http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u97/eightyse7ven/pride_logo.jpg?t=1239989800

K bros, BRICKS here to educate you on something called the PRIDE Mystique. [Definition of Mystique] (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mystique)

In 1997 The PRIDE Fighting Championships were formed in Japan. "The Land of The Rising Sun" / "The Secret Land of The Samurai" / etc. While not as popular, the American counterpart, UFC (Founded in 1993) was chugging along quite nicely.

The Difference and Cause of This "Mystique":
Common fans of MMA were beginning to watch PRIDE fights on FSSW and on the internet. Instead of seeing two fat Canadians drooling and pissing in the Octagon, they saw a well lit and structured ring. They saw epic entrances and most importantly, fighters from countries that they never knew existed. People were amazed when they saw these ruthless Japanese, Russian, Croatian and Brazilians. I don't think, outside of Vitor Belfort, that the UFC fans had seen a great Brazilian striker until they came across PRIDE FC.

But back to the Mystique. It was almost like fighting the unknown, you didn't know much about the camps, you were in a country with a mass amount of culture and discipline. And on top of that, the promotion was epic. Everyone gave respect to each other and was able to compete for just that, PRIDE.

So that is what created the PRIDE "Mystique." Now here's my two cents:

If you believe that there ever truly was mystique, describe PRIDE fighters as having mystique and say that the reason PRIDE fighters were so feared is because of mystique, you're bull****.

Plain and simple, it's a cop-out. Personally, when I saw people like Wanderlei, Fujita and CroCop, I knew that I wouldn't **** with them. Not because of some bull**** "Mystique," but because they were badasses. These fighters are becoming older and there best years may be behind them, but give them credit where credit is deserved. Prime for Prime, I would put any PRIDE FC champ against any UFC champ from any division. Again, not because of some bull**** "Mystique," but because we all know what would happen. I'm not even going to say it.

All in all, hop off Joe Rogan's sack and realize that PRIDE was badass. Yeah, it was in Japan. Yeah, it gave you a badass feeling being there. Yeah, if you ever WERE there you would nearly **** your pants (Believe me). But there was no 'hocus pocus,' just some badass fighters and a cool organization. Oh, Hell. I could have just said "Fedor" instead of typing this.

(CAN'T WAIT FOR YOUR REPLY BRAH)

Here ya go bud. . .

Old argument that died 2 years ago when the org was swallowed up due to their lack of business skills kept alive by PRIDE sackriders. This is all opinion, no fact. PRIDE vs UFC? Really? Bricks dude, you're a fan of MMA but you have to compare organizations as a way of justifying how good the fighters were. It don't work that way. The UFC and PRIDE didn't make these fighters good fighters. They had a hand in making them stars when the guys would tear through one another and sit atop their respective brand but they didn't make them good fighters. Facts are facts.

As for who would beat who. Again all hearsay and what you base it on is what they accomplished in PRIDE as opposed to who they fought and the styles. With the exception of a few guys, every fighter has and had flaws. For Wanderlei it was the fact that his striking was awful. He would brawl all the time and was fed opponents alot of the time that would do the same thing. Whenever he found himself in a fight with guys who's other attributes such as wrestling or striking were much more technically sound and proficient he looked ordinary. What got him through was his aggression and ability to finish when the opportunity arose. But when that was nullified he had nothing. With Crocop it was a simple case of great skill, great power, KO ability but a weak will when under fire and a submission game that was about as good as his chin. Fujita was tough. . .that's about it. He is only famous for the fact that he rocked Fedor yet the history books will always show you that Fedor floored him and tapped him out.

As for "Mystique". . . created by Pride nuthuggers who call themselves "true MMA fans" but **** on anything remotely different to PRIDE. It's the type of stuff that idiots would do because they have some sort of elitist way of thinking and that they're feel a sense of entitlement because they watch the so-called "better" brand. But when you look at facts the UFC was always the better brand once Zuffa took over (remember brand, nothing to do with the fighters). They were able to market their brand better. Draw better gates and PPV numbers. Put on more shows on a frequent basis. And basically push MMA out of the underground and into the mainstream both in North America and around the world moreso than any other. PRIDE although great for their production skills and what have you could never seem to get out of the blocks and didn't have the kind of machine behind it that Zuffa provided the UFC with. I mean you have to look no further than the 2 PPVs they did in the USA which barely did 100k in buys. . . COMBINED! All PRIDE fans could ever say is that they had better fighters and blah blah blah. Fact is while PRIDE were losing money trying to compete with the UFC brand, the UFC were turning their company around and were able to do more with one reality show than PRIDE did in their whole existence. PRIDE fans needed to create a "mystique" in order for the brand to be able to be of any relevance. But quite frankly it was never enough as proven by its demise. While the UFC introduced new fighters regularly to the company, PRIDE relied on the same guys all the time. Whether it be at HW, MW, WW or LW. It was the same guys at the forefront all the time. They never gave two ****s about weight classes as much as it appeared they did. Hardly ever had title matches and provided us with abominations like Bob Sapp, Giant Silva and Dos Caras Jr. And before you start with teh Brock Lesnar hate, the first PRIDE show was built off of the back of Takada and his pro-wrestling career. Quite frankly that becomes stale and boring and all it says about the brand itself is that they don't have a clue how to run a company other than rehashing the same old **** time and time again.

Here ya go bud. . .

Old argument that died 2 years ago when the org was swallowed up due to their lack of business skills kept alive by PRIDE sackriders. This is all opinion, no fact. PRIDE vs UFC? Really? Bricks dude, you're a fan of MMA but you have to compare organizations as a way of justifying how good the fighters were. It don't work that way. The UFC and PRIDE didn't make these fighters good fighters. They had a hand in making them stars when the guys would tear through one another and sit atop their respective brand but they didn't make them good fighters. Facts are facts.

As for who would beat who. Again all hearsay and what you base it on is what they accomplished in PRIDE as opposed to who they fought and the styles. With the exception of a few guys, every fighter has and had flaws. For Wanderlei it was the fact that his striking was awful. He would brawl all the time and was fed opponents alot of the time that would do the same thing. Whenever he found himself in a fight with guys who's other attributes such as wrestling or striking were much more technically sound and proficient he looked ordinary. What got him through was his aggression and ability to finish when the opportunity arose. But when that was nullified he had nothing. With Crocop it was a simple case of great skill, great power, KO ability but a weak will when under fire and a submission game that was about as good as his chin. Fujita was tough. . .that's about it. He is only famous for the fact that he rocked Fedor yet the history books will always show you that Fedor floored him and tapped him out.

As for "Mystique". . . created by Pride nuthuggers who call themselves "true MMA fans" but **** on anything remotely different to PRIDE. It's the type of stuff that idiots would do because they have some sort of elitist way of thinking and that they're feel a sense of entitlement because they watch the so-called "better" brand. But when you look at facts the UFC was always the better brand once Zuffa took over (remember brand, nothing to do with the fighters). They were able to market their brand better. Draw better gates and PPV numbers. Put on more shows on a frequent basis. And basically push MMA out of the underground and into the mainstream both in North America and around the world moreso than any other. PRIDE although great for their production skills and what have you could never seem to get out of the blocks and didn't have the kind of machine behind it that Zuffa provided the UFC with. I mean you have to look no further than the 2 PPVs they did in the USA which barely did 100k in buys. . . COMBINED! All PRIDE fans could ever say is that they had better fighters and blah blah blah. Fact is while PRIDE were losing money trying to compete with the UFC brand, the UFC were turning their company around and were able to do more with one reality show than PRIDE did in their whole existence. PRIDE fans needed to create a "mystique" in order for the brand to be able to be of any relevance. But quite frankly it was never enough as proven by its demise. While the UFC introduced new fighters regularly to the company, PRIDE relied on the same guys all the time. Whether it be at HW, MW, WW or LW. It was the same guys at the forefront all the time. They never gave two ****s about weight classes as much as it appeared they did. Hardly ever had title matches and provided us with abominations like Bob Sapp, Giant Silva and Dos Caras Jr. And before you start with teh Brock Lesnar hate, the first PRIDE show was built off of the back of Takada and his pro-wrestling career. Quite frankly that becomes stale and boring and all it says about the brand itself is that they don't have a clue how to run a company other than rehashing the same old **** time and time again.

Actually, I don't think it's fair to put Caras in the same list as Sapp and Giant Silva, since he actually improved over the years (his record is 7 wins 4 losses right now) and actually has an amatuer wrestling background.

I'm sick of the whole UFC/PRIDE talk, too much elitist BS from both sides. Sakuraba is my all time favorite fighter but I doubt he has a chance against someone like Couture or GSP.

The Pride/UFC debate reminds me of the boxing/MMA debate and my stance is the same on both issues - there is no reason why you can't value and appreciate both without denigrating the other.

The Pride/UFC debate reminds me of the boxing/MMA debate and my stance is the same on both issues - there is no reason why you can't value and appreciate both without denigrating the other.

Exactly, try to enjoy the best of both worlds.

Don't turn this into PRIDE vs UFC because if you read my post, it's not.

Here ya go bud. . .

Old argument that died 2 years ago when the org was swallowed up due to their lack of business skills kept alive by PRIDE sackriders. This is all opinion, no fact. PRIDE vs UFC? Really? Bricks dude, you're a fan of MMA but you have to compare organizations as a way of justifying how good the fighters were. It don't work that way. The UFC and PRIDE didn't make these fighters good fighters. They had a hand in making them stars when the guys would tear through one another and sit atop their respective brand but they didn't make them good fighters. Facts are facts.

As for who would beat who. Again all hearsay and what you base it on is what they accomplished in PRIDE as opposed to who they fought and the styles. With the exception of a few guys, every fighter has and had flaws. For Wanderlei it was the fact that his striking was awful. He would brawl all the time and was fed opponents alot of the time that would do the same thing. Whenever he found himself in a fight with guys who's other attributes such as wrestling or striking were much more technically sound and proficient he looked ordinary. What got him through was his aggression and ability to finish when the opportunity arose. But when that was nullified he had nothing. With Crocop it was a simple case of great skill, great power, KO ability but a weak will when under fire and a submission game that was about as good as his chin. Fujita was tough. . .that's about it. He is only famous for the fact that he rocked Fedor yet the history books will always show you that Fedor floored him and tapped him out.

As for "Mystique". . . created by Pride nuthuggers who call themselves "true MMA fans" but **** on anything remotely different to PRIDE. It's the type of stuff that idiots would do because they have some sort of elitist way of thinking and that they're feel a sense of entitlement because they watch the so-called "better" brand. But when you look at facts the UFC was always the better brand once Zuffa took over (remember brand, nothing to do with the fighters). They were able to market their brand better. Draw better gates and PPV numbers. Put on more shows on a frequent basis. And basically push MMA out of the underground and into the mainstream both in North America and around the world moreso than any other. PRIDE although great for their production skills and what have you could never seem to get out of the blocks and didn't have the kind of machine behind it that Zuffa provided the UFC with. I mean you have to look no further than the 2 PPVs they did in the USA which barely did 100k in buys. . . COMBINED! All PRIDE fans could ever say is that they had better fighters and blah blah blah. Fact is while PRIDE were losing money trying to compete with the UFC brand, the UFC were turning their company around and were able to do more with one reality show than PRIDE did in their whole existence. PRIDE fans needed to create a "mystique" in order for the brand to be able to be of any relevance. But quite frankly it was never enough as proven by its demise. While the UFC introduced new fighters regularly to the company, PRIDE relied on the same guys all the time. Whether it be at HW, MW, WW or LW. It was the same guys at the forefront all the time. They never gave two ****s about weight classes as much as it appeared they did. Hardly ever had title matches and provided us with abominations like Bob Sapp, Giant Silva and Dos Caras Jr. And before you start with teh Brock Lesnar hate, the first PRIDE show was built off of the back of Takada and his pro-wrestling career. Quite frankly that becomes stale and boring and all it says about the brand itself is that they don't have a clue how to run a company other than rehashing the same old **** time and time again.

You're misunderstanding me brotha. All I'm saying is, don't call the reason that they've won "Mystique." Hell, don't even call the reason they lose "Mystique." Call it what it is, a fight. I just want people to give every fighter the respect they deserve because anyone who has taken the time to go pro and steps in there with anyone from either of these organization has some major balls.

Actually, I don't think it's fair to put Caras in the same list as Sapp and Giant Silva, since he actually improved over the years (his record is 7 wins 4 losses right now) and actually has an amatuer wrestling background.


He's 7-4 with wins against guys who either hadn't fought before or with losing records. Plus his best opponent (Crocop) hit him once and KO'ed him. At least with Sapp you had a guy who was manhandling Nog until he gassed.

Don't turn this into PRIDE vs UFC because if you read my post, it's not.

You're misunderstanding me brotha. All I'm saying is, don't call the reason that they've won "Mystique." Hell, don't even call the reason they lose "Mystique." Call it what it is, a fight. I just want people to give every fighter the respect they deserve because anyone who has taken the time to go pro and steps in there with anyone from either of these organization has some major balls.

That's all fair and good bro. Respecting them for being warriors is one thing. But when you title the thread "PRIDE Mystique" and then mention a PRIDE fighter against a UFC fighter and what would happen it leads me to a different understanding in that the banners are what makes the fighter and not the fighter themselves. A truly great fighter in MMA would be able to win under any banner such as Fedor or Anderson. The ones that were once great but have fallen off were either past their prime (Nog & Wand). Complacent and adamant on resting on their laurels and have paid for it (Liddell). Weren't that good to begin with and have got by on padded records (Filho). Were great, but had dips and peaks in form (Arlovski & Belfort). Were great and have fallen off and will probably never return to the heights of their success due to a lack of heart or fear (Crocop & Ortiz). Flash in the pans (Houston). Or they just weren't good full stop (Kimbo). That's not disrespect, just calling it how I see it.

the pride/ufc debate reminds me of the boxing/mma debate and my stance is the same on both issues - there is no reason why you can't value and appreciate both without denigrating the other.

+1........