known as the greatest boxer by the majority of the world because he told them he was. He sweet talked his way to being the "best fighter ever" Not that im not saying hes not a top 5 atg but he doesnt come close to srr in pfp terms.

Slimey Limey
07-01-2009, 07:31 PM
Ali is only known as the greatest boxer by the majority of the world because he told them he was. He sweet talked his way to being the "best fighter ever" Not that im not saying hes not a top 5 atg but he doesnt come close to srr in pfp terms.

Yes, it's not because he beat 5 top 15 ATG Heavyweights, and a ****load of other great fighters, or winning the title back twice after being robbed 3 years of his prime, or because he gave us many ATG fights etc.

Maybe if Mayweather kept telling everybody that he's the greatest everybody would believe him too, innit?

Oh wait...he already does that..

and oh wait...nobody actually believes him.

You know why right mate?

Home town hero
07-01-2009, 08:02 PM
Yes, it's not because he beat 5 top 15 ATG Heavyweights, and a ****load of other great fighters, or winning the title back twice after being robbed 3 years of his prime, or because he gave us many ATG fights etc.

Maybe if Mayweather kept telling everybody that he's the greatest everybody would believe him too, innit?

Oh wait...he already does that..

and oh wait...nobody actually believes him.

You know why right mate?

im not saying ali isnt one of the best ever but he created an illusion that he was. Hell ali even said srr was the greatest what more do you need?

Slimey Limey
07-01-2009, 08:37 PM
im not saying ali isnt one of the best ever but he created an illusion that he was. Hell ali even said srr was the greatest what more do you need?

Ali said things like that because a was a very respectful man. A true class act.

At Joe Louis' funeral he told his son that Louis was the greatest.

Soon after Marciano's death Ali said in an interview that Rocky would have been the most difficult to beat out of all the greats(although there is a lot of truth to that).

Don't base your opinion on that. As far as him saying he was the greatest, he damn sure had the right to. Look at his accomplishments.

GJC
07-01-2009, 09:13 PM
Ali... For his stands against political racism...

Boxing wise... There's little to choose... Both ATG's in my opinion....
I put SRR as the number one but why choose celebrate both is my view.

Miburo
07-01-2009, 11:14 PM
By boxing fans/historians - Sugar Ray Robinson

By the general public - Muhammed Ali

Exactly.

...

Phenomkidd
07-01-2009, 11:19 PM
Ali said things like that because a was a very respectful man. A true class act.

At Joe Louis' funeral he told his son that Louis was the greatest.

Soon after Marciano's death Ali said in an interview that Rocky would have been the most difficult to beat out of all the greats(although there is a lot of truth to that).

Don't base your opinion on that. As far as him saying he was the greatest, he damn sure had the right to. Look at his accomplishments.

He wasn't respectful all the time, but I guess you have to hype up the fight.

Infern0
07-01-2009, 11:22 PM
Ali and it's Bull****, Ali aint even better than louis let alone srr

Squabbles94806
07-02-2009, 10:13 AM
I'd have to go with Sugar Ray Robinson as being the P4P greatest fighter. He fought during a waay tougher era and had waay over 100 fights. Not to mentions his fighting style was ahead of its time.

ALI on the other hand was more a political situation. And i think the fact that ALI was a heavyweight weighs more in his favor as being the greatest fighter.

billionaire
07-03-2009, 12:46 PM
question for any SRR fans i havent seen much of his career to know.....do you think he couldve beaten tommy hearns at 147 whos one of the hardest matchups in history....did he ever fight anyone similar to hearns...